Not guilty. The Israeli captain who killed Palestinian schoolgirl

Nodin · 01-09-2010 11:19AM

I remember this quite well. However I don't see why its been resurrected to a thread of its own some 5 years later....

Micky Dolenz · 01-09-2010 09:32PM

Horndawg wrote: »

Mickey Dolenz.

Quite simply. You're a c**t.

So Mickey, to refer to another post as a typical example of a reaction you'd expect from an Irish person on this subject matter is beyond ignorant, dismissive and arrogant with regard to the facts of the subject matter of the discussion.

It is a typical example of a reaction I'd expect from an a lot of Irish people myself included and a fair few people I know, I would actually say most of the people I know would have an automatic emotional response to an Israeli attack on a Palestinian. not so much the other way around .

You are a case in point. You showed very little reasoning or understanding to the posts I had made and slightly missed my point. You responded in confrontational and emotive language. Discounting all possibility of reasonable discussion. I could go over it again but Einhard summed up my feelings quite well so I won't.

Look, no one here is defending the killing and it was a horrible thing that happening. But there is a bigger picture, there are facts we will never know because that's the way it is. I for one want as many facts as I can gather before I call for heads.

FlutterinBantam · 01-09-2010 09:38PM

Sadly when a population supports suicide bombers and terrorists, there will always be innocents killed as appears in this case.

Don't blame the soldier, blame the ballless punters who send young women into the state of Israel with explosives strapped to their bodies.

wes · 01-09-2010 09:42PM

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Sadly when a population supports suicide bombers and terrorists, there will always be innocents killed as appears in this case.

Don't blame the soldier, blame the ballless punters who send young women into the state of Israel with explosives strapped to their bodies.

So its someone else fault...... Can't say I am surprised that someone would make such a claim. As I said earlier the same reasoning could easily be applied to Hamas, but would be just as faulty.

FlutterinBantam · 01-09-2010 10:06PM

wes wrote: »

So its someone else fault...... Can't say I am surprised that someone would make such a claim. As I said earlier the same reasoning could easily be applied to Hamas, but would be just as faulty.

Incorrect my friend.

If an ethos of suicide bombing and terrorism is tacitly accepted by a group,then the defending force has to treat any unauthorised incursion as potentially life threatening and take appropriate action.

Sad but true.

wes · 01-09-2010 10:14PM

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Incorrect my friend.

If an ethos of suicide bombing and terrorism is tacitly accepted by a group,then the defending force has to treat any unauthorised incursion as potentially life threatening and take appropriate action.

Sad but true.

Yes, and you can easily say the exact same about you know Israeli's who vote for there government, and the settlers who are in the West Bank and East Jerusalem illegally under international law. The reasoning is still faulty, and you are just making excuses for one sides violence as per usual. At the end of the day Hamas are responsible for what they do, and the IDF are responsible for what they do. Trying to pass on the blame doesn't help anything and is pretty ridiculous.

FlutterinBantam · 01-09-2010 10:18PM

wes wrote: »

Yes, and you can easily say the exact same about you know Israeli's who vote for there government, and the settlers who are in the West Bank and East Jerusalem illegally under international law. The reasoning is still faulty, and you are just making excuses for one sides violence as per usual. At the end of the day Hamas are responsible for what they do, and the IDF are responsible for what they do. Trying to pass on the blame doesn't help anything and is pretty ridiculous.

Trying to evaluate a single case without taking into account the context and prevailing circumstances is certainly ridiculous.

wes · 01-09-2010 10:25PM

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Trying to evaluate a single case without taking into account the context and prevailing circumstances is certainly ridiculous.

No, what is ridiculous is the fact that you have no problem making excuses for a murderer and trying to blame someone else. I am well aware of the context, but context is no excuse for either sides murderers.

As I said before, your reasoning can easily apply to Hamas and there reasoning for killing Israeli's. So basically, if we are to follow your reasoning, everyone gets to blame someone else.

FlutterinBantam · 01-09-2010 10:38PM

wes wrote: »

No, what is ridiculous is the fact that you have no problem making excuses for a murderer and trying to blame someone else. I am well aware of the context, but context is no excuse for either sides murderers.

As I said before, your reasoning can easily apply to Hamas and there reasoning for killing Israeli's. So basically, if we are to follow your reasoning, everyone gets to blame someone else.

Can't quite follow your reasoning pal, was someone in this situation convicted of murder?

Or are you just applying your own ideas to the situation.

Last I heard the thread topic referred to the killing of a young girl, I'm not making excuses for anyone ,just pointing out the circumstances of the event under discussion.

wes · 02-09-2010 02:29AM

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Can't quite follow your reasoning pal, was someone in this situation convicted of murder?

Or are you just applying your own ideas to the situation.

Its pretty clear that it was murder and that as per usual a IDF murderer was let off. You see Israel has a habit of letting there murderer's and terrorists off scot free or with a slap on the wrist. Doesn't for a second change what they did. You see the IDF have a habit of killing innocent people, and as such I see no reason why I shouldn't call a spade a spade. I don't buy into the apologetic's offered up for the IDF and Israel in general, a murderer in a uniform is still a murderer. I see no reason to sugar coat that.

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Last I heard the thread topic referred to the killing of a young girl, I'm not making excuses for anyone ,just pointing out the circumstances of the event under discussion.

Yes, you were actually making excuses, and now you are denying it:

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Don't blame the soldier, blame the ballless punters who send young women into the state of Israel with explosives strapped to their bodies.

You say not to blame the soldier, which sounds just like an excuse. In fact a common excuse for IDF atrocities in general actually, about how it isn't really there fault.

FlutterinBantam · 02-09-2010 07:45AM

wes wrote: »

Its pretty clear that it was murder and that as per usual a IDF murderer was let off. You see Israel has a habit of letting there murderer's and terrorists off scot free or with a slap on the wrist. Doesn't for a second change what they did. You see the IDF have a habit of killing innocent people, and as such I see no reason why I shouldn't call a spade a spade. I don't buy into the apologetic's offered up for the IDF and Israel in general, a murderer in a uniform is still a murderer. I see no reason to sugar coat that.

Yes, you were actually making excuses, and now you are denying it:

You say not to blame the soldier, which sounds just like an excuse. In fact a common excuse for IDF atrocities in general actually, about how it isn't really there fault.

I really feel you should temper your language, which doesn't contribute to reasoned debate.

I am not making excuses for anyone. Was someone convicted of murder?

General rhetoric and ill judged sweeping statements do nothing to advance your argument.

The people I do blame are the faceless terrorists who send out innocent young people with bomb kits strapped to their bodies.

This is the context and situation which leads to situations like this,and you know that very well.

Trying to put out a smokescreen and putting words into my mouth won't change that.

ch750536 · 02-09-2010 08:06AM

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

I really feel you should temper your language, which doesn't contribute to reasoned debate.

I am not making excuses for anyone. Was someone convicted of murder?

General rhetoric and ill judged sweeping statements do nothing to advance your argument.

The people I do blame are the faceless terrorists who send out innocent young people with bomb kits strapped to their bodies.

This is the context and situation which leads to situations like this,and you know that very well.

Trying to put out a smokescreen and putting words into my mouth won't change that.

Can you imagine how bad life must be that you would even contemplate strapping a bomb on to your daughter and sending her out? Maybe if they had something to live for things would be a little more peaceful.

The history of the area is easy to see and read, unfortunately jewish ownership of large parts of the worlds media skews what most people see. There are some extremely good reporters out there, just look them up.

The IDF is the only advanced army that has orders to kill anything in an exclusion zone, which has been called but not yet passed as a war crime. They even shoot dogs in the exclusion zone. Suicide dog bombers anyone?

FlutterinBantam · 02-09-2010 08:18AM

ch750536 wrote: »

Can you imagine how bad life must be that you would even contemplate strapping a bomb on to your daughter and sending her out? Maybe if they had something to live for things would be a little more peaceful.

The history of the area is easy to see and read, unfortunately jewish ownership of large parts of the worlds media skews what most people see. There are some extremely good reporters out there, just look them up.

The IDF is the only advanced army that has orders to kill anything in an exclusion zone, which has been called but not yet passed as a war crime. They even shoot dogs in the exclusion zone. Suicide dog bombers anyone?

All valid points.

I am not trying to justify anything in history.

My point is the situation in this thread and the use of inflammatory language and sweeping generalisations.

Setting oneself up as the sole judge of what happened when one wasn't there , and dismissing any context which might be prevalent, doesn't seem to me to be reasoned debate.

Smacks of entrenchment and close mindedness.

galwayrush · 02-09-2010 08:19AM

ch750536 wrote: »

Can you imagine how bad life must be that you would even contemplate strapping a bomb on to your daughter and sending her out? Maybe if they had something to live for things would be a little more peaceful.

?

Bloody hell,it would take one hell of a sick bastard to do that to their daughter:eek:

the_syco · 02-09-2010 10:21AM

Sanjuro wrote: »

It doesn't matter what side you're on, what politics you follow, or what god you believe in. It takes a sick fucking mind to be able to unload a magazine into a thirteen year old child.

Don't you mean "unload a magazine into a dead thirteen year old child."? This shows that the guy has some major anger issues. It's not just a case of killing her, it's also a case of dumping his anger into her dead lifless corpse.

Also, why did she go close to the Israeli base? Sadly, it sounds like "suicide by cop" if she went by her own free will.

dlofnep wrote: »

There's always one who'll look for a way to justify the murder of a child.

I'm looking at it as a POV of murder. I'm trying to figure out why the kid went there, and what caused her to retreat? If she was sacred going there, was she sacred due to the IDF, or scared as someone had forced her to go there?

nice1franko wrote: »

A lot of the IDF soldiers openly hold nothing but contempt for Palestinians.

They have contempt for each other. Nothing surprising there.

KyussBishop wrote: »

How can that be justified by 'standard operating procedure', i.e. the confirming kill thing mentioned in the article?

As the saying goes: do your job, or we'll find someone who will.

General Zod wrote: »

he never stood trial for murder.

What was he charged with?

nice1franko wrote: »

"I was only following orders" doesn't cut it anymore. The Israelis, of all people, should know that.

maybe we're talking about the soldier not getting charged. If those are his orders, he won't get charged for following them by the court that made the laws.

wes wrote: »

You see Israel has a habit of letting there murderer's and terrorists off scot free or with a slap on the wrist.

As opposed to the other side celebrating the results of their "heroes". Both sides are as bad as each other.

ch750536 wrote: »

Can you imagine how bad life must be that you would even contemplate strapping a bomb on to your daughter and sending her out? Maybe if they had something to live for things would be a little more peaceful.

That they hate their enemy so much, that they see their kids not as their children, but as future instruments of war?

ch750536 wrote: »

They even shoot dogs in the exclusion zone. Suicide dog bombers anyone?

No doubt everyone knows this, so again, why did the kid go there?

Nodin wrote: »

I remember this quite well. However I don't see why its been resurrected to a thread of its own some 5 years later....

Why indeed?

Nodin · 02-09-2010 11:21AM

the_syco wrote: »

Don't you mean "unload a magazine into a dead thirteen year old child."? This shows that the guy has some major anger issues. It's not just a case of killing her, it's also a case of dumping his anger into her dead lifless corpse.

Also, why did she go close to the Israeli base? Sadly, it sounds like "suicide by cop" if she went by her own free will.

It was on the way to school. The case is well documented. I suggest looking it up.

Sanjuro · 02-09-2010 11:35AM

the_syco wrote: »

Don't you mean "unload a magazine into a dead thirteen year old child."? This shows that the guy has some major anger issues. It's not just a case of killing her, it's also a case of dumping his anger into her dead lifless corpse.

Alive, dead, what's the difference? The whole notion of proportionality is something that needs to be addressed.

wes · 02-09-2010 01:18PM

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

I really feel you should temper your language, which doesn't contribute to reasoned debate.

I am not making excuses for anyone. Was someone convicted of murder?

Yes, you did make an excuse, you decided to put the blame on someone else.
Personally, I think such excuses do not contribute to reasoned debate. The language is perfectly appropriate the IDF are no better than Hamas terrorists, and are well known to kill innocent civilians. I see no reason to sugar coat things.

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

General rhetoric and ill judged sweeping statements do nothing to advance your argument.

Excuses for murderers actually do that. Calling a spade a spade on the other hand is a perfectly good idea. Personally, the constant attempts to absolve the IDF are a bad idea. Instead of taking the sane step and condemning both sides when they kill innocents, you actually try and blame someone else for the IDFs crimes, which in turn make those who support Israel look pretty bad.

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

The people I do blame are the faceless terrorists who send out innocent young people with bomb kits strapped to their bodies.

This is the context and situation which leads to situations like this,and you know that very well.

Repeating an excuses, doesn't stop it being an excuse. I could just as easily blame everything on Israel, seeing as there the ones doing the occupying. See its very easy to make excuses, and you know just as well that Israel occupation can lead to such situations, see I can do it too.

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Trying to put out a smokescreen and putting words into my mouth won't change that.

You are making a clear excuses for the brutal murder of a 13 year old girl, which you refuse to call murder and then try and blame someone else for it. Yes you are making excuses for the IDF, an organization well versed in murdering innocent civilians.

Personally, the constant excuses and obfuscation that are used for the IDF murderers doesn't do Israel any favors, and in fact make those who defend Israel look extremely bad.

wes · 02-09-2010 01:21PM

the_syco wrote: »

As opposed to the other side celebrating the results of their "heroes". Both sides are as bad as each other.

Yes, and where did I say otherwise? I know Israeli's have a habit of celebrating there "heroes" as well btw. How exactly does that change a thing I said? I was replying to someone making excuses for one side of the conflict.

the_syco · 02-09-2010 06:01PM

Sanjuro wrote: »

Alive, dead, what's the difference? The whole notion of proportionality is something that needs to be addressed.

Pumping a full mag into a living person can be seen as ensuring the living person dies. Pumping a full mag into a dead person shows there's something wrong with the dude.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 02-09-2010 06:18PM

Nodin wrote: »

It was on the way to school. The case is well documented. I suggest looking it up.

Then I take it the post is responsible for shooting children on a daily basis, or was an exception made for this child?.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 02-09-2010 06:23PM

the_syco wrote: »

Pumping a full mag into a living person can be seen as ensuring the living person dies. Pumping a full mag into a dead person shows there's something wrong with the dude.

This is the part I don't get either.

Was this accepted into evidence, and is it just the reported word of a doctor in Rapha hospital?.

Who recovered the body?.

As I said earlier in the thread, regardless of the weapons rate of fire it actually takes a lot of time to accurately fire that amount of rounds at a person. And for the life of me I can't understand whats inside the mind of a person who can put three rounds into the head of a child at point blank range - to my thinking thats twisted and sick beyond repair.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 02-09-2010 06:32PM

ch750536 wrote: »

Can you imagine how bad life must be that you would even contemplate strapping a bomb on to your daughter and sending her out? Maybe if they had something to live for things would be a little more peaceful.

I've spoken to well heeled, middle class Lebanese businessmen who told me they'd be very happy to send their children off to die as 'martyr's.

This was during the start of the second intifada when innocent Israeli's were being slaughtered by suicide bombers almost daily.

ch750536 wrote: »

The IDF is the only advanced army that has orders to kill anything in an exclusion zone

No its not.. Try break into an army barracks here in Ireland and see what happens to you.

ch750536 wrote: »

which has been called but not yet passed as a war crime.

By who, you?.

ch750536 wrote: »

They even shoot dogs in the exclusion zone. Suicide dog bombers anyone?

Maybe a better suggestion would be to call out the dog warden?.

Nodin · 02-09-2010 07:51PM

Riya Raspy Sinkhole wrote: »

I've spoken to well heeled, middle class Lebanese businessmen who told me they'd be very happy to send their children off to die as 'martyr's.

Well that justifies everything then. Lets get that carved in stone for the next time they shoot a few kids.

Riya Raspy Sinkhole wrote: »

This was during the start of the second intifada when innocent Israeli's were being slaughtered by suicide bombers almost daily..

The second intifada started late 2000. The child was shot in October 2004, so no, it wasn't "during the start of the second intifada".

Secondly the suicide attacks were almost entirely by male adults and were conducted within Israel.

Riya Raspy Sinkhole wrote: »

No its not.. Try break into an army barracks here in Ireland and see what happens to you...

So the Irish army shoots 10 year olds now?

The official account claimed that Iman was shot as she walked towards an army post with her schoolbag because soldiers feared she was carrying a bomb.
But the tape recording of the radio conversation between soldiers at the scene reveals that, from the beginning, she was identified as a child and at no point was a bomb spoken about nor was she described as a threat. Iman was also at least 100 yards from any soldier.
Instead, the tape shows that the soldiers swiftly identified her as a "girl of about 10" who was "scared to death".
The tape also reveals that the soldiers said Iman was headed eastwards, away from the army post and back into the refugee camp, when she was shot.
At that point, Captain R took the unusual decision to leave the post in pursuit of the girl. He shot her dead and then "confirmed the kill" by emptying his magazine into her body.
The tape recording is of a three-way conversation between the army watchtower, the army post's operations room and the captain, who was a company commander.
The soldier in the watchtower radioed his colleagues after he saw Iman: "It's a little girl. She's running defensively eastward."
Operations room: "Are we talking about a girl under the age of 10?"
Watchtower: "A girl of about 10, she's behind the embankment, scared to death."
A few minutes later, Iman is shot in the leg from one of the army posts.
The watchtower: "I think that one of the positions took her out."
The company commander then moves in as Iman lies wounded and helpless.
Captain R: "I and another soldier ... are going in a little nearer, forward, to confirm the kill ... Receive a situation report. We fired and killed her ... I also confirmed the kill. Over."
Witnesses described how the captain shot Iman twice in the head, walked away, turned back and fired a stream of bullets into her body. Doctors at Rafah's hospital said she had been shot at least 17 times. On the tape, the company commander then "clarifies" why he killed Iman: "This is commander. Anything that's mobile, that moves in the zone, even if it's a three-year-old, needs to be killed. Over."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2004/nov/24/israel

Riya Raspy Sinkhole wrote: »

Maybe a better suggestion would be to call out the dog warden?.

Well theres certainly some dogs there that needed reining in.

FlutterinBantam · 02-09-2010 08:54PM

wes wrote: »

Yes, you did make an excuse, you decided to put the blame on someone else.
Personally, I think such excuses do not contribute to reasoned debate. The language is perfectly appropriate the IDF are no better than Hamas terrorists, and are well known to kill innocent civilians. I see no reason to sugar coat things.

Excuses for murderers actually do that. Calling a spade a spade on the other hand is a perfectly good idea. Personally, the constant attempts to absolve the IDF are a bad idea. Instead of taking the sane step and condemning both sides when they kill innocents, you actually try and blame someone else for the IDFs crimes, which in turn make those who support Israel look pretty bad.

Repeating an excuses, doesn't stop it being an excuse. I could just as easily blame everything on Israel, seeing as there the ones doing the occupying. See its very easy to make excuses, and you know just as well that Israel occupation can lead to such situations, see I can do it too.

You are making a clear excuses for the brutal murder of a 13 year old girl, which you refuse to call murder and then try and blame someone else for it. Yes you are making excuses for the IDF, an organization well versed in murdering innocent civilians.

Personally, the constant excuses and obfuscation that are used for the IDF murderers doesn't do Israel any favors, and in fact make those who defend Israel look extremely bad.

Was anyone charged with murder in this case.

Was anyone convicted of murder.

You are deliberately trying to obfuscate and cloud the waters.

What you think and the opinions you hold, are of no relevance in this situation.

The facts are ,no one was convicted of murder.

Your cavalier use of the word 'murderers' does you no favours, merely serves to lump you into the coterie who look on conflict situations with the rheumy eyes of the fanatic and whose views are so flawed and biased as to be almost worthless.

Micky Dolenz · 02-09-2010 08:58PM

Lads, be civil please.

wes · 02-09-2010 09:11PM

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Was anyone charged with murder in this case.

Was anyone convicted of murder.

You are deliberately trying to obfuscate and cloud the waters.

I never claimed anyone was charged or convicted with murder.

I was just stating my personal opinion that it was murder, which isn't the same as saying someone was charged with murder. There is a difference.

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

What you think and the opinions you hold, are of no relevance in this situation.

The facts are ,no one was convicted of murder.

The lack of a conviction doesn't mean murder did not take place, and I made no claims of there being a conviction. Still reading the op's article clearly shows that a murder did take place, and as per usual the IDF chose to let there guy of scot free, which is something there known to do.

Secondly, if my opinion doesn't matter then your opinion regarding trying to blame anyone but the IDF is similarly irrelevant on the grounds of it just being your own opinion.

Now, what I would like to see is a 3rd party to investigate the matter, to decide on guilt, as opposed to Israel letting there own people off again. BTW, the same goes for the Palestinians, in regards to any crimes on there side in this conflict.

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Your cavalier use of the word 'murderers' does you no favours, merely serves to lump you into the coterie who look on conflict situations with the rheumy eyes of the fanatic and whose views are so flawed and biased as to be almost worthless.

A lot of nonsense as per usual and it always wonderful to see the murder of a 13 year old defended by those who will support Israel no matter what. The smart thing to do would be to of course condemn this horrible crime, but instead you actually try and defend it, and accuse me of bias, which is laughable.

I fully condemn both sides murderous violence, unlike yourself who has clearly chosen to excuse the horrific murder of a 13 year old girl for some bizarre reason, by trying to blame someone else. Honestly, those who defend Israel really go over board sometimes. The smart thing to do here would be to condemn both sides, and not try and defend one of the sides crimes.

The use of the word murder is perfectly accurate, and it is sadly something both sides do on a regular basis, and I think it very sad that anyone would try and excuse this. it doesn't help either side when an innocent is murdered and it certainly doesn't help things either when the person responsible is let of scot free and then defended.

Personally, I find that fact that anyone would choose to call this anything but murder pretty messed up, and I suppose I could even call anyone who hold such a position biased, but I rather not, as I think people can make up there own minds in that regard.

FlutterinBantam · 02-09-2010 09:38PM

wes wrote: »

I never claimed anyone was charged or convicted with murder.

I was just stating my personal opinion that it was murder, which isn't the same as saying someone was charged with murder. There is a difference.

The lack of a conviction doesn't mean murder did not take place, and I made no claims of there being a conviction. Still reading the op's article clearly shows that a murder did take place, and as per usual the IDF chose to let there guy of scot free, which is something there known to do.

Secondly, if my opinion doesn't matter then your opinion regarding trying to blame anyone but the IDF is similarly irrelevant on the grounds of it just being your own opinion.

Now, what I would like to see is a 3rd party to investigate the matter, to decide on guilt, as opposed to Israel letting there own people off again. BTW, the same goes for the Palestinians, in regards to any crimes on there side in this conflict.

A lot of nonsense as per usual and it always wonderful to see the murder of a 13 year old defended by those who will support Israel no matter what. The smart thing to do would be to of course condemn this horrible crime, but instead you actually try and defend it, and accuse me of bias, which is laughable.

I fully condemn both sides murderous violence, unlike yourself who has clearly chosen to excuse the horrific murder of a 13 year old girl for some bizarre reason, by trying to blame someone else. Honestly, those who defend Israel really go over board sometimes. The smart thing to do here would be to condemn both sides, and not try and defend one of the sides crimes.

The use of the word murder is perfectly accurate, and it is sadly something both sides do on a regular basis, and I think it very sad that anyone would try and excuse this. it doesn't help either side when an innocent is murdered and it certainly doesn't help things either when the person responsible is let of scot free and then defended.

Personally, I find that fact that anyone would choose to call this anything but murder pretty messed up, and I suppose I could even call anyone who hold such a position biased, but I rather not, as I think people can make up there own minds in that regard.

So in your opinion, even though you were not there , you can give a definitive decision that this was murder?

My point is that you ignore context, prevelant conditions, intelligence available to the soldiers,past history of attacks and you can still state categorically the this was murder.!!

Only in your last post do you change tack and say 'in your personal opinion'

Why not say that from the start.

Nodin · 02-09-2010 09:51PM

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

So in your opinion, even though you were not there , you can give a definitive decision that this was murder?
.

What would you call it? A child identified as no threat by soldiers is shot and finished off by a soldier.

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

My point is that you ignore context, prevelant conditions, intelligence available to the soldiers,past history of attacks and you can still state categorically the this was murder.!!
.

Actually, because theres a recording of what happened, yes, he can.

Nodin · 02-09-2010 10:01PM

Riya Raspy Sinkhole wrote: »

Well The Saint seen it as an invite, so yea - you bottled it.

There'll be other's no doubt, maybe next time.. We'll have a right ol' knee's up.

No, I didn't. I didn't respond and - contrary to being included in

You all went on about attending an anti-Operations Cast Lead protest during the last Gaza conflict.

...did not in fact 'go on' about attending "an anti-Operations Cast Lead protest during the last Gaza conflict." at all.

Now, kindly retract your claim.

Not guilty. The Israeli captain who killed Palestinian schoolgirl

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