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Discrimination against Men

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Comments

  • #182
    metrovelvet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,375 ✭✭✭metrovelvet


    Would Ireland's museums be at risk for the confiscation of headless statues and still lifes where the head isnt included or the subject is faceless?

    What about crossing it into the film censorship board?

    What about removing Ann Summers from O Connell Street?


  • #183
    Zulu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,967 ✭✭✭✭Zulu


    Sorry, what?


  • #184
    Lu Tze
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,524 ✭✭✭Lu Tze


    MediumWell wrote: »
    I'd imagine the C3 at higher level requirement hasn't been around for a long time.

    I am pretty sure that all engineering degree courses in the Universities still have a requirement of C3 minimum in honours.

    I'm thankful they have kept up his standard to be honest.


  • #185
    norrie rugger
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,656 ✭✭✭norrie rugger


    Zulu wrote: »
    Sorry, what?

    indeed


  • #186
    amacachi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,315 ✭✭✭✭amacachi


    Lu Tze wrote: »
    I am pretty sure that all engineering degree courses in the Universities still have a requirement of C3 minimum in honours.

    I'm thankful they have kept up his standard to be honest.

    Should be higher than a C3 IMO. Hate that for engineering once you're just somewhat competant at maths you can get in ahead of someone who is excellent by learning off history and geography. But hey, the CAO is another rant. :P


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  • #187
    Lu Tze
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,524 ✭✭✭Lu Tze


    amacachi wrote: »
    Should be higher than a C3 IMO. Hate that for engineering once you're just somewhat competant at maths you can get in ahead of someone who is excellent by learning off history and geography. But hey, the CAO is another rant. :P


    Perhaps. I have met competent engineers who came through the IT system due to not attaining the C3 in honours.

    But i suppose those guys/gals were going to make it anyway.


  • #188
    iptba
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,950 ✭✭✭iptba


    amacachi wrote: »
    Should be higher than a C3 IMO. Hate that for engineering once you're just somewhat competant at maths you can get in ahead of someone who is excellent by learning off history and geography. But hey, the CAO is another rant. :P
    I agree. There should be different weightings. And given everyone has to do maths, courses with a fairly high maths content could have a weighting bonus for maths. One of the reasons advocated by people like Christine Murphy* (ex Irish Times columnist) to get rid of bonus points for maths (which I’ve heard others also mention) was that it was “too complicated”. But the reality is (i) it wasn’t that complicated to work out bonus points (people applying for colleges are supposed to have a degree of intelligence) and (ii) you don’t really need to know anyway, you should put your choices down in terms of what you want and see whether you get in – the student isn’t the person who has to sort through the various applicants. Anyway, possibly going a bit off-topic.

    * She used to complain that Honours maths (before the points went to 100s) was too easy, looking at the percentages of As from people who did Honours maths. Everyone should have known this was a stupid thing to say as pretty much everyone thought the old syllabus and the exams they set on it was/were very long and demanding. The thing she missed was only 12-13% of the people were doing honours maths. A better statistic is the percentage of As out of the total number who do the subject.


  • #189
    CDfm
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    here you have the INTO estimating the disappearence of male primary teachers in 30 years time

    check out this link

    http://www.into.ie/ROI/Publications/GenderImbalancePrimaryTeaching.pdf

    i imagine part of the reason is that the competetive nature of the point system means that females will go for career options that facilitate child rearing or aptitude tests etc

    so maybe there is a case for minimum gender quotas to allow young men to qualify as primary teachers


  • #190
    iptba
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,950 ✭✭✭iptba


    CDfm wrote: »
    here you have the INTO estimating the disappearence of male primary teachers in 30 years time

    check out this link

    http://www.into.ie/ROI/Publications/GenderImbalancePrimaryTeaching.pdf

    i imagine part of the reason is that the competetive nature of the point system means that females will go for career options that facilitate child rearing or aptitude tests etc

    so maybe there is a case for minimum gender quotas to allow young men to qualify as primary teachers
    One initiative I saw in the UK is that they have specialist maths teachers for primary school e.g. can’t remember if they are solely responsible for classes’ maths teaching or just “add-ons”. If there were specialist jobs like this, one might have more male teachers in primary schools.


  • #191
    amacachi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,315 ✭✭✭✭amacachi


    iptba wrote: »
    * She used to complain that Honours maths (before the points went to 100s) was too easy, looking at the percentages of As from people who did Honours maths. Everyone should have known this was a stupid thing to say as pretty much everyone thought the old syllabus and the exams they set on it was/were very long and demanding. The thing she missed was only 12-13% of the people were doing honours maths. A better statistic is the percentage of As out of the total number who do the subject.

    If you want a good laugh, check out the "project maths" paper on examinations.ie. If the same number of people did higher maths I'd say over half will get As.


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  • #192
    metrovelvet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,375 ✭✭✭metrovelvet


    Zulu wrote: »
    Sorry, what?

    There are a lot of headless statues about in museums. Are you going to complain about those too?

    Are you going to complain about the homoerotic art hanging in the national gallery, objectifyng men?

    What about gay magazines?

    Where do you draw the line between being offended and censorship?


  • #193
    norrie rugger
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,656 ✭✭✭norrie rugger


    There is a bit of a difference between appreciative art and objectifying of people


  • #194
    CDfm
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    I posted this elsewhere but it would have been mpre appropriate here


    According to this report there is a huge imbalence in the numbers of men and women in teaching

    Primary 17.5% Male 82.5% Female Secondary 40% Male 60% Female

    http://economics.nuim.ie/staff/docum...ishTimes37.pdf

    No wonder you will get an imbalence of teaching on gender issues.

    So when you get a Union like the ASTI and the ICTU adopting a gender biased policy -weyhey - quel suprise thats what gets taught in schools.


    http://www.asti.ie/pay-and-condition...omestic-abuse/

    So how come members of unions aren't challenging these policies at branch and national level, or at congress level or at Equality Authority Level.

    I wonder do we have any Union Members here who would think of challenging it.

    I mean individual science teachers often let slip their atheism and challenge all kinds of education policies.

    For that matter are there any Student Union Members who would challenge similar policies at college level or Congress level

    I mean if USI can support the 16 Day Campaign by Womens Aid why cant it support Amens campaigns?


  • #195
    CDfm
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    iptba wrote: »
    One initiative I saw in the UK is that they have specialist maths teachers for primary school e.g. can’t remember if they are solely responsible for classes’ maths teaching or just “add-ons”. If there were specialist jobs like this, one might have more male teachers in primary schools.

    in the army and garda they change the fitness / height rules for female entry -what is so so different when it comes to guys having differenrt entry requirements into teaching??


  • #196
    citytillidie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,041 ✭✭✭✭citytillidie


    Here is an article with a different approach as to why fewer males apply for primary school teaching

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/3101958/Paedophile-hysteria-preventing-men-applying-to-work-in-primary-schools.html

    ******



  • #197
    iptba
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,950 ✭✭✭iptba


    CDfm wrote: »
    in the army and garda they change the fitness / height rules for female entry -what is so so different when it comes to guys having differenrt entry requirements into teaching??
    It's interesting. If one combined the two ideas, one could have this: one of the things that keeps men out of primary teaching is the requirement to have a C in Honours Irish. If one took this requirement away and let a certain number of men become primary teachers without this requirement, one could have more men. One could have specialist Irish teachers teaching the Irish.

    If the male teachers taught extra sports during this period (which I think is one of the things that may attract some men to teaching), it might even be more attractive to some men as more of their time would be teaching sports. One could still have the traditional jobs and routes. Just brain-storming.


  • #198
    Macha
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 6,391 Mod ✭✭✭✭Macha


    citytillidie wrote: »
    Here is an article with a different approach as to why fewer males apply for primary school teaching

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/3101958/Paedophile-hysteria-preventing-men-applying-to-work-in-primary-schools.html
    I would be more interested in the theory if some evidence had been given in support. It's quite possible it's a factor and it may simply be the fault of the journalist for poor reporting that no evidence was given in the article.


  • #199
    The Corinthian
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,777 ✭✭✭✭The Corinthian


    taconnol wrote: »
    I would be more interested in the theory if some evidence had been given in support. It's quite possible it's a factor and it may simply be the fault of the journalist for poor reporting that no evidence was given in the article.
    Anecdotally, I remember finding myself outside my home a few years ago chatting to the neighbours boys. Such is the hysteria on the subject nowadays that I did feel very self-concious of being seen talking to them.


  • #200
    citytillidie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,041 ✭✭✭✭citytillidie


    Here is perfect example of Male Discrimination in Irish law.

    A couple in Donegal both under age were caught having sex but its only the boy who has been charged.

    http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0326/court.html

    ******



  • #201
    dr.bollocko
    Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 35,948 Mod ✭✭✭✭dr.bollocko


    citytillidie wrote: »
    Here is perfect example of Male Discrimination in Irish law.

    A couple in Donegal both under age were caught having sex but its only the boy who has been charged.

    http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0326/court.html

    This one is almost deserving of its own thread. The judge indicated that the potential results of underage sex, ie a baby is more likely to be a problem for the girl. Problems of underage pregnancy, poor education as a result of it etc. more likely to be a problem for the girl so the state has a right to prosecute in cases like this.
    Bloody ridiculous if you ask me.


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  • #202
    Herbal Deity
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,397 ✭✭✭Herbal Deity


    Wtf?

    I'm reading that article over and over again, and I can't even begin to point out what I think is wrong with it, because it makes so little sense.


  • #203
    The Corinthian
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,777 ✭✭✭✭The Corinthian


    Herbal Deity wrote: »
    I'm reading that article over and over again, and I can't even begin to point out what I think is wrong with it, because it makes so little sense.
    The judge was brought a stand-in from 1894. She correctly pointed out that in back then sexual intercourse was "the one area of sexual activity that can result in pregnancy. It is the one consequence of sexual activity that carries no risk for boys or men."

    And if she did become pregnant, it is well known that under-age girls cannot have an abortion or would not be allowed to travel anywhere where they could. And of course the boy could walk away scot free and not be obliged to pay maintenance from the moment he hits 18. If she gets pregnant.


  • #204
    Herbal Deity
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,397 ✭✭✭Herbal Deity


    It's occurred to me that a 16 year old girl could rape a 12 year old boy, and not only would she get away scot free, but the boy could risk prosecution.

    Ridiculous.


  • #205
    PopUp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 236 ✭✭PopUp


    Between this and the blasphemy law you have to wonder what century lawmakers are living in.

    I may be reading the article wrong but we also seem to be using a different definition of 'Romeo and Juliet law' to the rest of the world. Whenever I've heard that term used, it's to describe laws which exempt young people from being prosecuted for statutory rape, ie, it may be illegal to have sex with a 13 year old, but you can't be prosecuted if you are less then 4 years older than them.

    But in Ireland 'Romeo and Juliet' apparently means Romeo can go to prison but Juliet can't.


  • #206
    CDfm
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    Herbal Deity wrote: »
    It's occurred to me that a 16 year old girl could rape a 12 year old boy, and not only would she get away scot free, but the boy could risk prosecution.

    Herb -i think you should write a letter to the times ;)


  • #207
    iptba
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,950 ✭✭✭iptba


    citytillidie wrote: »
    Here is perfect example of Male Discrimination in Irish law.

    A couple in Donegal both under age were caught having sex but its only the boy who has been charged.

    http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0326/court.html
    I set up a thread on this: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055866339


  • #208
    miec
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 856 ✭✭✭miec


    Dr Byron said boys - many of whom struggle to sit still at a young age - worked better with men. They also needed more exposure to males in school to show that learning was not a feminine virtue, she said.
    She added that positive male role models were particularly important for boys from single-parent households.


    I copied this bit from the Telegraph article because I felt there was some truth in the above statement, albeit it comes from personal experience. Until my son went into 5th class he had never been taught by a male teacher and he was extremely nervous but it was a very positive experience for him, he did work better and up until then he had been raised in a single parent household so this was his first decent male role model and it helped him adjust to having a step dad in his life, so I think more male teachers in primary schools would be a good thing. We need a serious gender balance in this area as it is heavily weighted towards female teachers at the moment.


  • #209
    Pygmalion
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,082 ✭✭✭Pygmalion


    Just thought that this could help explain why girls may be performing better?

    It's basically an idea (supported by studies) that those who are expected to do well generally do, perhaps due to pressure they feel placed on them, teachers willing to spend extra time with them to a greater extent than with other students and/or the boost to self-esteem motivating them more.

    Whether or not it applies here is debatable, but it's hard to say that girls aren't expected to do better in general.
    Problem is that I can't see how this expectation would have come about if not for the girls performing better BEFORE they were expected to, if that makes sense (I'm too young to know that kind of stuff :P).
    Also as for whether or not this effect can be proven, I won't claim that it can, but there have been a lot of fairly decent studies done on it, many of which are mentioned there, so if it sounds like crap to you feel free to go and check those out before making up your mind :P.

    Of course there's always the possibility that girls really do have greater memories, I spent about 5 minutes trying to remember the name of that wiki article, despite it being my own boards username, make of that what you will.


  • #210
    citytillidie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,041 ✭✭✭✭citytillidie


    I am thinking of complaining about the Alpen advert where the narrator says watching 5 women working out is sexist and the ad cuts to 5 men and she says thats better. Stating that its not sexist to watch men work out.

    ******



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  • #211
    CDfm
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    iptba wrote: »
    It's interesting. If one combined the two ideas, one could have this: one of the things that keeps men out of primary teaching is the requirement to have a C in Honours Irish.

    it should be equally simple to change the rules to allow male teachers as it was to change the rules on qualification of female garda and soldiers

    after all they have an extra 3 to 4 years of teacher training to bone up on an teanga before theyhave to teach it to daltai

    it is very very easy to take such an inintiative like that


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