Do you think Irish should become an option after LC?

jugger0 · 30-09-2010 03:08PM

They should make all primary schools gael scoils, problem solved. Pretty sad how we cant speak our own language.

starlit · 30-09-2010 03:14PM

jugger0 wrote: »

They should make all primary schools gael scoils, problem solved. Pretty sad how we cant speak our own language.

Not every student is good at Irish even if they went to a gael scoil!

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 30-09-2010 03:19PM

snuggles285 wrote: »

Not every student is good at Irish even if they went to a gael scoil!

You do realise that one of our strongest selling points too employers is that we are native-English speaking?

jugger0 · 30-09-2010 03:21PM

snuggles285 wrote: »

Not every student is good at Irish even if they went to a gael scoil!

My secondary school had a split, half from gael scoils and half from normal schools. ALL the gael scoil students could speak Irish! Even if there was a few who couldnt, the vast majority would be able to speak it fluently.

starlit · 30-09-2010 03:21PM

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

You do realise that one of our strongest selling points too employers is that we are native-English speaking?

Yes....?

Think they should add French, Spanish, German or Italian onto that in the near future!

starlit · 30-09-2010 03:24PM

jugger0 wrote: »

My secondary school had a split, half from gael scoils and half from normal schools. ALL the gael scoil students could speak Irish! Even if there was a few who couldnt, the vast majority would be able to speak it fluently.

Well ok, thats fair enough. For those who can't speak Irish fluently even having gone to a gael scoil, I have known a few who had ended up doing Ordinary Level Irish for Junior Cert and Leaving Cert who had gone to a gael scoil though!

cassi · 30-09-2010 03:31PM

snuggles285 wrote: »

Well ok, thats fair enough. For those who can't speak Irish fluently even having gone to a gael scoil, I have known a few who had ended up doing Ordinary Level Irish for Junior Cert and Leaving Cert who had gone to a gael scoil though!

Thats probably because they weren't given adequate exposure to or education in Irish after they finished primary school.

ScumLord · 30-09-2010 03:37PM

cassi wrote: »

I would hate to see the Irish language die out, but the way its being taught in schools is killing it.

I'd agree, I absolutely hated Irish in school but ever since leaving school I wish I had learned it in school.

While it's not an important language in today's world it is an interesting one and there's nothing to lose from learning it. It's not like we'll ever stop speaking English but it would be nice to be able to speak a language that no one else in the world speaks.

I could see all kinds of advantages, maybe even in business and sport being able to talk to your fellow countrymen without anyone having the foggiest what your on about could be a bonus.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 30-09-2010 04:05PM

snuggles285 wrote: »

Yes....? Think they should add French, Spanish, German or Italian onto that in the near future!

So, if you turn all the schools into Gaelscoileanna, do you think this reputation will be damaged, as other countries will see as trying to move away from being native english speaking?

Adding other languages depends on how practical you want an education system to be versus how traditional.

marzic · 30-09-2010 04:16PM

Ina theannta sin, deimhnímse leis seo go bhfuil an t-eolas ar fad tugtha ar an bhfoirm iarratais seo cruinn. Tuigim go bhféadfar dícháiliú uathfheidhmeach a dhéanamh orm de bharr eolas bréagach nó míthreorach atá tugtha agam.

Dearbhaím freisin má chiontófar nó má ionchúiseofar sa todhchaí mé, beidh sé mar fhreagracht orm, an fhíric seo a chur ar shúile Oifigigh um Acmhainní Daonna, gan mhoill.

"... and thats all i have to say about that":D

Novella · 30-09-2010 04:31PM

I don't think it should be optional. It's our language, and I think it'd be sad to lose it completely. Imo, the problem is with the way Irish is taught. I find it unbelievable that after learning a language for, I dunno, twelve years, the most so many students can manage is to write an essay about how they went to the shop and bought sweets and cake.

I think students would find it more enjoyable if they didn't feel so out of their depth, and the only way to tackle this is to change the way in which it is taught. At least that's the way I see it!

Scuid Mhór · 30-09-2010 04:33PM

they need to change how irish is educated to make it more in tune with contemporary times - not abolish it.

bleg · 30-09-2010 04:58PM

What if you want your kids learning a useful language instead?

Novella · 30-09-2010 05:06PM

bleg wrote: »

What if you want your kids learning a useful language instead?

They could learn another language as well. I've heard early in life is the best time to learn languages anyway.

D'Agger · 30-09-2010 05:07PM

bleg wrote: »

What if you want your kids learning a useful language instead?

Like Latin :pac:

nommm · 30-09-2010 05:12PM

I think it should be made optional after the JC. I'd prefer a system like in Britain where they only take on subjects you want to do for the LC. That way if you have difficulty with languages or maths it won't hold you back as much.

If they want to keep it as a compulsory subject they need to improve the way it's taught. I've been learning it for the last 13 years and I still struggle to string a sentence together.

Copper23 · 30-09-2010 07:08PM

thisisadamh wrote: »

Hi all I think a lot more good would be done for Irish if it was not compulsory for LC. What does everyone else think?

I think you are wrong. End of.

How is dropping Irish good for the language?

Copper23 · 30-09-2010 07:10PM

nommm wrote: »

I think it should be made optional after the JC. I'd prefer a system like in Britain where they only take on subjects you want to do for the LC.

Yeah, English is hardly compulsory in England :rolleyes:

Appleguy · 30-09-2010 07:13PM

Definitely, its working out just fine for me that the gardai cant speak to me when they pull me over.

LpPepper · 30-09-2010 07:30PM

After just doing my Junior Cert and getting results I can say Irish is possibly the most annoying , boring and dreadful class ever.

I ended up getting into the Highest class in the year in 1st year and stayed there till I finished the Jc , for 2 years for Irish we had this about to retire hag . Each day we would sit there and "learn" aka stare at a page and any questions asked would be responded to with " I told you what to do now get on with it ".

For 2 years we had that BS each day , doing foundation like level stuff in the Top honours class

About a month into 3rd year we were sick of it and protested to our Principal and refused to enter the class :cool: hah

So we ended up getting our English teacher for Irish too and thanks to her we managed to fit in the whole course in less than a school year. We done our poems , stories , vocab and etc..

At the mocks have the class failed , about 10 passed with D's (including myself) and only 5 got honours (1B)

Thanks to our teacher for the remainder of 3rd year we eventually managed to become mediocre at Higher level and sure enough just managed a C at the Junior cert...

What a rant ! , Anyway whole course needs to be re-vamped , no teenager wants to learn about old poets and stories . Its meant to be about talking it , yet barely anyone can at all .

Also needs to be a choice after the JC ,

I can safely say that Horrible hag has since retired

google faps · 30-09-2010 07:34PM

Listen to me, you goddam west brits, Irish is our national language and you'll learn it - whether you like it or not. Syre it may not be easy to speak it with your fake Hills accents, but you will try.

the purple tin · 30-09-2010 07:43PM

Appleguy wrote: »

Definitely, its working out just fine for me that the gardai cant speak to me when they pull me over.

I thought the gardai had to be able to speak irish. No?

AlexderFranke · 30-09-2010 07:46PM

Well, I am German and have been to Ireland several time.
I think the policies on Irish at school should depend on the regional circumstances. In the Gaeltacht Irish-medium education ought to be the sole kind of school. Those who do not like it can move.
In areas neighbouring to the Gaeltacht I would propose to have Irish-medium and bilingual schools. It is a special shame if people near the Gaeltacht do bot have a reasonable grassp in Irish. In the rest of the country one could offer the option of basic study of Irish and an emphased study as options. I consider it a very useful proposition in the 20-year-strategy to introduce an extra subject Irish literature.
The classical case of a neighbouring area to the Gaeltacht is Galway city. The influence from the Gaeltacht is still noticeable. The census shows clearly that a greater proportion of pupils use Irish outside the classroom than on average. Yes, in such areas Irish can well have a practical use.
I cannot say it often enough: The results of teaching Irish at school for 80 years are an absolute desaster and ineffective teaching is a waste of money and time! Actually one should expext that everybody in Ireland has some Irish as result.
I am a proponent of providing knowledge in three languages to pupils: The regional or heritage language, the language understood statewide and a language understood widely on the continent or in the world. I think it would make sense to offer Scottish Gaelic or Manx in some schools in Ireland as there are historical links zo Scotland and the Isle of Man.
Go n-éirí an Ghaeilge libh!

coffeenut · 30-09-2010 07:51PM

the purple tin wrote: »

I thought the gardai had to be able to speak irish. No?

i think they have to have LC higher level same as secondary school teachers?

Rebelheart · 30-09-2010 08:15PM

thisisadamh wrote: »

I know! I want to do Engineering in College and why do I need Irish for engineering?

For the same reason you have to know Shakespeare, Austen and all those pointless ponces on the Leaving Cert English syllabus to do the same engineering course in college?

Oh, but let's not get in the way of your rant against Irish. Right on, bud.

beccabeccabecca · 30-09-2010 08:28PM

When I was in secondary school, I would have agreed with you no problem about making Irish optional or even getting rid of it altogether, and this is coming from someone who loves languages (I'm doing my degree in Spanish and French). The course is long and dull with far more emphasis on being able to regurgitate learned off essays, poems and stories rather than being able to speak and write it fluently. I took Higher Level for the LC and remember my teacher telling our class that even teenagers who come from the Gaeltachts and had Irish as their first language often opted to take Ordinary Level purely because the course for Honours was too long.

However, when I started college last year I took up a night time diploma course in Irish and I LOVE it. Without the ancient poems, stories and the dreaded "An Triail", Irish is pretty fun. For the first time in fourteen years of learning it, I'm being taught the proper grammar rules and the basic structures of sentences so I can actually speak it coherently. It sounds lovely and I think it'd be nice to keep it alive if at all possible, though I dont think that's going to happen unless the course is seriously revamped.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 01-10-2010 12:23AM

google faps wrote: »

Listen to me, you goddam west brits, Irish is our national language and you'll learn it - whether you like it or not. Syre it may not be easy to speak it with your fake Hills accents, but you will try.

Troll, or sarcasm? not sure. been in a sauna for four hours, not seeing what is probably obvious...

Rebelheart wrote: »

For the same reason you have to know Shakespeare, Austen and all those pointless ponces on the Leaving Cert English syllabus to do the same engineering course in college?

Oh, but let's not get in the way of your rant against Irish. Right on, bud.

In fairness, a few people have been questioning the point in having any compulsory subjects after the junior cert.

Toyota_Avensis · 01-10-2010 12:53AM

Optional, no. Revamped Course, Yes (and much overdue!!) A new coursed primarily focused on the fluent spoken aspect is whats needed. IMO the uping of the Oral to 40% was a silly move, because I have noticed it has been counter productive. Teachers (whom I've met) have 'given up' on the fact that students will earn their 40% in the oral. They've assessed the fluency situation in classes and have pretty much decided, the majority of that 40% is down the drain (due to poor spoken Irish) so they've said lets focus on the other 60% to make sure these kids pass LC Irish. Its a pity, because had it been brought in efficiently, people could prepare. Poor teenagers nowadays, where are they gonna get their spoken Irish if not at school? The big option is flocks of them heading Westside during the summer to spend 3 weeks ''learning'' Irish and getting the shift no doubt. Those who take it seriously will make the grade, the other plebs who can't fork out the Mega Money to go to the Gaeltachts, will suffer as a consequence of the ''improved sylabus'' my arse.

Jake Rugby Walrus666 · 01-10-2010 12:59AM

I think it needs to remain an option after the leaving cert. It should always be an option. Right to the end of your life. You might not take up the option. But its there. You have it. We've left our options open. And this can only be beneficial in the language speaking jungle of that we find ourselves thrust in.

thisisadamh · 03-10-2010 01:12PM

Copper23 wrote: »

I think you are wrong. End of.

How is dropping Irish good for the language?

If you force people to learn it, then they just end up hating it and bringing the people who want to learn the language down. If it was an option the people who do not want to learn the language for LC, don't end up hating the language and might go on to learn it on their own after school and they wont have any awful memories.

Also if people hate the language because they were forced to learn it, their children will not be encouraged to put an effort in to the language because it is not promoted in the household.

Do you think Irish should become an option after LC?

Comments