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Ivor Callely Expenses

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    #92
    zootroid
    Registered Users Posts: 784 ✭✭✭zootroid


    Liam Byrne wrote: »
    Compare and contrast :

    a) FF members of the Dáil who take the mick on expenses
    b) FF members of the Seanad who take the mick on expenses

    Anyone know what the difference might possibly be, bearing in mind the slim majority that FF have and their continued reluctance to hold the by-elections that are long overdue ?

    They're very selective about who they require ethics from, aren't they ?

    And didn't Callely steal Cowen's thunder on some budget day or other ?

    Good point. There was a huge reluctance in the Dail to speak out on expenses when there was the controversy surrounding John O'Donoghue


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    #93
    jmayo
    Registered Users Posts: 13,130 ✭✭✭✭jmayo


    dan_d wrote: »
    And the story rumbles on.......
    http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/cowen-demands-explanation-from-second-senator-over-expenses-460320.html
    You'd wonder how long these claims have been going on for wouldn't you?? And we just know it would have continued unabated if the expensese hadn't been published online. Amazing when the UK Gov looked for cuts, one of their first stops was at Minister's expenses. And when we looked for cuts, we looked everywhere but at expenses and TD's incomes.
    Sometimes I just despair...

    This came out due to journalists making requests under FOI and getting the info and then going through them with fine tooth comb.
    They are working through the lot of them and more will surely follow.
    There is rumour of female TD being next in the revelations.

    AFAIK there is one Dublin ff TD that has residence out in Meath since he can get better expenses by living out there.
    Once you are outside something like 15 miles of the Dáil the expenses ratchet up.


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    #94
    mike65
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88,978 ✭✭✭✭mike65


    Good stuff, this did the Telegraph no harm across the water. Hopefully it'll be a long hot summer for our betters.


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    #95
    nohopengn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 95 ✭✭nohopengn


    jmayo wrote: »
    This came out due to journalists making requests under FOI and getting the info and then going through them with fine tooth comb.
    They are working through the lot of them and more will surely follow.
    There is rumour of female TD being next in the revelations.

    I wonder how what form of punishment will be introduced for those found guilty......?

    will it simply be party exclusion, fines or will the Gov introduce new penalties - I'd like to see something similar to that in Canada....


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    #96
    Jaysoose
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,212 ✭✭✭Jaysoose


    nohopengn wrote: »
    I wonder how what form of punishment will be introduced for those found guilty......?

    will it simply be party exclusion, fines or will the Gov introduce new penalties - I'd like to see something similar to that in Canada....

    I think criminal proceedings should be brought against anybody defrauding the state, no other outcome is acceptable. This is corruption plain and simple and if we as a people allow this to continue then we get everything we deserve.


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    #97
    gandalf
    Registered Users Posts: 26,458 ✭✭✭✭gandalf


    Jaysoose wrote: »
    I think criminal proceedings should be brought against anybody defrauding the state, no other outcome is acceptable. This is corruption plain and simple and if we as a people allow this to continue then there is no hope for this country.

    I agree with you on this. No matter what way Ivor or any of the others who come out of the woodwork spin it you have one residence and falsely representing a holiday home as your main residence should be considered a serious fraud against the state.

    He should be made pay back the expenses, fined heavily, forced to resign and barred from holding public office ever again at a minimum.


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    #98
    PeterIanStaker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,072 ✭✭✭PeterIanStaker


    http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0604/callelyi.html

    He "faces expulsion" but I feel it'll be like Beverly Pooper Scooper Flynn and he'll be let rejoin in a few months when everyone has forgotten about it:rolleyes:


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    #99
    Jaysoose
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,212 ✭✭✭Jaysoose


    gandalf wrote: »
    I agree with you on this. No matter what way Ivor or any of the others who come out of the woodwork spin it you have one residence and falsely representing a holiday home as your main residence should be considered a serious fraud against the state.

    He should be made pay back the expenses, fined heavily, forced to resign and barred from holding public office ever again at a minimum.

    Agreed,

    Im sick and tired of living in a country were the elected representatives are so blatantly corrupt, the minute bertie ahern was allowed to slither onto the back bench after b**l****ting his way throught the tribunal (which cost millions of euro with no outcome) and pocketing god knows how much money the game was up.

    There has to be some kind of consequence for these people and we cannot let them just steal money from the state its past a joke.


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    #100
    nohopengn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 95 ✭✭nohopengn


    Jaysoose wrote: »
    I think criminal proceedings should be brought against anybody defrauding the state, no other outcome is acceptable. This is corruption plain and simple and if we as a people allow this to continue then we get everything we deserve.

    Totally agree Jaysoose - Irish people do need to stand up and demand that corruption (in all it's forms) be properly dealt with. 1. Repayment of monies 2. Party expulsion 3. Criminal proceedings.

    IMHO TDs', Bankers etc. would not have acted as they did, if we had a proper system in place.

    The 'Bertie' ways of doing business have to leave this country once and for all


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    #101
    bubbaloo
    Registered Users Posts: 758 ✭✭✭bubbaloo


    This just angers me so much. If I had to claim expenses I would have to produce a receipt. I have always thought mileage was a joke anyway - why not just reimburse the cost of a tank of petrol/diesel?? That is the only cost they have had to encounter - and the cars are probably paid for anyway, so there is no cost to them for "wear and tear"!

    I'm a low paid public servant (less than 27k) and I have had to endure cuts like other low paid employees in the country and yet this f***er gets to swan around with his head held high!! Aaaarrgghhh!!! :mad::mad::mad:


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    #102
    Jaysoose
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,212 ✭✭✭Jaysoose


    nohopengn wrote: »
    Totally agree Jaysoose - Irish people do need to stand up and demand that corruption (in all it's forms) be properly dealt with. 1. Repayment of monies 2. Party expulsion 3. Criminal proceedings.

    IMHO TDs', Bankers etc. would not have acted as they did, if we had a proper system in place.

    The 'Bertie' ways of doing business have to leave this country once and for all

    I agree with you but to hide behind the "system" when caught out is more of a concern, they know right from wrong but have set up the system to allow them to legitimise corruption. These people are reprehensible and the fact that there has been no action regarding this case yet is staggering to me as its simply fraud..


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    #103
    SeaFields
    Registered Users Posts: 6,551 ✭✭✭SeaFields


    Sorry if this has been mentioned before but with FF saying they are going to remove the whip from Callely does that mean he is going to repay the money??

    I couldn't care less if he is in or out of FF once the taxpayer isn't out of pocket. More fool me say ye for hoping it will be paid back.


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    #104
    Biggins
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 34,567 ✭✭✭✭Biggins


    SeaFields wrote: »
    Sorry if this has been mentioned before but with FF saying they are going to remove the whip from Callely does that mean he is going to repay the money?

    No, it does not mean he is going to repay the money.
    It simply means that someone in FF has decided (doing him really a favour) to save Calley's face & the dishonour of having to actually stand up and state for the record he is resigning the position.
    The change of role to another person will now be done once again behind closed doors in a FF room somewhere - meanwhile Callely keeps his head down as much as possible from the public and cameras, hoping to ride out the storm!


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    #105
    SeaFields
    Registered Users Posts: 6,551 ✭✭✭SeaFields


    Biggins wrote: »
    No, it does not mean he is going to repay the money.

    Sorry I worded that badly....i meant everyone seems to be under the impression that he did wrong, his own party included, yet I don't hear cries for him to repay these expenses.


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    #106
    Biggins
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 34,567 ✭✭✭✭Biggins


    SeaFields wrote: »
    Sorry I worded that badly....i meant everyone seems to be under the impression that he did wrong, his own party included, yet I don't hear cries for him to repay these expenses.

    I suspect that some might be afraid to stick their head above the rest and call for such a payment - such a call from them might leave them open to attention brought upon themselves and when we're dealing with the media and the public, it might not be in a light either that could be beneficial to the person doing the calling either.

    Those that wish to put themselves into the public eye, will only do so when their's is a win/win situation - not a win/lose one.
    FF sure won't call for him to repay it back - sure they didn't call the many of their own previous to do so.
    It would set a bad precedent for them and would be shooting themselves in the foot.
    A lot of the opposition might not call for repayments back unless they that so do themselves are absolutely clear and clean of same abuses, to all degrees of possible claims, big or small.
    The safest route for most of them will be to join in with the general opinions but any more than that, keep their mouth shut for possibly the above reason!


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    #107
    Lando Griffin
    Registered Users Posts: 2,952 ✭✭✭Lando Griffin


    Not a bad pad.


    http://www.hol.ie/west-cork_property/ireland_residential/Kilcrohane/detail.htm
    Callely’s controversial pad up for sale
    By Claire O’Sullivan
    Friday, June 04, 2010
    THAT long oul’ drive to Dublin must be getting to him as Senator Ivor Callely’s "current principal residence" is on the market.


    A cursory glance at Clonakilty-based auctioneer Henry O’Leary’s website shows his sumptuous Bantry home on the market for €650,000.
    Maybe he found the bucolic lifestyle isn’t all it’s painted to be? And, maybe rising at dawn to "milk the cows" every morning (when he wasn’t in the Seanad) just took its toll? Maybe despite the cosmopolitan nature of West Cork living, he is craving the urban grit and buzz of Dublin life?
    Sources in West Cork believe he’s "not frantic to move" and that despite first putting the house on the market two years ago, he has never sought to adjust to the market by dropping the asking price.
    Described as "beautifully built and perfectly positioned on a spectacular site" and "with breathtaking bay views", the former junior minister’s home is described (not unlike himself) as "unique".
    With a floor area of 3,000 square feet, the auctioneers says it is a "a stunning setting for either a full time family home or a spectacular holiday home".
    And we all know the depth of Senator Callely’s love affair with West Cork, deciding after he lost his Dublin North Central Dáil seat to ditch his Clontarf home so that he could make Kilcrohane his "full-time family home".
    It appears now that it may not have worked out though.
    The house includes an open plan kitchen/dining/sitting area with stone interior and slate floors, a living room and four double bedrooms. The site also includes the controversial detached garage which got Ivor into a bit of pickle with the planning authorities when it emerged it included even more bedrooms. His planning permission was for a garage and nothing more.
    The Henry O’Leary website describes the Fianna Fáil politician’s home as having " one of the most amazing patios one is likely to come across".
    There are about 40 pictures of the house online. With all the controversy this home has courted in recent years, it could be sold as "rich in political intrigue".


    Read more: http://www.examiner.ie/ireland/callelys-controversial-pad-up-for-sale-121493.html#ixzz0pt7NOTT8



    http://www.examiner.ie/ireland/callelys-controversial-pad-up-for-sale-121493.html


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    #108
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,831 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    I don't know about anyone else, but I am sick and tired of hearing the lame and pathetic excuse that "it's the system." We ****ing know it is the system, but who the **** is riding the system, who set it up? And, they are riding the system BEYOND the norm too. They aren't happy with the corrupt and disgusting system, they want to corrupt it even more. This is what makes these people so despicable.


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    #109
    dan_d
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,819 ✭✭✭dan_d


    Thinking about it, it's actually a bigger problem than just Ivor Callely.

    Technically, he is entitled to move to Cork if he wants to, and still run for Dublin North. His mistake was having 2 houses, and listing the Dublin one as his residence (I believe that's the case - correct me if I'm wrong). Again, I could be wrong here but I believe that James Reilly of FG runs for Dublin North as he originally lived there, but his home and family are actually now in Tipperary. What happens if he's entitled to claim expenses?

    So where do we draw the line?? I suppose we firstly need to make every TD/Senator register their various addresses, and then nominate one as a principal residence, where their family are residing. Should they move house, this also needs to be registered. Maybe we should also be looking at making them move constituencies along with the house???

    It's a tough one, but I believe it can be regulated. I haven't time to come up with any more suggestions, but I do think it goes beyond the simple fact that Ivor Callely was screwing the system. We're back at tighter regulation...again...something these guys have failed miserably at.


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    #110
    jmayo
    Registered Users Posts: 13,130 ✭✭✭✭jmayo


    Lando Griffin wrote: »
    Maybe he found the bucolic lifestyle isn’t all it’s painted to be? And, maybe rising at dawn to "milk the cows" every morning (when he wasn’t in the Seanad) just took its toll? Maybe despite the cosmopolitan nature of West Cork living, he is craving the urban grit and buzz of Dublin life?

    I think it was the bull that fecker was milking. :rolleyes:
    Oh and not forgetting the taxpayers. :mad:
    Lando Griffin wrote: »
    Described as "beautifully built and perfectly positioned on a spectacular site" and "with breathtaking bay views", the former junior minister’s home is described (not unlike himself) as "unique".
    With a floor area of 3,000 square feet, the auctioneers says it is a "a stunning setting for either a full time family home or a spectacular holiday home".

    The house includes an open plan kitchen/dining/sitting area with stone interior and slate floors, a living room and four double bedrooms. The site also includes the controversial detached garage which got Ivor into a bit of pickle with the planning authorities when it emerged it included even more bedrooms. His planning permission was for a garage and nothing more.

    Yeah I was thinking how the old planning was handled.
    Ah but shure isn't he one of the boys, no problem for non local building 3000sq ft house in very scenic area and shure throw in the old garage as well.

    Meanwhile some farmers kid down the road has to jump through hoops to build a 1500 sq ft home behind a hill and covered by trees. :rolleyes:


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    #111
    stumpypeeps
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,139 ✭✭✭stumpypeeps


    Any chance we could stick Ivor on a Floatilla to Gaza?

    He is the embodiment of everything wrong with Irish Politics. Screw as much as you can from the system. No moral compass.


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    #112
    bijapos
    Registered Users Posts: 3,003 ✭✭✭bijapos


    Seems his estate agent has upgraded the pictures of the house.



    callely.jpg


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    #113
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    dan_d wrote: »
    His mistake was having 2 houses, and listing the Dublin one as his residence (I believe that's the case - correct me if I'm wrong). Again, I could be wrong here but I believe that James Reilly of FG runs for Dublin North as he originally lived there, but his home and family are actually now in Tipperary. What happens if he's entitled to claim expenses?

    It's not that simple.

    Even if he did reside in Cork, the fact remains that if he has a house in Dublin that he can use for overnight stays, then he is not entitled to claim the cost of a hotel or whatever, because he didn't incur the expenses.


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    #114
    Gunmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 4,067 ✭✭✭Gunmonkey


    stumpypeeps wrote: »
    Any chance we could stick Ivor on a Floatilla to Gaza?

    Dont give him ideas, he would claim it as his primary residence and charge us the cost of driving from the middle of the Med as expenses :rolleyes:


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    #115
    steelcityblues
    Registered Users Posts: 4,630 ✭✭✭steelcityblues


    Telling quote from Finian McGrath in today's Irish Times profile: “I have a good relationship with the other TDs, Sean Haughey and Richard Bruton. But no relationship whatsoever with Ivor. There is no love lost between us.”


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    #116
    Poly
    Registered Users Posts: 1,807 ✭✭✭Poly


    Well, lang-ball has finally surfaced:

    http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0605/callelyi_butlerl.html


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    #117
    mike65
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88,978 ✭✭✭✭mike65


    Knew he'd have to go, the other fella Butler also gone


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    #118
    allthedoyles
    Registered Users Posts: 6,893 ✭✭✭allthedoyles


    Some of these guys have been commuting by rail to Dublin for years and claiming mileage ............its about time it came to the surface


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    #119
    Poly
    Registered Users Posts: 1,807 ✭✭✭Poly


    allthedoyles wrote: »
    Some of these guys have been commuting by rail to Dublin for years and claiming mileage ............its about time it came to the surface

    If you were a joe-soap, revenue would look for receipts going back 5 years, no receipts, no claim.

    What's good for the geese....


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    #120
    Sir Oxman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,492 ✭✭✭Sir Oxman


    Get the tissues out, Ivor wants you to pity him:

    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/callely-my-emotional-crisis-after-poll-defeat-2209795.html?from=dailynews

    And a footnote to this story:

    "Yesterday, independent TD Jackie Healy-Rae revealed that he "regularly" shared the driving with another member of the Oireachtas when he was coming from Kerry, but he refused to say whether or not they both claimed mileage. "


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    #121
    Sulmac
    Registered Users Posts: 1,021 ✭✭✭Sulmac


    Now a third Fianna Fáil Senator, Ann Ormonde, is being asked to explain her expenses after a report in the Sunday Business Post. Link.

    Seems it's not limited to the Seanad either, James Reilly TD (of Fine Gael), has been the focus of an article in today's Sunday Tribune for claiming €32,000 in travel and sustenance expenses despite being based in north County Dublin (twice the average for a Dublin-based TD).


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