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Google TV

Comments

  • #2
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,460 ✭✭✭✭watty


    No, it does nothing to break the hold of Sky, UPC or any other cable company.

    It makes Goolge search the interface to your TV so that Google can know more about you and make more money from Adverts.

    You couldn't pay me to have this for TV. I do use Google Search. But only to search.


  • #3
    probe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,055 ✭✭✭probe


    watty wrote: »
    No, it does nothing to break the hold of Sky, UPC or any other cable company.

    It makes Goolge search the interface to your TV so that Google can know more about you and make more money from Adverts.

    You couldn't pay me to have this for TV. I do use Google Search. But only to search.

    You are living in the dark ages. UPC and Sky, companies focused on squirting low quality Anglo Saxon dominance on victims, force their customers (ie victims) to wait for a certain time to watch the programme. The book industry has been around since the 15th century – earlier if you go back to the book of Kells, and the pages of books may be consulted at any time one wishes. Time the TV industry grew up – the customer is king, and should be able to watch whatever they wish, whenever.

    There is no alternative to IP TV and fibre, for the average country. Providing a free open market for everyone to make/sell/display video material and make it available to the public at a mouse-click.


  • #4
    probe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,055 ✭✭✭probe


    UPC is an American company. Sky is a British company – run by a Rupert who is an Australian who pretends to be American. No other European country would allow these creatures take control of their electronic media – ie TV and broadband.


  • #5
    Kensington
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,683 ✭✭✭Kensington


    As watty says, Google's business model is based mainly around user observation. Every click on your remote will be logged and used to target you with advertisement and god knows what else. I'd rather not hand my details over to Google, I don't want them to know what what I watch, how, or when. In fact, I'd be more wary of google than any pay-tv platform operator in this country.

    As for your comments on scheduled TV, I'm afraid UPC and Sky have trounced your arguments there. Sky's Anytime+ pull-VOD service is currently being finalised, and UPC have proposed a pull-VOD service sometime next year. And ironically, for the majority of people who might want to use the Google box, UPC are about the only operator with a network capable of handling the demands of HD streamed tv in this country. You won't get it going over your average DSL line!


  • #6
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,460 ✭✭✭✭watty


    Probe cross posted the same thing twice

    Debate here too http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055918955


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  • #7
    probe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,055 ✭✭✭probe


    Kensington wrote: »
    As watty says, Google's business model is based mainly around user observation. Every click on your remote will be logged and used to target you with advertisement and god knows what else. I'd rather not hand my details over to Google, I don't want them to know what what I watch, how, or when. In fact, I'd be more wary of google than any pay-tv platform operator in this country.

    As for your comments on scheduled TV, I'm afraid UPC and Sky have trounced your arguments there. Sky's Anytime+ pull-VOD service is currently being finalised, and UPC have proposed a pull-VOD service sometime next year. And ironically, for the majority of people who might want to use the Google box, UPC are about the only operator with a network capable of handling the demands of HD streamed tv in this country. You won't get it going over your average DSL line!

    Click to view is the price of menu-mode TV watching - video on demand. Surely it is better to be able to watch TV when you want to, compared with turning up at the government appointed hour to watch what the civil servants in Donnybrook have decreed what you may see?


  • #8
    Kensington
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,683 ✭✭✭Kensington


    probe wrote: »
    Click to view is the price of menu-mode TV watching - video on demand. Surely it is better to be able to watch TV when you want to, compared with turning up at the government appointed hour to watch what the civil servants in Donnybrook have decreed what you may see?
    A price I'm not willing to pay tbh. I'll stick with the sky+ and soon to be launched Anytime+.


  • #9
    probe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,055 ✭✭✭probe


    Kensington wrote: »
    A price I'm not willing to pay tbh. I'll stick with the sky+ and soon to be launched Anytime+.

    Feel free to remain dumb, fat and happy watching Rupert if you wish. But please don't try and impose this mono-solution on everybody.


  • #10
    Kensington
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,683 ✭✭✭Kensington


    probe wrote: »
    Feel free to remain dumb, fat and happy watching Rupert if you wish. But please don't try and impose this mono-solution on everybody.
    I am neither dumb nor fat and I will remain happy as always once I am kept amused by your illogical, inane ramblings both here and in the broadband forum.


  • #11
    probe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,055 ✭✭✭probe


    Feel free to enjoy the last century in media technology. I say it should stop now.


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  • #12
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,460 ✭✭✭✭watty


    IPTV is nothing to do with Free TV or Google and is simply a delivery method for regular TV and Video on Demand.

    Video Streams via Public Internet is NOT true IPTV, it's impossible to ensure a particular bit rate and QOS.

    Real IPTV is delivered by your own ISP's local servers. Whether live Broadcast or Video On Demand it's an expensive addition to Cable or Fibre Broadband.

    Delivery Cost for DVD quality:
    • Lowest is Satellite. Can Be free to view, free to air, pay, pay per view. VOD requires large capacity PVR and background stream on each transponder.
    • Terrestrial Digital is 10x to 100x more expensive to deliver. Can Be free to view, free to air, pay, pay per view. VOD requires large capacity PVR and background stream on each transponder.
    • Cable or Fibre Digital is cheaper to deliver than Terrestrial for Broadcast or Switched video, but is x10 to x100 more expensive to install. Video on Demand uses IPTV only. Live TV can use DVB-c or IPTV.

    Actual Public Internet can't deliver true IPTV or VOD, ANYWHERE . The cost to do DVD quality, never mind HDTV, would be x10,000 the cost of ISP based CableTV/IPTV/VOD.

    Do not confuse low quality streaming with actual IPTV.

    Google TV is simply a GUI for HDTVs that have ethernet so Google knows more about what you watch.


  • #13
    icdg
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 12,835 Mod ✭✭✭✭icdg


    Probe, you are one step away from being banned, some of the tone of your comments are rather provocative and well out of order. Consider yourself warned, if I see another post of this nature you are banned.

    I'm not sure this thread belongs in Cable/MMDS/IPTV anyway, but I'm hesitant to move it to Broadcasting since, well it isn't really about broadcasting either...
    probe wrote: »
    UPC is an American company. Sky is a British company – run by a Rupert who is an Australian who pretends to be American. No other European country would allow these creatures take control of their electronic media – ie TV and broadband.

    UPC may be owned by an American company (and ultimately by John C Malone), but it is based in Holland and is Europe's biggest cable operator. News Corporation is also active in pay-TV in the UK, Germany, Austria, and Italy. So I think you'd find that Ireland is not the only European country that these companies are active in. Incidently, Rupert Murdoch no longer has any paid position in BSkyB (although his son is Chairman), and News Corporation only has a 38% stake in the company.

    But onto Google TV. As far as I can tell, its an operating system/firmware for TVs and set-top-boxes, though I can't see it appearing in the latter form here (given Sky and UPC's attachement to their own platforms). Google doesn't from what I can see actually plan on launching any hardware itself and it would appear to be up to the television manufacturing industry to implement it.

    Its main benefit would appear to be giving access to the internet and YouTube via telly. Both are or have been available here before - Independent News and Media's Unison service was a flop and I'd imagine that Apple TV (which offers YouTube access) has not sold well here. Now you might argue that both these products were add on devices and this will be built on to the TV. But how many people actually want to access the TV on the web? Very few if Unison and the no-longer-marketed WebTV is anything to go by. And I don't think YouTube will replace broadcast television - its a different type of experience, good for watch short home-made clips, but not for actual TV programmes.


  • #14
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,460 ✭✭✭✭watty


    With HDTV the browser experience is better. Lots of newer TVs have ethernet and Browser and can show streamed video.

    Google just wants to muscle in with their privacy busting GUI on these TVs. No extra content.

    Also BBC/ITV/C4/Five will be adding "Canvas" GUI and Video streaming to some Freesat, Freeview setboxes and TVs that have ethernet, now that it has got green light from Competition folks, the BBC Trust is final hurdle. Unlike "Google TV" that is CONTENT, even so only youTube quality as it's via public Internet. For decent quality you need PVR to watch when you want.

    You can be sure any video Google makes available (probably via YouTube which they own) will be available on any Setbox/TV that can connect to Internet Streaming.

    The only "extra" with "Google TV" is Google's monitoring of your channel changes and viewing.


    yes, ICDG, this is really all "Broadband".


  • #15
    Freddie59
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,679 ✭✭✭Freddie59


    probe wrote: »
    Click to view is the price of menu-mode TV watching - video on demand. Surely it is better to be able to watch TV when you want to, compared with turning up at the government appointed hour to watch what the civil servants in Donnybrook have decreed what you may see?

    I'm late into this, but all I can say is WTF?:eek: What you're describing is a DVR. Plain and simple. Be it Sky or UPC. And what in God's name - are all these ramblings about Anglo Saxon, Donnybrook, etc?:confused:


  • #16
    Freddie59
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,679 ✭✭✭Freddie59


    probe wrote: »
    UPC is an American company. Sky is a British company – run by a Rupert who is an Australian who pretends to be American. No other European country would allow these creatures take control of their electronic media – ie TV and broadband.

    As Kensington has already pointed out, UPC are leading the way in speed increases. So you'd like us to go back to the dark ages pre-UPC then?


  • #17
    probe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,055 ✭✭✭probe


    icdg wrote: »
    Probe, you are one step away from being banned, some of the tone of your comments are rather provocative and well out of order. Consider yourself warned, if I see another post of this nature you are banned.

    I'm not sure this thread belongs in Cable/MMDS/IPTV anyway, but I'm hesitant to move it to Broadcasting since, well it isn't really about broadcasting either...



    UPC may be owned by an American company (and ultimately by John C Malone), but it is based in Holland and is Europe's biggest cable operator. News Corporation is also active in pay-TV in the UK, Germany, Austria, and Italy. So I think you'd find that Ireland is not the only European country that these companies are active in. Incidently, Rupert Murdoch no longer has any paid position in BSkyB (although his son is Chairman), and News Corporation only has a 38% stake in the company.

    But onto Google TV. As far as I can tell, its an operating system/firmware for TVs and set-top-boxes, though I can't see it appearing in the latter form here (given Sky and UPC's attachement to their own platforms). Google doesn't from what I can see actually plan on launching any hardware itself and it would appear to be up to the television manufacturing industry to implement it.

    Its main benefit would appear to be giving access to the internet and YouTube via telly. Both are or have been available here before - Independent News and Media's Unison service was a flop and I'd imagine that Apple TV (which offers YouTube access) has not sold well here. Now you might argue that both these products were add on devices and this will be built on to the TV. But how many people actually want to access the TV on the web? Very few if Unison and the no-longer-marketed WebTV is anything to go by. And I don't think YouTube will replace broadcast television - its a different type of experience, good for watch short home-made clips, but not for actual TV programmes.

    If UPC is so European why does it transmit so much propoganda against our currency, the Euro. Sky, CNBC, CNN, BBC World, even Bloomberg, they all appear to be engaged in an economic warfare against the Euro - our money. No other European country would pipe such racist, biased, economic propaganda against itself to citizens over a state controlled monopoly infrastructure.


  • #18
    probe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,055 ✭✭✭probe


    Freddie59 wrote: »
    As Kensington has already pointed out, UPC are leading the way in speed increases. So you'd like us to go back to the dark ages pre-UPC then?
    Open fibre. Let UPC use it if they wish. Ditto for eircom etc. And ditto for content providers.


  • #19
    Kensington
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,683 ✭✭✭Kensington


    probe wrote: »
    If UPC is so European why does it transmit so much propoganda against our currency, the Euro. Sky, CNBC, CNN, BBC World, even Bloomberg, they all appear to be engaged in an economic warfare against the Euro - our money. No other European country would pipe such racist, biased, economic propaganda against itself to citizens over a state controlled monopoly infrastructure.
    Seriously, what in the name of devine Jesus are you on about? UPC are a carriage platform. They have no input over what the likes of Sky, CNN or BBC World broadcast - they simply re-broadcast it! Just like Canal+ France carry CNN, BBC World and CNN. As do Sky Italia. And UPC in the Netherlands. All major players in their markets. Obviously you forgot to mention that, guess it doesn't really do your "argument" any favours, does it?

    Oh and no, before you go throwing accusations against me again, I do not, nor have I ever, worked for UPC.
    probe wrote:
    Open fibre. Let UPC use it if they wish. Ditto for eircom etc. And ditto for content providers.
    Watty has already said, IPTV needs guaranteed QoS. Open fibre, by right, cannot have QoS as you'd effectively be giving one company (eg TV content provider) priority over another (eg an ISP) to get a workable service. Not exactly "open" and transparent?


  • #20
    BrianD
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,221 ✭✭✭BrianD


    probe wrote: »
    Click to view is the price of menu-mode TV watching - video on demand. Surely it is better to be able to watch TV when you want to, compared with turning up at the government appointed hour to watch what the civil servants in Donnybrook have decreed what you may see?

    Hmmm...but what would you talk about around the water cooler the following day? There is both a personal and community aspect to the consumption of media. Most people can make their own personal playlists on digital music players or access customised streaming services but the majority will still switch back to traditionally formatted broadcast services. I believe that this partially due to the communal aspect of media consumption - did you listen to Ray Foley, watch the late late show etc. There's nothing antiquated or old fashioned about having a programme schedule.

    Anyway, from what I have read this Google TV doesn't seem to be a real VOD. It just searches your PVR and schedules for suitable programming and will fire up the odd you tube clip on your screen.

    What might be firing Google on this one is that there is a lot of research into how TV viewing is related to searches on Google - whether it be an advert or programme material. Perhaps Google want to bring that viewing and subsequent search closer. As you view an advert, Google TV will fire up the relevant web site and probably a dozen comepetitors. Can't wait to see how this one plays out!


  • #21
    BrianD
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,221 ✭✭✭BrianD


    probe wrote: »
    Open fibre. Let UPC use it if they wish. Ditto for eircom etc. And ditto for content providers.

    Who pays for it?


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  • #22
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,460 ✭✭✭✭watty


    The ISP and then user. Verizon FIOS is near $90 a month!

    I'll stick with Broadband and DVDs + Aerial + FTA satellite for TV.

    Real IPTV/VOD is the most expensive way on the planet to deliver TV and watch it.
    Anyway GoogleTV isn't about Fibre or IPTV or VOD. It's about Google providing the GUI on an Internet enabled HDTV and knowing what you view.


  • #23
    hightower1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,210 ✭✭✭hightower1


    BrianD wrote: »
    Who pays for it?

    Communist Russia of coarse! lol, in probes world....

    UPC pay a shed load and buy out small operators cable networks dotted across the state... they upgrade the network to fiber backbone and new co-ax... costing in the region of 100milion a year for the last three years..... out of their own pocket.... then here's probes genius..... they.... hand .... it ..... over... for.... free!!!!!!!

    Outstanding! You have made/bought something better than me so you MUST share this. It worked for communist russia so why not modern day Ireland?

    Oh by the way, probe shops in M&S while we all shop in tesco so ......

    EVERYONE ROUND TO PROBES HOUSE FOR DINNER! YEEEYYYYY!!




    Communist%20Party.gif


  • #24
    paulm17781
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,858 ✭✭✭paulm17781


    Kensington wrote: »
    Watty has already said, IPTV needs guaranteed QoS. Open fibre, by right, cannot have QoS as you'd effectively be giving one company (eg TV content provider) priority over another (eg an ISP) to get a workable service. Not exactly "open" and transparent?

    Whoa whoa whoa. Whoa. Let's not let facts get in the way. Whoa. Too many people here are posting facts, whoa. They must all work for UPC. ;)


  • #25
    Dodge
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,147 ✭✭✭✭Dodge


    probe wrote: »
    If UPC is so European why does it transmit so much propoganda against our currency, the Euro. Sky, CNBC, CNN, BBC World, even Bloomberg, they all appear to be engaged in an economic warfare against the Euro - our money. No other European country would pipe such racist, biased, economic propaganda against itself to citizens over a state controlled monopoly infrastructure.

    Can I just say I absolutely love this post. He appears to say some news organisations are racist against the Euro. Did i get that right? I hope I did...

    I also love the way he criticises the platform for allowing these channels to broadcast, only 2 posts after calling for a more open TV expereince

    Apologies probe if I've wrongly assumed you're a man.


  • #26
    Freddie59
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,679 ✭✭✭Freddie59


    probe wrote: »
    If UPC is so European why does it transmit so much propoganda against our currency, the Euro. Sky, CNBC, CNN, BBC World, even Bloomberg, they all appear to be engaged in an economic warfare against the Euro - our money. No other European country would pipe such racist, biased, economic propaganda against itself to citizens over a state controlled monopoly infrastructure.

    :rolleyes: This HAS to be a wind-up.


  • #27
    Freddie59
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,679 ✭✭✭Freddie59


    probe wrote: »
    Open fibre. Let UPC use it if they wish. Ditto for eircom etc. And ditto for content providers.

    Rubbish. Hightower has got it in one. :p


  • #28
    icdg
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 12,835 Mod ✭✭✭✭icdg


    Maybe, but I'd rather huge graphics of a defaced USSR flag weren't posted on a cable/MMDS/IPTV forum. Take it to politics.

    Probe, banned for a week for ignoring my warning.

    Discuss news agendas in Broadcasting if you want, though if its going to get too political I'd rather you did it in politics.

    As for Google TV, this thread has got out of hand, and since its not an issue about a cable, MMDS, or IPTV provider - really Broadband, Television, or Consumer Electonics might be better places to discuss it. Thread closed.


This discussion has been closed.
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