Indicative of what is wrong with Irish politics....

allpro10 · 31-08-2010 07:55PM #1

http://www.independent.ie/national-n...n-2317989.html

A hurler with no college education, who worked in a frozen foods plant for 12 years and who is now a publican. What on Gods Earth qualifies this guy to be a politician. Surely there are enough highly educated people in Offaly out of work because of the recession who could do a far better job than this guy. Ah but sure he's a team mate of the Hannifys, who are good friends of the Enrights mother, and sure the Enrights have held that seat for the past 40 years so I guess Mr. Whelehan deserves it. These bloody monolopies in Irish politics have to be brought to an end. They are destroying the country. Take a bow Mr. Lenihan.

AckwelFoley · 31-08-2010 08:00PM

The beauty of democracy is that the people choose who to vote for.

You are making the distinct mistake of presuming that "educated" people exclusively hold a superior IQ.

You would be wong

Jeboa Safari · 31-08-2010 08:11PM

If people vote for him then I don't see how you can complain, unless your against democracy. What qualifies anyone to be a politician?

goose2005 · 31-08-2010 09:46PM

snyper wrote: »

The beauty of democracy is that the people choose who to vote for.

You are making the distinct mistake of presuming that "educated" people exclusively hold a superior IQ.

You would be wong

Would he be "wong"? I doubt Mr Whelehan knows very much about economics, finance, the law, healthcare administration, science, innovation, international trade etc. - you know, all of the things that would actually come in handy for a job as a national legislator. But, shur, didn't he hit some great points against Kilkenny and he's well-known in d'constichuency, and that's all that matters. And people wonder why we're in the state we're in. I mean, it's utterly appalling that we still have to put up with this sort of aristocratic shít:

Nevertheless, Fine Gael sources are not writing off the prospect of her brother, Kenneth, or her sister, Gemma, showing an interest.

The Enright family has held the seat for the past 40 years. Ms Enright's father, Tom, was a TD from 1969 to 2002, aside from five years in the Seanad after he lost his seat in 1992. He returned to the Dail in 1997.

Mr Enright is an extremely popular figure in the party and still keeps a close eye on political developments in the constituency.

Aside from the immediate Enright family, there is a strong chance a local hurling hero will become the party's candidate.

Ms Enright's mother, Rita, is a close relative of the former Offaly players Gary and Rory Hanniffy -- a link of which party strategists are well aware.

But of course, the culchie morons will elect him, and the city morons will vote FF, and that'll be that for another generation.

Einhard · 31-08-2010 09:57PM

snyper wrote: »

The beauty of democracy is that the people choose who to vote for.

That's both the best thing about democracy, and the worst thing about democracy!

Jeboa Safari · 31-08-2010 10:15PM

goose2005 wrote: »

Would he be "wong"? I doubt Mr Whelehan knows very much about economics, finance, the law, healthcare administration, science, innovation, international trade etc. - you know, all of the things that would actually come in handy for a job as a national legislator. But, shur, didn't he hit some great points against Kilkenny and he's well-known in d'constichuency, and that's all that matters. And people wonder why we're in the state we're in. I mean, it's utterly appalling that we still have to put up with this sort of aristocratic shít:
But of course, the culchie morons will elect him, and the city morons will vote FF, and that'll be that for another generation.

You come across as very condescending. People are given the choice, if they vote him in they vote him in. Why should people vote how you see fit?
And for the record, if he does run, I don't think he'll get elected.

gandalf · 31-08-2010 10:21PM

What is wrong with our National Politics is people are elected based mainly on local issues that Councillors should be dealing with.

mikemac · 31-08-2010 10:29PM

Some of the smartest people in the country have no college education, your post is a bit condescending.
I don't know what he did in the factory but he clearly has leadership skills, something lacking in politicians with more formal education

The constituency will either elect or reject him

And I don't think he will be elected

hallelujajordan · 31-08-2010 10:43PM

OP, Your post is hugely condescending . . . One of the great things about democracy is that we can all run for office (regardless of how smart you think we might be) and we can all vote. If you have such a problem with it, why don't you run against him !

goose2005 · 31-08-2010 10:54PM

Jeboa Safari wrote: »

You come across as very condescending. People are given the choice, if they vote him in they vote him in. Why should people vote how you see fit?

Because voting yet another publican into the Dáil, with little or no knowledge of what parliamentary work requires, would be very stupid.

RATM · 31-08-2010 11:29PM

It is democracy if a publican gets elected but that doesn't mean we can't improve it or the quality of candidates on offer. In France all civil servants must go to a certain university to get an education in administering large scale public departments before they can work in the civil service. Modules include Organisational Dynamics, Budgets, Public & Health Policy, Economic & Social Policy, Change Management, Administration, etc.

Im not suggesting a four year degree for our politicans but I do think they should have to do some sort of one or two year part-time course at some stage in their lives before standing for election. Call it gaining their ticket in safety before they can work on the site.

After all even top end Premier League coaches have to study to get their coaching badges from the Football Association. Why not politicians who are running an entire nation? It should at the very least be a pre-requisite for those who wish to attain Ministerial Portfolios, if not all people seeking to stand as a TD.

Vorsprung · 31-08-2010 11:36PM

...Quietly lols at OP suggesting someone isn't intelligent enough for office and then posts the same article after his first thread was locked...

hinault · 31-08-2010 11:41PM

Good and bad.

I don't know Brian Whelehan personally but any time I've seen him interviewed he comes across as a pleasant and intelligent bloke.
Superb hurler.

Does this make him a good politician?

probably not - but this is the system we have.

For better or worse.

mickeypat · 31-08-2010 11:48PM

democracy doesnt work,ireland needs a dictator/strongman for about 15/20 years to sort the place out

AckwelFoley · 01-09-2010 07:28AM

mickeypat wrote: »

democracy doesnt work,ireland needs a dictator/strongman for about 15/20 years to sort the place out

I hope you are not serious

monosharp · 01-09-2010 08:10AM

goose2005 wrote: »

Because voting yet another publican into the Dáil, with little or no knowledge of what parliamentary work requires, would be very stupid.

In fairness he's hardly going to be out of his depth relative to the other eejits is he ?

The problem with Irish politics is Irish people. Irish people put unqualified self concerned incompetent greedy idiots in power which says a lot about the majority of Irish voters.

This is a simple case of the proletariat's apathy, division, downright ignorance and a complete inability to come togeather collectively to force change on the system.

The situation as it currently stands has the majority paying for a small minority to maintain privileged positions over them. Ireland is an oligarchy where democracy is a thin veneer over a corrupt system where the minorities only concern is staying in power and getting the best for themselves, the majorities only concern is either keeping above water or joining the minority in a privileged position.

mike kelly · 01-09-2010 08:19AM

hinault wrote: »

Good and bad.

I don't know Brian Whelehan personally but any time I've seen him interviewed he comes across as a pleasant and intelligent bloke.
Superb hurler.

Does this make him a good politician?

probably not - but this is the system we have.

For better or worse.

For worse

danbohan · 01-09-2010 08:20AM

allpro10 wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/national-n...n-2317989.html

A hurler with no college education, who worked in a frozen foods plant for 12 years and who is now a publican. What on Gods Earth qualifies this guy to be a politician. Surely there are enough highly educated people in Offaly out of work because of the recession who could do a far better job than this guy. Ah but sure he's a team mate of the Hannifys, who are good friends of the Enrights mother, and sure the Enrights have held that seat for the past 40 years so I guess Mr. Whelehan deserves it. These bloody monolopies in Irish politics have to be brought to an end. They are destroying the country. Take a bow Mr. Lenihan.

condesending little pr~~k are you not , attidudes like yours has contributed as much to the mess this country is in ,as any poltician ,

Esel · 01-09-2010 08:31AM

A very suspicious maiden post from the OP, imo.

There is no mention in the linked article about Whelehan having 'worked in a frozen foods plant for 12 years' or of his being 'now a publican'.

Come clean, OP - what's the aginda?

dan_d · 01-09-2010 08:37AM

Setting aside his education, or lack thereof...

He's a hurler (shrugs)

That'll be enough to get him votes.

Parochial politics. We excel at them.

Permabear · 01-09-2010 08:40AM

This post has been deleted.

bryanw · 01-09-2010 08:41AM

RATM wrote: »

It is democracy if a publican gets elected but that doesn't mean we can't improve it or the quality of candidates on offer. In France all civil servants must go to a certain university to get an education in administering large scale public departments before they can work in the civil service. Modules include Organisational Dynamics, Budgets, Public & Health Policy, Economic & Social Policy, Change Management, Administration, etc.

Im not suggesting a four year degree for our politicans but I do think they should have to do some sort of one or two year part-time course at some stage in their lives before standing for election. Call it gaining their ticket in safety before they can work on the site.

After all even top end Premier League coaches have to study to get their coaching badges from the Football Association. Why not politicians who are running an entire nation? It should at the very least be a pre-requisite for those who wish to attain Ministerial Portfolios, if not all people seeking to stand as a TD.

We live in a representative democracy. Therefore, in the representatives we choose, we may like them to reflect ourselves. That doesn't mean that because someone you don't like is elected, that somehow people should be restricted from entering office, because you think they're wrong. The "nanny-knows-best" attitude of some people is astounding!

If you require someone who actually is applying for a job, such as a civil servant, to have certain qualifications, it is completely different because it usually a long term position.

But no, let's take power away from most people. Let's allow only people with a university degree to run for election. In fact... why stop there? Let's make it so that only people holding a university degree are the only ones allowed to vote. So that all those people that can't be allowed to be treated like adults will have no say in who represents them. Yes, that was an infinitely better way in the past!

Nijmegen · 01-09-2010 08:50AM

Boards can be funny sometimes, and a real example here of how general questions ("How can this go on?", in this case the elections of eejits to the Dail who say and do stupid things and, we believe, help contribute to the woes of the state) become thorny when translated into local and specific issues (in this case, the potential nomination of a candidate.)

Whilst I agree that a degree education is not required to be in the Dail - I run successful businesses and only got as far as the inter - I do disagree with the idea of 'inherited' seats in the Dail, or any sort of backhanding of positions and posts 'to the lads.'

The discussion around who to nominate, according to one article, is entirely based on the political family - if this guy doesn't run, one of his sisters might.

That is a microcosm of the parish pump politics that has royally screwed this country for decades. Politicians with no grand vision for the future of Ireland nor the capability to carry through with such a plan.

Esel · 01-09-2010 08:51AM

bryanw wrote: »

In fact... why stop there? Let's make it so that only people holding a university degree are the only ones allowed to vote. So that all those people that can't be allowed to be treated like adults will have no say in who represents them. Yes, that was an infinitely better way in the past!

Haven't we effectively got some of that already, with the Seanad?

bryanw · 01-09-2010 09:05AM

I don't think the Seanad is a glowing example of a well functioning house of parliament.

Nijmegen · 01-09-2010 09:13AM

bryanw wrote: »

I don't think the Seanad is a glowing example of a well functioning house of parliament.

Nor the Dail, for that matter.

Permabear · 01-09-2010 09:18AM

This post has been deleted.

mike kelly · 01-09-2010 09:37AM

we need a Presidential system, the Dail is just not working

jonsnow · 04-09-2010 01:41PM

donegalfella wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

That is one suspiciously lengthy and detailed Wikipedia entry.

Coillte_Bhoy · 04-09-2010 03:55PM

bryanw wrote: »

I don't think the Seanad is a glowing example of a well functioning house of parliament.

Why not?

jmayo · 04-09-2010 03:58PM

allpro10 wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/national-n...n-2317989.html

A hurler with no college education, who worked in a frozen foods plant for 12 years and who is now a publican. What on Gods Earth qualifies this guy to be a politician. Surely there are enough highly educated people in Offaly out of work because of the recession who could do a far better job than this guy. Ah but sure he's a team mate of the Hannifys, who are good friends of the Enrights mother, and sure the Enrights have held that seat for the past 40 years so I guess Mr. Whelehan deserves it. These bloody monolopies in Irish politics have to be brought to an end. They are destroying the country. Take a bow Mr. Lenihan.

By God some of us have a superiority complex. :rolleyes:

Just because someone got a collge education does not mean they have a monopoly on intelligence.
Look how our school examsand indeed our college grades have been called into question.
Look at some of the current government and there are some glaringly obvious college educated people completly out of their depth.
It is not education that they are lacking, but basic cop on, honesty, decency and ethics.

According to some, one of the supposed brightest intellectuals to enter Dáil Eireann in the last few decades was one Michael McDowell, yet he wasn't a great politican nor minister despite his supposed educational and law credentials.

To paraphrase something I believe supposedly written about Conor Cruise O'Brien...
he was like a lighthouse in the Bog of Allen, briliant but nevertheless useless.

willie o'dea is an accountant and barrister, lecturer in law and practiced as both lawyer and accountant.
Thus he could be said to have both studied at and taught at third level education establishments (UCD and UL) and would have been a member of at least two profession bodies.
Now would you care to take your third level education argument any further ?

Even worse goose2005 comes along and terms anyone that votes for this guy as being culchie morons.
By that inference are we saying only smart people vote for smart politicans ?

Brian Whelahan has given lots of enjoyment to many people over the years and he would have to cause a lot of destruction to come anywhere near to the disasters his fellow constituents mr cowen and mr parlon have visited upon this country.

This thread is a very strange one...
You have numerous ffers (supporters/memebrs etc) posters supporting and defending the fact that FG may be selecting this candidate.

Then even worse I find myself agreeing with them that some other posters are very condescending towards this supposed candidate

:eek:

Indicative of what is wrong with Irish politics....

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