how do idle civil servants pass the time?

MementoMori · 19-03-2010 08:16PM

Was talking to someone recently and mentioned the civil service go-slow and their response was "Go Slow?? How can anyone tell the difference?" :P

A big problem with the perception of the public service is that you have people like nurses lumped in with hospital porters, teachers lumped in with the people in the passport, the people who are in the front-line staff lumped in with the office workers.

A large part of this is because it suits the trade unions political purporse to have the largest numbers possible when it comes to threatening strikes.

Some of the groups in the public service should realise that one of their biggest problems in terms of perception is the other groups in the public service that they are being lumped in with.

For Forks Sake · 19-03-2010 09:22PM

Better call this man, he's sort them idle civil servant types right out

Tail Wagger · 19-03-2010 09:49PM

kpbdublin wrote: »

Now that they are on go-slows and work-to-rules how are our public servants passing the time. Can they go on the internet, do they play cards, or gaze out the window? Do they bring along a good book?
What would happen if a supervisor got it into his or her head to discipline them for not doing the work they are paid to do?

They invent silly little threads like this one!

sparkydee · 19-03-2010 11:22PM

I'm so sick of this. I work hard, i'm not paid that great but am happy to have a job. But of course generalisation is the order of the day here. Clearly none of us work or do anything at all. Hello what planet do some of ye live on? I worked in the private sector until 3 years ago and i'm as busy now as I was then. The lower paid civil servants are getting the worst hit. There should be reform bigtime but more paycuts for the lower paid is unfair.

changes · 19-03-2010 11:31PM

There is nothing slow about the current industrial action.

What do they do to pass the day you ask? They do their job.

Work to rule mean do your job as in your job description. Our office has had 2 half days where industrial action was upped to include not answering phones. About 5% of my job is answering phones so them days i did the rest of my work.

Nobody is sitting playing cards.... unless you think the entire public service does nothing other than answer phones all day.... so that if they strike they have nothing to do :rolleyes:

Tail Wagger · 20-03-2010 12:08AM

sparkydee wrote: »

I'm so sick of this. I work hard, i'm not paid that great but am happy to have a job. But of course generalisation is the order of the day here. Clearly none of us work or do anything at all. Hello what planet do some of ye live on? I worked in the private sector until 3 years ago and i'm as busy now as I was then. The lower paid civil servants are getting the worst hit. There should be reform bigtime but more paycuts for the lower paid is unfair.

Temper! Temper.!...take it easy.. or I'll apply for your job....only joking about applying for your job!

Min · 20-03-2010 12:27AM

Ring Joe Duffy to complain???

Herb Powell · 20-03-2010 12:43AM

I've never understood the animosity.

billybigunz · 20-03-2010 12:45AM

I spend about 30% of my time emailing in abuse to Ray Darcy and Ray Foley.

dubtom · 20-03-2010 02:56AM

This morning on kenny a few people were interviewed while waiting in the passport office,they insisted they were not moving until they got their passports. They had got the sorry come back monday speech after being told their passports would be ready today. That was about 11am.

I'm driving up Kildare st at about 3pm and a guy crosses me at the lights rummage in an envelope and takes out two shiney new passports, a big smile on his face.
Now I'm making huge assumptions here,but I understood that the PP office closes at 1 during their go slow and doesn't reopen until Monday, so my assumption is that this guy stood fast and the passport workers caved in. If so,is this a turning point,have they lost their momentum,Joe public is taking back the power and showing the civil servants who's boss.
Or am I over assuming.

Dudess · 20-03-2010 03:01AM

mickdw wrote: »

They do about 20 mins work in a full working day. This is from a worker in revenue. They dont bother answering phones at all. I would add though that public workers such as nurses work hard.

I think my father who worked as a council engineer, building roads and such, would disagree with you.

That said, some offices - particularly in Health it seems - appear to be top-heavy with administrators.

phantom_lord · 20-03-2010 03:43AM

dubtom wrote: »

This morning on kenny a few people were interviewed while waiting in the passport office,they insisted they were not moving until they got their passports. They had got the sorry come back monday speech after being told their passports would be ready today. That was about 11am.

I'm driving up Kildare st at about 3pm and a guy crosses me at the lights rummage in an envelope and takes out two shiney new passports, a big smile on his face.
Now I'm making huge assumptions here,but I understood that the PP office closes at 1 during their go slow and doesn't reopen until Monday, so my assumption is that this guy stood fast and the passport workers caved in. If so,is this a turning point,have they lost their momentum,Joe public is taking back the power and showing the civil servants who's boss.
Or am I over assuming.

this article says 10

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0320/1224266709582.html

Seloth · 20-03-2010 04:11AM

Ya I did work experiance in a public sector off ice whenI was 16 and they seemed to be kept fairly busy.

But yeah it would cost the country more if they left people go.If there were laods of people fired from the civil service then they'd be put on dole which would then not take in any tax.

Dj Stiggie · 20-03-2010 04:41AM

mickdw wrote: »

They do about 20 mins work in a full working day. This is from a worker in revenue. They dont bother answering phones at all. I would add though that public workers such as nurses work hard.

clarewoman wrote: »

as a revenue worker, we are never idle- if not answer phone dealing with correspondence or sending out demands

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight

I wonder which one's in management?

tallaght01 · 20-03-2010 04:57AM

I used to work in the motor tax office, and I was busier in there than I've ever been in any of the private sector jobs I've done.

The people working in there used to work their nuts off. But that doesn't suit those hellbent on righteous indignation.

Like it or not, the only people in the country taking pay cuts for the sake of the country ( as opposed to taking pay cuts so their own business stays afloat) are the public sector.

Hank_Jones · 20-03-2010 05:35AM

Give me a break, a large number of people within the public service are overpaid anyway.
Obviously there are going to be people who don't deserve to have their pay cut as they are earning so little.
The fact is that people are losing their jobs, not taking pay cuts.

I lost 2 jobs within the space of a year due to there being no work.
I'm in college now and trying to pay my way through it is a fcuking nightmare.
So I took a 100% pay cut as opposed to a 5% one....

There are a large number of people on the dole, which certainly is much worse than having to take a slight pay cut in your government job,
which most likely give you fairly good allowances regarding expenses, petrol, healthcare etc.
I would think that trying to feed/clothe/house a family on a couple hundred euro is not a nice experience.

shuvly · 20-03-2010 05:47AM

Ah, the old public versus private arg, here we go again, am in the public..a nurse...and am happy most days to be one. But our organisation, which looks after profoundly disabled kids, has been hit with a loss of a quarter of a million euros, so we are fecked..

phantom_lord · 20-03-2010 06:00AM

ah everyone has to stop taking this so personally, there's no doubt as a whole the public service is inefficient, bloated, and too expensive, but that shouldn't be taken as a criticism of every individual worker.

tallaght01 · 20-03-2010 06:08AM

Hank_Jones wrote: »

Give me a break, a large number of people within the public service are overpaid anyway.
Obviously there are going to be people who don't deserve to have their pay cut as they are earning so little.
The fact is that people are losing their jobs, not taking pay cuts.

I.

I think the point is that people are losing their jobs to keep their bosses' businesses afloat, whereas the public sector are the only ones taking pay cuts to benefit the economy.

The public were mad to crucify a group, as long as it wasn't them, so they would have a scapegoat. But I know a lot of private sector workers who haven't taken a pay cut, or have taken 5% or something. whereas all the manual labourers my dad works with have taken really big cuts, from being badly paid in the first place.

So, I don't blame them for not doing extra work. Why show goodwill to a public who have been villifying them since the start of the crisis.

Lots of private sector workers have lost their job. But it's not been some kind of selfless act. The really bizarre thing when I was back i Ireland a while back was how people were actively wanting public sector people to get sacked. They were some pretty sad conversations to listen to.

I don't know if people who were sacked by their bosses would feel better seeing public sector workers getting sacked. Pretty sad if that's the case.

Hank_Jones · 20-03-2010 06:53AM

Personally I don't want anyone to lose their job, myself included.

I would like people to have a little perspective though.
Having to take a 5% pay put from a 50k a year job isn't exactly a completely major thing, regardless of what others might say.
To be honest if you can't survive on 47k a year then you haven't got much common sense anyway and are probably throwing yor money away.

People are villifying them because they have the steady jobs that they aren't likely to lose.
Jobs with health insurance etc.
It's nothing more than jealousy really.

If you're standing in a dole queue and you look in and see the little amount of people working within those offices,
it doesn't actually make you feel that public servants are deserving of much, even if they are run off their feet.
Most people in most jobs are run off their feet in their job, I certainly know that I was (generally 6 days a week).
It's just hard to sympathise with someone within the pubic sector, when we see stuff in the papers about how much the fat cats are being paid and how much public money is being wasted.

tallaght01 · 20-03-2010 07:10AM

Hank_Jones wrote: »

Personally I don't want anyone to lose their job, myself included.

I would like people to have a little perspective though.
Having to take a 5% pay put from a 50k a year job isn't exactly a completely major thing, regardless of what others might say.
To be honest if you can't survive on 47k a year then you haven't got much common sense anyway and are probably throwing yor money away.

People are villifying them because they have the steady jobs that they aren't likely to lose.
Jobs with health insurance etc.
It's nothing more than jealousy really.

If you're standing in a dole queue and you look in and see the little amount of people working within those offices,
it doesn't actually make you feel that public servants are deserving of much, even if they are run off their feet.
Most people in most jobs are run off their feet in their job, I certainly know that I was (generally 6 days a week).
It's just hard to sympathise with someone within the pubic sector, when we see stuff in the papers about how much the fat cats are being paid and how much public money is being wasted.

I think that's fair enough. And I have no objection to the better paid members of society (both public and private) taking a pay cut (or rather and increase i tax). If I was still in Ireland, I'd be in the public sector, and would have expected a pay cut.

Now, I don't know a huge amount about the details. But my dad is a public sector worker. He's a foreman now, and he's raised his kids. He has enough money, and has't grumbled about it. But he said that the very low paid manual labourers he supervisors have all taken about a 10-15% cut in real terms. This is money taken specifically from the public sector.

This was in response to public pressure, when everyone should have had an increase in tax, with the richer paying a higher proportion, rather than taking 3 or 4 grand or whatever off someone on 25k per year.

Public sectors have been specifically been targetted. But it's pretty criminal that these guys are paying for the cockups of people in power, whereas there are a lot of rich people who are't taking hits.

So, I just don't see why these people WOULD do work they're not being paid for. Though the labourers in my dad's place still go the extra mile, to their eternal credit.

Odysseus · 20-03-2010 09:52AM

Hank_Jones wrote: »

Personally I don't want anyone to lose their job, myself included.

I would like people to have a little perspective though.
Having to take a 5% pay put from a 50k a year job isn't exactly a completely major thing, regardless of what others might say.
To be honest if you can't survive on 47k a year then you haven't got much common sense anyway and are probably throwing yor money away.

People are villifying them because they have the steady jobs that they aren't likely to lose.
Jobs with health insurance etc.
It's nothing more than jealousy really.

If you're standing in a dole queue and you look in and see the little amount of people working within those offices,
it doesn't actually make you feel that public servants are deserving of much, even if they are run off their feet.
Most people in most jobs are run off their feet in their job, I certainly know that I was (generally 6 days a week).
It's just hard to sympathise with someone within the pubic sector, when we see stuff in the papers about how much the fat cats are being paid and how much public money is being wasted.

It's a major enough thing, I earn 50K+. I'm down about 300 a month. Yes your right I'm not going to starve and I'm luckly enough that I just started to do work in the evening for the private sector, which is still paid much better in my line of work. I now make that lost 300 in nearly one eveing in the private sector.

I have always tried not to work privately in the evening as I listen to traumatic material during the day, so I like to unwind after work. However, with the last round of pay cuts I was left with no choice.

I don't know how old you are or why you earn, but for my qualifications and experience in my role I can tell you 50k is not a massive amount. Fair enough, I grew up in the 80s having to leave to get work, so I know what's what its like to not have work and to do poorly paid work. However, when you have put seven years of training in to work in an area, and worked in it for over twelve it is an acceptable wage.

John_Cultane · 20-03-2010 10:29AM

Unless you have worked in the public AND private sector you really don't know mush about the subject. The belief private sector works really efficiently and the public sector are lazy and inefficient is really a hard concept to prove. The main reason being it isn't true. The public sector is so vast and varied there really is no way to say that all sections are the same.

I have worked both and I am actually amazed how the some private companies mange to function and make a profit. At the moment the place I am in is a private company and it is full of incompetence. I am really shocked by some of the people's lack of knowledge and plain stupidity.

While in the public sector I saw similar people but none in positions of control. There are some problems that are just to do with the scale of an organisation. The age of an organisation has a lot to do with it as well. Older organisation generally have the most problems. As a person coming in to change processes the people most likely to be an issue are ill informed and close minded management. Strangely younger people don't like retraining after learning the process recently while older users often are delighted at the change and easier use.

ejmaztec · 20-03-2010 11:25AM

kpbdublin wrote: »

Now that they are on go-slows and work-to-rules how are our public servants passing the time. Can they go on the internet, do they play cards, or gaze out the window? Do they bring along a good book?
What would happen if a supervisor got it into his or her head to discipline them for not doing the work they are paid to do?

ejmaztec wrote: »

They're probably using that time to track whingers down in the internet, so's they can send out €50,000 tax demands, or hit squads, or both.

clarewoman wrote: »

as a revenue worker, we are never idle- if not answer phone dealing with correspondence or sending out demands

I hate to say "I told you so", Kpbdublin, but you're well and truly screwed now.

changes · 20-03-2010 04:31PM

The public service are basically doing the same work for similar pay as they were doing 3 yrs, 5 yrs, 10 years ago. They weren't getting grief back then.

Q. So what is the reason for the vilification now?

A. Jealousy and begrudgery!!

twinytwo · 20-03-2010 04:38PM

changes wrote: »

The public service are basically doing the same work for similar pay as they were doing 3 yrs, 5 yrs, 10 years ago. They weren't getting grief back then.

Q. So what is the reason for the vilification now?

A. Jealousy and begrudgery!!

your having a laugh

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/euro250m-pay-bonanza-for-340000-in-civil-service-1735768.html

http://www.ronanlyons.com/2009/02/04/public-sector-pay-in-ireland-the-e50000-question-its-not-that-difficult/

dresden8 · 20-03-2010 05:03PM

twinytwo wrote: »

your having a laugh

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/euro250m-pay-bonanza-for-340000-in-civil-service-1735768.html

http://www.ronanlyons.com/2009/02/04/public-sector-pay-in-ireland-the-e50000-question-its-not-that-difficult/

How much do private sector Gardai or private sector soldiers earn in comparison to their public sector equivalents?

ronanlyons · 20-03-2010 05:03PM

changes wrote: »

The public service are basically doing the same work for similar pay as they were doing 3 yrs, 5 yrs, 10 years ago. They weren't getting grief back then.

Q. So what is the reason for the vilification now?

A. Jealousy and begrudgery!!

Similar pay as 10 years ago? Their pay increased by 75% between 1996 and 2006, while private sector wages increased by only 65%. And public sector workers started out better-paid to begin with! And that's not taking account of pensions.

changes · 20-03-2010 06:04PM

ronanlyons wrote: »

Similar pay as 10 years ago? Their pay increased by 75% between 1996 and 2006, while private sector wages increased by only 65%. And public sector workers started out better-paid to begin with! And that's not taking account of pensions.

Spending power would have been largely the same for a public servant working in 2000 as it is in 2010 when all is said and done.

changes · 20-03-2010 06:15PM

twinytwo wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/euro250m-pay-bonanza-for-340000-in-civil-service-1735768.html

Thats just tatty, lazy journalism.... no more than i would expect from that rag.

Increments are part of the pay structure for public servants. Only about 25% of the ps staff will be eligible for increments on any given year. They are paid to the newer staff, if you've been in the job more than 10 years or so you won't be getting increments anyway (not everyone gets both long service increments either). So stopping them leaves the younger, lower paid staff at a disadvantage compared to the longer term staff.

Most people will work the last 25 years on the same money if they don't get promoted.

how do idle civil servants pass the time?

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