What happens to non-christians after death?

Sam Vimes · 18-04-2010 06:35PM #1

Hi, I have a question about who believes what about what's going to happen to non-christians. I won't be posting in the thread except possibly to ask clarifying questions, just want to get an idea of what people actually believe. If you pick an option I'd appreciate it if you could say what option you picked and what it is that makes you think that's what's going to happen, preferably with a biblical reference where it said that's what's going to happen.

Ta

(poll to follow)

edit:added. If you think I've left important options off let me know and I'll add them

edit2: and if you don't believe in "hell" per se, think of it as whatever you think the equivalent of hell is.

Yawlboy · 18-04-2010 06:38PM

they rot (like the rest of us)

casey junior · 18-04-2010 06:40PM

Hindus are usually burned on a pyre, most others are buried.

Sam Vimes · 18-04-2010 06:42PM

Yawlboy wrote: »

they rot (like the rest of us)

casey junior wrote: »

Hindus are usually burned on a pyre, most others are buried.

Well we're off to a bad start

I'd tend to agree but I was more hoping for christian responses

viclemronny · 18-04-2010 06:55PM

Being an atheist, I believe that there is no afterlife.

However, I gather from your thread title that you'd like a religious perspective. In that vein, to the best of my memory the Catholic Church preaches one of the two following doctrines, not sure which it is though.

1) If one does not hold catholic beliefs but lives a good and moral life then after a certain amount of time in purgatory one goes to heaven.

2) Virtuos pagans go to limbo, which I'm not sure if the RCC holds to be the first circle of hell. It is the first circle of hell in Dante's Inferno but not sure if this is a view held Catholic Theologians.

Personally, as stated above, I reckon nothing happens. We get our one shot at it and that's it.

antiskeptic · 18-04-2010 07:07PM

By non-Christian (who all go to Hell) I mean those who haven't the status "in Christ". That might include some who identify as Christians but who are not actually.

Conversely, by Christian (all of whom go to Heaven) I mean those who have the status "in Christ". That might include some who don't identify as Christian but who are actually.

janeeen · 18-04-2010 07:39PM

everyone goes into the ground and has no conscience until judgment day.

wolfsbane · 18-04-2010 08:08PM

janeeen wrote: »

everyone goes into the ground and has no conscience until judgment day.

Who are these then?
Revelation 6:9 When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held. 10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?” 11 Then a white robe was given to each of them; and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed.

1 John 3:1 Behold what manner of love the Father has bestowed on us, that we should be called children of God! Therefore the world does not know us, because it did not know Him.

Fanny Cradock · 18-04-2010 08:38PM

I'm confused by the options given on the poll. It seems to be a mish-mash between Christians opinions on the afterlife (options one and two) and Christians opinions on morality.

dermothickey · 18-04-2010 09:02PM

God Loves Everyone

janeeen · 18-04-2010 09:32PM

Ecclesiastes 9:5 For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing; they have no further reward, and even the memory of them is forgotten.
Ecclesiastes 9:10
Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with all your might, for in the grave, where you are going, there is neither working nor planning nor knowledge nor wisdom.

Sam Vimes · 18-04-2010 11:48PM

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

I'm confused by the options given on the poll. It seems to be a mish-mash between Christians opinions on the afterlife (options one and two) and Christians opinions on morality.

I'm confused too, that's why I started the thread

I often hear people talk as if certain moral actions or overall poor morality result in hell but then I hear that all who accept Jesus will be saved. Then I hear that god saves good people regardless of their religion. Would I be right in saying that you believe morality and salvation are separate issues, making you a 1 on the list?

Or would you be a variant of option 2, where the actions that Christians can do to lose salvation are something other than poor morality?

Or option 6,other [fill in as required]

casey junior · 18-04-2010 11:51PM

janeeen wrote: »

Ecclesiastes 9:5 For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing; they have no further reward, and even the memory of them is forgotten.
Ecclesiastes 9:10
Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with all your might, for in the grave, where you are going, there is neither working nor planning nor knowledge nor wisdom.

Here boy, I never knew that, thats a good one that is.

Stephentlig · 19-04-2010 12:23AM

God is there only judge for scripture says who can know the mind of the Lord?

Tail Wagger · 19-04-2010 12:28AM

We all become maggot food,, then who'll take you in?

Fanny Cradock · 19-04-2010 12:43AM

Sam Vimes wrote: »

I'm confused too, that's why I started the thread

I often hear people talk as if certain moral actions or overall poor morality result in hell but then I hear that all who accept Jesus will be saved. Then I hear that god saves good people regardless of their religion. Would I be right in saying that you believe morality and salvation are separate issues, making you a 1 on the list?

Or would you be a variant of option 2, where the actions that Christians can do to lose salvation are something other than poor morality?

Or option 6,other [fill in as required]

Haven't we discussed this before?

Anyway, as an atheists belief about what happens after death is neither a surprise or in question, further off topic posts will be deleted.

Glenster · 19-04-2010 12:52AM

I dont think anyone knows who goes to hell and who goes to heaven.

It would be presumptuous of anyone here to say whether they are going to heaven, how are we supposed to know what happens to X?

Especially since the only thing we know about X is that he's non-christian.

Soul Winner · 19-04-2010 04:05AM

To everyone who believes that we will just be nothing after we die can you tell me how long this will last for? Forever? Does that mean you believe in eternity?

If God exists then He will have the final say on the matter. If He doesn't exist then there's nothing to worry about at all, just nothingness for eternity, if such a thing exists. It is not our place to judge who will or who will not get in. All we can say is that God has guaranteed entry to those who trust in Jesus His Son, who gave Himself for us, and who said that we should judge not lest we be judged. What should be of paramount importance to everyone is whether they believe God has spoken to their hearts at anytime in their lives or not. Have you hearkened unto His promptings or have you rebelled and gone your own way? This is the essence of sin, that all we like sheep have gone astray, we have turned, everyone, to our own way. Until this is recognized by the self and turned from in repentance toward God you cannot be saved. You must recognize your need of God and then ask Him with a heart of truth to deliver you from your dreadful condition, and when you do, He will, I guarantee it.

Ramza · 19-04-2010 04:24AM

I did some thinking about this a while back and I came to my own conclusion

I wouldn't be very religious but I do believe in a prime creator

I deny that when we die its nothingness for eternity, can I ask you ; what or who experiences this nothingness? I thought ; the part of me that thinks, feels and experiences emotion will never die aka my soul (imo). In my opinion there will be something else when we die, I think that death is only the beginning for human beings.

I believe that the body is a host for a soul (I know it might sound cliched but this is my honest opinion). One might argue the lengths and breadths of the human body, how we experience emotion, the brain, and how when we die all life is terminated within us, but tbh I respect this view but I also politely deny it in place of my own belief and opinion

All energy is borrowed we must give it back at some stage

Sam Vimes · 19-04-2010 11:08AM

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

Haven't we discussed this before?

We have but it was never really made clear to me. My original post in that thread was to someone who was saying that bad moral behaviour sends you to hell so I said that it's a christian belief that believing in Jesus (or accepting the gift as you put it) is what earns salvation and not moral behaviour and people kept saying I was misrepresenting things but didn't say exactly how. Hence I started the thread to find out if moral behaviour effects salvation and if so, how.

Glenster wrote: »

I dont think anyone knows who goes to hell and who goes to heaven.

It would be presumptuous of anyone here to say whether they are going to heaven, how are we supposed to know what happens to X?

Especially since the only thing we know about X is that he's non-christian.

I thought that these would have been fairly clear no?

Jon 14:6: "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me"

John 3:16: "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life"

Ramza wrote: »

I deny that when we die its nothingness for eternity, can I ask you ; what or who experiences this nothingness?

who experienced the nothingness before you were born?

Blueboyd · 19-04-2010 10:17PM

Non Christians will go to Heaven but it will feel like Hell for them cos there are so many Christians there

Michaelrsh · 19-04-2010 11:41PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BfaQuk5tEKE

AtomicHorror · 19-04-2010 11:46PM

Soul Winner wrote: »

To everyone who believes that we will just be nothing after we die can you tell me how long this will last for? Forever? Does that mean you believe in eternity?

I imagine it'll feel about as long as the time before we were born. Nothing means nothing. If you talk about it in terms of how long it lasts, you're not getting what nothing means.

Glenster · 20-04-2010 03:50AM

Sam Vimes wrote: »

I thought that these would have been fairly clear no?

John 14:6: "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me"

John 3:16: "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life"

Yeah, clear, coz if there's one thing the bible isn't, it's cryptic.

If we're taking the bible literally, reading it like a child would, with no subtext (maybe we get confused by big ideas) the afterlife isnt really an issue coz, according to John 3:16, I'm going to live forever.

PDN · 20-04-2010 08:04AM

Glenster wrote: »

Yeah, clear, coz if there's one thing the bible isn't, it's cryptic.

If we're taking the bible literally, reading it like a child would, with no subtext (maybe we get confused by big ideas) the afterlife isnt really an issue coz, according to John 3:16, I'm going to live forever.

Some parts of the Bible are cryptic (eg apocalyptic literature such as Revelation) but I think John 3:16 is clear enough. You'd need to be deliberately obtuse, or have zero understanding of any context, to misunderstand it.

Sometimes I just get so tired of the games people want to play here.

Sam Vimes · 20-04-2010 09:29AM

PDN wrote: »

Some parts of the Bible are cryptic (eg apocalyptic literature such as Revelation) but I think John 3:16 is clear enough.

I'd have to agree with that tbh. Glenster, would I be right in saying that you have a personal view of god and the nature of god and that your reason for saying that these passages are cryptic and that we don't know who is saved and who isn't is that what those passages appear to be saying does not fit with your personal view of god?

dvpower · 20-04-2010 01:55PM

Sam Vimes wrote: »

Jon 14:6: "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me"

John 3:16: "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life"

I don't think John 14:6 is that clear at all (do you have to be a Christian or is he heaven's bouncer and sometimes lets non regulars in). John 3:16 seems clear enough about Christians, but doesn't mention non Christians at all.

Similar threads have failed to enlighten me in the past. There seems to be a range of opinion but with a reasonable body of consensus around the idea that only Christians can go to heaven (and perhaps those who didn't have the opportunity or the capacity to be Christians).

Expect a lot of metaphors and accusations of deliberately misunderstanding perfectly clear answers.

antiskeptic wrote: »

Conversely, by Christian (all of whom go to Heaven) I mean those who have the status "in Christ". That might include some who don't identify as Christian but who are actually.

@antiskeptic. I don't understand this (honestly). Can you elaborate please.

philologos · 20-04-2010 02:49PM

If you read John chapter 3 in its entirety one also notices:

John 3:18 wrote:

Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.

This might help to move the discussion along. This follows, John 3:17 which states the following:

John 3:17 wrote:

For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.

If you read all three together, from John 3:16, to John 3:18 while also giving individual notice to each verse, you will notice the importance of what Jesus is saying.

Sam Vimes · 20-04-2010 03:19PM

Jakkass wrote: »

If you read all three together, from John 3:16, to John 3:18 while also giving individual notice to each verse, you will notice the importance of what Jesus is saying.

Which is what exactly?

philologos · 20-04-2010 03:48PM

Sam Vimes wrote: »

Which is what exactly?

What do you think the point of John chapter 3 is?

Particularly the section from John 3:16 - 21

My viewpoint won't be remarkable to you, it is always best to think about it for yourself, and bring your own conclusions to the table.

Sam Vimes · 20-04-2010 04:20PM

Jakkass wrote: »

What do you think the point of John chapter 3 is?

Particularly the section from John 3:16 - 21

My viewpoint won't be remarkable to you, it is always best to think about it for yourself, and bring your own conclusions to the table.

When I read "Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already" I take it to mean that whoever believes in Jesus will be saved and whoever doesn't believe in him will be condemned (or is already) but when I said this in a previous thread I was accused of misrepresenting people and I'm often told that this is not the case. Also only 26% of people have picked that option on my poll. I'm confused.......

It also seems to be saying that what keeps people away from christianity is a desire to do wicked things and that those who do good things will be drawn to it. Does that sound accurate to you?

What happens to non-christians after death?

What happens to non-Christians? 38 votes

Comments