Does this make sense?

Big Mouth · 07-09-2010 05:51PM #1

Firstly, I ask people to FULLY READ my post before screaming "racist" bla bla bla.

In my opinion I would like Ireland to close its doors to the immigrant masses and preserve its ancient and unique culture (As many countries have).

Personally I think it Multi-cultaralism has to have a limit, Ireland I feel is reaching that limit now.

Don't get me wrong, I'm neither Racist or xenophobic and I love to travel to other countries to immerse myself in different cultures and love to meet people from Buenos Aires to Beijing.

I just think the world is becoming to small too quick.

If people could please stick to either agreeing or disagreeing with my views along with their reasons.

And anyone who wants counteract other posters then please start another thread. Thanks

stumpypeeps · 07-09-2010 05:55PM

Big Mouth wrote: »

Firstly, I ask people to FULLY READ my post before screaming "racist" bla bla bla.

In my opinion I would like Ireland to close its doors to the immigrant masses and preserve its ancient and unique culture (As many countries have).

Personally I think it Multi-cultaralism has to have a limit, Ireland I feel is reaching that limit now.

Don't get me wrong, I'm neither Racist or xenophobic and I love to travel to other countries to immerse myself in different cultures and love to meet people from Buenos Aires to Beijing.

I just think the world is becoming to small too quick.

If people could please stick to either agreeing or disagreeing with my views along with their reasons.

And anyone who wants counteract other posters then please start another thread. Thanks

I don't think the issue is the immigrant masses. Its more one of integration.

gandalf · 07-09-2010 06:09PM

But you are ignoring the fact that our ancient and unique culture is the result of the mixing of races and ideas. By taking the actions you prescribe you will stifle the development of our culture?

Lenny Lovett · 07-09-2010 06:46PM

So we (Irish) have been free to travel all over the world and work and earn money and prosper but we should deny that right to anyone who wants to come to our country and do likewise? Ireland (and it's people) need to open up our minds to new ideas and embrace change. Or else we'll stay in the old fashioned insular world that it has been. I've been lucky to work and live in several countries aroundto the world over the past twenty years and see it as a great privelage. I will happily welcome foreigeners here who have something to add our country.

Einhard · 07-09-2010 07:12PM

No it doesn't make sense, and is slightly racist, but possibly only because you haven't articulated it very well. You talk of Ireland having reached the limit of multi-culturalism, yet fail to define that limit or how it should be measured. Indeed, you seem to misunderstand the concept of multi-culturalism itself. There's a big difference between having an immigrant population, and being a multi-cultural society in the English style. The former, I believe, is a very good thing for any society, the latter can, admittedly, lead to problems and tensions. The key is not to start cracking down on immigration, but to ensure that immigrants integrate once they arrive here. And, for a number of reasons, I think we can have an easier time of this than England or France.

demonspawn · 07-09-2010 07:32PM

Big Mouth wrote: »

In my opinion I would like Ireland to close its doors to the immigrant masses and preserve its ancient and unique culture (As many countries have).

I reckon you're about 700 years too late on that one.

Personally I think it Multi-cultaralism has to have a limit, Ireland I feel is reaching that limit now.

Good thing the personal opinion of one man won't drive changes to our country's legislation. Democracy in action.

Don't get me wrong, I'm neither Racist or xenophobic and I love to travel to other countries to immerse myself in different cultures and love to meet people from Buenos Aires to Beijing.

Your objections to multiculturalism are based solely on race and culture. Why should I have to travel to Beijing to get a Chinese takeaway? That's just ridiculous?

I just think the world is becoming to small too quick.

The world has always been small, we just weren't able to realize it until recently.

demonspawn · 07-09-2010 07:35PM

By the way, racism simply means differentiating between people based solely on their race. It doesn't necessarily have to have negative connotations, but in this thread it certainly does as you seem to have the idea that other races should not live in our country. That's negative racism.

amacachi · 07-09-2010 07:38PM

Couldn't disagree more, the sooner old lines on maps become more irrelevant than they already are, the better.

deise go deo · 07-09-2010 07:50PM

Concidering what Irish culture has survived in the past Im not worried about Multicultralism being a threat to it. Certinally not worried enough to deny people from other countries the oppertunaty to come and live here.

sponsoredwalk · 07-09-2010 07:51PM

Unless your post was written as Gaeilge in a manner more colloquial to it's
original inception every single word of your post loses all credibility &
you show yourself to be extremely bigoted due to ignorance.
I'm sure you were lauding France for what it did to the Roma people despite
having much evidence to back up their claims.

Lenny Lovett · 07-09-2010 08:08PM

Einhard wrote: »

The key is not to start cracking down on immigration, but to ensure that immigrants integrate once they arrive here. And, for a number of reasons, I think we can have an easier time of this than England or France.

Spot on there Einhard. We could take many lessons on how not to do it from England. England not only allowed mass immigration from Asia and the Carribbean in the sixties and seventies but tended to house the immigrants in set areas. For example, today, Bradford is almost 55% Kashmiri Pakistani. East Leeds and parts of Lancashire tend to be concentrated Sikh communities. Parts of South London around Brixton tend to be dominated by Afro Carribbean and so on. Thus they have created ghettos and young people in those areas (born in the UK) are growing up extremely territorial and tending to drive out people who are not of their origin. Now, we need to ensure that immigrants to Ireland are integrated into all neighbourhoods and schoold etc so that we encourage a cross community and our kids grow up without the prejudices of their parents.

Brussels Sprout · 07-09-2010 08:25PM

Big Mouth wrote: »

Don't get me wrong, I'm neither Racist or xenophobic

I knew this line was coming

sponsoredwalk · 07-09-2010 08:30PM

Lol I expected it too, but I also expected a "I'm neither Racist or xenophobic but..."
but there never was the but

I was tempted to reply saying this already but just closed the page instead,
you've inspired me to mention it, it's the first I've seen of it's kind, this rare specimen :P

Big Mouth · 07-09-2010 08:52PM

Lenny Lovett wrote: »

Spot on there Einhard. We could take many lessons on how not to do it from England. England not only allowed mass immigration from Asia and the Carribbean in the sixties and seventies but tended to house the immigrants in set areas. For example, today, Bradford is almost 55% Kashmiri Pakistani. East Leeds and parts of Lancashire tend to be concentrated Sikh communities. Parts of South London around Brixton tend to be dominated by Afro Carribbean and so on. Thus they have created ghettos and young people in those areas (born in the UK) are growing up extremely territorial and tending to drive out people who are not of their origin. Now, we need to ensure that immigrants to Ireland are integrated into all neighbourhoods and schoold etc so that we encourage a cross community and our kids grow up without the prejudices of their parents.

Just because I don't want the likes of the above examples too happen in Ireland it makes me racist? Even though I stated I love visiting countries all over the world and meeting different people of all race and creed.

What country in the world has intergration ever worked well?

England? No.....USA? No.....France? No.....there is some merit in what I am saying so don't try brush it off as "Racism".

And I happen to like the Eastern European, Nigerian, etc peoples we have in Ireland, however, the current wave of immigration can't continue. In then years time when there are ghettos in Parnell Street and other places you might change your tune.

Bottle_of_Smoke · 07-09-2010 09:03PM

Big Mouth wrote: »

Just because I don't want the likes of the above examples too happen in Ireland it makes me racist? Even though I stated I love visiting countries all over the world and meeting different people of all race and creed.

Sorry mate. Unless you're an out and out liberal who wants everyone on the planet welcomed here no questions asked you're a bigoted racist who hates everyone who's even slightly different.

There's no middle ground on this board. Do yourself a favour and forget about this thread before your eyes start to bleed

demonspawn · 07-09-2010 09:03PM

Big Mouth wrote: »

What country in the world has intergration ever worked well?

Racism does not allow for integration. The racists in this country and others force these people into separate communities and try to convince everyone that this is what must be done to protect our "cultural identity". Or they straight up refuse to accept these immigrants and demand they be returned to their own countries.

Tell me, when has segregation and apartheid ever worked? Do you remember the civil rights movement in the U.S. in the 60s? South Africa ring any bells? Racism begets violence and hatred, nothing more. Acceptance and understanding begets peace and integration.

sponsoredwalk · 07-09-2010 09:08PM

Immigration is declining, I'm getting the whiff of Irish Aryanism :pac:

demonspawn · 07-09-2010 09:17PM

sponsoredwalk wrote: »

Immigration is declining, I'm getting the whiff of Irish Aryanism :pac:

Nope, they've just figured out this country isn't worth moving to anymore. You can't make money here as an immigrant, or at least not enough to put up with the bullsh*t we all have to put up with on a daily basis.

The only appeal this country has is it's welfare system but most immigrants come here to work, not mooch off the state. No work so no point in coming.

sponsoredwalk · 07-09-2010 09:21PM

But I keep reading on boards that they are all here on a free lunch to
mooch off the generous welfare & take all that they can get without working
a day for any of it???

I'm so confused

Big Mouth · 07-09-2010 09:22PM

demonspawn wrote: »

Nope, they've just figured out this country isn't worth moving to anymore. You can't make money here as an immigrant, or at least not enough to put up with the bullsh*t we all have to put up with on a daily basis.

The only appeal this country has is it's welfare system but most immigrants come here to work, not mooch off the state. No work so no point in coming.

Looks like I have nothing to worry about then, I take most immigrants will leave this hell hole society in search of greener pastures.........And you think I look foolish!!

Frogeye · 07-09-2010 09:23PM

Lenny Lovett wrote: »

So we (Irish) have been free to travel all over the world and work and earn money and prosper but we should deny that right to anyone who wants to come to our country and do likewise? Ireland (and it's people) need to open up our minds to new ideas and embrace change. Or else we'll stay in the old fashioned insular world that it has been. I've been lucky to work and live in several countries aroundto the world over the past twenty years and see it as a great privelage. I will happily welcome foreigeners here who have something to add our country.

Hey Lenny. Agree with that people who have something to add are welcome but I don't think some people want to add. They just stay in their own groups and don't mix and don't want to mix. We need to make it easy for them to integrate but they need to make efforts too.

I don't think we are free to travel and work all over the world. I needed visas for Oz, Pakistan, India, Saudi ........America isn't that open anymore....Okay we have the choice to try and go to these place so in that way we are free but its not like we can arrive on anywhere we want and open up shop and away we go

In general I think Irish people are quite open .If your nice to me , I'll be nice to you is the attitude I see around.

I'll tell you one thing, when the local "imigrant" lad ( be he roma, polish, fillipino or whatever) is knocking in 2-4 every sunday for the local hurling team he won't be long being integrated. The big problem is getting him into hurling in the first place! The GAA could be the solution! Serioously. Local organisation, always looking for recruits especially in rural areas.

Wolfe Tone · 07-09-2010 09:32PM

Just make sure that they are not just coming here to abuse social welfare and that they actually want to contribute to our society and become a part of it, rather than a distinct "ghetto" section of it.

demonspawn · 07-09-2010 09:41PM

Big Mouth wrote: »

Looks like I have nothing to worry about then, I take most immigrants will leave this hell hole society in search of greener pastures.........And you think I look foolish!!

Well, I'm actually planning on moving to the UK or elsewhere for a couple of years to save some money up, as are thousands of young Irish people. I may even give Poland a shot, they have teh sexy womens. What's your point exactly?

demonspawn · 07-09-2010 09:44PM

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

Just make sure that they are not just coming here to abuse social welfare and that they actually want to contribute to our society and become a part of it, rather than a distinct "ghetto" section of it.

Name me one "ghetto" that was created by the people that were forced to live in them. Name one. Oh, maybe you mean you don't want a Chinatown or a Little Italy type place in this country? Why not exactly? Those places make tons of money for the city of New York as tourist destinations. Rather unfortunate choice of words there.

Edit: We should go destroy the Japanese gardens down in Kildare. How dare those Japanese come and build their fancy gardens in our country. Are our gardens not good enough?

sponsoredwalk · 07-09-2010 09:47PM

demonspawn wrote: »

they have teh sexy womens.

+100

demonspawn · 07-09-2010 09:51PM

sponsoredwalk wrote: »

+100

You should see the Lithuanians. I worked at a shop in Dublin with a Lithuanian girl, she was unbelievably hot and she even talked to me every day! I helped her practice her English but was too shy to ask her out.

Bring on the immigrants I say!! The more the sexier!

sponsoredwalk · 07-09-2010 09:53PM

Haha, as did I but she was like 40-ish and not exactly milf material

Some of the Polish girls I worked with though, :eek::D

demonspawn · 07-09-2010 09:56PM

Romanian girls are inexplicably good looking, I mean loads of them are. It's just not statistically possible.

My manager was a 35ish year old redheaded Romanian....married though. Anyone who lived in north side Dublin a few years ago and shopped in the Favorite Checkout on Dorset St. knows who I mean.

Wolfe Tone · 07-09-2010 09:56PM

demonspawn wrote: »

Name me one "ghetto" that was created by the people that were forced to live in them. Name one. Oh, maybe you mean you don't want a Chinatown or a Little Italy type place in this country? Why not exactly? Those places make tons of money for the city of New York as tourist destinations. Rather unfortunate choice of words there.

Edit: We should go destroy the Japanese gardens down in Kildare. How dare those Japanese come and build their fancy gardens in our country. Are our gardens not good enough?

Might want to read what I said again.

society and become a part of it, rather than a distinct "ghetto" section of it.

As in we need to make sure sure that they integrate and not just keep to themselves.

Folllow?

demonspawn · 07-09-2010 10:03PM

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

Might want to read what I said again. As in we need to make sure sure that they integrate and not just keep to themselves.

Folllow?

You have no idea what a ghetto is do you? It's an area of a town or city where "undesirable" people are forced to live to segregate them from the rest of society. Blacks in apartheid South Africa were forced to live in ghettos, Jews in Germany, blacks in the U.S., most immigrants in the UK...follow?

As I said, an unfortunate choice of words. And so what if they want to live in their own neighborhoods? What difference does it make to you? They are still contributing to society, they just have better neighbors.

sponsoredwalk · 07-09-2010 10:04PM

The way I've seen foreign people treated in this country at times it's no
surprise that they would want to stick together. I'd prefer to let people
choose how they want to live, if they want to stick together then that's
fine, I think we want to ask ourselves why they'd prefer to stay together
than mix in with society.

Does this make sense?

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