Headshops; Should they be allowed?

Shulgin · 04-02-2010 04:01PM

AKA pat sheen wrote: »

Jim McDaid was clear, and said it repeatedly, he was against headshops and wanted them closed.

BUT, he said if you close them down that the dealers will take over.
A bit of a mixed message don`t you think?

reprazant · 04-02-2010 04:02PM

AKA pat sheen wrote: »

Jim McDaid was clear, and said it repeatedly, he was against headshops and wanted them closed.

McDaid: Banning headshops 'a huge mistake'

A Fianna Fail TD has said the banning of headshops "is not the way forward".

Deputy Jim McDaid said he believes that the country is "on the verge of making a huge mistake" if such shops are banned.

Mr McDaid, who is also a GP, said: "It isn't the way to tackle drug problems and doing so won't solve anything."

Read more: http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/mcdaid-banning-headshops-a-huge-mistake-444849.html#ixzz0ea05lxQU

AKA pat sheen · 04-02-2010 04:05PM

Dempsey wrote: »

Yes, headshops should be allowed for reasons explained already in this thread.

Like with cigarettes & alcohol, people should have a choice.

Unregulated and outside any normal legal framework by design of the headshop owners?

TPD · 04-02-2010 04:05PM

PauloMN wrote: »

No thanks.

Glorified drug dealers and scum of the earth. Greedy bastards preying on the weak. I'd be quite happy for the owners of such shops to be shot.

A headshop owner in Derry was shot recently. Lower torso and legs I think, for running a legal business that some people didn't like.

Real drug dealers are not so easy a target for the vigilante types, and they would fight back. IMO the people doing/advocating the shooting of legal business owners because they disagree with them, are the scum of the earth. Cowards who can't or won't fight their battles using logic, against their real enemies.

Linky - http://www.derryjournal.com/politics/Politicians-condemn-Derry-shooting.6024952.jp

strawberryb0y · 04-02-2010 04:08PM

Well Joe, I have a young son who buys 'drugs' out of these headshops. Now i dont want him buying the drugs, but i couldn't be bothered with the hassle of being a parent so I'd like the government to make it illegal for everyone instead.

AKA pat sheen · 04-02-2010 04:10PM

Shulgin wrote: »

BUT, he said if you close them down that the dealers will take over.
A bit of a mixed message don`t you think?

Actually to be more accurate he said banning the substances would allow the dealers to take over. The implication was that he favoured educating the customers..so they will think twice about using their products.

Morlar · 04-02-2010 04:11PM

I voted they should not be alllowed / they should be banned. Far as I am concerned they are preying on the young and weak, they are legitimising recreational drug abuse, they are not capable of regulating themself so shut them down. I don't agree with the headshops point that if they close then drug dealers will take over their trade, and even if it was true just because a public health step poses challenges doesn't mean you should do nothing. I pass by one of these usually twice sometimes 4 times a day and pretty much every single time see groups of 10-15 yr olds hanging around outside.

Dempsey · 04-02-2010 04:14PM

AKA pat sheen wrote: »

Unregulated and outside any normal legal framework by design of the headshop owners?

Stop using government jargon and explain to me what you are trying to say in proper english :pac:

Are we suppose to have a recommended daily allowance on the side of a packet of mephedrone or their strength in units. They've done all that regulation crap around alcohol and it doesnt make a difference.

Judgement Day · 04-02-2010 04:15PM

strawberryb0y wrote: »

Well Joe, I have a young son who buys 'drugs' out of these headshops. Now i dont want him buying the drugs, but i couldn't be bothered with the hassle of being a parent so I'd like the government to make it illegal for everyone instead.

Are you being serious? I wonder reading through these posts how many of them are from people with young children - or perhaps they live in such a drug induced haze that they can't see the dangers for their children.

McDaid came across like an asshole - as he always does - education and avertising are the answer says the former FF minister who was done for drink driving down the wrong side of the road to Galway. Truly the lunatics have taken over the asylum!

lookinbusy · 04-02-2010 04:16PM

Yes

AKA pat sheen · 04-02-2010 04:17PM

Dempsey wrote: »

Stop using government jargon and explain to me what you are trying to say in proper english

Government jargon? wtf?

AnonoBoy · 04-02-2010 04:18PM

Judgement Day wrote: »

Are you being serious?

I think it's obvious he's not.

Shulgin wrote: »

BUT, he said if you close them down that the dealers will take over.
A bit of a mixed message don`t you think?

I think McDaid wants to educate people about the dangers, formulate legislation and then phase out the headshops so by the time street dealers are the only ones selling the products the majority of people will know of their dangers.

That's his plan anyway.

Doubt it'll work that way in practice.

strawberryb0y · 04-02-2010 04:20PM

Judgement Day wrote: »

Are you being serious? I wonder reading through these posts how many of them are from people with young children - or perhaps they live in such a drug induced haze that they can't see the dangers for their children.

McDaid came across like an asshole - as he always does - education and avertising are the answer says the former FF minister who was done for drink driving down the wrong side of the road to Galway. Truly the lunatics have taken over the asylum!

Of course I'm not being serious. Just having a go at the attitude of parents on the Joe Duffy show who think that everyone else should do thier parenting for them.

04-02-2010 04:22PM

Morlar wrote: »

I voted they should not be alllowed / they should be banned. Far as I am concerned they are preying on the young and weak, they are legitimising recreational drug abuse, they are not capable of regulating themself so shut them down. I don't agree with the headshops point that if they close then drug dealers will take over their trade, and even if it was true just because a public health step poses challenges doesn't mean you should do nothing. I pass by one of these usually twice sometimes 4 times a day and pretty much every single time see groups of 10-15 yr olds hanging around outside.

"Recreational" and "Abuse" don't go in the same sentence. Nor would there be a problem with legitamising something recreational? I think the word your looking for is "habitual" and I highly doubt there's many people ruining their lives over anything these headshops sell.

How can you not agree with the point that drug dealers will take over their trade if they're banned.. I know people taking legal stuff because it's easy. If they're ever made illegal, they'll go straight back to their dealers. Society benefits from the headshops taking the money instead of the gangs.

Have you ever taken any drugs or have any experience in anything mentioned in this thread? Or are you just putting in an uneducated opinion based on nothing but your own closed minded thoughts on something you know nothing about?

Edit: Oh yea, I'm not "young and weak".. I'm a 22 year old accountant who doesn't appreciate people like yourself trying to limit what I do in my own time and with my own money.
Why on earth should I not be able to do something because of your opinion on it?
Until even one person dies, headshops should stay open.. They're not harming anyone.

Shulgin · 04-02-2010 04:23PM

AKA pat sheen wrote: »

Actually to be more accurate he said banning the substances would allow the dealers to take over. The implication was that he favoured educating the customers..so they will think twice about using their products.

Im pretty sure he said all combinations of the above on newstalk and joe duffy. Good attempt at an alternative view but he shot himself in the foot with the BZP argument. He didn`t do his research there.

Judgement Day · 04-02-2010 04:27PM

strawberryb0y wrote: »

Of course I'm not being serious. Just having a go at the attitude of parents on the Joe Duffy show who think that everyone else should do thier parenting for them.

Fair enough but that's what our overpaid Goverment ministers are paid to do - protect the citizens of the State! Are you advocating some sort of vigilantism on the part of the public instead of ringing Joe Duffy? Incidentally, the other 'full-time' A&E doctor (from Cork) was fully in favour of banning the shops - unlike the part-time doctor, part-time alcoholic, part-time failed politican from Donegal.

Shulgin · 04-02-2010 04:29PM

Judgement Day wrote: »

Fair enough but that's what our overpaid Goverment ministers are paid to do - protect the citizens of the State!

They are also overpaid to protect our civil liberties.

Dempsey · 04-02-2010 04:30PM

Judgement Day wrote: »

Fair enough but that's what our overpaid Goverment ministers are paid to do - protect the citizens of the State! Are you advocating some sort of vigilantism on the part of the public instead of ringing Joe Duffy? Incidentally, the other 'full-time' A&E doctor (from Cork) was fully in favour of banning the shops - unlike the part-time doctor, part-time alcoholic, part-time failed politican from Donegal.

Only because he'd have to do some work :pac:

Judgement Day · 04-02-2010 04:30PM

Incidentally,I hope the 11% of posters who voted who cares feel really proud of themselves. When some drugged up yob breaks into their house some night they can remember how they voted. :mad:

Judgement Day · 04-02-2010 04:32PM

Shulgin wrote: »

They are also overpaid to protect our civil liberties.

How does letting legalised drug dealers peddle their wares to our children protect our civil liberties?

reprazant · 04-02-2010 04:32PM

Judgement Day wrote: »

Fair enough but that's what our overpaid Goverment ministers are paid to do - protect the citizens of the State! Are you advocating some sort of vigilantism on the part of the public instead of ringing Joe Duffy? Incidentally, the other 'full-time' A&E doctor (from Cork) was fully in favour of banning the shops - unlike the part-time doctor, part-time alcoholic, part-time failed politican from Donegal.

That means nothing though.

You could easily find some doctor who would be in favour of banning alcohol. My sister-in-law used to do A&E in James St and it put her off alcohol.

The head shops are obviously working in the grey area of the law, but they are being very stupid by selling to people under 18.

strawberryb0y · 04-02-2010 04:32PM

Judgement Day wrote: »

Fair enough but that's what our overpaid Goverment ministers are paid to do - protect the citizens of the State! Are you advocating some sort of vigilantism on the part of the public instead of ringing Joe Duffy? Incidentally, the other 'full-time' A&E doctor (from Cork) was fully in favour of banning the shops - unlike the part-time doctor, part-time alcoholic, part-time failed politican from Donegal.

No, I'm advocating that the parents time would be better spent educating thier children of the dangers of these drugs, forbidding them from taking them and punishing them if they do ie. parenting.

Shulgin · 04-02-2010 04:32PM

Judgement Day wrote: »

Incidentally,I hope the 11% of posters who voted who cares feel really proud of themselves. When some drugged up yob breaks into their house some night they can remember how they voted. :mad:

You really think people who buy drugs from headshops go robbing houses while high?

I would say dancing,talking sh1t,hugging, or eating the fridge clean are more likely outcomes.

AnonoBoy · 04-02-2010 04:33PM

Judgement Day wrote: »

Incidentally,I hope the 11% of posters who voted who cares feel really proud of themselves. When some drugged up yob breaks into their house some night they can remember how they voted. :mad:

Cause before any legislation is passed the government are going to come and take a look at a poll on boards.ie to help them make up their mind? :eek:

I never realised the polls in AH were so important!

Judgement Day · 04-02-2010 04:33PM

Dempsey wrote: »

Only because he'd have to do some work :pac:

Work in AE do you. Hilarious post!

reprazant · 04-02-2010 04:33PM

Judgement Day wrote: »

How does letting legalised drug dealers peddle their wares to our children protect our civil liberties?

Do you feel the same about news agents selling smokes and pubs/off-licences selling alcohol?

Or are they fine because you like a drink yourself?

AnonoBoy · 04-02-2010 04:34PM

There seems to be a notion on here and on Liveline that any 12 year old can wander into one of these shops and get served.

Not the case.

Now people may go in and buy stuff for them but then again people do that with booze and cigarettes all the time too.

So it's not quite a case of any child just deciding they want them and buying them in the same way they'd buy some sweets (which is the analogy one irate mother used on Joe Duffy today)

fcussen · 04-02-2010 04:35PM

I remember when that dead-eyed psycho raped my wife while looking for his daily spice gold fix all I could think was "why didn't I listen to the internet?"

Judgement Day · 04-02-2010 04:38PM

strawberryb0y wrote: »

No, I'm advocating that the parents time would be better spent educating thier children of the dangers of these drugs, forbidding them from taking them and punishing them if they do ie. parenting.

And that works? How long is since you were a kid? I'm fifty and I know that being forbidden to do something is just the thing to make you try something. Remember Adam & Eve? Although ancient I can well remember what I got up to at primary school - smoking everything and anything, drinking whatever could be got hold of etc.etc. but the point was there was a major scarcity of anything really dangerous to take not like today.

04-02-2010 04:39PM

Morlar wrote: »

I voted they should not be alllowed / they should be banned. Far as I am concerned they are preying on the young and weak, they are legitimising recreational drug abuse, they are not capable of regulating themself so shut them down. I don't agree with the headshops point that if they close then drug dealers will take over their trade, and even if it was true just because a public health step poses challenges doesn't mean you should do nothing. I pass by one of these usually twice sometimes 4 times a day and pretty much every single time see groups of 10-15 yr olds hanging around outside.

"preying on the young and weak," - Every one i've set foot in has 'over 18's" signs all over the place. I've witnessed people being I.D.'d and even refused before. If you were to ban everything that preys on the weak, then the list would be as long as your arm: - caffeeine, nicotine, scratch cards, the Lotto, alcohol, sugar etc.

"legitimising recreational drug abuse" - Every time someone has a pint, or a smoke they are legitimising drug use. What is so wrong about recreational drug taking?

"groups of 10-15 yr olds hanging around outside" - Ever see any of them inside? Or buying anything in there? Or off their heads outside the place? Didn't think so. So why are they hanging around? Waiting for someone to go in and buy it for them? Who's at fault then? The head shop owners, or the irresponsible adults who buy it for the kids?

Headshops; Should they be allowed?

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