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Same Sex Adoption

24567…16

Comments

  • #32
    Ostrom
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,483 ✭✭✭Ostrom


    atavan-halen wrote: »
    Why is this even being debated? They should be allowed to with the same rights as opposite sex couples, end of.

    Because the rest of us who have spent decades being fu**ed by the relevant departments on post-placement support would like to see the system overhauled before subjecting more parents and children to it.


  • #33
    m5ex9oqjawdg2i
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,217 ✭✭✭✭m5ex9oqjawdg2i


    Simply put, no.

    Thinking logically, same sex cannot reproduce, therefore they should not be allowed adopt a child, generally speaking.

    Homosexuality is not "natural" in the sense that if it were a human normality and dominant, we may be in a spot of bother.

    The child should have the right to "normal" parents, in the sense that both parents are of opposite sex.

    It's fcuking complicated because there are lots of circumstances that a child would be better off with a gay couple. i.e. loving gay parents > abusive straight parents.

    As the child grows up, it is only fair that he/she is brought up by both sexes and has a male and a female influence. Growing up with gay parents doesn't mean the child will automatically be unstable or anything of the like.

    Oh, this is my opinion, so if you don't like it you are more than welcome to FO ;)


  • #34
    Wolfe Tone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    Personally I am against same sex couples adopting. I don't believe its a good environment for a child to be brought up in. This is also the reason why I am against same sex marriage, I fear that that would lead to adoption.


  • #35
    keepkeyyellow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 705 ✭✭✭keepkeyyellow


    So let me get this straight, some people think that having NO parents is better for a child than having GAY parents?

    And all this need a father and a mother bullcra/p is the same arguments they used when saying that single parents couldn't adopt.

    Option 1 ftw.


  • #36
    Piriz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,271 ✭✭✭Piriz


    ScumLord wrote: »
    Not as such as far as I know, the natural environment involves cousins, grandparents, neighbours. Out of all the higher primates humans spend the least amount of time with their offspring. They readily hand their children over to other family members and even non family, it helps learn all the social techniques humans need to interact with each other. The natural upbringing for a human child tends to involve dozens of people it's not completely dependant on just two people.

    true to an extent, yet you can not dispute the child's parents are commonly the most important people in the child's life., whilst a secondary structure 'may' exist the primary structure is with the parents. As a result hey learn most about adult gender differences from their mother and father. Hence the most ideal role models. The balance of male and female figures is what makes it ideal.


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  • #37
    starbelgrade
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,739 ✭✭✭✭starbelgrade


    Piriz wrote: »
    A childs natural environment involves male and female parents..adoption mimics this natural system.
    both male and female role models are the ideal setting which adoption structure follows as it is best for the child...how can you not get that...this is not about gay rights...its about a child's rights.

    A child also has the right to be reared by his/ her biological or legal parent. This parent also has the right to choose any partner they wish - even one of the same sex. If the partner they choose also rears the child, then where are their rights?

    In the eyes of the law as it stands, neither the child, nor the partner have any rights to each other. In this case, no, it is not about gay rights. It is not about parental rights either & it's certainly not about the rights of the child.

    The only rights that are upheld in such cases is the right of the state.


  • #38
    jiltloop
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,293 ✭✭✭jiltloop


    I have a nothing against gay marriage or gay people but I do not think gay people should have a right to adopt children. I believe children should ideally be brought up with 2 opposite sex parents as this is probably most beneficial for their mental and psychological development. I also would be worried about such children being bullied in schools. We all know how cruel children and teenagers can be and I think they could easily become targets.
    Also I wonder why this is even being considered or debated in this country at the moment considering how backward father's rights are. Maybe we should improve legislation regarding the natural father's rights to their children before even considering gay people's rights to children.


  • #39
    Overature
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 908 ✭✭✭Overature


    To be honest i dont think that its fair to the child to be brought up by two people of the same sex. You need both male and female for the child to have the best understanding of how the world works. There are things that males will be able to teach the child that the female would not be able to and vice versa.


  • #40
    bluecatmorgana
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 447 ✭✭bluecatmorgana


    I think the rights of the child come first and then the rights of the adopter second.
    However many many people are not brought up with a mother and a father and in most causes it turns out grand. You often hear of people being brought up by their two aunts or their mother and grandmother. I think the ideal is to have a support system of two people regardless of gender.


  • #41
    Bodhisopha
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,068 ✭✭✭Bodhisopha


    If they can pass the "hamster test" first, i'm all for it.


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  • #42
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 1,882 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Piriz wrote: »
    true to an extent, yet you can not dispute the child's parents are commonly the most important people in the child's life., whilst a secondary structure 'may' exist the primary structure is with the parents. As a result hey learn most about adult gender differences from their mother and father. Hence the most ideal role models. The balance of male and female figures is what makes it ideal.

    To be honest, I think they learn most about adult gender differences when they reach puberty, and the parents have very little to do with this education.

    The balance of male and female figures does not have any benefits. Any suggested benefits depend on some supposed personality differences between men and women, which are largely outdated.


  • #43
    m5ex9oqjawdg2i
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,217 ✭✭✭✭m5ex9oqjawdg2i


    bluecatmorgana wrote: »
    I think the rights of the child come first and then the rights of the adopter second.
    However many many people are not brought up with a mother and a father and in most causes it turns out grand. You often hear of people being brought up by their two aunts or their mother and grandmother. I think the ideal is to have a support system of two people regardless of gender.

    In those situations there is not a sexual relationship, they are also family. That's somewhat different.


  • #44
    ScumLord
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,787 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    Deleted User wrote: »
    To be honest, I think they learn most about adult gender differences when they reach puberty, and the parents have very little to do with this education.
    The parents do have a huge effect if they're there, have you ever noticed that it's always mammys boy and daddys girl?


  • #45
    Knarr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 117 ✭✭Knarr


    Warren Unkempt Papier-mache wrote: »
    Thinking logically, same sex cannot reproduce, therefore they should not be allowed adopt a child, generally speaking.

    Lots of heterosexual couples cannot reproduce which is why many turn to adoption in the first place. Nothing exclusive to homosexual couples.
    Homosexuality is not "natural" in the sense that if it were a human normality and dominant, we may be in a spot of bother.

    But it is a human 'normality'. In the same way there is gender imbalance, racial imbalance or eye colour imbalance there is imbalance in relation to sexuality in society. Some have even proposed evolutionary reasons why homosexuality exists in the same way we can explain in evolutionary terms the purpose of heterosexuality as a human condition.
    The child should have the right to "normal" parents, in the sense that both parents are of opposite sex.

    Norms and attitudes constantly change and are not rigid. Look at this poll - people are redefining them.


  • #46
    m5ex9oqjawdg2i
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,217 ✭✭✭✭m5ex9oqjawdg2i


    Deleted User wrote: »
    To be honest, I think they learn most about adult gender differences when they reach puberty, and the parents have very little to do with this education.

    The balance of male and female figures does not have any benefits. Any suggested benefits depend on some supposed personality differences between men and women, which are largely outdated.

    You will have a serious influence from your parents about a lot, from a very very young stage, this will be stored in your subconcious, it will effect you. More than you think.


  • #47
    Piriz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,271 ✭✭✭Piriz


    starbelgrade wrote: »
    A child also has the right to be reared by his/ her biological or legal parent. This parent also has the right to choose any partner they wish - even one of the same sex. If the partner they choose also rears the child, then where are their rights?

    In the eyes of the law as it stands, neither the child, nor the partner have any rights to each other. In this case, no, it is not about gay rights. It is not about parental rights either & it's certainly not about the rights of the child.

    The only rights that are upheld in such cases is the right of the state.

    fair point. a biological right over-rights any adoptive legal system. hence you can not take a child from its natural parents and enforce their adoption into another family. A gay person can not have their child taken from them bacause they are gay. If the childs boilogical parent died and the child had a relationship with the parents partner then if it was deemed best for the partner to become a foster parent then this is what would happen.

    simply put, as said above homosexuality is not 'natural' in the sense of making a family..its the childs right to be placed into as 'natural' & 'ideal' upbringing as possible. This is what i agree with!


  • #48
    bluecatmorgana
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 447 ✭✭bluecatmorgana


    Warren Unkempt Papier-mache wrote: »
    In those situations there is not a sexual relationship, they are also family. That's somewhat different.

    Whats the sexual relationship got to do with it?
    Children adopted by a couple could be in a sexless relationship. Parents are a support system and a support system can be made up of any family.


  • #49
    starbelgrade
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,739 ✭✭✭✭starbelgrade


    Warren Unkempt Papier-mache wrote: »
    In those situations there is not a sexual relationship, they are also family. That's somewhat different.

    Most couples who have kids together consider themselves a family. In all essence, they are a family.

    What they do in the bedroom - be they gay or straight - really has nothing to do with it.


  • #50
    m5ex9oqjawdg2i
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,217 ✭✭✭✭m5ex9oqjawdg2i


    Knarr wrote: »
    Lots of heterosexual couples cannot reproduce which is why many turn to adoption in the first place. Nothing exclusive to homosexual couples.

    That's unfortunate, but many factors may play a role, at least both people have the reproductive organs, they just don't work. Tight pants on men, diets, etc etc.

    But it is a human 'normality'. In the same way there is gender imbalance, racial imbalance or eye colour imbalance there is imbalance in relation to sexuality in society. Some have even proposed evolutionary reasons why homosexuality exists in the same way we can explain in evolutionary terms the purpose of heterosexuality as a human condition.


    I would class it as an abormality. Reproducing offspring is high on the list of priorities for life forms, in order for that species to exist and continue existing it must reproduce. Homosexuals cannot reproduce.

    You can theorise that homosexuality is a defence mechagnism for our species to slow down reproduction, but... that's a whole can of worms there.

    Racial imbalance, eye colour imbalance etc etc is not a problem, it does not effect your psychological development to the extent of having two same sex parents. It is quite normal for different races to reproduce, because they can ;)
    Norms and attitudes constantly change and are not rigid. Look at this poll - people are redefining them.


    When I say normal, I mean it is normal for a man and a woman to reproduce, under normal circumstances. I am talking about the very basics. Also, can you name any animal that reproduces same sex? Not asexually ;) I am unaware of any.


  • #51
    bluecatmorgana
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 447 ✭✭bluecatmorgana


    I wonder is it the sex thing here that bothers people. Say if two sisters who lived together wanted to adopt a child , technically can they? If a single person can surely they could also?


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  • #52
    m5ex9oqjawdg2i
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,217 ✭✭✭✭m5ex9oqjawdg2i


    bluecatmorgana wrote: »
    Whats the sexual relationship got to do with it?

    Think about that one for a moment ;)
    Children adopted by a couple could be in a sexless relationship. Parents are a support system and a support system can be made up of any family.

    They sure could be, but how common is same sex couples being completely sexless in a relationship? Even kissing, cuddling, holding hands...?
    starbelgrade wrote: »
    Most couples who have kids together consider themselves a family. In all essence, they are a family.

    What they do in the bedroom - be they gay or straight - really has nothing to do with it.

    Are you two saying that you are not influenced by the sexual activities of your parents? In any way shape or form?



    In most cases like these, I tend to take a step back and look at the basics, take a look around you and see how nature works and all that lark ;)


  • #53
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,214 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    This is a serious thread which raises the issue of reproductive techniques - so why do you have to make me giggle repeatedly OP with your use of the phrase "polling options"? :(


  • #54
    starbelgrade
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,739 ✭✭✭✭starbelgrade


    Warren Unkempt Papier-mache wrote: »
    Are you two saying that you are not influenced by the sexual activities of your parents? In any way shape or form?

    Are you saying that the children of same sex couples could "catch the gay"?


  • #55
    m5ex9oqjawdg2i
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,217 ✭✭✭✭m5ex9oqjawdg2i


    starbelgrade wrote: »
    Are you saying that the children of same sex couples could "catch the gay"?

    That's quite possible.

    And it's spelt "the ghey"... :P


  • #56
    CrazyRabbit
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,659 ✭✭✭CrazyRabbit


    Wow...currently 25.00% of voters are homophobic. I thought Ireland had moved on a little bit more than that.

    Edit: Came across this a while ago when looking for Dutch clips on Youtube (to help me learn the language). Just remembered it and dug it up.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qf0puHJ-KM


    Shame we still don't have as tolerant a society...


  • #57
    starbelgrade
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,739 ✭✭✭✭starbelgrade


    Dudess wrote: »
    This is a serious thread which raises the issue of reproductive techniques - so why do you have to make me giggle repeatedly OP with your use of the phrase "polling options"? :(

    Lesbians don't even want "polling options". :D


  • #58
    m5ex9oqjawdg2i
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,217 ✭✭✭✭m5ex9oqjawdg2i


    CrazyRabbit wrote: »
    Wow...currently 25.00% of voters are homophobic. I thought Ireland had moved on a little bit more than that.

    Wow, what an ignorant post... How the fcuk did you come to that conclusion? People are against same sex adoption and that makes them homophobic? You talk some amount of shíte, really.

    Did you even read the fcuking thread? Of course you didn't...


  • #59
    starbelgrade
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,739 ✭✭✭✭starbelgrade


    Warren Unkempt Papier-mache wrote: »
    That's quite possible.

    And it's spelt "the ghey"... :P

    That is quite possibly one of the most ridiculous posts that I have ever read in my 4 odd years of posting on Boards.

    And believe me, I have read some stupid sh*t in my time.


  • #60
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 1,882 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    ScumLord wrote: »
    The parents do have a huge effect if they're there, have you ever noticed that it's always mammys boy and daddys girl?

    Of course, there are many mammy's girls and boys who like to play a bit of football with their dad, it's just because we have names for those two. There's no actual point there, just a linguistic observation...


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  • #61
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,214 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    If children raised by a same-sex couple run the risk of catching the ghey, how come many children who are raised by hetero couples also succumb to the ghey?


This discussion has been closed.
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