Where is the Libertarian explosion coming from?

Laminations wrote: »

You may think your trite reply is an answer but you still haven't addressed how the vulnerable who are liabilities in a system would fare under libertarianism. Or does the corpus of libertarian thought concern itself only with the 'average' person. If your response is simply 'people can look after themselves' then why look after your kids? They are a group who can't look after themselves? What happens to orphans, addicts, homeless, disabled? All valid questions despite you thinking you can brush them aside

So the fact you have no policies aside, what would be the consequence for thislack of concerted policy, this lack of a state to intervene, on the lives of the non average person?

I find libertarians make the most sense out of everyone out there.
Their policies and simple and straight to the point.
They also tend to not lie like most other politicians do.


I do accept that the right wing libertarian, anarcho-capitalist system is the way to go. I believe in a more center weighted, welfare state system.
But in today's economy the libertarian system is a good starting point to start re-building society upon.

Like seriously listen to the opinion people like Ron Paul and Daniel Hannan have about the war, foreign relations, economny etc. and tell me it doesn't make sense to you.

Valmont wrote:

The best a libertarian can hope for is if some group of billionaires buy a country and start from there.

Yes indeed.

deeply amused,
Scofflaw

thebaldsoprano wrote: »

Hm. Seemingly it's possible to be a libertarian and support state welfare.



From this quick quiz.

Interesting:



cordially,
Scofflaw

Sandvich wrote: »

That's the whole point! It's the same with US conservatism.

Their policies are EASY TO UNDERSTAND. That means it's easy to convince people who know NOTHING ABOUT POLITICS OR ECONOMICS OR SOCIOLOGY.

People take the piss out of Objectivists constantly for good reason; so many of their policies, again like american conservatives, are based on slogans, not arguments. Is Man not Entitled to the Sweat off his Brow???

Of course a lot of lefties are like this too, but at least they mean well by comparison.

That's not to say the simples views are always the worst. But it doesn't make them right, either. What makes sense to you, the average joe(probably) isn't the same thing as makes sense on a more objective level(not objectivIST obviously, which doesn't make sense at all ).

You've been had, mate.

So saying that us going to war and invading countries like Iraq and Afghanistan is only going to fuel more hatred for "the west" and thus the best way to keep our countries secure is to just focus on our own matters and leave the other countries to themselves as its none of our business meddling in their matters... Is that statement completely false?

I said I don't agree with libertarianism 100%. I do agree there needs to be some form of government regulation over the market and there needs to be laws which do give people the freedom they deserve but at the same time restrict the citizens from crossing the boundaries. And there needs to be a welfare system for distribution of wealth to uplift the poor of the society.

Basically I like the libertarianist system but there needs to be boundaries defined which the citizens and the market cannot cross. Along with a social welfare tax which distributes money from the rich to the poor. Apart from this the citizens and market should be free to do whatever they want as long as they stay within the boundaries.

Anyway, that's what I believe in a few lines.


I do have a good knowledge of politics and I also know that things have been overly complicated in it so that the politicians can easily fool people with their empty promises to remain in power.

I would say the current political system is perfect and doesn't need to be changed if it was well... perfect! But it isn't. People are losing jobs, the country is in massive debt, there are two wars going on which have achieved nothing significant and instead left the countries in more of a mess than they were before, there is rising taxes along with pay cuts, people are working more hours for lesser pay. Do you call this an efficient system?

Sometimes the simplest answers DO work the best.

That quiz is bloody joke.


And i'm generally a big government statist.

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

People will, in a Libertarian world, actually have to (and this is the shocker,) look after themselves !! :eek:

now you may think you've answered my question but you haven't. You merely said something along the same lines as 'everything will work out'. So please could you tell me what happens to the people who can't look after themselves?we've already identified children as fitting this label but obviously all children have their parents to look after them and all parents are good enough to look after them. Any other groups you can think of that couldn't look after themselves? What would happen to them?

Laminations wrote: »

I'll feel happy if I can save one person from the clutches of libertarianism.

No worries there, they have failed to make a case.
Their ideology is pie-in-the-sky stuff.

Beyond even Marxists.

Akrasia wrote: »

But the fundamental point of libertarianism is that there are millions of walls, all designed to keep people out.
Exclusivity is an essential feature of private property. What happens in a libertarian world to the disenfranchised, the people that don't have property of their own, and are not permitted access to the property of others.
Are you simply suggesting that this group would not exist?

Ssshhhh now. People will look after themselves, everything will be fine. The homeless man screaling in the middle of the night was only a bad dream.

ei.sdraob wrote: »

still being off-topic i see :rolleyes:
people who can not help themselves (disabled) usually have family and friends who are willing to help
and then there is this alien concept of charity and giving to charity


you keep trying to paint Libertarians as some cold blooded monsters, but you ignore that people of this country are extremely charitable and care about their family, friends and neighbours all without being forced to do so
there is nothing preventing groups of people forming and helping others in a Libertarian setting


but of course all of the above has been discussed with you before in other thread, but you choose to ignore what is said if it doesn't fit your "ideology"
anyways unlike all other ideologies (like yours) nothing will be forced on you or others, so fear not my friend
oh feel free to get back on topic anytime soon

I ignore you shouting 'charity' as a panacea for our social ills the same way I'd ignore the government responding to difficult questions with such a naive proposal,

'Brian how will we solve homelessness?'
'How will we solve pension shortfalls?'
'How will we solve social exclusion?'

BRIAN- 'Charity'

what evidence do you have that charity would be enough? It's certainly not enough at present. As for my ideology, I'm a social capitalist. I'm closer to libertarian than statist and I bounce from left on social issues like health and welfare to right on justice issues. That sh1t test says I'm a liberal so I suppose it's got something going for it. And I'll say it to you too, if you don't like the state then disassociate and leave

Akrasia wrote: »

Left libertarians, or libertarian socialists, or anarchists, are pretty much the opposite of right libertarians or laissez faire capitalists or so called 'anarcho-capitalists'
The only thing they have in common is an opposition to authoritarian government, but left libertarians are generally opposed to all forms of imposed authority, while right libertarians are perfectly ok with authoritarianism on 'private property' (which would be everywhere)

Yeah it's a strange quiz. A friend of mine is hardcore anarcho-syndicalist and yet when he answers the quiz he gets libertarian. BUt it is a simple quiz so you can't expect much out of it.


I got this anyway