Under 20's dole cut...increase in antisocial behaviour?

Richard Dower · 07-04-2009 06:02PM #1

I am going to generalise here!...ok, lets assume those under 20 are thugs and housing estate types, if there dole is cut in half will this increase crime and anti social behaviour?

Or...will it stop them from blowing all there doleon cans and hash ? and keep them off the street?

Jamie-b · 07-04-2009 06:03PM

It will make those who are wasters try to get a ob and an education... but at the expense of those who geuinely need and deserve the dole.

johnnyskeleton · 07-04-2009 06:04PM

If they are already thugs the budget won't change them.

If they are not, they might be tempted into petty crime.

I'm not sure of the specifics of this change though. If you are 19 and doing a fas course, do you get effectively the same as the dole (or whatever it is that FAS pays)? Is it actually a way of getting under 20s to do courses, or is it a pure cut them and save tactic?

ionix5891 · 07-04-2009 06:06PM

actually there be a decrease probably as these people would have to get a job in restaurants etc and work hard (like i did at that age)

instead of sitting at home playin xboxes and then drinking rest of their money

johnnyskeleton · 07-04-2009 06:15PM

ionix5891 wrote: »

actually there be a decrease probably as these people would have to get a job in restaurants etc and work hard (like i did at that age)

instead of sitting at home playin xboxes and then drinking rest of their money

And if the jobs aren't there or instead of giving it to someone who was on the dole for 2 years, the resteraunt decides to give it to the recently laid off builder who never missed a days work etc?

At best, it will encourage them to take up fas courses, provided that those courses will give them more money than the dole.

The Muppet · 07-04-2009 06:19PM

Richard Dower wrote: »

I am going to generalise here!...ok, lets assume those under 20 are thugs and housing estate types, if there dole is cut in half will this increase crime and anti social behaviour?

Or...will it stop them from blowing all there doleon cans and hash ? and keep them off the street?

What exactly is a "housing estate type"?

Holsten · 07-04-2009 06:28PM

Skangers.

Richard Dower · 07-04-2009 06:31PM

Housing estate types....you'll know them when you see and here them and how they behave.

The Muppet · 07-04-2009 06:39PM

Richard Dower wrote: »

Housing estate types....you'll know them when you see and here them and how they behave.

Could the same generalisation be applied to citizens of Limerick?

I know well what you mean but many decent people are reared in housing estates, you stereo typing in such a manner is insulting.

mayordenis · 07-04-2009 06:46PM

The Muppet wrote: »

Could the same generalisation be applied to citizens of Limerick?

I know well what you mean but many decent people are reared in housing estates, you stereo typing in such a manner is insulting.

In fairness there is a clear caveat that the OP admitted beforehand to generalising, not fair to attack the OP on this imo. Not saying everyone, just using the term for the sake of the argument.

ShooterSF · 07-04-2009 06:47PM

I await the papers finding an unemployed 19 year old who's parents have passed away living on a 100 a week.

Jah Luff · 07-04-2009 06:50PM

What difference does it make if you are 19 and 20? This is ridiculas I was sturggling to survive on 200 nevermind 100. And how will it encourage people to do courses if there are no courses to do? There is already huge waiting lists for courses. **** them.

IrishLady · 07-04-2009 06:54PM

The dole should have been cut for people who are on it the longest and who couldnt bother their arse in getting a job even when the celtic tiger was at its peak...not for under 20 when people only finish up school and cannot find a job because of the way the job fronts are at the moment.They should be trying to implement courses for people who have lost their jobs so they will have better skills and training and also investing in companys by keeping them up and running..well my education didnt get me anywhere in the end, just got let go there last friday and im sick of this p**y gov!!:mad:

Richard Dower · 07-04-2009 06:58PM

My sweeping generalisation applies to all areas of the country.

limericklady87 · 07-04-2009 06:59PM

tbh i dont see many reasons for anyone 18 or 19 to be sitting around on the dole.. i know genuinely there are some that will have lost their jobs but ffs it might encourage some of the school drop-outs/druggies/buggy brigade to think a bit more or do a course and try to make something of themselves...:rolleyes:

Richard Dower · 07-04-2009 07:00PM

IrishLady wrote: »

The dole should have been cut for people who are on it the longest and who couldnt bother their arse in getting a job even when the celtic tiger was at its peak...not for under 20 when people only finish up school and cannot find a job because of the way the job fronts are at the moment.They should be trying to implement courses for people who have lost their jobs so they will have better skills and training and also investing in companys by keeping them up and running..well my education didnt get me anywhere in the end, just got let go there last friday and im sick of this p**y gov!!:mad:

ionix5891 · 07-04-2009 07:00PM

IrishLady wrote: »

The dole should have been cut for people who are on it the longest and who couldnt bother their arse in getting a job even when the celtic tiger was at its peak...not for under 20 when people only finish up school and cannot find a job because of the way the job fronts are at the moment.They should be trying to implement courses for people who have lost their jobs so they will have better skills and training and also investing in companys by keeping them up and running..well my education didnt get me anywhere in the end, just got let go there last friday and im sick of this p**y gov!!:mad:

what was you education in?

im in engineering and there is a HUGE number of available jobs even in this day and age, im after paying the taxman a huge chunk of money and will have to do that again in few months to support people who decided to take an easy path in life

and whats funny is when i was in uni all eng courses were almost empty and now that im working with a local IT the engineering courses are still empty, in meantime 3rd level education is still one of the cheapest in europe...

ive no sympathy for people who went doing arts or commerce or other courses that dont help economy and now cant find jobs

there is still demand for people with Eng, It, Science backgrounds

.

aare · 07-04-2009 07:06PM

I think politicians overlooked the fact that not everyone under 20 has a family to turn to, or subsidize them, and these young people are denied other educational advantages as a result and are less likely to be able to find work than the norm.

Without provision to make exception for anyone without effective family support you will kill some of them and drive the rest to crime.

Thatcher tried this in the 80s, that's how the cardboard cities were born...and even she had to allow for exceptions on humanitarian grounds within a few weeks.

Rev. Kitchen · 07-04-2009 07:07PM

Its cut to 100 euro but if you join a course or further education or re training you dont get cut. The only ones that will be cut are the ones that want to sit around doing nothing all day as a carrer

Jah Luff · 07-04-2009 07:08PM

Ima go buy me a decent box tomrrow and some nice pastic bag to wear with my lovely 100 euro.

limericklady87 · 07-04-2009 07:31PM

fair enough! :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

the fact that these under 20's receiving JA will not have their payments cut if they are undergoing a fas course is also going prett handy on them. imo if they cannot work they should be out learning something to assist their entry/re-entry into the workforce instead of sitting at home watching jeremy kyle

Jah Luff · 07-04-2009 07:32PM

limericklady87 wrote: »

fair enough! :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

the fact that these under 20's receiving JA will not have their payments cut if they are undergoing a fas course is also going prett handy on them. imo if they cannot work they should be out learning something to assist their entry/re-entry into the workforce instead of sitting at home watching jeremy kyle

If you were looking for a course you would see the huge wating lists to get one.

IrishLady · 07-04-2009 07:34PM

ionix5891 wrote: »

what was you education in?

im in engineering and there is a HUGE number of available jobs even in this day and age, im after paying the taxman a huge chunk of money and will have to do that again in few months to support people who decided to take an easy path in life

and whats funny is when i was in uni all eng courses were almost empty and now that im working with a local IT the engineering courses are still empty, in meantime 3rd level education is still one of the cheapest in europe...

ive no sympathy for people who went doing arts or commerce or other courses that dont help economy and now cant find jobs

there is still demand for people with Eng, It, Science backgrounds

.

Im educated in business and computers and having no sympathy for people who have studied arts etc .. i think thats a bit harsh after all they have educated themselves to get where they are today regardless of what they study their not the ones who have been sitting around for years collecting tax payers money...the government should of looked into unmarried mothers also,sure why wouldnt these people keep having kids when us irish fools will pay for their pleasure and im not condeming all unmarried mothers by the way..

limericklady87 · 07-04-2009 07:35PM

then wait i suggest isntead of drawing for the rest of your days! thankfully im not looking for one, i am about the complete a 4year law degree which i worked damn hard to get into and at the end of which i will probably be unemployed. I did not receive a grant either as my parents income was slightly over the threshold but i finance myself completely. if i had the option of e100 each week while completing this course, i would have been damn greatful

ionix5891 · 07-04-2009 07:37PM

IrishLady wrote: »

Im educated in business and computers and having no sympathy for people who have studied arts etc .. i think thats a bit harsh after all they have educated themselves to get where they are today regardless of what they study their not the ones who have been sitting around for years collecting tax payers money...the government should of looked into unmarried mothers also,sure why wouldnt these people keep having kids when us irish fools will pay for their pleasure and im not condeming all unmarried mothers by the way..

me agrees :pac:

tho government looking into anything involves alot of money being wasted and i heard that public sector workers are a bit disgruntled lately for being told that their employment depended on tax receipts from a housing ponzy scheme

aare · 07-04-2009 07:38PM

Rev. Kitchen wrote: »

Its cut to 100 euro but if you join a course or further education or re training you dont get cut. The only ones that will be cut are the ones that want to sit around doing nothing all day as a carrer

I don't think that aspect has been specified yet...it looked to me as if it will be cut whether you join a course or not...

rainbowtrout · 07-04-2009 07:52PM

Jah Luff wrote: »

If you were looking for a course you would see the huge wating lists to get one.

There are plenty of PLC courses you could enrol on, which allow you to keep JSA and make you eligible to apply to third level.

ionix5891 · 07-04-2009 07:57PM

limericklady87 wrote: »

tbh i dont see many reasons for anyone 18 or 19 to be sitting around on the dole.. i know genuinely there are some that will have lost their jobs but ffs it might encourage some of the school drop-outs/druggies/buggy brigade to think a bit more or do a course and try to make something of themselves...:rolleyes:

theres this thing called weed, does wonders to you at that age

bobbiw · 07-04-2009 08:14PM

Richard Dower wrote: »

Absolutly, they should have cut the longest term dole people completly.

People should be given a maximum of 6 months or maybe 12 after that they should be on their own.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i · 07-04-2009 08:33PM

This thread stinks of generalisations, it is not benificial to anyone, more tolls here than AH...

Richard Dower wrote: »

I am going to generalise here!...ok, lets assume those under 20 are thugs and housing estate types, if there dole is cut in half will this increase crime and anti social behaviour?

Or...will it stop them from blowing all there doleon cans and hash ? and keep them off the street?

While some do spend their money on drink, most spend very little on drink, very little. Those that do spend a lot on drink do not need social welfare, if you know anyone like this, report them.

How it will keep them off the streets? If they want drink they will still spend the money on drink...

ionix5891 wrote: »

actually there be a decrease probably as these people would have to get a job in restaurants etc and work hard (like i did at that age)

instead of sitting at home playin xboxes and then drinking rest of their money

Sure there's millions of jobs out there, magic jobs that just appear when you need. Social welfare is only for people who don't want to work... :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

This type of tripe is getitng annoying... Where the hell do you think these jobs are going to appear from???

aare · 07-04-2009 08:44PM

bobbiw wrote: »

Absolutly, they should have cut the longest term dole people completly.

People should be given a maximum of 6 months or maybe 12 after that they should be on their own.

On their own, in a recession, with galloping unemployment, to do precisely what?

Of course some of them will just bludgeon their children and hang themselves, relatively peacefully, but most of them will collect and survive, any way they can...

...and I do NOT think that will enhance the society we live in for anyone.

Also, though I am sure there are some long term dole scroungers, there are other reasons why people fall into the unemployment trap and can't get out too.

Under 20's dole cut...increase in antisocial behaviour?

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