Ferguson vs Benitez thread

SlickRic · 21-04-2009 12:05PM

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Ferguson;..."They are hurt by it."..

trying to convince himself I see, seen as nobody's buying it apart from the most biased of utd fans.

Highsider · 21-04-2009 12:49PM

Ferguson..."they are hurt by it" :rolleyes:
Yeah i must have missed the press conference where Rafa was in tears because of the things ferguson has said. Lol

monkey9 · 21-04-2009 01:16PM

Jesus, what a weak response from Ferguson. He said what he said for whatever reason, he knew full well that Rafa's gesture wasn't what he implied it was, Allardyce just basically lied about knocking Rafa's door down for an explanation.
Ferguson isn't going go back on what he said now anyway. He's better off not saying anything because he's just embarrassing himself more and more.

"They're hurt" Ha ha!!!! What does that even mean?? I thought he was the master of the 'mind games'. Ha!!

It was a good move putting Sammy in the press conference yesterday. He made his points well and came across well. No point Rafa creating headlines before the match tonight.

If we were to beat Arsenal tonight, then i'm sure Rafa will say something about it after the match to Sky or whatever that will be in the papers tomorrow and will just add that bit more pressure on Utd in the build up to the Pompey game

SlickRic · 21-04-2009 01:24PM

monkey9 wrote: »

It was a good move putting Sammy in the press conference yesterday.

i think saying it was a 'good' move is an understatement quite frankly. it shows, quite definitively, how calm rafa in fact is about this whole thing.

it's also an indication that he's true to his word. he is focused on one thing, and one thing only.

and perhaps, even more definitively, it's allowing everyone see who it is that in fact is the 'arrogant' one between himself and Fergie.

well played Rafa.

and as monkey said, if we win he'll no doubt mention it. and i've all the faith in the world that he'll allude to it just enough to put the pressure on to a sufficient degree for tomorrow night.

Karmafaerie · 21-04-2009 01:29PM

And even if we loose or draw, Rafa'll still talk to the press afterwards.

SlickRic · 21-04-2009 01:31PM

Karmafaerie wrote: »

And even if we loose or draw, Rafa'll still talk to the press afterwards.

he will, and he'll be calm about it i'm sure. he'll just say 'we're doing our own thing' or something to that effect.

CoachBoone · 21-04-2009 01:36PM

Highsider wrote: »

Ferguson..."they are hurt by it" :rolleyes:
Yeah i must have missed the press conference where Rafa was in tears because of the things ferguson has said. Lol

He didnt actually say "they are hurt by it" now in fairness. What actually happened was

Reporter: So you don't believe them (referring to Sammy Lee's explanation)?

Ferguson: I didnt say that.

Reporter: Because they are quite hurt by it.

Ferguson: Im sure they are. ( in a semi sarcastic tone)

I think the media is blowing this waaaaay out of proportion. I agree he shouldnt have said anything about the whole ambigous shuffle but now it seems like pool fans and the press are taking it to a whole new level.

Much like the rafas cracking up thing that pool fans were complaining about a while ago.

Karmafaerie · 21-04-2009 01:40PM

CoachBoone wrote: »

He didnt actually say "they are hurt by it" now in fairness. What actually happened was

Reporter: So you don't believe them (referring to Sammy Lee's explanation)?

Ferguson: I didnt say that.

Reporter: Because they are quite hurt by it.

Ferguson: Im sure they are. ( in a semi sarcastic tone)

I think the media is blowing this waaaaay out of proportion. I agree he shouldnt have said anything about the whole ambigous shuffle but now it seems like pool fans and the press are taking it to a whole new level.

Much like the rafas cracking up thing that pool fans were complaining about a while ago.

And do you think that maybe, just maybe, the reason that Liverpool fans are reacting this way, is solely down to the way that UTD fans reacted after the "rant"?!!

CoachBoone · 21-04-2009 01:42PM

Karmafaerie wrote: »

And do you think that maybe, just maybe, the reason that Liverpool fans are reacting this way, is solely down to the way that UTD fans reacted after the "rant"?!!

Im quite sure it is. But jesus christ is that not ridiculously childish?

"he did it first"

ffs

SlickRic · 21-04-2009 01:44PM

CoachBoone wrote: »

He didnt actually say "they are hurt by it" now in fairness. What actually happened was

Reporter: So you don't believe them (referring to Sammy Lee's explanation)?

Ferguson: I didnt say that.

Reporter: Because they are quite hurt by it.

Ferguson: Im sure they are. ( in a semi sarcastic tone)

I think the media is blowing this waaaaay out of proportion.

if what you say above is true, then yes, our reactions are obviously a bit OTT in terms of this specific interview by Ferguson.

but in this case Ferguson only has himself to blame. his attack on Rafa was pathetic, and the media didn't have to blow anything out of proportion. it's there on audio and in black and white.

so no, still no defending Fergie on this one.

CoachBoone · 21-04-2009 01:50PM

SlickRic wrote: »

if what you say above is true, then yes, our reactions are obviously a bit OTT in terms of this specific interview by Ferguson.

but in this case Ferguson only has himself to blame. his attack on Rafa was pathetic, and the media didn't have to blow anything out of proportion. it's there on audio and in black and white.

so no, still no defending Fergie on this one.

Its actually on the sky website in a video so its there in audio, picture and full colour right beside the sensational report written by some socially retarded journalist.

We could say the same about Rafa's pathetic fact sheet? I think both sides are wrong/were wrong.

We could go further back and say well...fergie said this before that, but then rafa said this before that, but but fergie said this which started it all.

Jesus fúcking christ.

The duplo is in the corner beside the jigsaws, now make yourselves busy kids.

Karmafaerie · 21-04-2009 01:54PM

CoachBoone wrote: »

Im quite sure it is. But jesus christ is that not ridiculously childish?

"he did it first"

ffs

Yes everything is childish.
And you're joining in.

All the posts in here sying this is childish are really annoying.

Guess what, if you don't want to read it, don't.

Posting that this is childish.
Is childish!

SlickRic · 21-04-2009 02:02PM

CoachBoone wrote: »

Its actually on the sky website in a video so its there in audio, picture and full colour right beside the sensational report written by some socially retarded journalist.

We could say the same about Rafa's pathetic fact sheet? I think both sides are wrong/were wrong.

We could go further back and say well...fergie said this before that, but then rafa said this before that, but but fergie said this which started it all.

Jesus fúcking christ.

The duplo is in the corner beside the jigsaws, now make yourselves busy kids.

i don't care who started it.

i'm talking about how ferguson has handled himself in this instance, and in my view it's been in a pathetic, bullying manner.

rafa's fact sheet was not advisable imo, but it was very different. the agenda wasn't to bully and slander someone's integrity. the agenda was to set out the facts as he saw them in terms of referees and fixture schedules, after ferguson had talked about Liverpool in the press. he didn't attack ferguson's integrity as a sportsman, and get other bosses to join in with him. he questioned how utd are treated by football authorities, and how ferguson can claim the things he was claiming as a result.

but this is all in the past and has been dealt with.

ferguson's behaviour should not just be swept under the carpet because 'Rafa did it first' etc. utd fans on here were laughing at the perceived 'cracking up' of Rafa, weren't complaining of the subsequent sensationalising by the media, and didn't allow that sensationalising stop them from analysing, questioning and often attacking Rafa's behaviour.

the same rules should apply to ferguson thanks.

CoachBoone · 21-04-2009 02:06PM

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Yes everything is childish.
And you're joining in.

All the posts in here sying this is childish are really annoying.

Guess what, if you don't want to read it, don't.

Posting that this is childish.
Is childish!

Because I wont relent and bow to your viewpoint is what is really annoying you. If I said "fergies a wanker, i think rafa is god and Im a united fan" you'd leave this thread with a smug shít eating grin on your face.

All Ive done is presented facts. The childish ones are the people jumping on a bandwagon of Fergie hate not even acknowledging what really happened.

This thread is childish, annoying as it may be to your sensitivites, it is. It has been called so by many reasonable people and posters. Childish on BOTH sides.

How is posting "that is childish" childish? Im not trying to get one over on anyone like all the fans in here? Im not coming in here slating either manager? I havent had a go at any set of fans individually?

Your answer doesnt really matter anyway as Im not bothered getting into an argument about how I am or am not childish.

CoachBoone · 21-04-2009 02:09PM

SlickRic wrote: »

i don't care who started it.

i'm talking about how ferguson has handled himself in this instance, and in my view it's been in a pathetic, bullying manner.

rafa's fact sheet was not advisable imo, but it was very different. the agenda wasn't to bully and slander someone's integrity. the agenda was to set out the facts as he saw them in terms of referees and fixture schedules, after ferguson had talked about Liverpool in the press. he didn't attack ferguson's integrity as a sportsman, and get other bosses to join in with him. he questioned how utd are treated by football authorities, and how ferguson can claim the things he was claiming as a result.

but this is all in the past and has been dealt with.

ferguson's behaviour should not just be swept under the carpet because 'Rafa did it first' etc. utd fans on here were laughing at the perceived 'cracking up' of Rafa, weren't complaining of the subsequent sensationalising by the media, and didn't allow that sensationalising stop them from analysing, questioning and often attacking Rafa's behaviour.

the same rules should apply to ferguson thanks.

I agree with all of what you are saying. Preaching to the choir.

In saying that, two wrong dont make a right. Would it not be more advisable for 'pool fans to take the higher road here and let fergie say what he wants much like I would have liked United fans to respond to Rafa's fact sheet.

Reasonable people will have their own opinion and the biased fans views wont be changed so this whole argument is a bit pointless.

The culture of oneupmanship between fans is great banter but not when it comes to something as ridiculous as managers personal vendetta's.

~Rebel~ · 21-04-2009 02:09PM

CoachBoone wrote: »

shít eating grin on your face.

I've never understood this phrase. Who grins while eating shit?!

monkey9 · 21-04-2009 02:11PM

~Rebel~ wrote: »

I've never understood this phrase. Who grins while eating shit?!

Maybe it's more a grimace thing or something?

SlickRic · 21-04-2009 02:14PM

CoachBoone wrote: »

Reasonable people will have their own opinion and the biased fans views wont be changed so this whole argument is a bit pointless.

i agree unreservedly.

it's not a personal thing for me, because at the end of the day it's just a prelude to what actually matters, the games.

i just see it as a bit of banter myself. what i take issue with is when utd posters get uppity about people making an issue of it if they want to, when they did the very same thing themselves months ago.

at the end of the day, we probably all just need to relax a bit :pac:

Karmafaerie · 21-04-2009 02:21PM

CoachBoone wrote: »

Because I wont relent and bow to your viewpoint is what is really annoying you. If I said "fergies a wanker, i think rafa is god and Im a united fan" you'd leave this thread with a smug shít eating grin on your face.

All Ive done is presented facts. The childish ones are the people jumping on a bandwagon of Fergie hate not even acknowledging what really happened.

This thread is childish, annoying as it may be to your sensitivites, it is. It has been called so by many reasonable people and posters. Childish on BOTH sides.

How is posting "that is childish" childish? Im not trying to get one over on anyone like all the fans in here? Im not coming in here slating either manager? I havent had a go at any set of fans individually?

Your answer doesnt really matter anyway as Im not bothered getting into an argument about how I am or am not childish.

Why would I be happy if you agreed with me.
You don't even know what I think, but you know I'd be happy if you agreed with me.

I want one thing.
Fair treatment from and for all parties.

Is it childish of me to want Rafa to get the same treatment as Fergie, and visa versa?

Is it childish of me to find it ridiculous that the same UTD fans who called Rafa borderline insane, and posted pictures of him in a straight jacket, now get offended with the suggestion that Fergie made a mistake?

Is it childish of me to find it offensive when UTD fans come into this thread, calling Torres a ladyboy, implying that I'm the same, and then post pictures of Mannuel as Rafa?

Is it childish of me to get annoyed at the blatent attempts by one or two UTD fans in this thread to get somebody banned, or the thread closed, as the weren't happy with it?

No, it's not childish.
It's perfectly reasonable.

I reffered to Ferguson as "whiskey nose" (wrongly) a few days ago.
I didn't mean anything malicious by it, but can see it was wrong.
I was simply saying that Fergies attempt at mind games has cacused him to fall on his face.
That's all Ive said all along.

Since then, I've had to sit here and endure some (obviously not all) posters insulting me, Liverpool players, Liverpools manager, and in homophobic and racialy steryeotyping ways no less.

But I've never gotten mad, or petty, and instead have just reported my oppinion on the matter.

And what happens?
Somebody comes in, and states that the very fact that I'm postin in here means I'm childish.
And that all I want is for you to agree with me.
I couldn't care less if you agree with me.

I came in here to see what the UTD supporters would have to say.
And unfortunately (with a few exceptions), I haven't been surprised.

Mr. Frost · 21-04-2009 02:22PM

Karmafaerie wrote: »

And even if we loose or draw, Rafa'll still talk to the press afterwards.

Of course. He loves an opportunity to talk about the champions.

Karmafaerie · 21-04-2009 02:25PM

Mr. Frost wrote: »

Of course. He loves an opportunity to talk about the champions.

Why wouldn't a manager talk about his own squad?;)

BaZmO* · 21-04-2009 02:26PM

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Is it childish of me to want Rafa to get the same treatment as Fergie, and visa versa?

Is it childish of me to find it ridiculous that the same UTD fans who called Rafa borderline insane, and posted pictures of him in a straight jacket, now get offended with the suggestion that Fergie made a mistake?

Is it childish of me to find it offensive when UTD fans come into this thread, calling Torres a ladyboy, implying that I'm the same, and then post pictures of Mannuel as Rafa?

Is it childish of me to get annoyed at the blatent attempts by one or two UTD fans in this thread to get somebody banned, or the thread closed, as the weren't happy with it?

Yes to all of the above. The main reason that all these people that you are so gallantly defending are not close friends or family.

It's one of the things in life that I really don't get. Why do people insist on getting offended on behalf of others?

Karmafaerie · 21-04-2009 02:27PM

BaZmO* wrote: »

Yes to all of the above. The main reason that all these people that you are so gallantly defending are not close friends or family.

It's one of the things in life that I really don't get. Why do people insist on getting offended on behalf of others?

Not my close friend or family?!

You did read the part where I said that it was suggested I was a ladyboy right?

CoachBoone · 21-04-2009 02:33PM

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Why would I be happy if you agreed with me.
You don't even know what I think, but you know I'd be happy if you agreed with me.

I want one thing.
Fair treatment from and for all parties.

Is it childish of me to want Rafa to get the same treatment as Fergie, and visa versa?

Is it childish of me to find it ridiculous that the same UTD fans who called Rafa borderline insane, and posted pictures of him in a straight jacket, now get offended with the suggestion that Fergie made a mistake?

Is it childish of me to find it offensive when UTD fans come into this thread, calling Torres a ladyboy, implying that I'm the same, and then post pictures of Mannuel as Rafa?

Is it childish of me to get annoyed at the blatent attempts by one or two UTD fans in this thread to get somebody banned, or the thread closed, as the weren't happy with it?

No, it's not childish.
It's perfectly reasonable.

I reffered to Ferguson as "whiskey nose" (wrongly) a few days ago.
I didn't mean anything malicious by it, but can see it was wrong.
I was simply saying that Fergies attempt at mind games has cacused him to fall on his face.
That's all Ive said all along.

Since then, I've had to sit here and endure some (obviously not all) posters insulting me, Liverpool players, Liverpools manager, and in homophobic and racialy steryeotyping ways no less.

But I've never gotten mad, or petty, and instead have just reported my oppinion on the matter.

And what happens?
Somebody comes in, and states that the very fact that I'm postin in here means I'm childish.
And that all I want is for you to agree with me.
I couldn't care less if you agree with me.

I came in here to see what the UTD supporters would have to say.
And unfortunately (with a few exceptions), I haven't been surprised.

Your missing my point completely. The fact that you want equality is fine. I agree with that.

The way in which you think equality is achieved " by having a go at fergie cos united fans had a go at rafa" is what is childish.

Fair treatment is all well and good but when the fair treatment is used as a cover to just have a pop at a club, its manager and fans then it becomes a farce.

again, this goes for both sides.

BaZmO* · 21-04-2009 02:42PM

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Not my close friend or family?!

You did read the part where I said that it was suggested I was a ladyboy right?

Suggested, implied or actually said?

You are of course entitled to get offended if someone tries to sully your good name, but to get offended on behalf of somebody else?

Karmafaerie · 21-04-2009 02:42PM

CoachBoone wrote: »

Your missing my point completely. The fact that you want equality is fine. I agree with that.

The way in which you think equality is achieved " by having a go at fergie cos united fans had a go at rafa" is what is childish.

Fair treatment is all well and good but when the fair treatment is used as a cover to just have a pop at a club, its manager and fans then it becomes a farce.

again, this goes for both sides.

Please look back over the thread and see where I had a go at Fergie.

I said that Fergies attempt messed up.
And I said that it seems Fergie tried to bully Rafa in conjunction with Allardyce.

I've never gloated, or insulted Fergie.
I've never tried to shove my oppinion down somebody elses throat.

I agree with what you said about getting personal or using this as an excuse to slag off another club.
I simply said that (some, and to be honest it was a lot of) UTD fans went to such extremes of insults and unbridled slagging, that I can see why some Liverpool fans would get as bad at the first chance to strike back.

I haven't and the vast majority in here haven't.

To be honest we've been a bit shocked with the level of defense from one or two posters, and the bad way they went about doing so.

CoachBoone · 21-04-2009 02:47PM

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Please look back over the thread and see where I had a go at Fergie.

I said that Fergies attempt messed up.
And I said that it seems Fergie tried to bully Rafa in conjunction with Allardyce.

I've never gloated, or insulted Fergie.
I've never tried to shove my oppinion down somebody elses throat.

I agree with what you said about getting personal or using this as an excuse to slag off another club.
I simply said that (some, and to be honest it was a lot of) UTD fans went to such extremes of insults and unbridled slagging, that I can see why some Liverpool fans would get as bad at the first chance to strike back.

I haven't and the vast majority in here haven't.

To be honest we've been a bit shocked with the level of defense from one or two posters, and the bad way they went about doing so.

Please look back over the thread and see where I said you specifically were childish.

The rest I agree with except I can't understand why a person who doesnt like something been done to them would do it to someone else. "a taste of your own medicine" is not the way forward, it is childish.

Karmafaerie · 21-04-2009 02:47PM

BaZmO* wrote: »

Suggested, implied or actually said?

You are of course entitled to get offended if someone tries to sully your good name, but to get offended on behalf of somebody else?

The post was deleted, along with those that led up to it.
Better left that way.

I'm a sports fan, and I do take Liverpool way too seriously at times.
I'm also a very argumentative person, and I find it hard to take when one group are held to one set of rules, while another are held to a different set.

Over this thread there was a lot of that.

More than anything else, myself and other Liverpool fans have found this whole thing funny.

It's a nice distraction for a week with no football.

Karmafaerie · 21-04-2009 02:53PM

CoachBoone wrote: »

Please look back over the thread and see where I said you specifically were childish.

The rest I agree with except I can't understand why a person who doesnt like something been done to them would do it to someone else. "a taste of your own medicine" is not the way forward, it is childish.

You call it childish, others call it human nature.
Just because it's something that I wouldn't do, doesn't mean I'll dismiss it as childish.

If you annoy somebody enough, they will bite back.
A lot of Liverpool fans have endured months of Rafa's cracked jibes, especially those with a lot of UTD friends.

If they did go overboard this last week, I don't agree with them, and I wouldn't do it myself, but I wouldn't write it off as childish and ignore the root cause.

If somebody is being childish, do you think that numerous poeple coming in calling them childish helps anything?

CoachBoone · 21-04-2009 03:02PM

Karmafaerie wrote: »

If somebody is being childish, do you think that numerous poeple coming in calling them childish helps anything?

If somebody is being mature, do you think that numerous poeple coming in calling them mature helps anything?

If somebody is being angry, do you think that numerous poeple coming in calling them angry helps anything?

If somebody is being pathetic, do you think that numerous poeple coming in calling them pathetic helps anything?

If somebody is unhappy, do you think that numerous poeple coming in calling them unhappy helps anything?

Yes to ALL of the above. Well at least for normal, emotionally stable people anyway.

Ferguson vs Benitez thread

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