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'Opposition to gay marriage' cost contestant Miss USA title

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    #32
    corkkaz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭corkkaz


    nevershutsup wrote: »
    she got asked the question when she chose judge number 8 out of a bowl for her random question that corresponded to perez hiltons panel number. perez himself is gay and it was topical because vermont became the fourth state to legalise same-sex marraige. she answered the question badly.

    think she got booed too!!!

    I dont agree with her but I think her honesty and her opinions should not have been thrown at her in such a negative way.


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    #33
    Sabre0001
    Registered Users Posts: 7,499 ✭✭✭Sabre0001


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XMvviFbkf0

    🤪



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    #34
    ibarelycare
    Registered Users Posts: 58,456 ✭✭✭✭ibarelycare


    Although I disagree with the girl's views, I think the backlash is completely unfair. Who's to say whether her answer is wrong or right? It's an opinion. If she had said she was all FOR gay marriage then there would be people from the opposite side complaining :rolleyes:

    I think fair play to her for speaking about what she believes in and not conforming to the beliefs of the judges and the audience.


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    #35
    cotwold
    Registered Users Posts: 950 ✭✭✭cotwold


    Sharpshooter wrote: »
    Live and let live I say, that's the way I was raised.

    A comment like that simply defends her attitude. If you hadn't been raised that way you're implying you might just as easily deny gay marriage on the same basis. The most insulting aspect of Miss California's comments in my opinion was that her opinion was hers because 'that was the way she was raised'. Why cant people make up their own mind, they're not expressing their opinions, theyre expressing their parents.


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    #36
    0ubliette
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,643 ✭✭✭0ubliette


    Shes just as entitled to say she doesnt support gay marriage as anyone else is entitled to say they do support it. And if she lost because she doesnt support it thats discrimination in itself, essentially saying 'you need to be in line with this specific point of view or you wont win'.


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    #37
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    Equal rights, is equal rights for all. She just got clearly discriminated against because of her views. I respect her more for speaking her mind, too many people are afraid to do so these days for fear of upsetting someone or being politically-incorrect.


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    #38
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    I'm glad that she stood up for her opinions, and didn't succumb to public pressure. It's not bigoted to disagree with a particular structure of marriage, many people have objections to this. It's another sign basically of discrimination for your views. I'm sure there would be outrage if someone said "I'm gay and I'm all for it" and they lost. It would be clear homophobia, but still what's the difference between discriminating this woman for her views, and discriminating another for their sexuality.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/09/AR2009040904063.html

    ^^ In many situations peoples rights to freedom of speech are being curbed over this issue, and I think people in the US need to speak out against it.


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    #39
    Irishcrx
    Registered Users Posts: 2,861 ✭✭✭Irishcrx


    I'm not against people being themselfs, so I have no problem with people being gay if they cannot help it but I don't believe it is natural if it was we would all be extinct. I do believe the bible (If people believe in that) outlawed homosexuality therefore making it a sin, so why would gay people get married if it is totally against the church and who is a government to decide that.

    If they want the tax relief fine, give it to them but don't call it marriage change it to something else and keep everybody happy.


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    #40
    Sharpshooter
    Registered Users Posts: 31,859 ✭✭✭✭Sharpshooter


    cotwold wrote: »
    A comment like that simply defends her attitude. If you hadn't been raised that way you're implying you might just as easily deny gay marriage on the same basis. The most insulting aspect of Miss California's comments in my opinion was that her opinion was hers because 'that was the way she was raised'. Why cant people make up their own mind, they're not expressing their opinions, theyre expressing their parents.

    I said I was raised to live and let live.

    Which meant I was raised to live my life in the way I choose and let others do the same.

    So in case you need it put another way, I was raised not to judge people for their choice of lifestyle.

    How does that defend her attitude?


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    #41
    Sleipnir
    Registered Users Posts: 5,514 ✭✭✭Sleipnir


    0ubliette wrote: »
    Shes just as entitled to say she doesnt support gay marriage as anyone else is entitled to say they do support it. And if she lost because she doesnt support it thats discrimination in itself, essentially saying 'you need to be in line with this specific point of view or you wont win'.

    +1 to that. "What, you say the jews are human? You can't have an opinion like that! Change your views immediately.


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    #42
    ibarelycare
    Registered Users Posts: 58,456 ✭✭✭✭ibarelycare


    Irishcrx wrote: »
    I'm not against people being themselfs, so I have no problem with people being gay if they cannot help it but I don't believe it is natural if it was we would all be extinct. I do believe the bible (If people believe in that) outlawed homosexuality therefore making it a sin, so why would gay people get married if it is totally against the church and who is a government to decide that.

    If they want the tax relief fine, give it to them but don't call it marriage change it to something else and keep everybody happy.



    The bible also states that sex before marriage is a sin....so should people who do this be getting married if it goes against the church?

    Marriage isn't necessarily a relgious union.


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    #43
    Sleipnir
    Registered Users Posts: 5,514 ✭✭✭Sleipnir


    Sharpshooter wrote: »
    I said I was raised to live and let live.

    Which meant I was raised to live my life in the way I choose and let others do the same.
    So in case you need it put another way, I was raised not to judge people for their choice of lifestyle.

    How does that defend her attitude?

    Because you're forcing the views of your own upbringing on her.

    "I was brought up to believe in live and let live. Therefore, you should also believe in live and let live.


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    #44
    cotwold
    Registered Users Posts: 950 ✭✭✭cotwold


    Sharpshooter wrote: »
    I said I was raised to live and let live.

    Which meant I was raised to live my life in the way I choose and let others do the same.

    So in case you need it put another way, I was raised not to judge people for their choice of lifestyle.

    How does that defend her attitude?

    I'm not trying to attack you so sorry if it came across like that. however im saying that using your upbringing to justify your current attitudes isn't necessarily positive, yeah it's great in your case where you've a positive out look but in the case on Miss California she's hiding behind the same justification. "the way i was raised". I just don't think its a positive way of thinking.


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    #45
    Sharpshooter
    Registered Users Posts: 31,859 ✭✭✭✭Sharpshooter


    Sleipnir wrote: »
    Because you're forcing the views of your own upbringing on her.

    "I was brought up to believe in live and let live. Therefore, you should also believe in live and let live.

    I was speaking of my upbringing, I live and let live.

    Which also means I don't judge her for her opinions.
    What are you not getting in that answer?


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    #46
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    cotwold wrote: »
    I'm not trying to attack you so sorry if it came across like that. however im saying that using your upbringing to justify your current attitudes isn't necessarily positive, yeah it's great in your case where you've a positive out look but in the case on Miss California she's hiding behind the same justification. "the way i was raised". I just don't think its a positive way of thinking.

    Everyone's formative years and upbringing have an effect on their own personality and viewpoints. Like it or not. You might not always agree with your parents or guardians, but that does not mean that how they raised you does not shape your own, even if differing, opinions.

    Nobody's opinions are formed in a vacuum. The world around us shapes who we are and what we think. So it's just as legitimate to say your upbringing resulted in your opinion, than TV and the media shaped your opinions, or friends, or posts on Boards. Frankly it's better to have the people who raised you from the time you were born have the greatest influence on you.


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    #47
    cotwold
    Registered Users Posts: 950 ✭✭✭cotwold


    Sharpshooter wrote: »
    I was speaking of my upbringing, I live and let live.

    Which also means I don't judge her for her opinions.
    What are you not getting in that answer?

    Well basically defending your opinions or attitudes behind your upbringing is a cop out.


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    #48
    Sharpshooter
    Registered Users Posts: 31,859 ✭✭✭✭Sharpshooter


    cotwold wrote: »
    Well basically defending your opinions or attitudes behind your upbringing is a cop out.

    What opinions?


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    #49
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    We could argue all day about her point of view, however by and large the main point of this is the suppression of peoples rights to speak out on what they believe in when asked. No matter what side you take on this issue it should be clear that at least the right to freedom of speech should be paramount.


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    #50
    Irishcrx
    Registered Users Posts: 2,861 ✭✭✭Irishcrx


    ibarelycare wrote: »
    The bible also states that sex before marriage is a sin....so should people who do this be getting married if it goes against the church?

    Marriage isn't necessarily a relgious union.

    I don't know to be honest i'm atheist myself I think the church has so many flaws and hypocracy's in it I wouldn't know where to begin but it is my opinion that gay marriage is not right simply because I feel it is not natural i think it is a step to far. By all means they should get couples rights and tax breaks but marriage itself I feel is a union between a man and a woman.


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    #51
    Mr. Frost
    Closed Accounts Posts: 726 ✭✭✭Mr. Frost


    Sabre0001 wrote: »
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XMvviFbkf0

    Good on her. At least she was honest and didn't go for the text book answer. I'm indifferent to the whole thing tbh.

    Priceless seeing that fcuking gimp "Perez Hiltons' mug at the end of that clip! :pac:


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    #52
    cotwold
    Registered Users Posts: 950 ✭✭✭cotwold


    Sharpshooter wrote: »
    What opinions?

    Your attitude to live and let live.
    prinz wrote: »
    Everyone's formative years and upbringing have an effect on their own personality and viewpoints. Like it or not. You might not always agree with your parents or guardians, but that does not mean that how they raised you does not shape your own, even if differing, opinions.

    Yeah i agree completely. but if you actually believe in something strongly enough to talk about it i believe you should be able to stand behind it as your own opinion. I have opinions that differ from my parents and those that dont. Same with my friends but i stand behind my own opinions and attitudes as products of my own reasoning.


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    #53
    Sleipnir
    Registered Users Posts: 5,514 ✭✭✭Sleipnir


    Sharpshooter wrote: »
    I was speaking of my upbringing, I live and let live.

    Which also means I don't judge her for her opinions.
    What are you not getting in that answer?

    I mis-read the point of your post, my apologies.


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    #54
    RiverWilde
    Closed Accounts Posts: 419 ✭✭RiverWilde


    1984 anyone? This is an annoying topic. The contestant was asked her opinion, she gave it and now she's being flayed for it. How does that saying go? Don't ask an honest question if you don't want an honest answer? So the woman is not in favour of same sex marriage. Big deal.
    This race to the center on issues is really boring and smacks of intellectual censorship.

    Why people get 'offended' when someone doesn't agree with them is hilarious. I don't agree with divorce. I don't think unmarried couples should be given the same rights as married couples. These are my views. Some people may not agree, that is their choice. Do I care that they don't agree with me? No.

    I think there should be varying levels of marriage - one marriage contract that allows for the sundering of the contract at a later date and a more stringent marriage contract that does not. It would solve alot of idiotic debate. Both marriage contracts would have varying levels of benefits. Will my ideas on marriage become law? Doubtful. Am I offended because this is not the case? No.

    I think the contestant was naieve in her answer. She was competing in a beauty pageant. What on earth did she expect? Knee-jerk populist reactions are par for the course with such events.

    Riv


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    #55
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    book smarts wrote: »
    What about incestous adult marriage? A father and adult daughter for example. They're consenting adults aren't they? Or what about straight same-sex platonic friends who wish to "commit"? Or is that beyond the boundaries of whatever modern moral fashion that academia and the media have convinced you to believe?

    What about it?

    If you want to do your hot cousin, there's more subtle ways of letting us know. Relax.


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    #56
    homerjay2005
    Registered Users Posts: 29,346 ✭✭✭✭homerjay2005


    heard this on the radio this morning. she has an opinion that for me, she is entitle to and this reaction is crazy. by all accounts, she had this wrapped up and that one judge cost her. that, in my opinion, is total bulls*it. as to why a judge should see the need to discuss gay marriage at a womans beauty pagent is another issue.


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    #57
    ejmaztec
    Registered Users Posts: 24,009 ✭✭✭✭ejmaztec


    "Hilton said he had been "floored" by Ms Prejean's answer, which, he said, "alienated millions of gay and lesbian Americans, their families and their supporters"."

    I think that Perez Hilton (a prize obnoxious twat whichever side he bats for), made the stupid comment. She alienated fewer people than she would have done by not giving the answer that he would have preferred.


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    #58
    Acacia
    Registered Users Posts: 2,816 ✭✭✭Acacia


    netwhizkid wrote: »
    What I can't figure out is why anyone would be gay when there are women are hot as her in the world. Plus she is a conservative +1 for me.

    Because being gay is a choice. I mean, if you just show gay people enough photos of hot women, they'll magically not be homosexual anymore....:rolleyes:


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    #59
    rainbow kirby
    Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators Posts: 26,928 Mod ✭✭✭✭rainbow kirby


    Acacia wrote: »
    I mean, if you just show gay people enough photos of hot women, they'll magically not be homosexual anymore....:rolleyes:
    Or possibly more gay :pac:


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    #60
    SoWatchaWant
    Registered Users Posts: 1,213 ✭✭✭SoWatchaWant


    book smarts wrote: »
    What about incestous adult marriage? A father and adult daughter for example. They're consenting adults aren't they? Or what about straight same-sex platonic friends who wish to "commit"? Or is that beyond the boundaries of whatever modern moral fashion that academia and the media have convinced you to believe?

    Who do you think you are bringing that up. "Consensual" incestuous marriage or relations doesn't happen, it happens because the sick **** of a father rapes the daughter or whatever to the point where she accepts it as normal. Shame on you for trying to compare this to gay marriage.

    So what if same sex friends commit? Are you so insecure that your own marriage loses meaning because a same sex couple marry, for love or otherwise? If this is so, grow up.

    "Whatever modern moral fashion that academia and the media have convinced you to believe?"

    What a brilliant paranoid statement. I believe you're referring to tolerance. Personally I think we as a society are the better for it, and with good reason.


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    #61
    SoWatchaWant
    Registered Users Posts: 1,213 ✭✭✭SoWatchaWant


    Jakkass wrote: »
    We could argue all day about her point of view, however by and large the main point of this is the suppression of peoples rights to speak out on what they believe in when asked. No matter what side you take on this issue it should be clear that at least the right to freedom of speech should be paramount.

    Well yeah, no one said that this shouldn't have reached the public ear. I'm glad I heard of it, and I'm glad she said it. People should be explicit no matter how wrong they are. I don't think anyone is debating that, criticising her view is another thing.


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