M3 - Inspection II + other work

jimbling · 25-08-2009 4:15pm #1

Right, I have a bit of work to get done to the car (04 M3)

Traction control stopped working two weeks ago when I got new tyres put on in a local tyre centre(bought the tyres online).
Called into the BMW garage (kearys) last saturday and was told they messed up the traction, but he'd have to run diagnostics to make sure.

Thing is, I will be due an Inspection II service in under 4k km. I'm wondering should I get an early service and just get it all done in one go?

I also want to get all the software updated in the car, as well as new maps for the sat nav etc.... is any of that included in a service?
Possibly looking for some sort of kit for the iphone too.

Anyway, main point here is, do I have any options. Do I have to go to the main dealer or are independent specialists an option? (obviously I want to keep a good service history for resale)
Are different dealers all the same, or should I get quotes from different places?

Do I have any bartering power with the service guys in there? How do I prevent getting taken for a ride?

Anan1 · 25-08-2009 4:17pm

AC Car Sales, don't have the number to hand but i'm sure someone will soon!

captainosull · 25-08-2009 4:22pm

You own an M3, your inspection II is due, prepare to accept some wallet bending over. The traction control is more than likely a broken wire to a wheel speed sensor, done whilst the tyres were being changed - as the M3 doesnt generally not give issues in this department. Shouldnt be too costly id so.

AC Car Sales all the way, they are very reputable, and having their stamp in your book is probably better than a main dealers at this stage.

kdevitt · 25-08-2009 4:29pm

Maps for your sat nav are definiately not included in a service. If you're lucky, they may update the version software for you - but even then I'd expect they'd charge you an hours labour for it.

If you're not wedded to the idea of a full BMW service history, then you have plenty of options. Most BMW indy's have the software needed to look after the car.

Gumbo · 25-08-2009 4:29pm

there was a good thread over on BMW-Driver a while back comparing inspections at various dealers and what exactly needs to be done.

if you car has built in bluetooth, theres an iPhone cradle available for the arwrest so it connects straight to the car.

BMW were doing a trade in deal on the Sat Nav discs, where you could upgrade tp the 2009 discs for 100euro iirc.

check here for loads of info.

also here and in particular here

no1beemerfan · 25-08-2009 4:36pm

http://www.accarsales.ie/servicing.aspx

Voodoomelon · 25-08-2009 4:36pm

With an inspection ll, you'll be looking in the region of €1000. You'll even be charged for items that need to be replaced, like discs and pads.

If you're in any way handy, you can do 75% of the stuff on the list yourself.

TheBazman · 25-08-2009 6:36pm

I got an Ipod attachment fitted last year at a main dealer which required a software update - apparently it takes a full day for the software to reset (?). Anyway it came to over €600 albeit it is the proper set up with all the details through the idrive etc

As for servicing - my most recent service on the 535d which was at a main dealer including oil service, microfilter service, front brake pads, front discs, replacement brake sensor, as well as a few other bits and pieces was €1400. Obviously that is a lot but it seems that the discs are very expensive on the 535. If I decide that I will be keeping the car for quite a few years, or if it was a little older I would be changing to an independent servicer like AC cars.

The Sat Nav discs I'm pretty sure will cost you

jimbling · 25-08-2009 8:31pm

Cheers for all the info lads. Great links there too.

I'm in Cork, so I presume there isn't many options down here. I would travel to Dublin to get it done if it was a big enough saving.

What do ye think about getting it done a bit early? I was thinking that bringing the car in twice would be more costly, but would I lose the value anyway on the few k kms?

jimbling · 25-08-2009 8:34pm

kceire wrote: »

if you car has built in bluetooth, theres an iPhone cradle available for the arwrest so it connects straight to the car.
[/URL]

Ya, I have the cradle unit in the car already, just have to switch for the iphone holder and get the software updated.
As far as I know this charges and links in the phone capability. I would like something that links in the music to the stereo speakers as well, any of ye know if this setup will do that???

kdevitt · 25-08-2009 9:17pm

Only reason I didn't mention AC is that I knew you're in Cork - so wsn't sure if you wanted to travel. Would recommend them.

Updating your sat nav pc to newer software is simple enough by the way - just involves sticking a CD in the drive.

You can play around with the boot up screen too if you feel like it!

Tails142 · 25-08-2009 9:28pm

Have used AC Car sales, they're the bees knees. Traction control went for me too recently on a 5er and it was the control module, apparently the soldering on the circuit board can fracture, got a refurb for about 300, though I've since learnt you can do the repair yourself if your handy with a soldering iron. Only way to determine the actual fault is by hooking it up and reading the codes though.

caze · 25-08-2009 9:45pm

TheBazman wrote: »

As for servicing - my most recent service on the 535d which was at a main dealer including oil service, microfilter service, front brake pads, front discs, replacement brake sensor, as well as a few other bits and pieces was €1400. Obviously that is a lot but it seems that the discs are very expensive on the 535. If I decide that I will be keeping the car for quite a few years, or if it was a little older I would be changing to an independent servicer like AC cars.

Dont think AC Cars are much cheaper than main dealers at this stage, last time I was there got Oil service, front and rear brake pads + sensors, brake fluid changed and microfilters on E60 diesel. Cost was €955 euro, I thought that was very steep. Work is top notch though.
Some main dealers are now offering discounts on labour and parts for cars 4 years and older, think I saw something in a paper mentioning Joe Duffy's. Haven't a clue what they normally charge labour wise though.

rebel.ranter · 25-08-2009 10:14pm

Hi OP, you could go to MMW (Murphy Motor Works). They are based on the Monahan Road. The two main mechanics down there are ex-main dealer with a lot of experience between them. They have all the proper diagnostics equipment etc.
Contact 021 432 2122
For your model M3 you could go for a DICE unit to integrate your iPod/iPhone.
Here is a link to the dice unit:

http://www.europeanautosource.com/product_info.php?products_id=1621

I have one in my e39 & it works very well.

Also I have some BMW diagnostics software that may be able to reset or at least check what your traction control issue is. PM me if you want to give it a go.

Voodoomelon · 25-08-2009 10:59pm

In regards the Nav update, if the system is DVD based, you can buy the discs on eBay. I got a 2008 CD last year for UK & Ireland for about eur60.00, for an 8 year old car.

jimbling · 31-08-2009 8:45am

This is the response I got from Kearys in Cork.

kearys wrote:

insp 2 approx 1,200 E incl valve adjustment
adapter for phone approx 90E depending on phone model
software update - i will need to check on the day as the software time varies depending on spec
sat nav disk is approx 200 E depending on the variant of sat nav in your car

a little vague i know but, all these cars vary, no 2 are the same

Should I shop around? Would I save enough to make it worthwhile going to dublin/belfast?

galwaytt · 31-08-2009 9:29am

jimbling wrote: »

This is the response I got from Kearys in Cork.

Should I shop around? Would I save enough to make it worthwhile going to dublin/belfast?

Will Keary's give you a courtesy car while yours is in ?

Or, if you travel, what do you do........hang around all day in the hope it'll be ready by end of day? And if it isn't ?........ That's the downside of long-distance servicing...........

jimbling · 31-08-2009 11:00am

galwaytt wrote: »

Will Keary's give you a courtesy car while yours is in ?

Or, if you travel, what do you do........hang around all day in the hope it'll be ready by end of day? And if it isn't ?........ That's the downside of long-distance servicing...........

Either way it might be better off doing it locally. If I have to go back for something etc it might cause problems. Just have to face facts really.... I have a car that costs a mint to keep running.
Ah, but it's worth it

I'll definitely have to look into updating the Sat Nav maps etc myself because 200 is way too much. Ridiculous price really.

mickdw · 31-08-2009 11:30am

I can see you saving a small fortune by going to northern ireland or a bmw specialist.
Its only a service. They make out like its rocket science because its an M3 but its not.

Cyrus · 31-08-2009 1:05pm

jimbling wrote: »

This is the response I got from Kearys in Cork.

Should I shop around? Would I save enough to make it worthwhile going to dublin/belfast?

thats a good price, ac did my old one and it was near 1,000 and without valve clearances,

as long as that price includes plugs, valve clearances and uprated diff oil (ask them for that aswell the one with the FM booster) id go with kearys.

there is also a guy in abbeyfeale limerick, ger (http://www.bavarianautotechnik.com/), who is excellent

31-08-2009 3:25pm

They're totally looney prices for a service, nothing there except the valve work is any way complicated or demanding for any competent DIY guy.

Cyrus · 31-08-2009 3:28pm

RoverJames wrote: »

They're totally looney prices for a service, nothing there except the valve work is any way complicated or demanding for any competent DIY guy.

price up the oil(castrol 10w60), the diff oil, the plugs and then the time it takes for the valve clearances, the parts alone will make up a fair chunk

31-08-2009 3:41pm

The remainder (another fair chunk) pays for the showroom.

All they do is a load of "checks", change the engine oil, dif oil, air f, fuel f and spark plugs. Madness paying a grand for that. Admittedly anyone driving a modern M3 is probablt not short of cash but a grand is still a grand.

voxpop · 31-08-2009 3:49pm

Is there something special about Inspection 2 - a grand for a service seems like a hell of a lot

31-08-2009 3:53pm

Inspection 1 is an oil change and a load of checks, insp 2 is the same except they do more checks and also change the diff oil, and the air and fuel filters. Easy money for them, folks will dish out the cash without questionning it as they think their car is such a sophisticated beast it needs the expensive servicing. Also they want to maintain their FBMWSH for trade in time :rolleyes: It will be more too if the car needs pads, discs, brake hoses, calipers etc etc.

mickdw · 31-08-2009 4:38pm

It is lunacy paying those prices for basic maintenance. Inspection II is nothing special.
I figure if you have receipts for all the service parts required for proper servicing, that would be good enough for any sensible person you would hope to sell it too so no need to pay the dealer prices.

Cyrus · 31-08-2009 5:38pm

RoverJames wrote: »

Inspection 1 is an oil change and a load of checks, insp 2 is the same except they do more checks and also change the diff oil, and the air and fuel filters. Easy money for them, folks will dish out the cash without questionning it as they think their car is such a sophisticated beast it needs the expensive servicing. Also they want to maintain their FBMWSH for trade in time :rolleyes: It will be more too if the car needs pads, discs, brake hoses, calipers etc etc.

and do you know how much the engine oil, diff oil and spark plugs cost for an m3? and the time it takes to check the valve clearances?

31-08-2009 8:40pm

A poster above paid a grand for the inspection 2 without the valve clearance check. Tell us the price of the oil, diff oil, spark plugs air and fuel filter................. then justify how the labour added on comes to a grand.

Quick googling DCPR8EKP (NGK) x 6 €75
Castrol 10 60 engine oil 4l €60 lets day €100 as I imagine the M3 takes more, lets say €120 actually
Lets say oil filter, fuel and air filter can be got for €100 (they defo can, no probs at all)
Diff oil, an M3 takes 1.7L of 83222282583, €40 tops from the stealers, also other brands are approved

So that all comes to €335, leaving €665 labour to perform the fluid and filter change (an hour at most) and to do all the visual checks.

The Kearys service was €1200 inc the valve work, the other price of €1000 was not inc. I know a BMW tech so if you want I could ask him how long would it take, of course the Kearys price would be the check, if the shims needed adjusting no doubt the charge may be more.

Cyrus · 31-08-2009 9:01pm

i havent got the receipt any more car is since sold, but the parts were more expensive than that, also the diff oil has been replaced by an uprated on with fm booster

31-08-2009 9:08pm

That's the price for main dealer diff oil, if you were charged more than the above for that you got no value at all, no offence but the fact is the grand for an inspection 2 is robbery.

jimbling · 01-09-2009 10:20am

RoverJames wrote: »

That's the price for main dealer diff oil, if you were charged more than the above for that you got no value at all, no offence but the fact is the grand for an inspection 2 is robbery.

You keep saying this, but what are the alternatives?
I cant do it myself, and from reading other threads, these bmw specialists are not much cheaper either. So what exactly are you suggesting I do?

jimbling · 01-09-2009 10:31am

rebel.ranter wrote: »

Hi OP, you could go to MMW (Murphy Motor Works). They are based on the Monahan Road. The two main mechanics down there are ex-main dealer with a lot of experience between them. They have all the proper diagnostics equipment etc.
Contact 021 432 2122

I just rang these guys there. He's putting a quote together, but I get the feeling it will be a lot cheaper. I asked him about valve adjustment etc and he told me that he would be about 90% sure none would be required as the car only has 45k on it.

01-09-2009 10:36am

You don't need to be a BMW specialist to change oil, plugs, diff oil, a few filter and have a looksee to ensure the brakes, shocks, bushings etc are sound. There are plenty of back street garages that do top quality work, plenty of them do shoffy work too, so you have to got to a good one. In saying that plenty of main dealers do shocking work too.

As I said though, anyone driving a modern M3 probably isn't short of cash, personally though there is no way I would hand over a grand for an inpection 2. Fair enough giving them a couple of hundred for the valve work. Do keep in mind the parts can be got a lot cheaper than what I posted too. Also as I have said if you need pads, discs, bushings, gaitors etc the price will be much more.

All in all, BMW service costs described in this thread from the dealers and specialists are nothing short of robbery. If the vanos is not giving trouble and there are no warning lights there is nothing required that a competent mechanic couldn't do easily.

kdevitt · 01-09-2009 10:57am

Once the Indy has the proper diagnostic equipment, and used the correct oil and plugs you should be fine (remembering there is a specific, and not very cheap oil for M engines)

Personally I'd only buy an M car which has all its major services done by BMW - it helps track the history of the car for a start, but plenty of people will buy one without it, so it won't really hinder you when it comes to selling.

I'm testing out the 2009-2 map dvd this evening by the way, if it works you can have a copy.

jimbling · 01-09-2009 11:13am

kdevitt wrote: »

Once the Indy has the proper diagnostic equipment, and used the correct oil and plugs you should be fine (remembering there is a specific, and not very cheap oil for M engines)

Exactly, most backstreet garages as RoverJames states wont have the proper equipment.

kdevitt wrote: »

Personally I'd only buy an M car which has all its major services done by BMW - it helps track the history of the car for a start, but plenty of people will buy one without it, so it won't really hinder you when it comes to selling.

What about a BMW specialist? I haven't checked, but I presume that they can put the history on the Key just like BMW do. Anyone know that? I'll ask later anyway.

kdevitt wrote: »

I'm testing out the 2009-2 map dvd this evening by the way, if it works you can have a copy.

Cheers mate, that would be brilliant. Someone else posted about updating the software on the car myself too.. might look into that, could save me quite a few quid.

RoverJames wrote: »

As I said though, anyone driving a modern M3 probably isn't short of cash

I know an M3 driver shouldn't be short of cash, but I seem to be these days. I used to have extra income from Poker, which has depleted. I didn't play golf which is now costing me a lot of money (most of which is petrol to drive too and from the course). And I used to get annual increases in wages :rolleyes:

So, things are relatively tight at the moment.

kdevitt · 01-09-2009 11:45am

jimbling wrote: »

What about a BMW specialist? I haven't checked, but I presume that they can put the history on the Key just like BMW do. Anyone know that? I'll ask later anyway.

Nope - wouldn't do it for me, and I know most of the Dublin specialists personally. I still get the likes of AC to do my interim oil changes on the M3 (its just handier for me) and the likes of my last wishbone replacement.

Only the mileage gets stored on the key - so its not much use to verify anything other than the that!

As I said though - I just want my cars to have the full BMW history for main services, and like keeping it that way - would also help if I ever need to put through a good will gesture claim. Most people aren't so fussy, once you hold onto all receipts you'll be fine.

Victor_M · 01-09-2009 11:48am

I paid €513 for an Inspection II on an E46 M3 with AC car sales about 2 years ago, Cyrus IIRC I think you paid around €700 for the same, I'm not entirely sure what 'valve clearance' is I've never heard of it, any one care to enlighten me?

I rang all the main dealers in Dublin and they were within €50 of each other at around €1200, AC cars was my first service outside of the Authorised BMW dealer network, I was a bit reluctant from a resale perspective, but anyone who is looking for a used M3 at this stage in Ireland will have heard of them, I haven't looked back since, from the detailed break down of exactly what was done, by a guy who clearly loves M3's to the advisories, with no pressure to get them to do it for you, I can't recommend AC car sales highly enough.

Unless the car is less than 3-4 years old I wouldn't go near a main dealer again.

jimbling · 01-09-2009 3:18pm

kdevitt wrote: »

Nope - wouldn't do it for me, and I know most of the Dublin specialists personally. I still get the likes of AC to do my interim oil changes on the M3 (its just handier for me) and the likes of my last wishbone replacement.

Fair enough... why though? Do you think the specialists do shoddier work or something?

kdevitt wrote: »

Only the mileage gets stored on the key - so its not much use to verify anything other than the that!

Oh, I thought way more information got stored on the key. I'm sure the bmw guy told me he could tell the cars history from the key

kdevitt wrote: »

As I said though - I just want my cars to have the full BMW history for main services, and like keeping it that way - would also help if I ever need to put through a good will gesture claim. Most people aren't so fussy, once you hold onto all receipts you'll be fine.

Eh, what's a good will gesture claim?

jimbling · 01-09-2009 3:20pm

Victor_M wrote: »

I paid €513 for an Inspection II on an E46 M3 with AC car sales about 2 years ago, Cyrus IIRC I think you paid around €700 for the same, I'm not entirely sure what 'valve clearance' is I've never heard of it, any one care to enlighten me?

I rang all the main dealers in Dublin and they were within €50 of each other at around €1200, AC cars was my first service outside of the Authorised BMW dealer network, I was a bit reluctant from a resale perspective, but anyone who is looking for a used M3 at this stage in Ireland will have heard of them, I haven't looked back since, from the detailed break down of exactly what was done, by a guy who clearly loves M3's to the advisories, with no pressure to get them to do it for you, I can't recommend AC car sales highly enough.

Unless the car is less than 3-4 years old I wouldn't go near a main dealer again.

Cheers for that. It's a pity they're not local for me. The car is 5 years old and ill have it for another year at least.

Gumbo · 01-09-2009 4:15pm

jimbling wrote: »

Fair enough... why though? Do you think the specialists do shoddier work or something?

if i was looking for an E46 M3 i would want to see the run service at 1200 odd miles from a main dealer, and all the scheduled services from a main dealer including inspection 1 and 2. all the in between stuff i would have no problem buying if done at a recognised specialist like AC or similar.

Ken would have hign regard for specialists like AC, just look at his website to confirm BMW-Driver, so i would imagine its nothing to do with shoddy work or anything, just a case of keeping the official history of such a specialised car imo.

jimbling wrote: »

Oh, I thought way more information got stored on the key. I'm sure the bmw guy told me he could tell the cars history from the key

when you give the dealer the key, he puts it into the machine which in turn tells him the mileage and reg details of the car iirc, and with the reg details he can search the internal BMW system for service history, recalls and work carried out to the car.

jimbling wrote: »

Eh, what's a good will gesture claim?

its basically a good will gesture from BMW, like for instance if your car has a full history and then all of a sudden something major goes, BMW can discount the repair charge, ie i know a guy that the turbo went in his E46 320d and the car was bought new from Joe Duffy's and had full service history from duffys, so when the turbo blew he got BMW to carry out the repairs for half the price.

rebel.ranter · 01-09-2009 4:19pm

jimbling wrote: »

I just rang these guys there. He's putting a quote together, but I get the feeling it will be a lot cheaper. I asked him about valve adjustment etc and he told me that he would be about 90% sure none would be required as the car only has 45k on it.

Liam & Stephen in MMW are excellent mechanics & would have been highly regarded when they were in the main dealer network. They are only a year or two out of the main dealer shop. If it were me I woud rather have these two guys working on my car. Sometimes too an independent specialist will be more likely to see faults or issues that emerge on older non-current models.
Note: I am not knocking the main dealer system I had reason to use them recently (4 wheel alignment) & found the service offered to be quite good.

As I said the offer to reset the TC fault is still there.

rebel.ranter · 01-09-2009 4:58pm

Victor_M wrote: »

I'm not entirely sure what 'valve clearance' is I've never heard of it, any one care to enlighten me?

Most modern cars have hydraulic tappets that are adjusted automatically, I remember in my old Beetle, e34 5 series & e30 3 series all needed valve clearance adjustments, that is the gap between the tappet & the top of the valve adjusted. An easy job witha 10mm spanner & a set of feeler guages. The Beetle used to require it regularly.
Having the right valve clearances means the valves open up the right amount, I would imagine that an out of sorts valve clearance would mean the valve is not opening enough, hence the air or fuel getting in is not adequate. Having it adjusted too tight coudl cause the valve to burn.

A decent mechanic, especially one that is used to a particular model of car would nearly be able to tell by listening if they were not right.

My guess is that the majority of the labour cost would be in the stripping down of the various engine covers, oils, etc.

jimbling · 03-11-2009 5:15pm

Okay, so the car has been in twice now......

Trip one Breakdown:
Service as Required. (including running diagnostics etc)
Check ABS/ASC, PDC Systems.
Oil (Castrol TWS): 136.50
Oil Filter: 12.40
Air Filter: 21.71
Brake Fluid: 12.50.
Labour: 120

Trip two Breakdown:
Software upgrade.
Parts:
Rear Shock Mountings*2: 52.26
Trailing arm bushes*2: 51.40
Fuel Filter: 57.60
ABS Pressure Switch: 124.61
Labour: 180

Also note, that he ordered a PDC sensor for me the first time but never installed it as it had started working again.
Alas, that didn't last as when I picked it up the second day it started acting up again pretty much immediately.
So, that's another 103.78 for the part, and the inevitable labour cost.

Also, there is a problem with the steering angle sensor. It's 232 for the part and he said the labour is a big one on it too. He reckoned we can get away without fixing it after everything else was done though so haven't ordered anything for it yet.

I drove the car up to clare at the weekend. The shuddering at high speeds was insane. WAY worse than it was a few weeks ago. I was completely shocked. He had said that the tracking still need to be done but I dont think he was expecting any problems like that.

So, that's €850+ charged so far.... and it's booked in again for Thursday.

M3 - Inspection II + other work

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