Saab to be bought by Koenigsegg

Mini_Moose · 11-06-2009 09:55PM #1

This is being reported in the Swedish news.

Not sure this will be a good thing for either company but lets hope that Koenigsegg can give help them bring out some good new cars!

Luke Crowley · 11-06-2009 09:58PM

Good in theory at least, if Saab go back to being all-Swedish, maybe future Saabs will be more like the Saabs of old, before GM messed everything up.

Guy:Incognito · 11-06-2009 10:00PM

Do Koenigsegg do something other than make 1 car? I assume they either do or their owner is very rich?

Mini_Moose · 11-06-2009 10:04PM

Well they have a few different models but they are effectively different versions of the same car.

The main owner isn't that rich but a Norwegian investor is reportedly putting up the money

Mycroft H · 11-06-2009 10:12PM

Savage! Back to the mad old days of the 900 turbo.

Will this have any impact on supply of spare parts? Ie will you still be able to get parts for the 9000 and 9-5 for example?

colm_mcm · 11-06-2009 10:35PM

Mini_Moose wrote: »

Well they have a few different models but they are effectively different versions of the same car.

as opposed to Saab......

mumblin deaf ro · 11-06-2009 10:44PM

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5gipbD_h1BFQfUosnT4mbq9ePCO6w

good timing as i pick this up on saturday

http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C95530/

Mycroft H · 11-06-2009 11:00PM

http://www.reuters.com/article/innovationNews/idUSTRE55A3Z020090611

The deal seems to have been finalised or quite near.

Just in time too, my da bought a spotless 95 today.

niceirishfella · 11-06-2009 11:02PM

good news, they need to get away from the whole GM/Fiat parts bin.

Caliden · 11-06-2009 11:04PM

A good looking saab in the pipeline perhaps?

unkel · 11-06-2009 11:09PM

Luke Crowley wrote: »

Good in theory at least, if Saab go back to being all-Swedish, maybe future Saabs will be more like the Saabs of old, before GM messed everything up.

+1

My hopes are high!

mumblin deaf ro · 11-06-2009 11:12PM

Christian Von Koenigsegg is certainly ambitious - he's only 36 and started the company when he was 22!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_von_Koenigsegg

colm_mcm · 11-06-2009 11:19PM

Building a successful mainstream car from scratch (a full lineup of cars is required for Saab) on your own is next to impossible, I'd expect one of 2 things:

They start to build low volume, premium cars

They will tie in with another manufacturer and use a platform for their own mainstream car.

unkel · 11-06-2009 11:46PM

colm_mcm wrote: »

Building a successful mainstream car from scratch (a full lineup of cars is required for Saab) on your own is next to impossible, I'd expect one of 2 things:

They start to build low volume, premium cars

They will tie in with another manufacturer and use a platform for their own mainstream car.

Agreed except that I don't think Saab needs a full lineup of cars to stay mainstream. I'd say one platform with two cars (as is) will suffice

Maybe they should try and use the Ford Mondeo (EUCD) platform? Or even a RWD platform? :cool:

bazz26 · 11-06-2009 11:47PM

I think this is good news.

At the very least it is worthy of trying if it keeps Saab going for the interim anyway. They cannot do worse than what GM did anyways imo.

Saabs might now gain decent handling again.

mumblin deaf ro · 11-06-2009 11:50PM

Saab have an excellent AWD drive system and could consider that. New 9-5 and 9-3 already in the pipeline based on the GM platform so don't expect a radical departure just yet - 9-4x SUV due for next year too.

bazz26 · 11-06-2009 11:53PM

The new 9-5 was already at an advanced state before GM dropped the brand. I would imagine it would be easy enough to use a shortened version of that same platform for the next 9-3.

Even though they had links through GM to Subaru, maybe they could continue to use their diesel engines at least. Though for petrol however they at least need to be looking at sourcing a proper 6 cylinder.

niceirishfella · 11-06-2009 11:56PM

Wonder will they rebrand Koenigsaab? lol

colm_mcm · 11-06-2009 11:56PM

the Saab XWD system will be also used on other non Saab cars, AFAIK Haldex have the rights to the system.

mumblin deaf ro · 12-06-2009 08:15AM

Personally I think they should just make one great car and build from there. The 900 kept them going for about 14 years and i reckon a lot of the residual interest in Saab among buyers dates back to that era.

The_Conductor · 12-06-2009 08:52AM

They're not going to build a new range from scratch. Koenigsegg has a long standing arrangement with Volvo to use their development and test facilities- and before he developed his own engine- used V8s made by Ford.

The current rumour is that Ford are desperately trying to offload Volvo- but the main group interested (Geely- a Chinese holding company), were less than enthused when they examined the books (4 companies have conducted due diligence on Volvo year-to-date).

Volvo AG (the holding company who offloaded Volvo to Ford back in the late 90s for nearly 7 billion)- are said to be interested in certain parts of Saab- particularly its developement works for its consumer aviation wing- which has a massive cross-over with its own business, but the current proported price tag is a sticking point.

A Norwegian investment fund (government owned) is willing to stump the cash needed to make the deal work ($2 billion in cash for Volvo + technology transfer + parts inventory & access to distribution network) merging it into Koenigsegg and Saab- and offloading the civilian and military aviation wing into Volvo AG.

Saab- meanwhile has outstanding debts to GM of about $1.3 billion and another loan from the EIB of $625million- which is why the Swedish government have refused to support it (any cash they put towards it- would simply vanish like a puff of smoke). GM would agree to accept to write off its debt- in return to be rid of its troubled child- Koenigsegg gets access to volume production (relatively speaking anyway- he was building less than 30 cars per annum up to now), an asset to sell (the aviation wing), a distribution network and developmental partner (Volvo)- and a lot of consolidation in the Swedish automobile sector- funded by Norwegian government funds (which are cheaper than further EIB borrowing- and despite their historical differences- more politically acceptable to the Swedes.

Volvo cars are seen as important to this- from a few different perspectives- they would continue to access to a slimmed down Ford distribution network, parts and inventory bin (it is assumed the common platforms would continue to be used for the next 2 iterations), and very importantly- they are seen to have in particular electric technology in the wings which would marry very well with Saabs future tech (god only knows what Koenigsegg would want with it though).

:-) Interesting times......

Playing hardball just might work out for the Swedish government on this one.......

godtabh · 12-06-2009 09:36AM

niceirishfella wrote: »

good news, they need to get away from the whole Fiat parts bin.

The Fiat diesel is a very good engine

mumblin deaf ro · 12-06-2009 09:50AM

I think the avaiation wing of Saab is already a separate company, although i could be wrong. Koenigsegg has already said that it thinks the new 9-5 is a good car, but could be made much better by some minor tweaks, so maybe it's not too late for their input. Given the slow rate that Saab introduces new models, they may as well get stuck in right away, as it could be years before we get a pure Koenigsegg/Saab car.

pburns · 12-06-2009 11:08AM

Sounds...interesting...

What are the traditional componants of Saabs DNA though? What makes a Saab a Saab? To me:

- Quirky styling
- Steep windscreen, ignition in centre console(?)
- Hatchbacks
- Utilitarian
- Turbocharging
- FWD (AWD OK, was there ever a RWD Saab though?)

I'm sure there are other factors and this 'heritage' should only be a starting point. Thing is I think in this economically-chastened, environmentally aware world there is a place for a prestige car brand that is not German and aggressive and obsessed with lapping the 'Ring...

mumblin deaf ro · 12-06-2009 12:12PM

Spot on Pburns.

Mycroft H · 12-06-2009 01:21PM

pburns wrote: »

Sounds...interesting...

What are the traditional componants of Saabs DNA though? What makes a Saab a Saab? To me:

- Quirky styling
- Steep windscreen, ignition in centre console(?)
- Hatchbacks
- Utilitarian
- Turbocharging
- FWD (AWD OK, was there ever a RWD Saab though?)

I'm sure there are other factors and this 'heritage' should only be a starting point. Thing is I think in this economically-chastened, environmentally aware world there is a place for a prestige car brand that is not German and aggressive and obsessed with lapping the 'Ring...

Add a dash like a cockpit aswell.

And the nicest seats of any cars

And one of the safest cars on the road

unkel · 12-06-2009 01:57PM

pburns wrote: »

there is a place for a prestige car brand that is not German and aggressive and obsessed with lapping the 'Ring...

+1

They should learn to walk before they can run though. Saab never was a prestige brand, but they were in between the plain janes (Mondeo, Vectra, Avensis, etc. ) and prestige. A few steps ahead of Volvo. Because of that they could command a premium over these bog standard cars

This "semi-prestige" position has nearly completely eroded over the past 15+ years under GM. First step is to get right back in where they were in their glory days (80s) with a deserving car. If they can do it, they'll be on to a winner.

niceirishfella · 12-06-2009 02:11PM

kearnsr wrote: »

The Fiat diesel is a very good engine

not in my experience.

niceirishfella · 12-06-2009 02:14PM

unkel wrote: »

First step is to get right back in where they were in their glory days (80s) with a deserving car. If they can do it, they'll be on to a winner.

Your clearly not a marketeer Unkel.
This is completely wrong. Then they'd be bringing coal to newcastle so as to speak.

Saab Ed · 12-06-2009 02:26PM

unkel wrote: »

+1

They should learn to walk before they can run though. Saab never was a prestige brand, but they were in between the plain janes (Mondeo, Vectra, Avensis, etc. ) and prestige. A few steps ahead of Volvo. Because of that they could command a premium over these bog standard cars

This "semi-prestige" position has nearly completely eroded over the past 15+ years under GM. First step is to get right back in where they were in their glory days (80s) with a deserving car. If they can do it, they'll be on to a winner.

Its funny you should bring that up how cars these days come from " Premium" or " Non premium " brands. BMW, Audi, Merc versus Ford, Opel, Toyota etc. Why oh why is the world so obsessed with so called premium sport saloons. Back in the good old days we had choice. Boggo cars i.e Cortinas and 131's , Quality cars like Saabs and Volvos, Premium cars like Mercs, Sports saloons like 3 series and Alfas.....Even barges from ordinary brands like Granadas and Omegas. Now everybody wants to be the same.C -Class / 3 Series / A4... all the same, An Audi 80 used to be a quality car ( ordinary everyday car for a man who wanted superior build quality) , a 190E a premium car ( for someone to stand above the crowd in a world of ordinary and pay a premium for it) and a 3 series was a sport saloon ( sporting credentials such as firmer ride and rear wheel drive and poised chassis ) Why in the name of Jayzuz did the world decide it wanted a Cortina with some nice plastic but priced more than a high spec Granada!!!!.......I will never understand it.

niceirishfella · 12-06-2009 02:30PM

Saab lost their way a lobg time ago.
Even Dentists stopped buying them and moved over to Lexus's!

Saab to be bought by Koenigsegg

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