Inset Stove

I would have a look at sites like this one: http://www.stovesonline.co.uk/stoves_with_backboilers.html and perhaps email them for suggestions.

Actually the installation manual for the Charnwood SLX20 gives some very different advice on flue size to what we're hearing here -

In order for the appliance to perform satisfactorily the chimney height must not be less than 4 metres measured from the outlet of the fire to the top of the chimney. The chimney should preferably be 175mm (7 inches) or 200mm (8 inches) internal diameter or square with sides of 175mm or 200mm internally and MUST NOT BE LESS THAN 150mm (6 INCHES) INTERNAL DIAMETER OR 150 x 150MM INTERNAL SQUARE.

It also recommends that the void between the stove and the structural framework be filled with vermiculite.

Is this a case of "doctors differ, patients die"?

i personally like the look of the Charnwood - I've seen the SLX45i in the metal and liked it.
On the flue, it seems on 2nd reading that they're telling you that the flue should be no smaller than the 6" outlet on the stove, which makes sense to me. It doesn't require sizing down from a bigger diameter to 6" though - what the building regs and Sooty suggest is that you should ideally do that.
On the vermiculite packing around the stove, it makes sense to me to fill that void with it, to prevent the heat being lost out the back. But if there's a good reason not to, I'd be interested to hear it.
I haven't come across any other inset with a small boiler just for water, not rads.

I have read everything in this post but I'm still confused about a few things. When I moved into my apartment I removed everything from my fireplace until I was just left with a square box with a flue hole at the top (6 or 7" clay). Well, now with the winter coming i want to install an inset stove.

Can any of you guys tell me if i need the fire back in place for it to work? or can I just slide it in and secure. I'm looking at a TR 4 or greenstove as I need something in €400 -€500 range. With an inset stove do I need to line the chimney, and does this lining have to connect to the stove? I cannot see this mentioned anywhere except in this post. I will upload pictures and more details onceI get home.

thanks
Freddie

New_Girl wrote: »

Hi,
I've found the info here really useful but struggling to find an inset that suits my needs... I'm looking to heat the room (about 3x4m) and heat domestic hot water (no rads), does anyone have any suggestions?

Thanks

The Clearview inset can have an 8,000 BTU boiler fitted, and with a gross heat output of 5KW it should do what you need it to do, but they are not the cheapest stove out there, but if you are looking for clear glass, controllability and efficiency, it is hard to beat. Ask Dilbert75

freddie wrote: »

I have read everything in this post but I'm still confused about a few things. When I moved into my apartment I removed everything from my fireplace until I was just left with a square box with a flue hole at the top (6 or 7" clay). Well, now with the winter coming i want to install an inset stove.

Can any of you guys tell me if i need the fire back in place for it to work? or can I just slide it in and secure. I'm looking at a TR 4 or greenstove as I need something in €400 -€500 range. With an inset stove do I need to line the chimney, and does this lining have to connect to the stove? I cannot see this mentioned anywhere except in this post. I will upload pictures and more details onceI get home.

thanks
Freddie

If you fit an inset into the fireplace, then it becomes a problem if you don't line the chimney, as soot will naturally fall from the chimney during everyday use and accumulate on top and around the stove...soot being the combustible stuff that burns at high temperature during chimney fires. If it doesn't fall down naturally it certainly will during the sweeping process, and as you can imagine it can be a pain in the neck to have to remove the stove every time you need to get the chimney swept. Plus you will find that the soot builds up a lot quicker when the chimney is unlined as the flue gasses cool a lot quicker from a stove and lead to condensates building up in the chimney. Our web site might be woth a visit.

Best regards

Cat_M wrote: »

I've just joined in here and am a bit bamboozled TBPH by all the tecky info but I first need to know, what hope do I have at all really of retro-fitting an insert stove??

I live in a 16yr old house. Have included a pic of my fireplace.

Easy. Just break out the fireback and you can put in a Clearview inset, and bring a flex liner down to join on top. Have a look at our web site, but you'll have to follow the clues about going to google and searching for stoves in county down as I am not allowed to advertise the web site on this forum. You can email me or send me a PM with your email address and I'll send you some pictures of what way it could be done, and some of the stoves we have fitted to a fireplace alomst identical to yours.

Best regards

David

sooty_soupy wrote: »

it may be worth speaking to Charnwood and asking their technical guys if they recommend fitting a steel liner for the inset, as you are concerned soot is going to accumulate on and around the appliance. If you tell them you have a conventional chimney and are not too sure about the condition of the flue liners throughout, or if they are installed to correct way around, you might find they suggest as good practice to put the insulated steel in. Just a thought.

As I said here, re-reading it I can interpret it as instructing that you shouldn't have a flue diameter smaller than the outlet. Maybe its just not very well written.

Amazing too, as I read with interest today on Stanley's web site that they now want a steel lining installed for flues over 6" just as Clearview suggest. Have a look yourself.

I wouldn't necessarily take Stanley's advice on how to install, given the wide range of doubt I've heard cast on their product quality. Nevertheless, whatever stove I buy, I will be lining my flue and insulating it with vermiculite.

Would be interested to know what Jonathan has to say to be honest, but obviously I am more concerned with the fact that you get a good stove and it performs well.

Well actually Jonathan doesn't seem to have much to say - in 9 working days since I mailed him, I called 3 times and got no further than the receptionist. He didn't return my calls and didn't reply to my 2 mails, nor did he delegate anyone else to do so, which I thought was a startling reflection on the company's customer service.

I did eventually get to speak to someone else at the factory - today - who pretty much confirmed your statement on the warranty question - although I do think it bizarre that a perfectly legitimate Clearview stove might not be covered by warranty because it was only indirectly bought from an official stockist.

Its funny how things turn around - two weeks ago I would have taken the hand off the nearest person to offer me a Clearview Vision Inset and I was only waiting on quotes for flue liner and installation. Now I'm strongly considering going elsewhere because if, when I'm trying to give him business, the company owner hasn't time to either talk to me or delegate someone else to talk to me, what service will I get if I have a problem? (cue stock answer - "you won't have a problem")

Strange - maybe they meant they just don't have one in the showroom?

Have you tried the dealer in Dublin? Shipping it to Galway would be very do-able.

PS. What a strange name for a company - evokes the image of woodWORM to me, which is a negative association. Suppose they wanted to convey wood burning and heat but still...

I'm no expert Skigolf but, based on what I've read around here as being best practise, that's not it. Maybe some of the more expert contributors will comment specifically.

The Green inset seems to be made by the same people who make Tripp. That's what I started off looking at but could find out very little about them and could get little feedback (positive or negative). They're possibly best described as "entry-level". The Green that I looked at didn't have a round flue to which a flue liner could be attached though, so that's a negative for me.

skigolf wrote: »

Sorry to intrude into this interesting debate re insert stoves...

But can I just say, that in the south of Ireland anyway, the amount of misinformation and bad advice out there is seriously alarming.

I have concerns about my recent stove installation and I hope some of you better qualified people can give me some advice. I initially assumed that the 'experts' I employed knew what they were doing, my installation went as follows, as far as I could see...

A nice granite panel with a hole in it was used to cover up the existing fireplace. A 45 deg connection bend was inserted into the hole in the granite (it definitely did not extend longer than a 9"/12" on the chimney side of the panel - no register plate etc.), then the 45 deg bend connection was connected to the rear outlet of the appliance.

The couple of times we lit the stove there was no heat output...

Called the fitter, said we needed the chimney lined, fair enough, tried to get the 6" chimney liner down the chimney - wouldn't fit due to chimney bends. He suggested using a 5" liner and connecting to 6" outlet using a flue narrowing connection - I asked was it ok to reduce the diameter - pressure drops - possibly lower dew point temp, condensation etc. He said it was fine, he'd done it before...

Following my own research, looking at the buildings regs etc., the regs say that the flue diameter should not be smaller than the appliance outlet.

So, two major concerns (1) the possibly incorrect connection to the stove outlet and (2) the problem with reducing the CSA of the flue.
What should I do - help?

What they have done is illegal. Do not use the appliance again until it has been sorted out. YOU NEVER reduce the flue diameter lower than the outlet on the appliance. The flue diameter is determined by the manufacturer prior to testing to ensure it can exhaust the gasses safely into the chimney and pass harmlessly into the atmosphere, not by the installer. Carbon Monoxide is a real threat when the appliance can not get rid of the combustion gasses correctly. If the burn rate is affect, incomplete combustion is a real threat which can compound the problem. It sounds to me as though your "experts" are dubious to be kind to them in their knowledge of the solid fuel industry. You are in fact supposed to upsize the flue if there are severe bends in the flue to ensure velocity of gas discharge is not compromised. I would be demanding my money back, and employ the services of another company, and if that is not forthcoming, then speak to a consumer organisation or solicitor and pursue them.

I am intrigued about fitting the stove with this type of panel. Am I right in imagining that behind the panel is an area for soot to collect, and has there been a bend fitted as opposed to a "t" section to allow soot to build up below the flue outlet on the stove.

Another point that is very important is the fact that if the stove has been fitted onto the existing hearth, has it been increased in depth to ensure the door swings over a non combustible surface. If there is not a minimum of 9" or 225mm, but preferably the swing of the door in front of the stove, then you might find that you are uninsured in the event of a house fire, as the stove does not comply with fire and building regulations.

Hope this helps, but our web site might be of benefit. We sell stoves and flues in County Down if you google it, we come quite high up the rankings LOL ;-}

soldsold wrote: »

Thanks for the reply sooty soupy.

The hrv system is only a ventilation system and will never be able to move enough air to transfer heat in any useful way. I've never heard of one being controlled by a thermostat, they just run 27/7. Hrv systems need to provide balanced air pressure to work properly and safely so they won't suck harmful gases from the stove for example. My house has 300mm of insulation under the floor, 240 in the cavity walls and 280 in the roof with extreme airtightness and 0.7 u value windows, so I just need to make sure my stove doesn't become an 'ornament' Ie can't use without roasting the room.

Good points on the 316 flue, I'm definitely not going to be burning coal but no harm to point it out. If Clearview made a room sealed inset stove large enough not to look out of place in a big room with an external air supply and a large back boiler I'd be first on the list!

Cheers!

S

Sounds like my kind of day...an extra 3 hours in it to cope with the emails etc. ..LOL

Hello,

Just joining this thread very late as I am now (thanks to the changing weather) looking into replacing a useless gas insert with a solid fuel stove. I have read thru (most of the) thread and there's so much information to take in.

I will come back with a photo of my current fireplace setup but in the meantime I found this site really useful. It's a bit like what PavingExpert is for paving - lining the flue is explained in great detail with a lot of pictures - great help for someone like me who didn't know 'hearth' from 'fireplace'.

http://www.stovesonline.co.uk/stove_help_and_advice.html

hi p,
yes afraid lovely insert has to go, the hood is the problem, would need to get either a flat granite insert or a flat plate cast iron insert, but to my knowledge none come with lovely tiles, but have replaced many of these and when stove is in place you wont miss the tiles!! unless free standing option but then you have problem of clearance of non combustible in front of stove, is it carpet wooden floor infront of hearth?