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911 revisited

12357…12

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  • #122
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    squod wrote: »
    Of course you're correct King Mob.

    Obviously the first thing I'd do i f I wanted someone to film the events of 9/11 is call a moving agency, not a film crew.
    Or at least a team of spies who'd do a better job of concealing themselves than standing on van and shouting.
    squod wrote: »
    These guys appear on TV to talk about their experiences and again you say
    they're probably just a couple of dicks.
    And as far as I'm aware most intelligence agencies don't allow their operatives to talk about very recent or very sensitive operations especially on TV.
    squod wrote: »
    The artilce and the others like it published at the time gave me an interest
    in the events of 9/11. So far I haven't heard anything concrete from any side.

    I expect that you just don't have an interest. That's the impression that I get.
    I'm very interested in 9/11 I just don't buy the conspiracy theories.


  • #123
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    If you do have an interest than you must have found the article of some interest.

    The 'team of spies' as you say also gave accounts to other news sources at the time. I suppose even if they did you wouldn't have read them as you 'don't buy the conspiracy theory'.

    I've more of an open mind on this. I don't dismiss every piece of evidence, for or against, as bull.

    As I said so far nothing concrete has turned up. If something concrete does turn up, for or against, would you read about it?


  • #124
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    squod wrote: »
    If you do have an interest than you must have found the article of some interest.
    Not really as this has come up many many time before.
    http://www.911myths.com/html/dancing_israelis.html

    It's not exactly new.
    squod wrote: »
    The 'team of spies' as you say also gave accounts to other news sources at the time. I suppose even if they did you wouldn't have read them as you 'don't buy the conspiracy theory'.
    Well that article doesn't mention any other interviews by these guys other than the Israeli talk show.
    Maybe you can show these accounts?

    And again if these guys where involved in 9/11 why do they keep telling everyone?
    squod wrote: »
    I've more of an open mind on this. I don't dismiss every piece of evidence, for or against, as bull.
    Neither am I. I'm just pointing out the glaring holes in these part of the conspiracy theory.


  • #125
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    King Mob wrote: »
    Not really as this has come up many many time before.
    http://www.911myths.com/html/dancing_israelis.html

    It's not exactly new.

    Well that article doesn't mention any other interviews by these guys other than the Israeli talk show.
    Maybe you can show these accounts?

    And again if these guys where involved in 9/11 why do they keep telling everyone?

    Neither am I. I'm just pointing out the glaring holes in these part of the conspiracy theory.


    Originally I posted a reqest to find a Sunday Tribune article, turns out I found it.
    You'll find there's holes in the official line also. Seems as if the further away this conspiracy gets in terms of time, the less correct the information gets.


  • #126
    meglome
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,980 ✭✭✭meglome


    squod wrote: »
    Originally I posted a reqest to find a Sunday Tribune article, turns out I found it.
    You'll find there's holes in the official line also. Seems as if the further away this conspiracy gets in terms of time, the less correct the information gets.

    There are plenty of questions but questions are just that... questions. They are not evidence of anything. You can assume what you like but that is just your opinion.

    These Israelis are either some of the worst secret agents in history or maybe they were just videoing the aftermaths as they said. And you do realise there are more Jews in New York than anywhere else in the world outside of Israel?


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  • #127
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    meglome wrote: »
    There are plenty of questions but questions are just that... questions. They are not evidence of anything. You can assume what you like but that is just your opinion.

    These Israelis are either some of the worst secret agents in history or maybe they were just videoing the aftermaths as they said. And you do realise there are more Jews in New York than anywhere else in the world outside of Israel?


    Fantastic response again meglome, and again you've brought nothing with you to this discussion.

    These Isrealies wre the kind from Isreal, you know the Isreali kind of Isrealis! So again, I re-iterate, by their own words they were sent there to document the event. Not remove the bluddy furniture.


  • #128
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    squod wrote: »
    Fantastic response again meglome, and again you've brought nothing with you to this discussion.

    These Isrealies wre the kind from Isreal, you know the Isreali kind of Isrealis! So again, I re-iterate, by their own words they were sent there to document the event. Not remove the bluddy furniture.

    Have you not read my responses?

    You interpreted the words ''Our purpose was to document the event." as "we were sent to America before the attacks to document the attacks."

    However anyone with a camera that day could have said the same ''Our purpose was to document the event."

    There is no evidence at all they had any foreknowledge of the attacks.


  • #129
    Black Uhlan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 283 ✭✭Black Uhlan


    meglome wrote: »
    There are plenty of questions but questions are just that... questions. They are not evidence of anything. You can assume what you like but that is just your opinion.

    These Israelis are either some of the worst secret agents in history or maybe they were just videoing the aftermaths as they said. And you do realise there are more Jews in New York than anywhere else in the world outside of Israel?

    There are some questions you need to ask yourself, such as when New Jersey became New York?
    What your there being more Jews in New York comment brings to the table, if anything? They were 5 ISRAELI's arrested, Israel despite everything must be at least 20% Moslem. Therefore statistically one of these guys should have been a Moslem.

    Why can you not admit that their actions are beyond strange when the rest of the world was in shock? I don't mean to be offensive here but your holier-than-thou posts always come back to you looking at the finer points


  • #130
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    I have read your response King mob, and thank you for pionting this out.

    However the Isrealis' spent two months behind bars under interrogation.
    One of them refused a lie detector test because of previous missions
    he took part in.


    They went on TV in Isreal telling people about themselves. This is all great and eveything but I don't expect you're gonna convince me that Mossad
    got into the bluddy furniture removal business.

    So far as I'm aware this story's been through the mill and no-one so far has proved that these guys weren't working for the Isreali security forces.
    Given that they said so on TV.

    So whats the argument for?


  • #131
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    squod wrote: »

    However the Isrealis' spent two months behind bars under interrogation.
    One of them refused a lie detector test because of previous missions
    he took part in.
    And exactly how do you know why he refused a lie detector test?
    And if they were in on 9/11 why where they held at all?
    And why was this story even covered on the news?
    squod wrote: »
    They went on TV in Isreal telling people about themselves. This is all great and eveything but I don't expect you're gonna convince me that Mossad
    got into the bluddy furniture removal business.

    So far as I'm aware this story's been through the mill and no-one so far has proved that these guys weren't working for the Isreali security forces.
    Given that they said so on TV.

    So whats the argument for?
    So far as I'm aware no-one has proved that these guys weren't shapeshifting aliens.

    And even if they did work for the Mossad there is still nothing at all to show they had foreknowledge of the attacks.


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  • #132
    meglome
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,980 ✭✭✭meglome


    Black Uhlan wrote: »
    There are some questions you need to ask yourself, such as when New Jersey became New York?
    What your there being more Jews in New York comment brings to the table, if anything? They were 5 ISRAELI's arrested, Israel despite everything must be at least 20% Moslem. Therefore statistically one of these guys should have been a Moslem.

    Why can you not admit that their actions are beyond strange when the rest of the world was in shock? I don't mean to be offensive here but your holier-than-thou posts always come back to you looking at the finer points

    He he okay. I do find it amusing when people accuse me of being holier than thou by taking a holier than thou stance. And you say holier-than-thou I say common sense.

    New Jersey has a lot of Jews too, point being having Israelis in a place where there is many many Israelis and Jews isn't odd.

    I don't know if their actions are strange. We know that their neighbour reported them thinking they were speaking Arabic. So given the language differences they might have been laughing or maybe they were just excited or maybe that's just the way young people who speak Hebrew come across to English speakers, we just don't know. Or as King Mob suggested maybe they are just dickheads. We also know they were not charged with any crime and they went on television to speak about it. Now just from a common sense point of view they would seem to be terrible secret agents and other than innuendo and speculation there is no evidence they did anything wrong. I've said it before but if they had not been mistaken for speaking Arabic I wonder if they would they have even been reported to the police in the first place.


  • #133
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    King Mob wrote: »

    So far as I'm aware no-one has proved that these guys weren't shapeshifting aliens.

    Aliens huh?

    I can't be bothered. Go back in time and read some newspapers or whatever.
    Or don't, I don't care. I'm not responding anymore, believe whatever bulls1t story you want or make one up for yourself.


  • #134
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    squod wrote: »
    Aliens huh?

    I can't be bothered. Go back in time and read some newspapers or whatever.
    Or don't, I don't care. I'm not responding anymore, believe whatever bulls1t story you want or make one up for yourself.
    Because news stories are better and more accurate the sooner they're reported?


  • #135
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    meglome wrote: »
    We also know they were not charged with any crime and they went on television to speak about it


    Two months in prison, they spent. And then were sent off to Isreal.


  • #136
    meglome
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,980 ✭✭✭meglome


    squod wrote: »
    Two months in prison, they spent. And then were sent off to Isreal.

    They might have been Mossad agents, that's possible although as I said not very good ones. Israel has been caught spying on the US several times as have any number of other countries. However it's a huge stretch to say they had foreknowledge of or were involved in 911. Sure it's easy to assume it if that's what anyone wants to do.


  • #137
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    meglome wrote: »
    They might have been Mossad agents, that's possible although as I said not very good ones. Israel has been caught spying on the US several times as have any number of other countries. However it's a huge stretch to say they had foreknowledge of or were involved in 911. Sure it's easy to assume it if that's what anyone wants to do.


    'suppose the only way to know for sure is to ask one of them. Maybe some one already did, as they did spend two months being interrogated.

    All we have to do then is wait for the answer to appear in the media or online.

    What will you think then, say if they had fore knowledge?


  • #138
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    squod wrote: »
    'suppose the only way to know for sure is to ask one of them. Maybe some one already did, as they did spend two months being interrogated.

    All we have to do then is wait for the answer to appear in the media or online.

    What will you think then, say if they had fore knowledge?
    And the released them saying:
    the men were released because they "did not know anything about 9/11".

    And for the like fifth time there is no evidence to suggest they had any foreknowledge.

    The only thing you have put forward was
    squod wrote: »
    So, as the eyewitness 'Maria' said she reported the van and the people filming and cheering on top of it as the first plane went in, not after the attacks as you say.
    Which your own link showed to be false.


  • #139
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    King Mob wrote: »
    And the released them saying:



    And for the like fifth time there is no evidence to suggest they had any foreknowledge.

    The only thing you have put forward was

    Which your own link showed to be false.

    You're basing this on one article rather than the many published around the same time. Great work!

    Tell me where I said these guys had fore knowledge then.

    http://www.tribune.ie/article/2003/nov/09/the-real-911-cover-up/?q=september%2011%20mossad


  • #140
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    squod wrote: »
    You're basing this on one article rather than the many published around the same time. Great work!

    Tell me where I said these guys had fore knowledge then.

    http://www.tribune.ie/article/2003/nov/09/the-real-911-cover-up/?q=september%2011%20mossad

    The same article you are talking about.

    And if you read my last post you'd see I already pointed out where you claim these guy had foreknowledge.
    squod wrote: »
    So, as the eyewitness 'Maria' said she reported the van and the people filming and cheering on top of it as the first plane went in, not after the attacks as you say.


  • #141
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    King Mob wrote: »
    The same article you are talking about.

    And if you read my last post you'd see I already pointed out where you claim these guy had foreknowledge.

    Great then you're paying attention.


    http://www.rense.com/general64/moss.htm

    [SIZE=+1]At least two Israel-based employees of Odigo received warnings of an imminent attack in New York City more than two hours before the first plane hit the WTC. Odigo had its U.S. headquarters two blocks from the WTC. The Odigo employees, however, did not pass the warning on to the authorities in New York City, a move that could have saved thousands of lives.[/SIZE]


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  • #142
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    squod wrote: »
    Great then you're paying attention.


    http://www.rense.com/general64/moss.htm

    [SIZE=+1]At least two Israel-based employees of Odigo received warnings of an imminent attack in New York City more than two hours before the first plane hit the WTC. Odigo had its U.S. headquarters two blocks from the WTC. The Odigo employees, however, did not pass the warning on to the authorities in New York City, a move that could have saved thousands of lives.[/SIZE]

    So you giving up on these dudes from Jersey then?

    http://www.911myths.com/html/4000_israelis.html
    http://www.911myths.com/html/odigo.html


  • #143
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    You?

    How about the 'People finder' software and why is your link talking of people working for Odigo in the WTC?

    Odigo wasn't in the WTC!

    Whats the point of these links?


  • #144
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    squod wrote: »
    You?

    How about the 'People finder' software and why is your link talking of people working for Odigo in the WTC?

    Odigo wasn't in the WTC!

    Whats the point of these links?
    So that's a yes, you have given up with the lads in Jersey.

    What about the people finder software?

    And some people make the claim that that company was in the WTC.

    And would you like to address the points brought up in them?


  • #145
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    King Mob wrote: »
    So that's a yes, you have given up with the lads in Jersey.

    What about the people finder software?

    And some people make the claim that that company was in the WTC.

    And would you like to address the points brought up in them?


    It's a no. They were sent to document the event, their words not mine.
    And again they weren't bluddy furniture removers.

    Again no, there are no points as far as I'm aware. You sending links to
    prove something or other.

    The webpage talks of Odigo sending warning to it's staff? Where did that come from? More of your aliens maybe!

    People finder software would have sent messages to corresponding groups of people regardless of their location.


  • #146
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    squod wrote: »
    It's a no. They were sent to document the event, their words not mine.
    And again they weren't bluddy furniture removers.
    Seriously?
    Are you actually reading any replies?

    They didn't say they were sent to document the attacks.
    That's only your interpretation of their words.
    There is nothing to suggest they had foreknowledge.
    squod wrote: »
    Again no, there are no points as far as I'm aware. You sending links to
    prove something or other.
    Yes because those links sum up the facts pretty cohesively.

    What about the fact that the message had no information about the attack or where it was going to be.
    squod wrote: »
    The webpage talks of Odigo sending warning to it's staff? Where did that come from? More of your aliens maybe!
    You realise that bomb threats all the time right?
    Why was the warning sent to a company that has nothing to do with the WTC?


  • #147
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    King Mob wrote: »
    Why was the warning sent to a company that has nothing to do with the WTC?


    Why are you insisting that the messages were sent to a company?
    Where is that comming from?

    [SIZE=+1]Odigo has a feature called People Finder that allows users to seek out and contact others based on certain demographics, such as Israeli nationality.[/SIZE] [SIZE=+1] Two weeks after 9/11, Alex Diamandis, Odigo's vice president, reportedly said, "It was possible that the attack warning was broadcast to other Odigo members, but the company has not received reports of other recipients of the message."[/SIZE]


  • #148
    Black Uhlan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 283 ✭✭Black Uhlan


    meglome wrote: »
    He he okay. I do find it amusing when people accuse me of being holier than thou by taking a holier than thou stance. And you say holier-than-thou I say common sense.

    New Jersey has a lot of Jews too, point being having Israelis in a place where there is many many Israelis and Jews isn't odd.

    I don't know if their actions are strange. We know that their neighbour reported them thinking they were speaking Arabic. So given the language differences they might have been laughing or maybe they were just excited or maybe that's just the way young people who speak Hebrew come across to English speakers, we just don't know. Or as King Mob suggested maybe they are just dickheads. We also know they were not charged with any crime and they went on television to speak about it. Now just from a common sense point of view they would seem to be terrible secret agents and other than innuendo and speculation there is no evidence they did anything wrong. I've said it before but if they had not been mistaken for speaking Arabic I wonder if they would they have even been reported to the police in the first place.

    "having Israeli's in place where there Israeli's...isn't odd" seriously, I have no clue where you are going with this.

    Come on man, try to read the info at least. 1. Their "neighbour" was never their neighbour to begin with, as far as I can make out no details are given as to were these guys lived. Neighbour was mentioned in a headline of an news piece I read, please tell me you are not just reading the headlines. 2. The "neighbour" did not report them because they were "speaking arabic", she reported them because they they were posing for pictures with the burning tower as a backdrop, celebrating the attack and at the latest in the minutes after the first plane hit.

    Can we agree on this? I'd like you to think about it for just a second if you would...Bare in mind this is before the world was aware it was not just a terrible accident. It is what I thought at the time as I watched live, Pres Bush even saw fit to continue reading his childrens book. Surely noone would be compelled to celebrate a plane crash? And anyone who would possess such pschyopathic tendencies would surely keep any feelings to themselves? What chance of five individuals to record, dance, and celebrate on top of their van to get a better shot of a plane crash? Almost Zero I would say. But...would it make more sense if they were celebrating and recording the succesful completion of the greatest crime of all time?

    When you said this ..."So given the language differences they might have been laughing or maybe they were just excited or maybe that's just the way young people who speak Hebrew come across to English speakers,"

    I have no idea what you are getting at. Seriously, are you trying to say laughing sounds different in Hebrew? I know there is a scarcity of Jews in Ireland, especially those who speak Hebrew but I don't live there any more and I can assure you, as an English speaker myself that "young people who speak "Hebrew" do not come across as people celebrating and recording an apparent terrible tragedy.

    "they were just dickheads" perhaps but it really doesn't explain anything. If you haven't already please read these two short links. They were the best I could find from the NT Times and ABC. http://web.archive.org/web/20020802194310/http://abcnews.go.com/sections/2020/DailyNews/2020_whitevan_020621.html http://www.crimelynx.com/dozens.html
    They answer most of the questions that I believe you would have to establish that it is all a little fishy.


  • #149
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    squod wrote: »
    Why are you insisting that the messages were sent to a company?
    Where is that comming from?

    [SIZE=+1]Odigo has a feature called People Finder that allows users to seek out and contact others based on certain demographics, such as Israeli nationality.[/SIZE] [SIZE=+1] Two weeks after 9/11, Alex Diamandis, Odigo's vice president, reportedly said, "It was possible that the attack warning was broadcast to other Odigo members, but the company has not received reports of other recipients of the message."[/SIZE]

    Because it was sent to two people in that company.
    And that company has no connection to the WTC at all.

    But are you seriously going to go the "the Jews were in on it" route?


  • #150
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    King Mob wrote: »
    Because it was sent to two people in that company.
    And that company has no connection to the WTC at all.

    But are you seriously going to go the "the Jews were in on it" route?


    No, not going to go the "the Jews were in on it" route.

    There's no evidence to support that as far as I recall.


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  • #151
    Black Uhlan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 283 ✭✭Black Uhlan


    King Mob wrote: »
    Because it was sent to two people in that company.
    And that company has no connection to the WTC at all.

    But are you seriously going to go the "the Jews were in on it" route?

    Why do you think the sender, wasn't questioned?

    If it was so, and if it was just some crazy coincidence/practical joke or whatever that it didn't come to light with the public to clear up an confusion? Likewise, why not reveal the actual contents of the message?

    Wasn't there a 9/11 commission for the purposes of clarity?


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