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almostnever · 03-11-2010 08:53PM

Noel2k9 wrote: »

Dude, in fairness, you've started posting in C&H with what? 2 weeks? You don't know any of the posters that well and you don't know how C&H works. This is a totally different forum to all the others on boards as it's specifically aimed at teenagers.

TBH Noel I'd say that strengthens the case that the posts in question could be taken as offensive. For people who know the posters, either through their interactions with them on the site or in real life, it may be easier to see the intended humour and it'll be less likely that you'd be intimidated. But for new posters, they haven't got a clue in what way something is meant or the type of humour that a poster may have, be it sarcastic or caustic, and this kind of thing could easily discourage them from posting. Which is a pity, and I really don't think it should be overlooked or brushed off. And the idea that just because someone is new they can't understand the forum or voice their opinions/concerns doesn't sit well with me at all.

I don't know. C&H has been weird lately, but I can't put my finger on it. Just in general the atmosphere has changed, or something. I'll think about this some more and try to be more specific when I'm not wrecked.

OopsyDaisy · 03-11-2010 08:55PM

I think this was just blow out of proportion completely...and I think people questioning the Mods was a bit far tbh.

While I did feel like it was personal, and was intimidated to post afterwards, I do understand that private conversations about things that wouldn't involve a lot of posters is unfair, and I apologize if I had an part in making anyone feel unwelcome to post or if I annoyed anyone, I can assure you all that I didn't mean to.
However, I think that if someone had just told us that we were being annoying or 'taking over' the Den, it would have been a lot nicer than taking the piss out of our posts.

Fad · 03-11-2010 08:58PM

I'm not arsed reading back on the rest of this thread*, but an incident with the words "Elitism" or "Clique" being thrown around does not surprise me in the slightest.

Imo, the IRC all but ruined C&H.

I post on C&H occasionally, but am no longer bothered reading shít like "Dur.... lulz were had in IRC last night", so the Den died, I liked the Den. I'm busier now, so I dont have a huge amount of time to read stuff, but for a forum I liked so much a few months ago, I just cant bring myself to be bothered.

Aoibheann · 03-11-2010 08:58PM

almostnever wrote: »

I don't know. C&H has been weird lately, but I can't put my finger on it. Just in general the atmosphere has changed, or something. I'll think about this some more and try to be more specific when I'm not wrecked.

It's because I don't really post here anymore, and the place is sorely missing my awesomeness.. :pac:

Bonito · 03-11-2010 08:58PM

almostnever wrote: »

TBH Noel I'd say that strengthens the case that the posts in question could be taken as offensive. For people who know the posters, either through their interactions with them on the site or in real life, it may be easier to see the intended humour and it'll be less likely that you'd be intimidated. But for new posters, they haven't got a clue in what way something is meant or the type of humour that a poster may have, be it sarcastic or caustic, and this kind of thing could easily discourage them from posting. Which is a pity, and I really don't think it should be overlooked or brushed off. And the idea that just because someone is new they can't understand the forum or voice their opinions/concerns doesn't sit well with me at all.

I don't know. C&H has been weird lately, but I can't put my finger on it. Just in general the atmosphere has changed, or something. I'll think about this some more and try to be more specific when I'm not wrecked.

Thank you. That's the way I'm taking it, at face value of the contents within the posts. If they didn't mean any harm, why have they not simply apologised for anyone who misunderstood?

The silence is deafening. I would have been in like a shot to rectify a mess I made.

Grindylow · 03-11-2010 08:58PM

Bonito wrote: »

Think it's closer to 8 weeks or so. Why didn't you bring it to the attention of the mods if the posting in the arghhh/yarrr thread?

Yeah, you're right, I don't know many posters but I can create my opinion of them based on their online persona and your comment of me not being here a wet day is covered in an elitist mentality. Just because I'm not here as long as others, doesn't mean I should be excluded on any measures. This forum is still under the platform of boards and has to behave accordingly, it's not a hosted forum.

BTW, I'm 19, I'm nowhere near the eldest of posters in here.

I'm not referencing to your age or anything and I'm not trying to offend anyone, It's just that this has been taken way out of proportion. I didn't bring it to the attention of the mods because I thought if I did it'd end up in something like this.....

almostnever wrote: »

TBH Noel I'd say that strengthens the case that the posts in question could be taken as offensive. For people who know the posters, either through their interactions with them on the site or in real life, it may be easier to see the intended humour and it'll be less likely that you'd be intimidated. But for new posters, they haven't got a clue in what way something is meant and this could discourage them from posting. Which is a pity. And the idea that just because someone is new they can't understand the forum or voice their opinions/concerns doesn't sit well with me at all.

I don't know. C&H has been weird lately, but I can't put my finger on it. Just in general the atmosphere has changed, or something. I'll think about this some more and try to be more specific when I'm not wrecked.

Yeah I get what your saying. It's just a case of a joke took too far. I don't think that they actually meant offence by anything like so I don't think it's fair that they should be labelled bullys, etc. I know it probably comes across as me taking sides, but I'm not. I know it wasn't the right way to go about things, and I know that in the case of it being other posters something different may have happened (but sure we'll never know, it didn't.). And I honestly don't mean offence to Novella if she's reading this about what I said earlier (Because I know she isn't one bit hypocritical and one of the nicest people on boards), I was just pointing it out there.

And yeah, I know that the other posters didn't intend anything bad by their posting either. I'm presuming it was just a case of one post turns into a conversation without them noticing it, so I'm not blaming them for that either. I'm kinda neutral on this, but I think that everyone involved should act like an adult and try to get over it.

Namlub · 03-11-2010 09:05PM

Noel2k9 wrote: »

IYeah I get what your saying. It's just a case of a joke took too far. I don't think that they actually meant offence by anything like so I don't think it's fair that they should be labelled bullys, etc. I know it probably comes across as me taking sides, but I'm not.

+1 to this, I'm sure no-one set out to upset anyone else. It was just bad judgement I guess. I'll stop getting involved now

Aoibheann · 03-11-2010 09:06PM

Fad wrote: »

I'm not arsed reading back on the rest of this thread*, but an incident with the words "Elitism" or "Clique" being thrown around does not surprise me in the slightest.

Imo, the IRC all but ruined C&H.

I post on C&H occasionally, but am no longer bothered reading shít like "Dur.... lulz were had in IRC last night", so the Den died, I liked the Den. I'm busier now, so I dont have a huge amount of time to read stuff, but for a forum I liked so much a few months ago, I just cant bring myself to be bothered.

I really don't agree with you about the IRC channel (and you can ask anyone, I'm there even less than I am here these days! :P). There's been about as many posts talking about the IRC channel as there have been of people discussing "lulz" in other media such as facebook, and I've seen a lot of one-to-one conversations spilling over here that had nothing to do with the channel.

I don't think it's fair of you to blame IRC for your lack of participation in the forum. That's completely your own call, but I think what I explained above is fairly accurate.

EDIT: Oh, and as an extra point, the channel has done the forum a lot of good in that it encouraged more people to get posting regularly. I'm hoping that conorstuff won't mind me using him as an example here. He didn't post very much, then got into conversations on the channel and then became one of our lovely regulars. There's definitely other examples of this!

Jay P · 03-11-2010 09:12PM

Aoibheann wrote: »

I really don't agree with you about the IRC channel (and you can ask anyone, I'm there even less than I am here these days! :P). There's been about as many posts talking about the IRC channel as there have been of people discussing "lulz" in other media such as facebook, and I've seen a lot of one-to-one conversations spilling over here that had nothing to do with the channel.

I don't think it's fair of you to blame IRC for your lack of participation in the forum. That's completely your own call, but I think what I explained above is fairly accurate.

Definitely true. I think the IRC really benefited C&H as a social forum as I got to know a good few posters fairly well over the summer, which was really nice. The only major change in the forum since the IRC was started was that The Den got quieter... That's how I see it anyway...

Novella · 03-11-2010 09:13PM

Noel2k9 wrote: »

Dude, in fairness, you've started posting in C&H with what? 2 weeks? You don't know any of the posters that well and you don't know how C&H works. This is a totally different forum to all the others on boards as it's specifically aimed at teenagers. The people in question had been posting in an incorrect manner for a long time, and this is probably going to come across wrong but I'm going to refer to Novella's previous post in feedback about how hard it is for new members to join in the forum. I'm not trying to aim this at you personally Novella, but in the Yaaah/Arrgh thread along with a few other posters, you guys started to discuss stuff that was carried over from facebook, and like if that's not hypocritical at all, I don't know what is. It just brings across my point that people are quick enough to point out what other people have done wrong, but not themselves.

Noel, I make every effort with new posters and I made one post in the argh thread and mentioned two other posters at the very end, as a joke. I wasn't offending anyone, nor was I excluding anyone. It wasn't a private in-joke. I stated that I dislike when you comment on a status and end up getting a million notifications because two other people go on to have a huge conversation on it. Oh, and you thanked my post so it obviously didn't rub you the wrong way at the time, did it?

I'm sorry if you think I'm too quick to point out the faults of others though, and will keep that in mind in future.

Fad · 03-11-2010 09:13PM

Aoibheann wrote: »

I really don't agree with you about the IRC channel (and you can ask anyone, I'm there even less than I am here these days! :P). There's been about as many posts talking about the IRC channel as there have been of people discussing "lulz" in other media such as facebook, and I've seen a lot of one-to-one conversations spilling over here that had nothing to do with the channel.

I don't think it's fair of you to blame IRC for your lack of participation in the forum. That's completely your own call, but I think what I explained above is fairly accurate.

I'm not entirely blaming IRC, but there are other things that I promised not to mention in C&H (I'm sure you know exactly what I'm referring to) that did nothing but annoy me. Also, it partly killed the den because it took a lot of the random posting away from the forum.

I cant really elaborate on the IRC itself because it would get a little ad hominum and I just amn't bothered getting into some petty internet argument.....

Some people who use IRC managed to remain sane though, they're still nice.....

Aoibheann · 03-11-2010 09:16PM

Fad wrote: »

I'm not entirely blaming IRC, but there are other things that I promised not to mention in C&H (I'm sure you know exactly what I'm referring to) that did nothing but annoy me.

I cant really elaborate on the IRC itself because it would get a little ad hominum and I just amn't bothered getting into some petty internet argument.....

Some people who use IRC managed to remain sane though, they're still nice.....

I'm not entirely sure what you're talking about (PM/MSN/something me to enlighten me?

).

I'm lovely! Although I don't use it anymore really, so I don't know if I count. I barely count as a C&H user these days. Might just be time for us oldies to move on? :pac:

Grindylow · 03-11-2010 09:16PM

Novella wrote: »

Noel, I make every effort with new posters and I made one post in the argh thread and mentioned two other posters at the very end, as a joke. I wasn't offending anyone, nor was I excluding anyone. It wasn't a private in-joke. I stated that I dislike when you comment on a status and end up getting a million notifications because two other people go on to have a huge conversation on it. Oh, and you thanked my post so it obviously didn't rub you the wrong way at the time, did it?

I'm sorry if you think I'm too quick to point out the faults of others though, and will keep that in mind in future.

No I wasn't referencing to that! It's just that usually when the afore mentioned people (I really don't wanna say names cos I'd feel bitchy) started a conversation, you were part of it! I'm not trying to be mean or anything to you, and I know you make every effort to welcome new posters. You're the person who mentioned it to us like, but it was just that one particular incident, and I'm just pointing it out that this offended you so much that you decided not to post, yet the incident there didn't offend anyone in such a manner.

Fad · 03-11-2010 09:18PM

Aoibheann wrote: »

I'm not entirely sure what you're talking about (PM/MSN/something me to enlighten me? ).

I'm lovely! Although I don't use it anymore really, so I don't know if I count. I barely count as a C&H user these days. Might just be time for us oldies to move on? :pac:

Another forum.....

D4RK ONION · 03-11-2010 10:28PM

Since I started really posting on boards, this forum has been my home. For a long time now. I don't know if I've changed or if the forum has changed, but this isn't the C&H I first got involved with. That's really sad. I do not apologise for my "actions" if you could even call them that, I don't think there's anything to apologise for.

I don't think C&H is for me (or maybe I'm not for C&H?) anymore. And that makes me feel pretty crap.

storm2811 · 03-11-2010 10:39PM

D4RK ONION wrote: »

Since I started really posting on boards, this forum has been my home. For a long time now. I don't know if I've changed or if the forum has changed, but this isn't the C&H I first got involved with. That's really sad. I do not apologise for my "actions" if you could even call them that, I don't think there's anything to apologise for.

I don't think C&H is for me (or maybe I'm not for C&H?) anymore. And that makes me feel pretty crap.

How so?

QueenOfLeon · 03-11-2010 10:40PM

Ok heres my 2 cents...

At first when I read all those posts I barely paid any attention to them...I most be the most gullible poster on C&H cos I thought they were actually real (didn't really notice the posters either). I think thats cos we see that sort of thing so regularly, chats about facebook statuses, private jokes, comments etc.

Tbh I don't really take any offence to them, but there are times in the Den where I'd prefer to have a conversation with people about the topics that have been brought up recently (driving, blood donation, the student march, etc) than read reams and reams of whats going on on facebook (if you're that interested, just join in on fb).

I'm not really for or against the method of bringing all this to people's attention, as long as people don't feel like they were targeted in those posts then I wouldn't think it was too much harm. However, anything that was going to upset other posters should have been kept private imo.

jumpguy · 03-11-2010 10:44PM

D4RK ONION wrote: »

I don't think C&H is for me (or maybe I'm not for C&H?) anymore. And that makes me feel pretty crap.

Dude, you've left C&H twice already, give it a break! :P

Umm, I haven't really been on C&H that much recently, and tbh I've no idea what happened at all. But as for the "C&H is changing man...changing for the worst!" argument I would say it's because I don't post as much as I used to to.

Nah JK, I think the atmosphere has changed because the people who post have changed, and there are new regular posters. I don't like the crap being said like "dude, you only post here for [a short lenght of time], so you don't get it, and hence your opinion isn't valid". Ah now. That's not very friendly and inviting, is it? It doesn't take that long to be able to form an opinion.

People are taking the forum too seriously. Ya just gotta chill, relax, and be a nice person. This is an excellent forum, and I'm very glad I found it - I've met some wonderful people out of it. It'll change, get over it. But as long as the underlying principles which make this forum great, that is, friendliness, bit o' respect, banter, and the ability to have a laugh remain it doesn't matter. And not to be creepy.

Can we stop the drama now?

Jackobyte · 03-11-2010 11:09PM

Fad wrote: »

Imo, the IRC all but ruined C&H.

I post on C&H occasionally, but am no longer bothered reading shít like "Dur.... lulz were had in IRC last night", so the Den died, I liked the Den. I'm busier now, so I dont have a huge amount of time to read stuff, but for a forum I liked so much a few months ago, I just cant bring myself to be bothered.

Have to agree with this. I think the Den was much more open to new posters since the IRC involves PMing on of the channel mods for a password. It has died since IRC was established which is a shame. The Den was nicer than the IRC imho. Posts were always more substantial and they were visible to people who weren't there at the time. When I spent time in IRC over the summer, there were a fair few private jokes that didn't make sense to me since I couldn't track back to see what they were about. When you spend every night there it is very enjoyable as you understand the jokes but if you are an infrequent user, it doesn't come anywhere near the old Den when there were 20 new pages with 30 posts per page every morning, all of which anyone could make sense of.

Novella · 03-11-2010 11:10PM

Noel2k9 wrote: »

No I wasn't referencing to that! It's just that usually when the afore mentioned people (I really don't wanna say names cos I'd feel bitchy) started a conversation, you were part of it! I'm not trying to be mean or anything to you, and I know you make every effort to welcome new posters. You're the person who mentioned it to us like, but it was just that one particular incident, and I'm just pointing it out that this offended you so much that you decided not to post, yet the incident there didn't offend anyone in such a manner.

I'm actually not really sure what you're talking about... If you're implying that I ever belittle other users (other than Midnight, who knows I'm kidding!

), then yeah, I am offended 'cause I don't and I never would and what has pissed me off isn't anyone having a bit of a banter in The Den - it was the manner in which it was done. I think it was plain mean, and if you don't agree or if others don't, fine, but that's my opinion and I'm not gonna sit around and pretend I thought it was okay.

Grindylow · 03-11-2010 11:14PM

Novella wrote: »

I'm actually not really sure what you're talking about... If you're implying that I ever belittle other users (other than Midnight, who knows I'm kidding! ), then yeah, I am offended 'cause I don't and I never would and what has pissed me off isn't anyone having a bit of a banter in The Den - it was the manner in which it was done. I think it was plain mean, and if you don't agree or if others don't, fine, but that's my opinion and I'm not gonna sit around and pretend I thought it was okay.

But they did the exact same thing in the den. You were part of the convesations too. Conversations such as "Midnight loves hard ****" etc aren't exactly going to be appealing to new people browsing through the den? It's as if there's a serious double standard here, where when it's done as a reality-check that it's bullying but where it's done as part of a real conversation, its supposedly hilarious.

Konata · 03-11-2010 11:14PM

D4RK ONION wrote: »

Since I started really posting on boards, this forum has been my home. For a long time now. I don't know if I've changed or if the forum has changed, but this isn't the C&H I first got involved with. That's really sad. I do not apologise for my "actions" if you could even call them that, I don't think there's anything to apologise for.

I don't think C&H is for me (or maybe I'm not for C&H?) anymore. And that makes me feel pretty crap.

Snap, unfortunately

C&H just doesn't do it for me anymore. It's been some journey but I think ii's time for me to move on. This recent incident has proven that to me.

Things have changed but I'll always love you guys

<33333 4eva

Novella · 03-11-2010 11:20PM

Noel2k9 wrote: »

But they did the exact same thing in the den. You were part of the convesations too. Conversations such as "Midnight loves hard ****" etc aren't exactly going to be appealing to new people browsing through the den? It's as if there's a serious double standard here, where when it's done as a reality-check that it's bullying but where it's done as part of a real conversation, its supposedly hilarious.

Yes Noel, I take part in conversations in The Den. We've established that, thank you. Have I ever posted in C&H mocking anyone though? No, and that's the point I'm making and the one you are obviously missing. This isn't about jokes, it's not about off-topic chats between anyone. This is about how it is seemingly alright to take the piss out of other users.

Grindylow · 03-11-2010 11:23PM

Novella wrote: »

Yes Noel, I take part in conversations in The Den. We've established that, thank you. Have I ever posted in C&H mocking anyone though? No, and that's the point I'm making and the one you are obviously missing. This isn't about jokes, it's not about off-topic chats between anyone. This is about how it is seemingly alright to take the piss out of other users.

They weren't taking the piss out of them. They were trying to get a point across, and tbh, it worked.

Bonito · 03-11-2010 11:27PM

Noel2k9 wrote: »

They weren't taking the piss out of them. They were trying to get a point across, and tbh, it worked.

How did it work if they said they're now leaving C&H? Or maybe you're happy that they've more or less stopped those posters feeling comfortable posting here again? What was the point in doing it? Sure they haven't even said if they ment it as a joke or not or what their real intentions were.

It was a harsh thing to do.

Grindylow · 03-11-2010 11:28PM

Bonito wrote: »

How did it work if they said they're now leaving C&H? Or maybe you're happy that they've more or less stopped those posters feeling comfortable posting here again? What was the point in doing it? Sure they haven't even said if they ment it as a joke or not or what their real intentions were.

It was a harsh thing to do.

Aww lord grow up. What has it got to do with you what they said like? How does it offend you? did you mysteriously transform into one of them or something? LIKE SERIOUSLY?

jefreywithonef · 03-11-2010 11:29PM

It shouldn't be interpreted as a personal affront against anyone. To me, it's a parody / satire of the type of vague, facebook-y chat that's been prevalent in the Den (or drivel as I'd call it), not a personal attack on you Novella, nor anyone else who's taken offence to it.

Bonito · 03-11-2010 11:33PM

Noel2k9 wrote: »

Aww lord grow up. What has it got to do with you what they said like? How does it offend you? did you mysteriously transform into one of them or something? LIKE SERIOUSLY?

Rock bottom, I've nothing more to say to you.

suitcasepink · 03-11-2010 11:34PM

Bonito wrote: »

How did it work if they said they're now leaving C&H? Or maybe you're happy that they've more or less stopped those posters feeling comfortable posting here again? What was the point in doing it? Sure they haven't even said if they ment it as a joke or not or what their real intentions were.

It was a harsh thing to do.

In fairness only Onion said hes leaving C&H (Hotaru wasnt part of it I dont think?) and Onions being trying to leave since.... the start of the summer?
None of the others said they were leaving

But I think it should just be left as it is now, its over done with. Unless the people involved want to pm each other or whatevz theres no more to be done(unless you want infractions handed out, but talking here wont make that happen, coz IO made a decision and isnt it a rule you cant argue with decisions?)
So yea hugs and kittens and lets move onto something more meaningful in our lives...

Novella · 03-11-2010 11:35PM

Noel2k9 wrote: »

Aww lord grow up. What has it got to do with you what they said like? How does it offend you? did you mysteriously transform into one of them or something? LIKE SERIOUSLY?

The tone of this post is completely inappropriate as well, Noel. Everyone has a right to voice their opinion.

On that note, I'm tired of justifying how I feel in here. It's pointless.

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