Pay freeze

femur61 · 10-09-2010 05:46AM #1

Mr O'Driscol from Dimplex said we should follow suit what the Germans did and have a pay freeze but will this happen. Realistically.

DOC09UNAM · 10-09-2010 05:53AM

no it most likely won't.

Tora Bora · 10-09-2010 06:09AM

DOC09UNAM wrote: »

no it most likely won't.

Where I work, pay frozen since august 2008. Told last week, freeze likely for 2 years more at minimum. Nobody batted an eyelid.

femur61 · 10-09-2010 07:16AM

Private sector I assume?

Tora Bora · 10-09-2010 07:26AM

femur61 wrote: »

Private sector I assume?

Yes. Multinational.

murphaph · 10-09-2010 08:52AM

German wage restraint over the past few years now enables Germany to compete favourably against expensive countries like Ireland. How times have changed. Man we really blew it.

Tora Bora · 10-09-2010 08:56AM

Seriously though. Is there anybody in this country, who expects a wage increase in the next number of years. I would say, I don't know anybody who seriously expects one.
Keeping the job you have at the rate you currently have, would be a good result, for the next three years minimum.

Tora Bora · 10-09-2010 08:58AM

murphaph wrote: »

German wage restraint over the past few years now enables Germany to compete favourably against expensive countries like Ireland. How times have changed. Man we really blew it.

On the other hand, many economists claim that this policy has severely dampened domestic demand, and hence stunted growth in the engine room of Europe.

sellerbarry · 10-09-2010 09:40AM

I can't actually believe someone is complaining about their wage being frozen. I know plenty of people who would agree with a pay cut at the moment if they had a job. Wake up! and think yourself lucky to have a job.

Head The Wall · 10-09-2010 10:02AM

Tora Bora wrote: »

Seriously though. Is there anybody in this country, who expects a wage increase in the next number of years.

Public sector workers are expecting them and that is because they are still receiving pay increases and have been doing so all through their so called pay freeze and moratorium.

Brussels Sprout · 10-09-2010 10:23AM

femur61 wrote: »

Mr O'Driscol from Dimplex said we should follow suit what the Germans did and have a pay freeze but will this happen. Realistically.

Public Sector: Not without a lot of screaming and roaring and realistically not until the government is absolutely forced to

Private Sector: Already happened

liammur · 10-09-2010 10:26AM

Head The Wall wrote: »

Public sector workers are expecting them and that is because they are still receiving pay increases and have been doing so all through their so called pay freeze and moratorium.

Wait until the big hike in income tax starts to kick in. And yet our government are encouraging people to spend.

RichardAnd · 10-09-2010 10:27AM

Tora Bora wrote: »

Seriously though. Is there anybody in this country, who expects a wage increase in the next number of years.

It is my strongest opinion that the Croke Park deal will be broken by the unions looking for more money before 2014. Not to put PS workers down but those greedy f**ks in the unions will be whining for more as soon as unemployment starts to fall.

Of course, I don't expect the government to keep their side of the bargain either. Isn't it a wonderful modern world we live in, it's perfectly acceptable to give your word on something and then renege on it.

jmayo · 10-09-2010 10:44AM

murphaph wrote: »

German wage restraint over the past few years now enables Germany to compete favourably against expensive countries like Ireland. How times have changed. Man we really blew it.

Well according to SIPTU and ICTU boss jack o'connor on Morning Ireland Germany is so sucessful because it pays it's workers so much and gives them wage increases.
So basically he reckons if we increase salaries we will be as successful as Germany.

Also remember this little piece of information...

http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/siptu-boss-refuses-cut-to-8364124000-pay-1915673.html

THE leader of the country's biggest union is not considering a cut in his €124,000 pay while his members are facing wage reductions and job losses.

Jack O'Connor, whose annual salary is €124,895, said a drop in wages would be used as "an excuse to drive pay cuts across the economy".

What is also interesting about today's interview was the interviewer thanked him as head of SIPTU and head of ICTU and he made a joke of having two jobs nobody wanted.
How much does he get for his ICTU gig I wonder ?

Oh and people should remember this guy has been involved with Labour party upto level of executive.
Now why would anyone wonder if Emaon Gilmroe will take on the unions ?

Tora Bora wrote: »

Seriously though. Is there anybody in this country, who expects a wage increase in the next number of years. I would say, I don't know anybody who seriously expects one.
Keeping the job you have at the rate you currently have, would be a good result, for the next three years minimum.

ehh jack o'connor for a start. :rolleyes:

OldNotWIse · 10-09-2010 10:46AM

Brussels Sprout wrote: »

Public Sector: Not without a lot of screaming and roaring and realistically not until the government is absolutely forced to

Private Sector: Already happened

the lucky ones...a lot of private sec workers have had cuts, and would consider it fantastic luck to have a pay freeze

changes · 10-09-2010 11:01AM

Brussels Sprout wrote: »

Public Sector: Not without a lot of screaming and roaring and realistically not until the government is absolutely forced to

Private Sector: Already happened

Public sector: Already happened and add a paycut and pension levy to that also.

Nobody in the PS expects a payrise... where are people getting this rubbish from?

Tora Bora · 10-09-2010 11:06AM

jmayo wrote: »

Well according to SIPTU and ICTU boss jack o'connor on Morning Ireland Germany is so sucessful because it pays it's workers so much and gives them wage increases.
So basically he reckons if we increase salaries we will be as successful as Germany.

Also remember this little piece of information...

http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/siptu-boss-refuses-cut-to-8364124000-pay-1915673.html

What is also interesting about today's interview was the interviewer thanked him as head of SIPTU and head of ICTU and he made a joke of having two jobs nobody wanted.
How much does he get for his ICTU gig I wonder ?

Oh and people should remember this guy has been involved with Labour party upto level of executive.
Now why would anyone wonder if Emaon Gilmroe will take on the unions ?

ehh jack o'connor for a start. :rolleyes:

He's not anybody! He is nobody:cool: ****n double jobber, when so many of the comrades are unemployed:P

c montgomery · 10-09-2010 11:06AM

I work for a large multinational pharmaceutical company. One of those "knowledge economy" type companies.

We have been on a pay freeze for the last 3 years.
During this pay freeze my pay has reduced by 22% by the removal of allowances and shift benefits.
I am currently waiting to be given my redudancy date as the company is letting 140 of us go. (not schering plough)

It will be alot longer than 2 (5 in total) years before people here get a pay rise. Some of who get let go wont get another job.

This country is screwed. The company i work for is one of the biggest players in the industry, the type of company the government say they are trying to get into the country for our "knowledge economy". The pharmaceutical industry whcih is one of the few that had remained strong is now on its knees and with competition from the far east it will not recover.

5 year pay freezes wont make much difference.

The_Honeybadger · 10-09-2010 11:17AM

changes wrote: »

Public sector: Already happened and add a paycut and pension levy to that also.

Nobody in the PS expects a payrise... where are people getting this rubbish from?

I think he was talking about increments, I'm sure you will argue that they are not a payrise, but they increase take home pay, in my book that is a payrise. And yes, I know alot of people in the PS, and not one of them expects a payrise any time soon, and have little faith in the CP deal.

George Orwell 1982 · 10-09-2010 11:18AM

Brussels Sprout wrote: »

Public Sector: Not without a lot of screaming and roaring and realistically not until the government is absolutely forced to

Private Sector: Already happened

It has already happened in the public sector as well. They took roughly a 20% pay cut and they have agreed to a pay freeze until 2014.

And by the way Irish public sector unions have been the most passive in Europe accepting paycuts, pension levies, freezes on promotion and recruitment and tax increases. Ireland has been used as an example for other countries in how to "take the pain" lying down. Witness the 2 million protesting in France because they want to raise the retirement age to 62.

Brussels Sprout · 10-09-2010 11:31AM

mickeyk wrote: »

I think he was talking about increments, I'm sure you will argue that they are not a payrise, but they increase take home pay, in my book that is a payrise. And yes, I know alot of people in the PS, and not one of them expects a payrise any time soon, and have little faith in the CP deal.

Absolutely. My understanding of the public sector system is that as you serve more time your pay goes up. (I presume that is what you mean by increments). So if say a teacher has 5 years experience then in 3 years time he'll be on more wages. If a civil engineer in the private sector has 5 years experience he'll be lucky to be on the same level of wages in 3 years time. therefore in relative terms the public sector wage earner has got a wage increase.

George Orwell 1982 wrote: »

It has already happened in the public sector as well. They took roughly a 20% pay cut and they have agreed to a pay freeze until 2014.

And by the way Irish public sector unions have been the most passive in Europe accepting paycuts, pension levies, freezes on promotion and recruitment and tax increases. Ireland has been used as an example for other countries in how to "take the pain" lying down. Witness the 2 million protesting in France because they want to raise the retirement age to 62.

This is a national trait found not only in the public sector. We take things lying down and grumble about them down the pub and on internet forums. And anyway didn't they all go on strike and carry out work to rule before getting the Croke Park agreement?

gurramok · 10-09-2010 11:41AM

If you're on low pay for your role and never enjoyed the fruits of pay increases in past years, the freeze should not apply.

If you enjoyed constant pay increases over the years to been overpaid for your role, a pay freeze applies.

Head The Wall · 10-09-2010 11:47AM

George Orwell 1982 wrote: »

It has already happened in the public sector as well. They took roughly a 20% pay cut and they have agreed to a pay freeze until 2014.

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D What planet are you on.

It was an average of 7% and they also have to pay some more for their pension (:eek:) which is tax deductible and it's easy to agree to a pay freeze when you know you will still get increments

liammur · 10-09-2010 12:14PM

Head The Wall wrote: »

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D What planet are you on.

It was an average of 7% and they also have to pay some more for their pension (:eek:) which is tax deductible and it's easy to agree to a pay freeze when you know you will still get increments

I doubt the younger members of the PS will get anything like they are being promised in their future pensions.

It boils down to whether your employer can afford a pay rise or not. Most can't.

ParkRunner · 10-09-2010 12:16PM

The stats for Earning and Labour Costs Q4 2009 - Q1 2010 have been released and sum up the hit taken by public sector workers in the last budget:

Weekly earnings in the private sector fell by 2.8% compared with a fall
of 5.5% in the public sector. The Q1 2010 estimates reflects the
decreases in public sector pay rates announced in the Budget in
December 2009. Earnings in the public sector are, however calculated
before deduction of the pension levy that was introduced in March
2009.

http://www.cso.ie/releasespublications/documents/earnings/current/earnlabcosts.pdf

Brussels Sprout · 10-09-2010 12:24PM

EF wrote: »

The stats for Earning and Labour Costs Q4 2009 - Q1 2010 have been released and sum up the hit taken by public sector workers in the last budget:

http://www.cso.ie/releasespublications/documents/earnings/current/earnlabcosts.pdf

What would be more interesting would be to see cuts in wages since say May 2007 as a lot of the cuts and job losses in the private sector would have happened before Q4 in 2009

liammur · 10-09-2010 12:25PM

EF wrote: »

The stats for Earning and Labour Costs Q4 2009 - Q1 2010 have been released and sum up the hit taken by public sector workers in the last budget:

http://www.cso.ie/releasespublications/documents/earnings/current/earnlabcosts.pdf

Public sector workers clearly need to take more cuts as their employer is virtually bust. I don't buy into this public v private sector debate at all.

Mister men · 10-09-2010 12:37PM

Pay freezes :pac: When are people going to realise we are broke as a nation. We don't need pay freezes we need huge pay cuts across the board..private and public. I know several people in the private sector who are on 60k+ and ditto for the public sector. No one needs to be on that sort of money. Of course these type of earners won't be touched by the recession in real world terms (no heat,food,unable to pay rent etc...) it will be minimum wage and the low paid who will suffer the most.

We have'nt seen the start of this thing really hitting hard yet but it's coming no doubt.

liammur · 10-09-2010 12:41PM

Mister men wrote: »

Pay freezes :pac: When are people going to realise we are broke as a nation. We don't need pay freezes we need huge pay cuts across the board..private and public. I know several people in the private sector who are on 60k+ and ditto for the public sector. No one needs to be on that sort of money. Of course these type of earners won't be touched by the recession in real world terms (no heat,food,unable to pay rent etc...) it will be minimum wage and the low paid who will suffer the most.

We have'nt seen the start of this thing really hitting hard yet but it's coming no doubt.

€60K isn't that much. It depends on your net worth to the business.
I would agree things will get a whole deal harder though.

mikemac · 10-09-2010 12:48PM

That person on 60k may be a fine salesman and bringing 5 million euro worth of business.

You don't know their job and you don't know their value.
Their private sector manager will decide their pay and their bonus and I don't see how others can judge it.

If management need to cut staff costs to be competitive they'll do it and if they need good salary packages to get the best staff they will do that too.

Tora Bora · 10-09-2010 12:56PM

feelingstressed wrote: »

That person on 60k may be a fine salesman and bringing 5 million euro worth of business.

You don't know their job and you don't know their value.
Their private sector manager will decide their pay and their bonus and I don't see how others can judge it.

If management need to cut staff costs to be competitive they'll do it and if they need good salary packages to get the best staff they will do that too.

As per poor, down trodden, under valued Pat Kenny:D Did you read the manure he spouted out in last Sindo:cool: Himself and Marian Finucane, should be earning as much as the Man Utd players:P:P:P

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

Shows you more than the builders, bankers and developers retain their sense of worth

Pay freeze

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