How can houses be so expensive?

SuperInfinity · 04-08-2010 01:11AM #1

I can't understand how it can be that incredibly expensive for a house in this day and age.

People lay walls of bricks & mortar themselves in their spare time all the time. Why not just have the same concept in mind, be a little more elaborate, and make a house from it?

Things get cheaper all the time, why can't housing materials? Why aren't there there self-sufficient types out there saying "I built my own house, it took me a few weeks/months, it's made of such and such material, and only cost me a fraction of what I'd have to pay otherwise."?

Of course, "the man" doesn't want cheap housing. That way the man would have very little to keep people down. Nothing to put on the backs of young people weighing them down and enslaving them for years. (to be fair the man might have a point on this one as otherwise a lot of people such as the ones you see on Jeremy Kyle would have tons more children and house them all). I'm not sure there's a conspiracy going on, I just find it very odd how housing doesn't go down in price over the years.

mojesius · 04-08-2010 01:12AM

Who da man?

mikom · 04-08-2010 01:14AM

SuperInfinity wrote: »

People lay walls of bricks & mortar themselves in their spare time all the time. Why not just have the same concept in mind, be a little more elaborate, and make a house from it?

Things get cheaper all the time, why can't housing materials? Why aren't there there self-sufficient types out there saying "I built my own house, it took me a few weeks/months, it's made of such and such material, and only cost me a fraction of what I'd have to pay otherwise."?

Because statistically, two out of three little pigs will use inferior building materials to construct their houses.

SuperInfinity · 04-08-2010 01:18AM

mojesius wrote: »

Who da man?

http://encyclopediadramatica.com/The_Man

The man is the establishment that wants to keep you down and live the high life off of your labour. The man is always looking for new ways to screw you out of your money, while destroying the planet at the same time. The man spends a lot of his time in the banking sector, corperate sector and most of all government.

IvySlayer · 04-08-2010 01:18AM

Supply and demand, people will always pay all sorts for a house. Banks love getting you tied down to a huge mortgage.

Saila · 04-08-2010 01:20AM

Naiviety is bliss

04-08-2010 01:21AM

YOU DA MAN!

Dr. No · 04-08-2010 01:22AM

mikom wrote: »

Because statistically, two out of three little pigs will use inferior building materials to construct their houses.

Sure builders can't even build houses properly in Ireland

Luno · 04-08-2010 01:22AM

It's Ireland!

mojesius · 04-08-2010 01:22AM

SuperInfinity wrote: »

http://encyclopediadramatica.com/The_Man

The man is the establishment that wants to keep you down and live the high life off of your labour. The man is always looking for new ways to screw you out of your money, while destroying the planet at the same time. The man spends a lot of his time in the banking sector, corperate sector and most of all government.

Ah yes, I think I met him in McDaids one night. Nice chap.

sligopark · 04-08-2010 01:23AM

How can houses be so expensive?

simply because of so many gombeen greedy bastard bankers throwing out the money and the gombeen greedy bastard politicians and developer politician (local and governmental) donators [read bribers] all round the cúntry

time to knock them down and demolish the houses too

amacachi · 04-08-2010 01:25AM

Because people are idiots. Renting has been far cheaper for ages and it isn't "dead money", because for most people it won't be long after they've finished buying their shoebox that they'll be put in a home and the house sold to pay for it.

amacachi · 04-08-2010 01:26AM

sligopark wrote: »

simply because of so many gombeen greedy bastard bankers throwing out the money

And all the poor innocent ****ers who had no choice but to accept the loans.

oppenheimer1 · 04-08-2010 01:48AM

SuperInfinity wrote: »

I can't understand how it can be that incredibly expensive for a house in this day and age.

People lay walls of bricks & mortar themselves in their spare time all the time. Why not just have the same concept in mind, be a little more elaborate, and make a house from it?

Things get cheaper all the time, why can't housing materials? Why aren't there there self-sufficient types out there saying "I built my own house, it took me a few weeks/months, it's made of such and such material, and only cost me a fraction of what I'd have to pay otherwise."?

Of course, "the man" doesn't want cheap housing. That way the man would have very little to keep people down. Nothing to put on the backs of young people weighing them down and enslaving them for years. (to be fair the man might have a point on this one as otherwise a lot of people such as the ones you see on Jeremy Kyle would have tons more children and house them all). I'm not sure there's a conspiracy going on, I just find it very odd how housing doesn't go down in price over the years.

Because its not materials which make houses expensive generally. Its land and labour.

If you built your own house yourself on your own land it wouldn't cost that much. Its unlikely one person would have the time or the skills to complete the job though.

The_Kew_Tour · 04-08-2010 01:55AM

Well when people were willing to pay crazy prices it kept being a crazy market.

Thankfully they have come down to soem level of reality

rossie1977 · 04-08-2010 01:58AM

two reasons
1. land costs in this country are still stupidly high
2. labour costs in this country are insane

something like the burj dubai (which cost $800m-1.2b) would cost 20 times that at least to build here, same thing in the states, city center which opened in las vegas in december 2009 cost more than $8billion to build but today the owner mgm had to write down the value of the resort to just over $2billion, a $6billion loss in just over 6 months :eek:

Cheap Thrills! · 04-08-2010 01:59AM

SuperInfinity wrote: »

I just find it very odd how housing doesn't go down in price over the years.

It does, it's gone down 30-40% over the last couple of years....but yeh, screw the man, man.

Killer Pigeon · 04-08-2010 02:03AM

Someone give the OP a lecture on economics.

Rented Mule · 04-08-2010 02:06AM

Cheap Thrills! wrote: »

It does, it's gone down 30-40% over the last couple of years....but yeh, screw the man, man.

Let him go ....he's on a roll.

sligopark · 04-08-2010 02:07AM

Killer Pigeon wrote: »

Someone give the OP a lecture on economics.

amacachi wrote: »

And all the poor innocent ****ers who had no choice but to accept the loans.

not only the OP by the looks of it but many of those listening to our cúnt politicians

Guy:Incognito · 04-08-2010 02:08AM

Why buy anything? Spend enough time and you can make or grow everything you ever use.

Bear in mind though that , just like building a house,you may well be crap at it. People dont serve apprenticships to learn their trade because it's fun.

By all means have a go at laying the blocks for your house yourself, but do me a favour and don invite me inside it.

starbelgrade · 04-08-2010 02:13AM

Yeah sure - most people can lay a few blocks & build a coal shed. It's not rocket science. Most people could also build a box cart for their kids if they put their minds to it.

However, there are a few more basic principles & trades that one must learn before attempting to build a house or indeed a motor vehicle.

Cheap Thrills! · 04-08-2010 02:14AM

Killer Pigeon wrote: »

Someone give the OP a lecture on economics.

Okie, in the beginning there was nothing but spuds. Then Charlie came and told us to 'tighten our belts' -we had a bit of bloating from the spuds and the yellow pack bread but we said okie dokie.

Then other ones came and everyone forgot about yellow pack and got jobs. People were happy. Mostly (but some missed Findus crispy pancakes, wagon wheels and the like) but there was still spuds so things were ok.

Soon enough spuds were so passe (like last weeks undregarments) and pasta with pesto was where it was at, and gnocci and dvd box sets a big gaff, plenty of wine, cheese, carribean holidays, botox and earlobe extension operations. No one even mentioned spuds OR crispy pancakes any more. Everyone was always, drunk or high, even outside work hours. Coke flowed and people bought loads of gaffs and guzzled the property supplements and sparkies from Coolock had gaffs in 'the sun'

Suddenly you were NOONE unless you had a corner jacuzzi and italian taps.

Then everything went tits up, mainly because of a man with a face like a spud...Bertrude or somesuch they called the fellow. Anyhoo....spuds soon replaced the rocket drizzled artichoke heart salad and everyone moaned. A lot.

The end.

04-08-2010 02:14AM

Ok, you go out and lay a foundation OP, as well as walls, a roof, make sure its water proof, insulate the walls and attic, build inside walls for each room and do the same, run wire's through the walls for electricity, also do all of the plumbing, put windows, and doors in. Make sure you've plastered the whole house as well. Put tiles, carpets or wood on the floors, fit the sinks, toilets and baths/showers in as well. Make sure there connected to the plumbing. Put in sockets for plugs and light switches.

Only some reason's i think houses are so much at the moment.

But by all means, if you can do it yourself for nothing then go ahead. Keep us updated tho.

Einhard · 04-08-2010 02:17AM

amacachi wrote: »

And all the poor innocent ****ers who had no choice but to accept the loans.

Forced down our little gombeen throats so they were.

Cypher_sounds · 04-08-2010 02:18AM

Mak_United wrote: »

Ok, you go out and lay a foundation OP, as well as walls, a roof, make sure its water proof, insulate the walls and attic, build inside walls for each room and do the same, run wire's through the walls for electricity, also do all of the plumbing, put windows, and doors in. Make sure you've plastered the whole house as well. Put tiles, carpets or wood on the floors, fit the sinks, toilets and baths/showers in as well. Make sure there connected to the plumbing. Put in sockets for plugs and light switches.

Only some reason's i think houses are so much at the moment.

But by all means, if you can do it yourself for nothing then go ahead. Keep us updated tho.

Don't forget to get the planning permission before laying the foundation otherwise your fcuked:pac:

xOxSinéadxOx · 04-08-2010 02:21AM

land is fixed in supply

The_Minister · 04-08-2010 02:32AM

SuperInfinity wrote: »

I can't understand how it can be that incredibly expensive for a house in this day and age.

People lay walls of bricks & mortar themselves in their spare time all the time. Why not just have the same concept in mind, be a little more elaborate, and make a house from it?

Things get cheaper all the time, why can't housing materials? Why aren't there there self-sufficient types out there saying "I built my own house, it took me a few weeks/months, it's made of such and such material, and only cost me a fraction of what I'd have to pay otherwise."?

Of course, "the man" doesn't want cheap housing. That way the man would have very little to keep people down. Nothing to put on the backs of young people weighing them down and enslaving them for years. (to be fair the man might have a point on this one as otherwise a lot of people such as the ones you see on Jeremy Kyle would have tons more children and house them all). I'm not sure there's a conspiracy going on, I just find it very odd how housing doesn't go down in price over the years.

Really?

Really?

You didn't sit back and think for five seconds before posting? That would give many answers.
Here are a few I pulled earlier*:

Firstly, not all land is equal. Everyone wants to live in/near the city to access services, or enjoy the nightlife. Nobody wants to live on top of an isolated mountain (unless they are a Buddhist). Therefore, land in the city centre is expensive, and because it is sought after more, tends to be sold more frequently.
If you are prepared to live in a hole, there are places down the country where you could probably set up in adverse possession and no-one would notice.

Secondly, the costs of labour in this country, particularly those in the trades relating to construction, are insanely high. High wages = high costs.

Thirdly, while a shack is easy to build, a house with water/electricity/gas/heating/waterproofing is a substantial challenge, one which most people are not up to. When you factor in the various environmental rules that new houses must abide by, this becomes impossible for all by the handiest of men.

Fourthly, we are still a fairly rich country, we place a high value on owning land, and we refuse to rent.
This means that we have access to large amounts of money, which we choose, by and large, to spend on land.

*from the top of my head.

SuperInfinity · 04-08-2010 02:44AM

Mak_United wrote: »

Ok, you go out and lay a foundation OP, as well as walls, a roof, make sure its water proof, insulate the walls and attic, build inside walls for each room and do the same, run wire's through the walls for electricity, also do all of the plumbing, put windows, and doors in. Make sure you've plastered the whole house as well. Put tiles, carpets or wood on the floors, fit the sinks, toilets and baths/showers in as well. Make sure there connected to the plumbing. Put in sockets for plugs and light switches.

Only some reason's i think houses are so much at the moment.

But by all means, if you can do it yourself for nothing then go ahead. Keep us updated tho.

I never claimed that building a house would be a trivial thing to do, :rolleyes: just that it doesn't seem like it should cost many tens of thousands of euro for the labour. Plenty of jobs require labour and expertise to do them. If the labour isn't paid that much, then I find it hard to fathom how materials for it could still be that expensive as they are just walls.

As for your scenario of all the things you would have tod do: The builders wouldn't be phased at all by doing those things because they'd have done them a million times before.

I think there might be a big element of fear involved, people not trusting their own work or materials that maybe aren't the very expensive 'standard' materials. I can see why people might be terrorized into doing things the "official" way when it comes to something as important as their home, and builders/contracters only too willing to prey on this fear.

up for anything · 04-08-2010 02:44AM

SuperInfinity wrote: »

Why aren't there there self-sufficient types out there saying "I built my own house, it took me a few weeks/months, it's made of such and such material, and only cost me a fraction of what I'd have to pay otherwise."? .

They say that a man who represents himself has a fool for a client and a fool for a lawyer.

People lay walls of bricks & mortar themselves in their spare time all the time. Why not just have the same concept in mind, be a little more elaborate, and make a house from it?

Much the same could be said about building your own house if you have no qualifications to do so whatsoever unless of course you're using Lego.

starbelgrade · 04-08-2010 02:47AM

To construct a house correctly, you will need an extensive knowledge & adequate experience in the following;

Designing foundations & rising walls
Placing of hardcore, insulation, DPMs & DPCs
Reinforcement of concrete floors
Lintel design / specification
Cavity wall construction
External rendering
Movement joints
Fireplace & Chimney construction
Sizing of floor joists
Knowledge of floor construction details
Floor decking
Construction of stud partitions
Detailing of stairs & handrails
Design of roof trusses
Roof tiling / slating
Roof ventilation
Flashings & gutters
Thermal insulation of suspended floors
Plasterwork
Screeds
Protection of completed works
Radon
Ventilation requirements for habitable rooms, rooms with heat producing appliances & roof spaces
How to insulate for sound transmission between walls & floors
How to design & install drainage which includes all traps, branch discharge pipes, ventilated branch pipes, discharge stacks, materials for pipes, fittings & joints both above & underground, trench evacuation, pipe gradients & sizes, pipelaying & jointing, testing etc.
Electricity supply & distribution

You will also need a full understanding of Fire Regulations to provide means of escape, adequate fire resistance, fire fighting access, radiation onto boundaries, safety of heating appliances, flue pipes, hearths and oil storage tanks.

Add to that a full understanding of Disabled access regulations for transitional arrangements, approaches & access to dwellings, circulation within a dwelling & sanitary conveniences.

The building will also have to comply with all Building Regulations, including Conservation of Fuel & Energy.

You will also need a Safe Pass to work on the site, professional indemnity & public liabilty insurance.

You will also need to produce a bill of quantities so you know exactly what materials you need, down to the last screw in each door frame, then source your suppliers for all materials and then schedule the works so that the materials arrive on time & can be stored in a finished area of the building if they are subject to adverse weathe conditions.

And before any of that happens, you will need to train yourself to use Autocad so you can do the drawings to submit the planning application.

But, sure anyone can lay a few blocks.

How can houses be so expensive?

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