Plotting and intrigue by Noel Dempsey

murphaph · 01-03-2010 09:50PM

Irlandese wrote: »

Civil servants are tied by tough confidentiality rules, so even if retired, I can give no specifics. Believe me if you like, but personal ethics push me to set the record straight, when it concerns on of the very few straight, clean and intelligent ministers we ever had. No, not a fan club member and not his personal acquaintance, but a fan nevertheless because a life spent serving the self-serving unscrupulous chancers that make up most of our politicians was very rarely made more bearable by having a decent, straight up guy come in once in a while and do it as it should be done.
The issues that impressed me and my colleagues also included taking difficult, honourable but personally politically risky stands, including against the big one, the church. Other politicians would ahve roilled over, as so many did before and after, but he didn't.
If he had been taoiseach for the past five years we would not be in the mess we are in now and a lot of dirty deals would never have happened.
There, thats all I can say. Put it in your pipe and smoke it if you like, but that rare breed, the good politician, deserves an honest press, not glib jibes.

How closely did you work with Dempsey? For how many years? I find it hard to believe you could have worked with him for more than a couple of years as he was moved about (as all ministers are with reshuffles). You couldn't have known him from his council days I presume, yet your posts suggest that you have known him for years in a civil service capacity. Quite frankly, it doesn't stack up and you likely (unless you were secretary general of a department he ran) wouldn't have been privy to many of the matters he would hav had the final say on.

My comments weren't glib. This was all well publicised in the press and (in particular) on the radio. Go over to the Infrastructure M9 thread to see what Dempsey got up to just before xmas, ie, just a few weeks ago. He was willing to potentially sacrifice someone's life on one of Ireland's most dangerous roads, to keep a few publicans (FF members maybe??) in Castledermot happy, whilst keeping a multi million Euro piece of national infrastructure needlessly closed (and thus costing the wider economy an unknown sum per day in the process). Honest my @rse.

Irlandese · 01-03-2010 10:22PM

murphaph wrote: »

How closely did you work with Dempsey? For how many years? I find it hard to believe you could have worked with him for more than a couple of years as he was moved about (as all ministers are with reshuffles). You couldn't have known him from his council days I presume, yet your posts suggest that you have known him for years in a civil service capacity. Quite frankly, it doesn't stack up and you likely (unless you were secretary general of a department he ran) wouldn't have been privy to many of the matters he would hav had the final say on.

My comments weren't glib. This was all well publicised in the press and (in particular) on the radio. Go over to the Infrastructure M9 thread to see what Dempsey got up to just before xmas, ie, just a few weeks ago. He was willing to potentially sacrifice someone's life on one of Ireland's most dangerous roads, to keep a few publicans (FF members maybe??) in Castledermot happy, whilst keeping a multi million Euro piece of national infrastructure needlessly closed (and thus costing the wider economy an unknown sum per day in the process). Honest my @rse.

Cannot say really, without breaking the rules or revealing my own identity, which I will not for other good reasons. I can say you are on the right track, I didn't work directly to him and certainly didn't follow him across departments, but did have occasion to make representations, including to him directly, on one memorable issue, where he did the right things as described earlier. The other evidence was anecdotal. We were and are a gossiping cabal at the best of times.
Maybe you are right re the road stuff, but I would wonder who had the final say in the end if it really was as you describe, which might sound to some as conspiracy theory stuff? Ministers are not always the last arbiters even in their own ministry. Country politics are what they are.

paddyland · 01-03-2010 10:39PM

I beg to ask you again, what has Noel Dempsey done constructively throughout his tenure in the Department of Transport?

The taxis are a shambles. The buses are a shambles. The trains are a shambles. The airports are a shambles. He has done absolutely NOTHING constructive to deal with any of these fundamental issues. Any input he had, in particular with the taxis, was to make affairs ten times worse.

He has looked after one thing well, and that is the affairs of the toll companies, making sure they are covered from every angle no matter what direction the economy takes.

Minister for transport my ass. The man is a charlatan.

AlekSmart · 01-03-2010 11:08PM

By far and away the greatest of Mr Dempsey`s good works will turn out to be his affinity for the PPP,and most of all,the Toll Collection franchises,a process in which he has taken a keen interest.

I would be certainly happier if this outstanding and courageous Politician would simply make public the terms of the Toll Collection contract now in place for the M3 Motorway and those other PPP`s as yet to be implemented.

The construction of "Toll Booths" on this Motorway when the M50 has shown the absolute virtue of electronic collection remains another unanswered question...why ?....who does it benefit ?

Mr Dempsey`s major virtue,and one which rates VERY highly within the established Civil Service,is his appreciation of "discretion",or secrecy as the rest of the world calls it.

paddyland · 01-03-2010 11:31PM

AlekSmart wrote: »

The construction of "Toll Booths" on this Motorway when the M50 has shown the absolute virtue of electronic collection remains another unanswered question...why ?....who does it benefit ?

While in real revenue terms, it might make absolutely no difference, there is always something satisfying about the sound of hard, greasy cash clinking into the till, hard cash that you can pick up and look at and crinkle and feel.

Bertie understood that.

donkey balls · 02-03-2010 12:23AM

i work in the transport industry and last year the gardai,rsa and english authority vosa issued over 8000 fines to the haulage industry.
in any other country the operator would lose there licence and the company closed down, dempsey replied by saying to close a company down would breached their eu rights to earn a living so if i get into my car and drink drive and lose my licence could i get my licence back as it affects me in earning a living:rolleyes:i dont think so.
also we got eu money to build our road network yet every major road has a toll on it if you were to travel from cork to belfast you would have to go through four tolls and three from galway to dublin.then again dempsey uses the aircorp AW139 to get around so it doesent bother him.

wingsof daun · 02-03-2010 12:23AM

paddyland wrote: »

The taxi industry - a spectacular mess. Industry thrown open to new applicants, that's great, but as soon as dedicated new taxi drivers invest heavily in new cars, plates, licences, and sit psv tests, they then find themselves scuttled as a new breed of bargain basement taxi driver is admitted, who seem to pass no test of any description, have no idea where they are going, drive disgraceful cars, aim to no standards whatsoever, and quickly turn the already congested city streets into a teeming mass of yellow taxi lights. Genuine taxi drivers plead desperation to Dempsey, who routinely ignores them. Listening to their case would be an admission of failure, and FF don't admit mistakes. Ever.

Bus licensing - another fine mess. A litany of court cases, as every private operator in the country takes action one after another against each other and the state operators, and badly needed bus routes go to the wall. Nothing done under Dempsey's entire tenure, and Cullen's before him. Issue completely ignored. People travelling on buses are people not driving and paying tolls.

Irish Rail - underfunded, in favour of more toll roads instead. And who has Dempsey packed onto the boards of the toll road companies? People travelling on trains are people not driving and paying tolls.

Dublin Airport Authority - what is going on out in Dublin Airport? The place has been a building site for years now, with terminals being built at enormous cost, before being knocked down and replaced by more, at even more scandalous cost. Love or loathe Michael O'Leary, he raises some very pertinent issues. Dempsey ignores same issues.

For a minister for transport, Noel Dempsey seems to have spectacularly failed to deliver one positive initiative, other than a mealy mouthed press release last year that everyone should 'get on their bikes' more - Way to go Dempsey, positive PR spin, looks good, and costs FF nothing. Perhaps we can reclassify Dempsey as the minister for cheap, pointless, empty press releases. He seems good at that.

Can you please list for me, in order, all of the achievements of this 'damned fine politician and human being,' because I can find damned all, other than a trail of PR disasters, foot in mouth disease, and incompetence on a grand scale.

Excellent post here. Public services are a shambles. They want everybody paying at toll roads - it's a scam. It doesn't matter to them that it's unsustainable, that oil won't last and the pollution. The money is all that matters. Short term bull. Who will be travelling on those big roads in 50 years time?

AlekSmart · 02-03-2010 01:12AM

They want everybody paying at toll roads - it's a scam.

Well since Mr Dempsey is such a reputedly straight-up kinda guy,i`m sure he would not even think of reducing the amount and quality of PUBLIC Road Transport options merely to ensure the Toll Franchisee`s turned a buck ?

Poor or non existent Public Bus services along the Toll corridors ensures that those disaffected passengers WILL seek out the Bill; Cullens of the world and tool themselves up with a "Wee Car"...hey VAT,VRT Tolls,etc etc.....Whereas with a Taxsaver Ticket all the Bus user represents is a net Loss to Noel and his chums .... :rolleyes:

Perish the thought !

murphaph · 02-03-2010 08:38AM

wingsof daun wrote: »

Who will be travelling on those big roads in 50 years time?

Motorways won't be obsolete with the running out of oil

Cars will (have no fear, the technology largely exists already, much of it held by "big oil") run on alternative sources of fuel int the future, but they WILL run, and in greater and greater numbers.

Irlandese · 02-03-2010 11:23AM

wingsof daun wrote: »

Excellent post here. Public services are a shambles. They want everybody paying at toll roads - it's a scam. It doesn't matter to them that it's unsustainable, that oil won't last and the pollution. The money is all that matters. Short term bull. Who will be travelling on those big roads in 50 years time?

Look, I said my bit and stand over every post. I am sure it is good fun to gripe and I do it myself, but, as I said, I feel I owe it to the one honest politico I knew in my time to set the record straight.

Laminations · 03-03-2010 04:08PM

Irlandese wrote: »

Look, I said my bit and stand over every post. I am sure it is good fun to gripe and I do it myself, but, as I said, I feel I owe it to the one honest politico I knew in my time to set the record straight.

So go ahead, set the record straight.

paddyland wrote: »

Can you please list for me, in order, all of the achievements of this 'damned fine politician and human being,' because I can find damned all, other than a trail of PR disasters, foot in mouth disease, and incompetence on a grand scale.

Get listing.

sceptre · 04-03-2010 05:15PM

OK, folks, I've just dumped eleven off-topic posts and edited a further two half on and half off-topic posts that for some reason decided to talk about Ryanair's handling of its passengers. And a chunk of one post that went on about taxi drivers, also for no apparent reason.

In case some of you chaps haven't noticed, this thread is about the call for Noel Dempsey (as mentioned in the thread title) and other cabinet ministers to resign or be sacked, made by FF National Executive member Jerry Beades.

Go talk about Ryanair and other off topic things elsewhere please:)

Complaints re the above to me by PM.

/mod

Plotting and intrigue by Noel Dempsey

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