All Estate Names to be in Irish

kowloon · 08-12-2009 12:22PM

It does seem a tad unfair to give extra marks to someone who is already going to get good marks in a core subject.

lallychops · 08-12-2009 12:33PM

kowloon wrote: »

It does seem a tad unfair to give extra marks to someone who is already going to get good marks in a core subject.

a tad? These extra marks that they award can mean the difference between grades, in turn this leads to the difference between the amount of points recieved which in turn leads to someone who did their exams through Irish getting the university place you wanted even if you got better grades than them ,before their 10% gets added on ..... A tad unfair??? Extremely unfair. I wouldn't mind but not every school provides this option.....

gamer · 08-12-2009 01:37PM

With emigration increasing its gonna be a long time be4 new estates are needed anyway,all over the country theres new estates half empty.Like the copying of all documents into irish which nobody reads its a complete waste of money .THIS is a free country ,if you want to go around speaking irish all day ,go ahead, most people wont understand you.I wonder will satnavs for cars ,phones be programmed for the irish language since most roads and towns have english names at the moment.

aDeener · 08-12-2009 01:51PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I think about 75% of Irish placenames are already (mis)transcribed from the original Irish, tullamore/ tullach mhor, Athlone/ áth luain are two that spring to mind.

make that something like 99%, every place name in ireland comes from the irish for that area. its a wonderfully unique thing about this country. then they had to go and name a town, adamstown ffs :rolleyes: when there was no doubt a townland in that area with a unique name. adamstown, in all fairness

aDeener · 08-12-2009 01:53PM

lallychops wrote: »

It is utter discrimination towards anyone (native to this country or otherwise) who do not attend Gaelscoils. This option to complete the Leaving Cert through Irish is not widely available to students nation wide. These extra marks allocated to students who complete their exams through irish ultimately "tip the balance" of the already competetive CAO system in favour of people who were given this option. I should know....im a Leaving Cert student.....and btw sdonn we have to go out of our way to learn the "native language " anyway as there is a standard exam for Irish as a subject....why dont we get an extra 10% for completing that exam ???

day off today, use it for study not venting on boards :pac::p

Fratton Fred · 08-12-2009 02:02PM

will they use makeyuppy Irish words like they did when they renamed all the Bus Lanes "Lana Bus"?

We could have Easta Ponta instead of East Point, Sanda y Fordi instead of Sandyford.

I think this would be a sensible use of people's time and money and would ceratainly promote the use of the Irish language amongst the Dubs who are just chomping at the bit to embrace it.

lallychops · 08-12-2009 02:13PM

aDeener wrote: »

day off today, use it for study not venting on boards :pac::p

for your information I was on a study break. Not that it's any of your business. And I wasn't ranting I was expressing my opinion about something I feel strongly about. It probably doesn't affect you anyway. So why do you care about what I write ?

monkeypants · 08-12-2009 02:32PM

Fratton Fred wrote: »

We could have Easta Ponta instead of East Point, Sanda y Fordi instead of Sandyford.

Sounds more like dodgy, made-up Italian from a Dolmio advert.

kowloon · 08-12-2009 04:26PM

monkeypants wrote: »

Sounds more like dodgy, made-up Italian from a Dolmio advert.

L'Arte Di Sacla!

08-12-2009 04:36PM

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Sanda y Fordi instead of Sandyford.
.

Is that the welsh gaelic translation?

aDeener · 08-12-2009 05:07PM

lallychops wrote: »

for your information I was on a study break. Not that it's any of your business. And I wasn't ranting I was expressing my opinion about something I feel strongly about. It probably doesn't affect you anyway. So why do you care about what I write ?

and i feel strongly about our native language, and think your ramblings are a load of poppycock from a person looking for excuses before the leaving cert has started already... its not fair, its not fair boohoo. its obviously harder to do exams through the medium of a language that is not your everyday language and thus people who choose this deserve their extra marks.

aDeener · 08-12-2009 05:10PM

Fratton Fred wrote: »

will they use makeyuppy Irish words like they did when they renamed all the Bus Lanes "Lana Bus"?

We could have Easta Ponta instead of East Point, Sanda y Fordi instead of Sandyford.

I think this would be a sensible use of people's time and money and would ceratainly promote the use of the Irish language amongst the Dubs who are just chomping at the bit to embrace it.

hmm because no other language, not even the one im using now, has makeyuppy words....:rolleyes:

that said though it is a pet hate of mine, when new words are introduced into the irish language that they simply put fadas over the english words when there is a world of old unique words and sayings to irish that could fit the bill. i would like to know who they are that decide this

Paulj · 08-12-2009 05:21PM

A much better idea would be to signpost new housing estates properly and introduce post codes but they're different issues i guess.

Its going to be a nightmare trying to dictate these new addresses over the phone to irish people and non-irish alike.

The word Bothar will become:
beta-oscar-tango-hotel-alpha-romeo

Fighting Irish · 08-12-2009 05:28PM

Baile an Locha wrote: »

And the problem is????

I think its a really good idea,

Why is it a really good idea?

It's a waste of time and effort
People bitch about gov spending money, this thing must have cost some money along the way to get up and going, it's bull**** to the highest degree

fatboypee · 08-12-2009 05:42PM

aDeener wrote: »

and i feel strongly about our native language, and think your ramblings are a load of poppycock from a person looking for excuses before the leaving cert has started already... its not fair, its not fair boohoo. its obviously harder to do exams through the medium of a language that is not your everyday language and thus people who choose this deserve their extra marks.

I'm bemused.
Regarding your point that it is harder to do exams through the medium of a language that is not your everyday language, lets look at that for a minute. Surely the motivation to do so is points driven ? In which case, forgive my cynicism, but there are really only 2 kinds of people who would avail of such a concession ? : 1) NATIVE IRISH speakers and 2)Those with with an exceptional ability in the subject. Otherwise, err, why the hell would your risk blowing your whole leaving Cert?

Therefore your point made earlier that it is not active discrimination to offer this concession is completely without foundation as, if the person undertaking the leaving certificate happens to be a non-national yet equally as bright as a person able to avail of the concession, surely the person able to avail of the concession would have an unfair and undue advantage, purely because they happen to have an inordinate ability with language, or are (and here's the real point), a NATIVE IRISH speaker ?

In Ireland, (like it or not) we live in a multi-cultural, multi-racial society. To offer concessions such as this, and then not make it available to ALL students is tantamount to discrimination and I honestly fail to see how you can argue otherwise.

As a postscript I would add that your derisive posting style is rather amusing as, if your argument had and weight, clearly you would not have to resort to such immature goading ?

FBP

lallychops · 08-12-2009 05:53PM

aDeener wrote: »

and i feel strongly about our native language, and think your ramblings are a load of poppycock from a person looking for excuses before the leaving cert has started already... its not fair, its not fair boohoo. its obviously harder to do exams through the medium of a language that is not your everyday language and thus people who choose this deserve their extra marks.

ramblings? Excuse you? How dare you say that my opinion is nothing more substantial than "ramblings" .Is the Irish language used on an every day basis outside of schools and gaeltacht areas? No it's not. Are you fluent in Irish? Do you speak it every day? Irish is the native language of this country. I never disputed that fact. Nor did I dispute the fact that doing exams through Irish is more or less difficult than doing exams through english.With regards to your comment about making excuses ? Sir you are sadly misinformed about the leaving very examination ststemnif you think that I am making excuses. I don't believe you have any right to personally attack me for expressing my opinion. Try putting yourself in my position. Failing that I suggest that you find something more worthwhile to do with your time than degrade and ridicule other peoples views.

Fighting Irish · 08-12-2009 06:08PM

fatboypee wrote: »

I'm bemused.
Regarding your point that it is harder to do exams through the medium of a language that is not your everyday language, lets look at that for a minute. Surely the motivation to do so is points driven ? In which case, forgive my cynicism, but there are really only 2 kinds of people who would avail of such a concession ? : 1) NATIVE IRISH speakers and 2)Those with with an exceptional ability in the subject. Otherwise, err, why the hell would your risk blowing your whole leaving Cert?

Therefore your point made earlier that it is not active discrimination to offer this concession is completely without foundation as, if the person undertaking the leaving certificate happens to be a non-national yet equally as bright as a person able to avail of the concession, surely the person able to avail of the concession would have an unfair and undue advantage, purely because they happen to have an inordinate ability with language, or are (and here's the real point), a NATIVE IRISH speaker ?

In Ireland, (like it or not) we live in a multi-cultural, multi-racial society. To offer concessions such as this, and then not make it available to ALL students is tantamount to discrimination and I honestly fail to see how you can argue otherwise.

As a postscript I would add that your derisive posting style is rather amusing as, if your argument had and weight, clearly you would not have to resort to such immature goading ?

FBP

I agree

Are non native people who go to school here given extra points for doing their leaving cert in english when they're native language is french, german or whatever?

Mike 1972 · 08-12-2009 06:13PM

aDeener wrote: »

and i feel strongly about our native language......its obviously harder to do exams through the medium of a language that is not your everyday language and thus people who choose this deserve their extra marks.

Its hardly your "native language" if youre not using it every day

aDeener · 08-12-2009 07:22PM

fatboypee wrote: »

I'm bemused.
Regarding your point that it is harder to do exams through the medium of a language that is not your everyday language, lets look at that for a minute. Surely the motivation to do so is points driven ? In which case, forgive my cynicism, but there are really only 2 kinds of people who would avail of such a concession ? : 1) NATIVE IRISH speakers and 2)Those with with an exceptional ability in the subject. Otherwise, err, why the hell would your risk blowing your whole leaving Cert?

Therefore your point made earlier that it is not active discrimination to offer this concession is completely without foundation as, if the person undertaking the leaving certificate happens to be a non-national yet equally as bright as a person able to avail of the concession, surely the person able to avail of the concession would have an unfair and undue advantage, purely because they happen to have an inordinate ability with language, or are (and here's the real point), a NATIVE IRISH speaker ?

In Ireland, (like it or not) we live in a multi-cultural, multi-racial society. To offer concessions such as this, and then not make it available to ALL students is tantamount to discrimination and I honestly fail to see how you can argue otherwise.

As a postscript I would add that your derisive posting style is rather amusing as, if your argument had and weight, clearly you would not have to resort to such immature goading ?

FBP

get over yourself bloody hell - tantamount to discrimination :rolleyes: heard it all now.

the leaving cert is a bloody memory test, those who work hard will get the results. if it wasnt there would be no point to repeating it.

could the non-national not have the same ability as picking up the language? i would say they are in an even better position as more than likely they can already speak 2, which in turn increses the ability to learn another.

and no i wont forgive your cynicism as there is a 3rd group, one which has a genuine interest and love for the language

aDeener · 08-12-2009 07:23PM

Mike 1972 wrote: »

Its hardly your "native language" if youre not using it every day

its the native language of ireland pedant. and i use it in some form or another everyday

aDeener · 08-12-2009 07:25PM

lallychops wrote: »

ramblings? Excuse you? How dare you say that my opinion is nothing more substantial than "ramblings" .Is the Irish language used on an every day basis outside of schools and gaeltacht areas? No it's not. Are you fluent in Irish? Do you speak it every day? Irish is the native language of this country. I never disputed that fact. Nor did I dispute the fact that doing exams through Irish is more or less difficult than doing exams through english.With regards to your comment about making excuses ? Sir you are sadly misinformed about the leaving very examination ststemnif you think that I am making excuses. I don't believe you have any right to personally attack me for expressing my opinion. Try putting yourself in my position. Failing that I suggest that you find something more worthwhile to do with your time than degrade and ridicule other peoples views.

i was in your position 2 years ago and you are getting worked up over nothing. if you do the work you wont have to worry about someone doing their leaving through irish getting a few extra marks. that is whinging of the highest degree.

i do speak irish everyday but im not fluent yet

lallychops · 08-12-2009 07:43PM

aDeener wrote: »

i was in your position 2 years ago and you are getting worked up over nothing. if you do the work you wont have to worry about someone doing their leaving through irish getting a few extra marks. that is whinging of the highest degree.

i do speak irish everyday but im not fluent yet

ok then can you please explain why extra marks aren't given for completing the standard Irish exam. Surely that would encourage people to take Irish as a subject rather than opt for an exemption ? If you think that these marks should be awarded then why isn't this option widely available? And I have researched and it isn't well advertised at all.

LionelNashe · 08-12-2009 07:45PM

I couldn't face reading the whole 20 pages of posts, so apologies if this point has been made already.

I don't like laws and rules that aren't necessary.

e.g. Those signs on public greens that say "No ballgames etc. By Order". By order of who?

or signs on railings that say "Bicycles will be removed". Why? Railings are perfect for chaining bicycles. Its like they were designed for it.

And now councils restricting the names that can be applied to housing developments. Its unnecessary. The downsides are minor but the benefits are doubtful. I wonder what the council vote was, and how many councillors voted for it out of political cowardice. They should have more important things to discuss.

aDeener · 08-12-2009 07:47PM

lallychops wrote: »

ok then can you please explain why extra marks aren't given for completing the standard Irish exam. Surely that would encourage people to take Irish as a subject rather than opt for an exemption ? If you think that these marks should be awarded then why isn't this option widely available? And I have researched and it isn't well advertised at all.

because that is just one exam, the extra marks are for doing it in all exams, is it that hard to see?

err it is widely available, anyone can elect to sit their exams through irish. everyone in our school knew about it. i can hardly comment for other schools and how they are ran

Rebelheart · 08-12-2009 07:53PM

kpbdublin wrote: »

This is blinkered and narrow-minded. In the past roads were named after naval battles, generals, kings, queens, astronauts, war of independence terrorists, and ultra catholic lunatics. Why should it only be open to gaelgoir zealots now?

Ah, I see Robin Bury and the "Reform Movement" nutjobs have made an appearance on Boards.ie. Or is it Niall Ginty of the Conor Cruise O Brien Society?

You couldn't invent these guys.

lallychops · 08-12-2009 07:53PM

aDeener wrote: »

because that is just one exam, the extra marks are for doing it in all exams, is it that hard to see?

err it is widely available, anyone can elect to sit their exams through irish. everyone in our school knew about it. i can hardly comment for other schools and how they are ran

it's still Irish. Wasn't that your argument that Irish should be encouraged etc etc I don't know I just think that the whole extra marks thing should be scrapped but that's just my opinion.can I ask you did you take the option and do your exams through Irish?

Rebelheart · 08-12-2009 08:06PM

vinylmesh wrote: »

I have to say I'm pretty angered about this :mad:
Do these people honestly see forcing people to use one or two irish words as a success for the irish language? Are they so arrogant that they don't value freedom even the tiniest bit? or are they just complete idiots who said "that sounds like a good idea" without thinking it through? Dickheads.

Yeah, and all those Canterburys, Westonburys, Highfieldburys, Wesleys, Shrewsburys and all the rest in Ireland are not created by "complete idiots" forcing their inferiority complex to all things English upon the rest of us, in their arrogance to think all Irish people have an inferiority complex to English and shopkeeper culture generally. Great "freedom" there, with one bog-ignorant builder deciding names of vast areas of Irish land and in the process imprisoning educated Irish people to the inadequacies of the lesser educated Irish-born plebs who still associate merchants - oops, the English - with culture and sophistication.

Imagine that, a world beyond mother England. Death would be preferable, eh?

PS: Your expertise on ignorant "dickheads" is unquestionable. You can always move to England if you hate Irish culture so deeply.

Rebelheart · 08-12-2009 08:15PM

PirateShampoo wrote: »

All this is gonna do is confuse people who wont be able to spell the new names, thus piss off the Post Man who will then go on strike until the names are changed back.

The concern for the average fear an phoist and taxi driver on this thread is admirable.

In the meantime, tens of thousands (if not hundreds of thousands) of people across all of Ireland already have their names and addresses in the Irish, seeing that they are Irish. Radical, eh? Amazingly enough, the fear an phoist manages to deliver the post to them. Shocking that such "ignorant" people as mere postmen have such capacity, eh? The stereotypes continue.

Rebelheart · 08-12-2009 08:19PM

Thucydides wrote: »

Well said. There are many many more important decisions facing the country

Of course there are; aren't there always. What the connection is between this comment and Dublin City Council deciding to put all estate names in the Irish is beyond me. Believe it or not, Dublin City Council does not rule the whole country.

Rebelheart · 08-12-2009 08:26PM

1fahy4 wrote: »

*Facepalm* I really don't see the point of giving estates bizarre Irish names that no-one can pronounce properly.

Speak for yourself. Beyond your evidently myopic anglocentric world, there are countless Irish people who have absolutely no shame about pronuncing Irish names correctly.

As for 'bizarre', here's an Irish man attacking Irish culture and defending English culture against Irish culture in Ireland. 'Bizarre' doesn't cover it.

All Estate Names to be in Irish

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