why do people spend so much

Graces7 wrote: »

Interesting re grain.. collie here who was left to roam, grazes on nettled and grasses, including seed heads. .... Where does the idea that they have no natural part of a dog's diet come from, please? Not challenging, just curious.
Collie had a dreadful upbringing and now a treat is a full slice of white bread.. Sounds dreadful but to see her run around with it in her mouth and then devour it. A rare treat of course....

My dog is a abandoned collie cross we found as a 4 week old pup riddled with fleas !
Grasses are certain herbs etc are perfectly good for a dog and very small wild grain types would of been eaten this fibre is good for a dogs diet, the problem is with the large quantities of different grains which are ground down and used as filler in the food , this is the easiest website to link to and its the food i use as the dogs had skin problems and digestive issues on other foods .Have a quick glance http://www.orijen.ca/orijen/orijen/grainFree.aspx it explains why grain free.

A few points here:

- Salmonella can certainly affect a dog. Raw chicken (especially when sourced from "chicken factories") should best be cooked

- dogs cannot digest raw vegetables, they do however need to eat veggie protein now and then. In the wild they would do this by eating the pre-digested food in their prey's stomach and intestines. In civilisation they get their veggy protein from prepared foods or from cooked veg.

- grass is not eaten as food but as a digestive aid (and in cases of severe tummy upset to induce vomiting)

- most foctory made dog foods are made from offal, offcuts and bone/meat meal that are not fit for human consumption. Unless your dog food (no matter how expensive it is) clearly states that all the ingredients are fit for human consumption, they aren't. These ingredients may sound yukkie to us but they still have nutritional value and if carefully prepared there is nothing wrong with them as such. No dog in the wild would turn away from a cow's eye or a bull's testicles

- the worst ingredients in prepared foods are the artificial ones ... sweeteners, preservatives, colourants, aromas. The more pleasant the food looks and smells to us, the more artificial it most likely is.

peasant wrote: »

A few points here:

- Salmonella can certainly affect a dog. Raw chicken (especially when sourced from "chicken factories") should best be cooked

- dogs cannot digest raw vegetables, they do however need to eat veggie protein now and then. In the wild they would do this by eating the pre-digested food in their prey's stomach and intestines. In civilisation they get their veggy protein from prepared foods or from cooked veg.

- grass is not eaten as food but as a digestive aid (and in cases of severe tummy upset to induce vomiting)

- most foctory made dog foods are made from offal, offcuts and bone/meat meal that are not fit for human consumption. Unless your dog food (no matter how expensive it is) clearly states that all the ingredients are fit for human consumption, they aren't. These ingredients may sound yukkie to us but they still have nutritional value and if carefully prepared there is nothing wrong with them as such. No dog in the wild would turn away from a cow's eye or a bull's testicles

- the worst ingredients in prepared foods are the artificial ones ... sweeteners, preservatives, colourants, aromas. The more pleasant the food looks and smells to us, the more artificial it most likely is.

agree agree agree....


esp about the

"The more pleasant the food looks and smells to us, the more artificial it most likely is"


each to their own i suppose..

i know people who refuse to give their dog nothin but Ped Chum.

"...sure he's always eaten it ---nothinwrong with him.."


while i disagree with him ....each to his own.

i would never give a dog,raw chicken/chicken bones...or raw pork cos of the bacterial element...


i've never heard bad stories about dogs eatin Hills,royal canin etc...

but i have about ped chum and madra etc....from approx ten different human sources,incl vets,dog trainers,welfare worker's,farmer's,hunter's,greyhound owner's et al.


anyhow

rant over

o/

I have three dogs; we got Rosie from the GSPCA and dog food wise, would eat anything you put in front of her with no bother. We had to change from Pedigree Chum food because Jack's poopage was distinctly unpleasant. It was just running out of him. I'm by no means squeamish when it comes to cleaning up after dogs but this was just...yikes! Next up was Hills Science plan, which seemed okay until Meg started throwing up good-o. They couldn't find anything wrong (which was a relief as the last time a dog of mine started throwing up, it was cancer and she had to be put down.) She threw up on the recovery food and on the Royal Canin food as well. Now this is a dog who chewed snails and other insects last summer and never regurgitated once. So I began to suspect that maybe it was the maize in the foods she'd been eating that was causing it and I changed to Orijen. The throwing up has stopped and the dogs are in great condition.
This is actually the first time in all my years of dog ownership that I've had dogs that had to go on premium food. The others all thrived on Pedigree. Yes, it's expensive and I'm not exactly flush with money these days, but it's well worth it.

ppink wrote: »

on dog food?

Am i missing something here or whay do people spend so much money on expensive dog foods.
Are the dogs healthier? Do they live longer? Are there any studies done to this effect?

Personally i think it you to people what they want to spend on their pet... its no different than people buying M&S food or organic food...

To be very honest (no offence to any posters intended) i wouldnt feed my dog the crap from supermarkets... thats includes lidl, aldi, tesco .... any of the infact... I wouldnt eat meat myself from ldil or aldi... so why would i feed it to my dog? I am a believer in you pay for what you get... cheap food is cheap for a reason....

Supermarket food is uauslly way to high in protien and too much is not good for a dog....

I feed my guy Burns... its about €55 for 15kg.... does him about 2 months or so.... at the weekend I boil him chicken breasts etc...

In germany, Lidl is like our supermarkets over here. It's not an inferior quality place. Then again, maybe you do all of your shopping in the likes of M&S (which I have found to have pretty poor quality fresh produce tbh, although their ready made stuff is usually nice)

Some human food in aldi/lidl is much better than in some irish supermarkets. Particurlary their fresh fruit and veg. You're really limiting yourself by cutting out a whole chain of supermarkets because it has a foreign sounding name

Up until recently, there was a real snobbery about everything in Irish society. Where you buy your food, your clothes, your car, where your house is located. Some of that, of course, transferred to our pets. Why shouldn't we buy "the best" for our pets. If it can be afforded then I agree, but to make people feel like they are not doing enough for their dogs and are feeding them "crap" because they can't afford the most expensive food is a bit OTT.

IMO you should tailor your dogs diet to what suits them. Keep an eye on their condition, their energy levels, their behaviour and their waste. Try different foods and methods of feeding until you find which suits both you and your dog. It's not as easy as going out and spending loads on a bag of food, and it takes more thought and time to get it right but works better for most people, and is likely to be less boring for the dog.

I'm giving out about people who buy expensive food for their dogs. Like I said Harleys base is Royal Canin. I'm saying that people shouldn't just buy a bag of expensive stuff and expect that to be it, while looking down on people who put more effort into their dogs diest.

Lando Griffin wrote: »

When I was groing up our dog lived off scraps and died when he was 15.
He was the happiest healthiest dog in the neighbourhood.
He tragically died chasing a hen onto the road.

looking back, we all stack the deck.

thebullkf wrote: »

no offence...but you sound like a snob:rolleyes:

No offence taken... (would rather be called that than a knacker )

everything i said in my post is true... supermarket dog food... regardless of which supermarket you get it from is "muck".... this food being fed to dogs leads to many behavioural problems in dogs... ie hyperactivity, kidney problems etc! ask any dog trainiers.... when they are called into a home where a dog is misbehaving etc first thing they will ask is regarding food... first thing they will change is a dog's food.... reduction in protein can reduce hyper behaviour etc.... :eek:

would you feed kids sweets all day??? its kinda the same thing as E numbers for kids... its not good for them... and based on my experience its cheap for a reason...

I stand by what i said about not eating meat from Ldil / Aldi... the supermarkets look like a poundworld with chilled counters.... the dont even stack the meat in PROPER refrigerated units... so no i wont eat meat from there... nor will i be feeding to my dog...

morganafay wrote: »

If someone can afford expensive food then that's great. But if someone can't, then that doesn't mean they're not looking after the dog properly. It's not neglecting the dog. I'm not saying anyone here said that, but I know people who feed their dog on really expensive healthy food, but leave the dog locked up all day and don't walk them . . . so that's kinda hypocritical. I do the best for my dogs that I can, cheap food but lots of walks and runs and grooming and attention.

And can everyone who feeds their dogs really expensive food say that they eat really healthy unprocessed foods? I know some people who feed their dogs much much better than themselves.

I had someone saying to me the other day "All dog foods are like feeding your dog McDonalds" and she smokes, does drugs, and proper eats a fair few chips herself . . .

Lidl food can be great, lovely fruit and veg, lovely sauces and stuff, except my local Lidl where all the veg is half gone off! I won't even buy it for my rabbits. That's pretty annoying, and they don't even have proper rice, only microwavable! They have nice houmous though, so it's ok!

i agree with what you are saying.... but i do think that if you added up the cost of supermarket food for a period of two months.... and compared it to other foods that can be bought in bulk... you would realise that infact you are spending the same ...

http://www.zooplus.ie/shop/dogs/dry_dog_food/burns

My dogs food which is organic and holistic.... works out and 90cents per day... a tin of dog food and nuts from a supermarket would work out more...

I do ageee with you though... along with food dogs needs lots of walk, love and attention... not just fancy food... and you are right theres NO excuse leaving a dog locked up all day... infact theres no excuse for leaving a dog locked up at all... let alone all day...

morganafay wrote: »

I think you're probably right about supermarket dog food, but what can people do if they can't afford it? If the dog gets by ok on it and is still healthy (mine are very healthy) . . .

It'd be great if a healthier cheaper food came out. I bet they could make it cheaper, but still good quality. I mean, people can eat healthily for very little money, so why not dogs. I know dogs need more meat and all, but I still think it could be a little cheaper.

I do think that price does not equal quality in every case when it comes to dog food, but I think it's true as a general rule. I steer clear of the commercial foods that are stocked in the vets, such as Hills' and Royal Canin - there is a huge mark-up on those foods and if you take a close look at the ingredients, they're no better than the mid-range brands. I've tried my dogs on both, and they are doing much better on a brand that costs about 25% less, but has no artificial additives and uses human-grade ingredients.

Some of the premium kibble brands really are worth the money, if you can afford them. If not, then a home-cooked or raw diet will be just as nutritious, and cheaper to boot. The problem with home-cooking or preparing raw of course is that it is time consuming and requires a delicate nutritional balancing act, and not everyone has the time or inclination for it.

Yes there is a risk in feeding raw - but there's a risk of bloat or choking when you feed kibble too, as the dog can eat it too quickly. Personally I feel the benefits of feeding "natural" diets outweigh the risks - and you can minimise the risks by providing size-appropriate bones, and being careful in handling raw meat.

What I like about the raw-feeding/BARF community is that there's no agenda as it's not commercial. Generally vets are very much in the pockets of the large dog food companies such as Iams, Eukanuba, Hills', Royal Canin etc.and have been fed a constant stream of marketing from these companies - starting in college! It does lead to bias against raw feeding.

As to the argument that x dog is fed/has always been fed on scraps or a cheap brand and looks healthy (shiny coat, energy etc.) I do think that over a lifetime, feeding inferior food does can a toll on the dog. You can feed a young dog rubbish and it'll still look healthy on the outside - but it's no reflection of the true state of its health.

boomerang wrote: »

I do think that price does not equal quality in every case when it comes to dog food, but I think it's true as a general rule. I steer clear of the commercial foods that are stocked in the vets, such as Hills' and Royal Canin - there is a huge mark-up on those foods and if you take a close look at the ingredients, they're no better than the mid-range brands. I've tried my dogs on both, and they are doing much better on a brand that costs about 25% less, but has no artificial additives and uses human-grade ingredients.

Some of the premium kibble brands really are worth the money, if you can afford them. If not, then a home-cooked or raw diet will be just as nutritious, and cheaper to boot. The problem with home-cooking or preparing raw of course is that it is time consuming and requires a delicate nutritional balancing act, and not everyone has the time or inclination for it.

Yes there is a risk in feeding raw - but there's a risk of bloat or choking when you feed kibble too, as the dog can eat it too quickly. Personally I feel the benefits of feeding "natural" diets outweigh the risks - and you can minimise the risks by providing size-appropriate bones, and being careful in handling raw meat.

What I like about the raw-feeding/BARF community is that there's no agenda as it's not commercial. Generally vets are very much in the pockets of the large dog food companies such as Iams, Eukanuba, Hills', Royal Canin etc.and have been fed a constant stream of marketing from these companies - starting in college! It does lead to bias against raw feeding.

As to the argument that x dog is fed/has always been fed on scraps or a cheap brand and looks healthy (shiny coat, energy etc.) I do think that over a lifetime, feeding inferior food does can a toll on the dog. You can feed a young dog rubbish and it'll still look healthy on the outside - but it's no reflection of the true state of its health.

Great post..... very true and informative!!