Some advice please

My name is URL · 31-07-2009 2:31pm #1

Hey,

I've just registered a domain name for a site I have an idea for.

I'm completely new to this and need some help

What's the next step to getting a working site online?

I know I need a CMS and frontend made so has anyone any tips as to what the best way is to go about that, and what the costs may be?

I don't even know anything about hosting =p

If someone could outline the steps I need to take to move this idea forward it'd be most appreciated

ontheway · 31-07-2009 2:36pm

If you are hiring someone to carry out design/development for you, then they should be able to take care of everything for you.

If you are going to try and do it yourself, which I don't advise, because it should be done properly, then pick a hosting company and purchase an appropriate hosting plan. Then through the control panel you have for your hosting you can associate the domain name you purchased with your hosting account. After that you need to update the DNS records for the domain to point to the name servers of your hosting company, and bob's your uncle. After DNS update is initiated, expect to wait anything from a few mins to 48 hours for DNS to complete the update.

hobochris · 31-07-2009 2:37pm

What is the sites purpose?

blog? ecommerce? personal site? business brochure site?

pts · 31-07-2009 2:43pm

Once you have the domain name you need to start looking for hosting. Your choice of host depends on many factors. For example if you are hoping to run a CMS on the website you will more than likely need a host which supports PHP and MySQL (most hosts do). There are ofcourse other factors such as reliability, price, support etc which should be considered when picking a host.

I've set up a few websites with Wordpress as the CMS. Even though it's blogging software I find it suitable as a CMS for small websites.

Once you've got a host, and you've installed and configured the CMS you need to point your domain name to your website. The process for doing this depends on company you purchased the domain name from.

My name is URL · 31-07-2009 2:44pm

hobochris wrote: »

What is the sites purpose?

blog? ecommerce? personal site? business brochure site?

An ebay type site

ontheway · 31-07-2009 2:54pm

My name is URL wrote: »

ie. an electrician has a few hours to spare on a Saturday so he advertises on the site and the winning bid gets his time

I know some extremely qualified and experienced electricians and I assure you in the current climate "a few hours to spare" is a real understatement. The fact of the matter is that the country is full of trades people currently unemployed so they individually are in no position to be auctioning their services to the highest bidder. If you did a reverse auction for what you propose, then I'd say it would be more successful, but I imagine that sort of thing exists already. The likes of www.elance.com is used quite a bit for outsourced work in the IT industry. However when you have clients looking for developers to carry out work, and developers just bid on price, it tells the client nothing about the quality of the work they will get, when price is the only concern. This is what tends to happen quite a bit on such sites. Reputation is important, and is still the main reason why hiring trades people usually starts off by asking someone you know and trust if they can recommend a reputable trades person to carry out the job. I know straight away who I would be going to if I needed a trades person. Unfortunately right now I don't need them.

At the end of the day this is a custom web application and requires the assistance of a developer. I'm sure that someone will however suggest an open source CMS with a magic plugin that may cater for your needs. Whether or not this is the best approach is debateable.

I'd do some market research on your idea before getting in to the technical details of the project.

Pixelcraft · 31-07-2009 3:02pm

My name is URL wrote: »

and what the costs may be?

To take on ebay, you'll probably need a few million to invest. 500k+ for the site I would imagine.

If it's a smaller venture, you'll still need quite a lot of capital to start an auction site.

My name is URL · 31-07-2009 3:06pm

ontheway wrote: »

I'd do some market research on your idea before getting in to the technical details of the project.

Well there is tenderme.ie which is similar. I thought about the reverse auction thing but it could get messy with tradespeople undercutting each other and so on.

There would be a starting or reserve price for bids which the tradesman decides upon themselves so it would be up to them what they're willing to work for

I know it wouldn't be a saving grace for workers but it would be an extra option that's available to them should they wish to use it

pts · 31-07-2009 3:44pm

I think ontheway is right. The system you are talking about is a web application, with a website around it. A CMS would only be suitable to maintain "contact us", "FAQ" etc pages. At the core of the website is the auction system. That system would probably have to be designed and programmed my a professional, and would more than likely cost you a fair few quid to get done.

My name is URL · 31-07-2009 4:07pm

pts wrote: »

I think ontheway is right. The system you are talking about is a web application, with a website around it. A CMS would only be suitable to maintain "contact us", "FAQ" etc pages. At the core of the website is the auction system. That system would probably have to be designed and programmed my a professional, and would more than likely cost you a fair few quid to get done.

There are some auction software solutions available, I'd probably incorporate one of those on the site

ontheway · 31-07-2009 4:26pm

Yes it would cost a bit because the project requirements push it well in to the bounds of a web-based software development project. I am a web developer, with years experience as a software engineer and the amount of times I've come across people who think that because some system is accessed via the web, then it must be a website and if they pay a freelance web desiger a few hundred quid they'll be sound. Unfortunately that's not the case.

I also agree with many previous posters on this forum that there seems to be a general misconception as to what a CMS actually does and should be used for. OP I commend you for coming on to this forum and providing us with a more elaborate level of detail, but unfortunately what you propose cannot be classed as simply a "website". I know you know this already.

Ebay is not a website, it's an auctioning system and global market place presented via a web interface. Ebay could have been used via a desktop application that we all download, but for good design and maintenance reasons it was made available via a web interface. During the last 10 years a lot of enterprise software development projects have seen a shift from traditional desktop applications to web based systems. As the business world realised the potential of web2.0 and mass collaboration this really shifted even further. It's one of the reasons why I moved in to the field of web technologies in the first place.

TBH I sometimes wonder how long it will take for SMEs in this country to realise that there is a difference between plain 'ol websites and web based systems and plan their budgets accordingly. E.g. I was working on a fairly sizeable project (for the company I work for), and without going in to too much detail the project was worth tens of thousands, tending towards 6 figures. While in the pub I was in the company of a SME business owner chatting about what I did for a living and what I was working on. As the drinks flowed they told me that my days in the industry were numbered because there are now fella's all over the place that can deliver exactly what I do for €295 a pop and that the recession is going to put an end to all us types from ripping everyone off. TBH I don't think the guy was listening to me, he heard the word "web" and off he went and painted his own picture of what the work entailed.

At the end of the day I have to bite my tongue and realise that the field of web technologies (and software development to a lesser extent) is heavily misunderstood by a lot of people. I think the government could go a long way in helping SMEs in this country understand the use of technology in business, because so far all that I seem to see is ignorance breeding ignorance, price wars and millions being invested in the spread of buzzwords and further confusion. I think it's the likes of boards.ie and authorative blogs that hold the potential for positive change, but so far in a less desireable capacity IMO.

My name is URL · 31-07-2009 4:36pm

Ok well maybe I'm out of my depth for what is my first attempt at launching a site

I have the domain name bought now so has anyone got any tips on what would be a good 1st project?

ontheway · 31-07-2009 5:04pm

OP it depends on what level of detail you want to go in to. In order to do it right and depending on what you want to do, that domain you registered would be well expired before you got anywhere concrete. On the otherhand you could learn how to develop a static web site for yourself over a relatively short period of time.

My advice if you choose to go down this road...(take a look at www.w3schools.com)
DEVELOPER...
Don't use WYSIWYG editors, learn how to write code
Learn about web standards and standards compliant code practices
Understand the difference between design & development
Use (XHTML/HTML5) for content/structure and CSS for presentation
Learn to create cross browser sites
Understand On-Page Content SEO
Understand Usability/Navigation & Accessability

Then perhaps look at client side scripting using the likes of Javascript (and some nice libraries like jQuery/Moo/etc)
Once you have that nailed, then look at server side scripting with the likes of PHP and SQL for database queries. Look at various frameworks and design patterns for gettings this done. At this stage come back to us...

I am not a graphics designer, so I can't offer you any advice on creating fluffy web graphics other than Illustrator/Photoshop/Fireworks are your friend. Also if you want take a look at Flash (I'm personally not a huge fan of Flash because it tends to be used incorrectly in many places, not the fault of the technology, but more so the designers).

As for admnistration, there isn't a whole lot to it, other than being able to acquire domains (which you seem to be comfortable with), acquiring hosting, configuring & managing both. Then things like writing .htaccess rules on Apache or administering a MySQL database or the likes.

Also don't forget security at every step of the way!!! - Expect people to try and break in.

At this stage I'm really just fluffing over some tech terms that may come across and it would really depend on what you want to do. There are so many things to consider when doing this kind of thing, but don't try and do too much at the one time and you'll be grand.

Do some research yourself, there is no way anyone can just hand you a step by step tutorial on precisely everything you need to do to get yourself up and running. If I took a stab at it, I would probably end up giving you a book over a thousand pages long.

...speaking of which, this post is getting rather long.

My name is URL · 31-07-2009 5:24pm

Thanks for the tips ontheway

The domain is bidd.ie so it won't really fit a site that isn't auction based!

I may have jumped the gun on registering it =p

Some advice please

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