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Nine charged with irish teenagers death

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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 442 ✭✭Emoran



    That malignant scrote of a mother never even bothered to say sorry or my condolences.... nothing! just tried to deny it and try pass the blame away from her child hope her kid stays in jail for a good while


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,900 ✭✭✭InTheTrees


    Emoran wrote: »
    That malignant scrote of a mother never even bothered to say sorry or my condolences.... nothing! just tried to deny it and try pass the blame away from her child hope her kid stays in jail for a good while

    yeah and all the while spewing sh*t about her "values".


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 970 ✭✭✭Kirnsy


    each one of them should get life, because thats what price that poor girl paid. And for the two rapists, i hope the enjoy a suprise when they bend over to get the soap in jail, because they deserve to be on the recieving end.

    While I'm completely guessing here, there is a good chance that they didn't in fact force her to have sex per ce, but admitted to being involved in a sexual relationship with Phoebe, which AFAIK being underage is regarded as statutory rape in the US. If someone has more knowledge than me on that please correct me.

    Emoran wrote: »
    That malignant scrote of a mother never even bothered to say sorry or my condolences.... nothing! just tried to deny it and try pass the blame away from her child hope her kid stays in jail for a good while


    Absolutely disgusting. Like mother like daughter in this case.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,849 ✭✭✭Valmont


    Does anyone know exactly what the bullies in question are being charged with? Apart from statutory rape for the boys, are the girls being charged with harassment or something? The most important thing that the school and authorities can do now is to punish the bullies in question quite severely, highlighting how this terrible behaviour is allowed to carry on under the teachers' noses. I'm afraid this cycle is doomed to repeat itself unfortunately.

    Does anyone have an idea if this is actually worse in America? In my experience, I found the yanks far less judgemental of social status than people here in Ireland. Although I wasn't there as a teenager.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 697 ✭✭✭chocgirl


    Such a sad case, I hope those nine learn something from it however unlikely that is.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,089 ✭✭✭ascanbe


    Valmont wrote: »
    Does anyone know exactly what the bullies in question are being charged with? Apart from statutory rape for the boys, are the girls being charged with harassment or something? The most important thing that the school and authorities can do now is to punish the bullies in question quite severely, highlighting how this terrible behaviour is allowed to carry on under the teachers' noses. I'm afraid this cycle is doomed to repeat itself unfortunately.

    Does anyone have an idea if this is actually worse in America? In my experience, I found the yanks far less judgemental of social status than people here in Ireland. Although I wasn't there as a teenager.

    From what i know of America, never having attended high school there, there seems to be an unspoken acceptance of a hierarchy of cliques at play in highschools and in some cases an all but concerted propagation of them; probably just a reflection of their culture.
    Having said that, i'd say the buds of something similar have emerged here over the last few years; having a relation who teaches, though, i do know that some teachers, at least in some schools, are aware of the possibility and measures have been taken to curb it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,900 ✭✭✭InTheTrees


    Kirnsy wrote: »
    While I'm completely guessing here, there is a good chance that they didn't in fact force her to have sex per ce, but admitted to being involved in a sexual relationship with Phoebe, which AFAIK being underage is regarded as statutory rape in the US. If someone has more knowledge than me on that please correct me.

    yes. Statutory rape means consensual sex between minors. I think.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,256 ✭✭✭metaoblivia


    ascanbe wrote: »
    From what i know of America, never having attended high school there, there seems to be an unspoken acceptance of a hierarchy of cliques at play in highschools and in some cases an all but concerted propagation of them; probably just a reflection of their culture.
    Having said that, i'd say the buds of something similar have emerged here over the last few years; having a relation who teaches, though, i do know that some teachers, at least in some schools, are aware of the possibility and measures have been taken to curb it.

    Having gone to high school in America, I have to say this largely depends on the dynamics of individual schools. For example, South Hadley High has a student population of just over 700. It's a relatively small population with less than 200 kids per grade. By comparison, the high school I went to had a population of over 2,500. It's much harder to maintain a hierarchy of cliques with that amount of students. We were also terrible at American football, so our jocks and cheerleaders weren't given any special status.

    I think this case shows the danger of mob mentality. Like a few others have said, individually, these kids wouldn't dare engage in the kind of outrageous behavior that led to this. But in the power of a group, and in a smaller school where people are more likely to brush things off from "good kids," i.e., kids they've known for years, it can reach dangerous levels when unchecked.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,089 ✭✭✭ascanbe


    Will people cop on. Bullying goes on in every school and that will never change. We don't know if this girl would have killed herself anyway. Thousands of kids and adults go through bullying every day but we dont see thousands of bullying related suicide. I really dont see the kids in this school as murderers.

    What you have written is not untrue; nor is it an excuse for what happened.
    As you wrote bullying has always been and will always be an issue in any school; the onus is on those in charge of the education system, as a whole, and those directly in charge of schools to protect those at risk, foremost, and also to foster an enviroment where bullying is deemed unacceptable.
    It shouldn't take a suicide to here make this a priority; indeed, i've little doubt that there have been a number of suicides here where this was the root cause.
    There has been a rush, in this case, to vilify the bullies deemed responsible for this; perfectly understandably, really, and i won't be weeping if they suffer the harshest penalty possible.
    But any healthy school systems main priority should be to ensure that the conditions that allowed this to take place do not emerge; those in charge have has much of a responsibility to restrain and educate potential bullies as they do to protect those who may suffer because of them.
    It can't be stopped completely, of course, but it must be controlled as much as possible.
    If the blame is simply placed on the kids responsible for the bullying then nothing will be achieved.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,089 ✭✭✭ascanbe


    Having gone to high school in America, I have to say this largely depends on the dynamics of individual schools. For example, South Hadley High has a student population of just over 700. It's a relatively small population with less than 200 kids per grade. By comparison, the high school I went to had a population of over 2,500. It's much harder to maintain a hierarchy of cliques with that amount of students. We were also terrible at American football, so our jocks and cheerleaders weren't given any special status.

    I think this case shows the danger of mob mentality. Like a few others have said, individually, these kids wouldn't dare engage in the kind of outrageous behavior that led to this. But in the power of a group, and in a smaller school where people are more likely to brush things off from "good kids," i.e., kids they've known for years, it can reach dangerous levels when unchecked.

    Unchecked, i think, is the key word in what you wrote. You, obviously have greater knowledge of the highschool system in America, and are in a better position to comment.
    As i just wrote in response to another comment and what i think you would agree with judging by your reply to my initial post, is that it is of paramount importance that any school responsible for the education of teenagers, regardless of what country it is in, should have, at its core, a responsibility to ensure, as much as possible, that tragic cases like this do not occur.
    That seems obvious; still, i think, many schools fall down in this regard.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,092 ✭✭✭Le King


    School is the States sucks. This girl obviously got on the bad side of some stupid click. Makes me sick. Surely someone seen the bullying going on, whether it be Facebook or in the corridor or what not. Everyone has been on the end of a bit of small bullying in their life.


    The only time I was ever bullied over here was because of my American accent when I was about 12. After a couple of weeks, I never heard anything of the sorts again. I've seen a few Irish kids get bullied, especially Red-Headed children. It's quite sad that as a society, as far as we have come, still don't accept some people. I don't care who you are you still deserve to be schooled without this shit.


    Anyway, these kids are likely to get off with a slap on the wrist. Which is a huge shame.

    I hope they do something to prove a point to all the kids like these bully's that it won't be tolerated any more and it will be punishable by law.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,256 ✭✭✭metaoblivia


    ascanbe wrote: »
    Unchecked, i think, is the key word in what you wrote. You, obviously have greater knowledge of the highschool system in America, and are in a better position to comment.
    As i just wrote in response to another comment and what i think you would agree with judging by your reply to my initial post, is that it is of paramount importance that any school responsible for the education of teenagers, regardless of what country it is in, should have, at its core, a responsibility to ensure, as much as possible, that tragic cases like this do not occur.
    That seems obvious; still, i think, many schools fall down in this regard.

    I absolutely agree. The teachers failed to respond when informed of the situation. What I would be interested in is why they failed. Is it because, being a relatively small high school, they assumed they knew the students involved well enough to think they weren't capable of such vicious abuse? Is it because they considered Phoebe Prince and her family as "outsiders" and therefore didn't take their complaints as seriously? Whatever the reason, it's absolutely inexcusable. But as an educator, I'd like to know the reason why they ignored what was right under their noses.

    I did hear on a news report tonight that Massachusetts is now considering legislation that would require teachers to follow up on reports of bullying. It's obviously too late for Phoebe, but it's a step in the right direction.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,082 ✭✭✭✭Spiritoftheseventies


    Will people cop on. Bullying goes on in every school and that will never change. We don't know if this girl would have killed herself anyway. Thousands of kids and adults go through bullying every day but we dont see thousands of bullying related suicide. I really dont see the kids in this school as murderers.
    I think the fact that charges were brought against them is telling. Sure the decision wasn't made lightly.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 709 ✭✭✭ClutchIt


    Fuhrer wrote: »
    What do they deserve?

    A Good hiding


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,082 ✭✭✭✭Spiritoftheseventies


    Interesting article this.
    When our elected leaders do nothing to condemn or prevent threats of violence and hate speech, in effect, they implicitly condone the behavior. The hate speech revved up very soon after the election of America's first black president and it hasn't slowed. The lack of respect, the hate speech, and the vitriol is the equivalent of adult bullying.

    15 year old Phoebe Prince was tormented for months by 9 other students at her high school in Massachusetts. The victim's mother repeatedly asked school officials to intervene but the school failed to protect the girl. She was harassed verbally and through social networking site, Facebook, and sent hate text messages.

    The culture of bullying isn't limited to school children, it has become a national pastime. During the 2008 Presidential campaign, crowds attending Sarah Palin rallies shouted, "Kill him" over and over again referring to President Obama. Neither Palin or any other GOP leaders condemned the vile shouts of their followers.

    Tea party activists carry signs depicting the American president as the devil, the anti-Christ, Hitler and worse. They carry guns to rallies and their paranoiac fear of the government has turned into hate and aggression.

    The hate speech and vitriol isn't limited to the Tea Party sect. Texas congressman Randy Neugebauer shouted "baby killer" at anti-abortionist, Bart Stupak because he signed the health care reform bill after being assured that no federal funds would be used to pay for abortion.

    Congresswoman Michelle Bachmann (MN), along with other GOP colleagues egged on Tea-party protestors outside the White House as they shouted racial slurs and other hate speech at Democratic colleagues entering the White House to vote on health care reform.

    It's become part of the collective knowledge of the U.S. that the entire GOP electorate has made the decision to vote no to every single piece of legislation the Democratic led Congress and or President Obama proposes. But the GOP has gone further than simple obstruction, they have resorted to vitriolic fear-mongering. They created a fear in the nation's elderly by saying health care reform would create death camps for old people during town hall meetings last summer.

    Hate speech has become the norm in today's political climate. Militias and hate groups have experienced explosive growth since the election of the first black U.S. president. The SPLC has documented an "astonishing 244% increase in the number of antigovernment Patriot groups in 2009." The people associated with the Patriot movement peaked in the 1990s with the Oklahoma City bombing and died down in the early 2000s. But they are back and they are angry. One Christian militia group in Michigan was arrested just yesterday when the FBI discovered the group planned to kill a group of policemen. The group wanted to kill the policemen for Jesus because in their ideology, policemen represent the government.

    GOP Congresswoman Michele Bachmann has urged her constituents to stockpile weapons. Minority leader John Boehner declared that the health care reform bill would cause instant Armageddon (it didn't).

    At town hall meetings around the country set up to discuss health care reform, anecdotes had a common theme. A majority of the audience would be bused in from out of state to "gin up" (to borrow a favorite Sarah Palin phrase) the GOP's relentless determination to obstruct not just health care reform but any and everything the Democrats in office proposed. The few local people attending town hall meetings were often represented by chronically and seriously sick individuals along with health care professionals. In town after town, the large crowd of bused in supporters shouted at people toting oxygen tanks with tales of losing jobs and health insurance to "sit down and shut up."

    This adult bullying by tea party sects, Sarah Palin, Glenn Beck, Michele Bachmann and other GOP officials, is protected by the First Amendment. The First Amendment gives every American the right to use hate speech. But if leaders of the GOP who have seemingly aligned themselves with the Tea party and whose own elected colleagues have participated in the violent rhetoric and oral bullying continue to ignore such antics, by their silence, they condone the behavior of people who attend their rallies as well as the colleagues who urge them on.

    The behavior of the GOP since President Obama was elected has been obstructionist and petty at best. But GOP leaders have condoned shouts by their colleagues of, "You lie" as well as tea party sects who portray the president of the United States as the anti-Christ while media mongrels like Sarah Palin and Glenn Beck urge their followers to prepare for war on Democrats and the President of the U.S. By their silence, Republican leaders agree with the sentiments of the vitriolic among their numbers.

    Is it any real surprise then, that children are emulating the current culture of bullying without recourse? Nine students bullied Massachusetts student Phoebe Prince, aged 15, for months through verbal insults, text messages and on the internet. Sound familiar? It should. The nine girls who relentlessly bullied Phoebe may simply be emulating the current political culture of hate and bullying. School officials were aware of the bullying and didn't intervene even though the girl's mother repeatedly asked school officials for help for her tormented daughter.

    http://www.examiner.com/x-1172-Progressive-Politics-Examiner~y2010m3d30-Does-Phoebe-Prince-school-bullying-case-in-Massachusetts-reflect-political-climate?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,716 ✭✭✭LittleBook


    Valmont wrote: »
    Does anyone know exactly what the bullies in question are being charged with?

    Prosecutor: Nine Teens Charged in Bullying that led to Girl's Suicide
    In the indictments, returned Friday but not made public until Monday, the Hampshire County grand jury charged

    17-year-old Sean Mulveyhill of South Hadley with statutory rape, violation of civil rights with bodily injury resulting, criminal harassment and disturbance of a school assembly.

    18-year-old Austin Renaud of Springfield with statutory rape

    Kayla Narey, 17, of South Hadley, was charged with violation of civil rights with bodily injury resulting, criminal harassment and disturbance of a school assembly

    ...

    Charges against another three girls included violation of civil rights with bodily injury resulting; two were also charged with stalking.

    Three other girls from South Hadley were named in four delinquency complaints from Hampshire Franklin Juvenile Court. Their charges included violation of civil rights with bodily injury resulting, criminal harassment and disturbance of a school assembly, violation of civil rights, criminal harassment and assault by means of a dangerous weapon. One of the juveniles was charged in a separate complaint involving a second victim, Scheibel said.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,038 ✭✭✭jackiebaron


    Fuhrer wrote: »
    So,


    Charged with murder in the first degree?

    They're sick little bastards no doubt but I don't know what kind of punishment is appropriate here. Sure, stalking and harassing and menacing are crimes but they didn't kill her. She took her own life as a result of their intimidation so really I don't know what to do with them. Is it a crime to bully? I don't know. Sexual harassment is certainly a crime as far as I know and workplace bullying is certainly a problem that has gained a lot of attention in recent years but I don't know where the law stands regarding juvenile bullying.
    Doubtless these kids are snotty New England rich kids. Part of the blue-blood set (think George W. Bush. Maybe not as rich and connected but certainly as nasty). Their rich daddy's will grease the palms of judges and others to make sure their little darlings don't face the music for this "silly little episode" in their child's formative years.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,038 ✭✭✭jackiebaron


    LittleBook wrote: »


    Statutory rape????? So this went far beyond bullying. Statutory rape is when you have sex with a minor. It doesn't necessarily mean taking someone by force. WTF? Was one of these guys having a relationship with the victim? This is damned confusing.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,949 ✭✭✭✭IvyTheTerrible


    Statutory rape????? So this went far beyond bullying. Statutory rape is when you have sex with a minor. It doesn't necessarily mean taking someone by force. WTF? Was one of these guys having a relationship with the victim? This is damned confusing.
    That's the whole point of the story. She went out with one of these guys for a while, and that's when his jealous female friends decided to start tormenting her.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Cianos


    From the schools website, the contact info for the principal;
    "Contact Dan Smith (danshhs@comcast.net) with any questions or comments."

    I think he should have a few questions and comments sent his way.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,082 ✭✭✭✭Spiritoftheseventies


    what is galling is that school said they knew nothing of the bullying until after the death. But this has since been contradicted.


    THE possibility of legal charges against staff in a US school where an Irish girl was bullied before she committed suicide has not been ruled out, prosecutors told the Irish Independent last night.
    THE possibility of legal charges against staff in a US school where an Irish girl was bullied before she committed suicide has not been ruled out, prosecutors told the Irish Independent last night.
    The disclosure came as a district attorney charged nine students -- including seven girls -- with offences including civil rights violations, statutory rape, stalking and inflicting bodily injury to Phoebe Prince.

    Prosecutors claim some staff at the Massachusetts school attended by Phoebe (15), who grew up in Fanore, Co Clare, knew of the bullying -- which took place in person and on social networking sites -- but did nothing to stop the students involved.

    Phoebe hanged herself in her family's apartment on January 14 after a final, horrific day of bullying and abuse waged by a gang of so-called 'mean girls', jealous over her brief dating of a school footballer.

    They had labelled her an "Irish slut" and the high school footballer had himself turned on the teenager and joined in the campaign of abuse which encompassed threats and insults on the Facebook website and an allegation of rape.

    The suicide, said prosecutor Elizabeth Scheibel, was the culmination "of this nearly three-month campaign of verbally assaultive behaviour and threats of physical harm.

    "The investigation revealed relentless activity directed toward Phoebe, designed to humiliate her and to make it impossible for her to remain at school," she said. "The bullying, for her, became intolerable."

    Insults and threats followed the pretty 15-year-old almost from her first day at South Hadley High School, targeting the Irish immigrant in the halls, library, in vicious mobile phone text messages and she was even pelted with drinks as she walked home from school.

    Family

    Phoebe was born in England and moved to Ireland when she was two with her parents, Anne O'Brien Prince and Jeremy Prince. The family, with sisters Lauren, Tessa and Bridget and brother Simon, moved to the US last year.

    When asked if teaching staff could still face charges over the case, a spokesperson for Ms Scheibel told the Irish Independent last night: "We do not know what the future will hold. Nothing can be ruled out at this stage," she said.

    In another twist to a case that has horrified America and ignited a debate on teenage bullying, the mother of a student charged in the case admitted her daughter had verbally clashed with Phoebe.

    None of the nine teenagers face arrest, the spokesperson said. Instead they will be summonsed to court in the coming weeks for a trial date.

    Management at South Hadley High School denied it knew of the abuse until Phoebe died but it has since emerged that her mother had discussed the bullying with at least two members of staff.

    Last night an anti-bullying consultant, Barbara Coloroso, said she consulted with parents and administrators months before Phoebe's death but the school didn't follow the advice she gave it.

    "Contrary to previously published reports, Phoebe's harassment was common knowledge to most of the student body," said Ms Scheibel.

    Sean Mulveyhill (17) and Austin Renaud (18) are accused of statutory rape, while Mulveyhill also faces charges of violation of civil rights, harassment and disturbance of a school assembly.

    Kayla Narey (17) was charged with violation of civil rights, criminal harassment and disturbance of a school assembly.

    Ashley Longe (16) faces charges of violation of civil rights as a youthful offender.

    Flannery Mullins (16) and Sharon Chanon Velazquez (16) were charged with violation of civil rights and stalking as a youthful offender. Three female juveniles, who were not named but are all from South Hadley, are also being charged.

    Statutory rape charges can result in penalties of up to life in prison, while conviction on a violation of civil rights charge could result in a 10-year jail sentence.

    Some of the bullying and abuse is alleged to have happened in front of teachers. The school's own website contains no reference to Phoebe's death and there is no online mem-orial for the Irish teenager.

    Ashlee Dunn (16) told the 'New York Times' she had heard stories spread about Phoebe in the hallways. "She was new and she was from a different country and she didn't really know the school very well. I think that's probably one reason why they chose Phoebe."

    Phoebe's family has since moved away from the area.

    The mother of Sharon Chanon Velazquez claimed yesterday her daughter had never hit Phoebe.

    Confrontations

    "She exchanged a couple of words with her," said Angeles Chanon. She refused to say what her daughter said in the confrontations with Phoebe. "My daughter never fought with her or said, 'Go harm yourself', or 'I hate you'."

    Ms Chanon said her daughter had informed her about the dispute. "Phoebe was calling her names. They're teenagers. They call names," she told the 'Boston Herald' newspaper.

    "It's very unfortunate to know what happened to that girl. I can hardly imagine what that family is going through," the mother said.

    Another student who is not facing charges, Sergio Loubriel (14), said he regretted never telling Phoebe he had a crush on her. "I wish I could have stopped it," he said.
    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/staff-at-phoebes-school-could-face-charges-2118116.html


  • Posts: 6,645 ✭✭✭ Maisie Straight Test


    Oh please. As if bullying doesn't go on in Ireland. It's terrible that this poor girl was harrassed to the point she took her own life, but it could have happened anywhere. Nothing described in the article sounds particularly out of the ordinary to me. Yes, high school girls (and some boys) are bitchy, vicious and cruel. Who knew? I have no doubt that Facebook and mobiles make it easier than ever for bullies to target their victims, but this is the case in Ireland as well.

    And as for the talk of life sentences, again, please. They didn't kill her. She killed herself. Sure, they sound like horrible excuses for human beings, but the last time I checked, being horrible to someone wasn't a crime. And I say this as someone who was bullied at secondary school for being 'foreign'. This story is only news because of the tragic outcome. Bullying of this sort goes on every day, in every country. Anyone who thinks it doesn't or this is an American thing has their head buried in the sand. The 'jocks vs nerds' culture might be less prevalent over here, but it was certainly very visible in my school. The rugby and hockey players were celebrated and protected by staff, free to bully those who weren't as 'cool'. I was able to stand up for myself, having grown up in Manchester and dealt with much tougher and scarier bullies, but I'm sure the more sheltered kids weren't.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,038 ✭✭✭jackiebaron


    OK, i'm dead against bullying, i'm also dead against suicide, i'm also a huge fan of survival of the fittest

    Well I certainly wouldn't like to see the culling of certain "unfit" weaklings like Einstein, Newton and Hawking.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,082 ✭✭✭✭Spiritoftheseventies


    [quote=[Deleted User];65176370]Oh please. As if bullying doesn't go on in Ireland. It's terrible that this poor girl was harrassed to the point she took her own life, but it could have happened anywhere. Nothing described in the article sounds particularly out of the ordinary to me. Yes, high school girls (and some boys) are bitchy, vicious and cruel. Who knew? I have no doubt that Facebook and mobiles make it easier than ever for bullies to target their victims, but this is the case in Ireland as well.

    And as for the talk of life sentences, again, please. They didn't kill her. She killed herself. Sure, they sound like horrible excuses for human beings, but the last time I checked, being horrible to someone wasn't a crime. And I say this as someone who was bullied at secondary school for being 'foreign'. This story is only news because of the tragic outcome. Bullying of this sort goes on every day, in every country. Anyone who thinks it doesn't or this is an American thing has their head buried in the sand. The 'jocks vs nerds' culture might be less prevalent over here, but it was certainly very visible in my school. The rugby and hockey players were celebrated and protected by staff, free to bully those who weren't as 'cool'. I was able to stand up for myself, having grown up in Manchester and dealt with much tougher and scarier bullies, but I'm sure the more sheltered kids weren't.[/QUOTE]
    again charges were brought against these kids. Not just a case of bullying. Prosecutors would need a very solid case before taking it to court.
    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Cianos


    [quote=[Deleted User];65176370]Oh please. As if bullying doesn't go on in Ireland. It's terrible that this poor girl was harrassed to the point she took her own life, but it could have happened anywhere. Nothing described in the article sounds particularly out of the ordinary to me. Yes, high school girls (and some boys) are bitchy, vicious and cruel. Who knew? I have no doubt that Facebook and mobiles make it easier than ever for bullies to target their victims, but this is the case in Ireland as well.

    And as for the talk of life sentences, again, please. They didn't kill her. She killed herself. Sure, they sound like horrible excuses for human beings, but the last time I checked, being horrible to someone wasn't a crime. And I say this as someone who was bullied at secondary school for being 'foreign'. This story is only news because of the tragic outcome. Bullying of this sort goes on every day, in every country. Anyone who thinks it doesn't or this is an American thing has their head buried in the sand. The 'jocks vs nerds' culture might be less prevalent over here, but it was certainly very visible in my school. The rugby and hockey players were celebrated and protected by staff, free to bully those who weren't as 'cool'. I was able to stand up for myself, having grown up in Manchester and dealt with much tougher and scarier bullies, but I'm sure the more sheltered kids weren't.[/QUOTE]

    While you have a point I don't see why peoples disgust at the matter in hand should be disregarded or calmed because "it happens everywhere". Everyone knows it happens everywhere, but the issue as a whole is readdressed when one case is discussed, such as right now.

    And how else is one to talk about the impact bullying can have except for talking about individual cases?
    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


  • Posts: 6,645 ✭✭✭ Maisie Straight Test


    Cianos wrote: »
    While you have a point I don't see why peoples disgust at the matter in hand should be disregarded or calmed because "it happens everywhere". Everyone knows it happens everywhere, but the issue as a whole is readdressed when one case is discussed, such as right now.

    And how else is one to talk about the impact bullying can have except for talking about individual cases?

    Well, there is also a tone of 'aren't American kids so horrible' running through the thread. This isn't an American thing or even a kid thing, it's a people thing. I've discovered since leaving school that a lot of the bullies just turn into adult bullies in the workplace. Lots of people are just sh*t.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,707 ✭✭✭skywalker


    Ive just heard about this story, really sad stuff. I cant imagine what that poor girl went through, that she thought suicide was her only option. Somethings wrong when a child doesnt feel they can confide in anyone, but in this case its even worse, she obviously told adults, but they didnt take responsibility. Disgusting. I hope the book gets thrown at the scum who did this, & the scum who turned their backs while it happened.

    The family have my sympathies.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 9,299 ✭✭✭sdanseo


    In before Kim Wilde

    I don't understand how you can be bullied by Facebook. If people are sending you messages surely you would just unfriendalise them or, you know, stop logging in all the time.

    That's very, very closed-minded. Some people don't think straight when upset or distressed, much less when you're 14 or 15.

    The people who caused this - yes, caused - knew exactly what they were doing even if they didn't expect the end result. No excuse, lock them up.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 9,441 ✭✭✭old hippy


    sdonn wrote: »
    That's very, very closed-minded. Some people don't think straight when upset or distressed, much less when you're 14 or 15.

    That's certainly correct - some people don't think straight at that age - victims or bullies. And when the pack mentality takes over... cripes :(

    Perhaps we need lessons in social interaction and respect for your fellow human being instead of wasteful religious instruction?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Cianos


    [quote=[Deleted User];65176913]Well, there is also a tone of 'aren't American kids so horrible' running through the thread. This isn't an American thing or even a kid thing, it's a people thing. I've discovered since leaving school that a lot of the bullies just turn into adult bullies in the workplace. Lots of people are just sh*t.[/QUOTE]

    Well that's because it happened in America. It's obviously going to draw out some blanket remarks regarding that country and it's culture, and seeing as though the child was new to the country and from our country the cultural elements are actually quite relevant in this case. Someone who grew up within that social dynamic as opposed to being new to it would probably be better prepared to deal with the circumstances as they unfolded (read, would know their place :mad: )And as I said, no one is denying that bullying doesn't happen elsewhere.
    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


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