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Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread

1…359360362364365…798

Comments

  • #10832
    Headshot
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56,089 ✭✭✭✭Headshot


    raven136 wrote: »
    quick calculation after looking through the present squad and adding in reyes its about 90m.Thats not small money.

    12m for arshavin
    17for reyes
    5(rising to 12)for walcott

    small clubs with small budgets dont do that.

    He unearths gems as does rafa.agger for 7 or sagna for 7.5.Rafa never gets the credit for his great transfer moves or his ability to shift out and make a small profit on players that didnt work out

    dont forget Nasri cost another big sum for Arsenal, 12 million

    Reyes is there record signing and he turned out very bad

    edit:every manager always gets a few good signings,its just getting more good ones than bads ones

    as liverpool fans has Rafa made more good signings than bad ones


  • #10833
    PHB
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,617 ✭✭✭✭PHB


    Rafa never gets the credit for his great transfer moves or his ability to shift out and make a small profit on players that didnt work out

    That's normally because he's the one who brought them in in the first place.


  • #10834
    kaimera
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,392 ✭✭✭✭kaimera


    jesus i thought this money thing would be over already but i guess not :(

    suppose something has to be brought up again and again


  • #10835
    raven136
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,929 ✭✭✭raven136


    PHB wrote: »
    That's normally because he's the one who brought them in in the first place.

    but its continually mentioned about his odd transfer dealings.Always mentions of Pennat,Crouch,Morientes etc.The same rule does not apply to other managers it seems.
    Not going down the route of saying there is a campaign against him or anything but a lot of pundits(not just ex reds)talk about his dealings as some kind of weakness.
    Yes he signed some crap,but given decent money he invariably signs excellent players who do a job.


  • #10836
    Headshot
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56,089 ✭✭✭✭Headshot


    found this list on the internet

    its rafa's buys (suppose buys anyway)
    1. Fernando Torres
    2. Robbie Keane
    3. Ryan Babel
    4. Xabi Alonso
    5. Dirk Kuyt
    6. Albert Riera
    7. Andrea Dossena
    8. Peter Crouch
    9. Lucas Leiva
    10. Jermaine Pennant
    11. Martin Skrtel
    12. Craig Bellamy
    13. Luis Garcia
    14. Jose Reina
    15. Dan Agger
    16. Mohammed Sissoko
    17. Fernando Morientes
    18. Yossi Benayoun
    19. Diego Cavalieri
    20. Alvaro Arbeloa
    21. Sebastian Leto
    22. Jose Miguel Gonzalez
    23. Gabriel Paletta
    24. Mark Gonzalez
    25. David Ngog
    26. Scott Carson
    27. Mikel San Jose
    28. David Martin
    29. Antonio Barragan
    30. Besian Idrizaj
    31. Jack Hobbs
    32. Alex Cooper
    33. Alexander Kacaniklic
    34. Krisztian Nemeth
    35. Andras Simon
    36. Victor Palsson
    37. Gary Mackay Steven
    38. Vitor Flora
    39. Andriy Voronin
    40. Nikolay Mihaylov
    41. Emmanuel Mendy
    42. Marvin Pourie
    43. Dani Pacheco
    44. Nikola Saric
    45. Lauri Dalla Valle
    46. Gerardo Bruna
    47. Hakan Duyan
    48. Damien Plessis
    49. Peter Gulacsi
    50. Charles Itandje
    51. Philipp Degen
    52. Vincent Lucas
    53. Ryan Crowther
    54. Mihail Alexandrov
    55. Robbie Fowler
    56. Ryan Wilkie
    57. Javier Mascherano
    58. Miki Roque
    59. Nabir El Zhar
    60. Mark Smyth
    61. Jay Smith
    62. Stephen Darby
    63. Craig Lindfield
    64. Adam Hammill
    65. Danny Guthrie
    66. Paul Anderson
    67. Lee Peltier
    68. Fabio Aurelio
    69. Jan Kromkamp
    70. Boudewijn Zenden
    71. Mauricio Pellegrino
    72. Godwin Antwi
    73. Robbie Threlfall
    74. Ryan Flynn
    75. Calum Woods
    76. Paul Willis
    77. Danny O'Donnell
    78. Ramon Calliste
    79. Steve Irwin
    80. Martin Kelly
    81. Ronald Huth
    82. Jordy Brouwer
    83. Francisco Manuel Duran
    84. Emiliano Insua
    85. Ray Putterill
    86. Martin Hansen
    87. Jay Spearing
    88. Dave Roberts
    89. David Mannix
    90. Antonio Nunez

    only 1 world class player Rafa has bought

    bought some very good players but alot of Rubbish too


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  • #10837
    PHB
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,617 ✭✭✭✭PHB


    raven136 wrote: »
    Yes he signed some crap,but given decent money he invariably signs excellent players who do a job.

    Keane?


  • #10838
    raven136
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,929 ✭✭✭raven136


    PHB wrote: »
    Keane?

    even the best makes mistakes:D

    anyhow it works out at around what 6/7m for a loan for 6months
    arent united paying 10m to loan Tevez


  • #10839
    daithijjj
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,588 ✭✭✭daithijjj


    raven136 wrote: »
    quick calculation after looking through the present squad and adding in reyes its about 90m.Thats not small money.

    12m for arshavin
    17for reyes
    5(rising to 12)for walcott

    small clubs with small budgets dont do that.

    He unearths gems as does rafa.agger for 7 or sagna for 7.5.Rafa never gets the credit for his great transfer moves or his ability to shift out and make a small profit on players that didnt work out

    raven.........i dont mean to pick on your particular post, theres others that should be included. All this balderdash about reyes costing 17mil just makes me compelled to make the point that both reyes and jeffers were bought solely of the profit of anelka going to madrid for 22.5 mil..........a cool 22mil profit. Those players cost arsenal nothing..........so if we include all dealings inc those 3 players then arsenal actually made a huge profit.

    I might also point out that arsenal sorely miss flamini, fabregas and walcott...............this time 12 months ago arsenal were playing some of the best football to be seen in a very long time on a minimal outlay for a top team in the prem. As a liverpool fan i very much admire wenger..............not only has he lost the likes of henry, viera, (insert french world cup winner here), but they have also purchased a huge new stadium in the interim.............criticising wenger for arsenals poor showing this season is a tad below the belt from any forum member.


  • #10840
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 42,150 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Mr Alan wrote: »
    why not? to give aul robbie the nice irish lad a break?

    Simple fact is that if he wasnt Irish, no one would give a ****. While i can get that to an extent, his nationality is irrelevant to me.....
    You are losing to the run of yourself making comments like this.

    I've given the minutes he played twice in this thread. 1254 mins iirc. Over 29 games. Thats 1254/29 = 43.24 mins per game.

    Here are a couple of questions for you regarding Robbie Keane.

    How many games did he play in the position that he has excelled in at Spurs?
    What player at Liverpool makes the sale of Robbie Keane sensilbe?
    How many Liverpool players have scored more goals than Robbie Keane this season?
    How many Liverpool players have a better goal per minutes on the pitch ratio than Robbie Keane this season?
    How many Liverpool players have more assists than Robbie Keane this season?


  • #10841
    Headshot
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56,089 ✭✭✭✭Headshot


    raven136 wrote: »

    anyhow it works out at around what 6/7m for a loan for 6months
    arent united paying 10m to loan Tevez

    but utd want to keep Tevez and he has score some vital goals


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  • #10842
    raven136
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,929 ✭✭✭raven136


    Headshot wrote: »
    found this list on the internet

    its rafa's buys (suppose buys anyway)
    1. Fernando Torres
    2. Robbie Keane
    3. Ryan Babel
    4. Xabi Alonso
    5. Dirk Kuyt
    6. Albert Riera
    7. Andrea Dossena
    8. Peter Crouch
    9. Lucas Leiva
    10. Jermaine Pennant
    11. Martin Skrtel
    12. Craig Bellamy
    13. Luis Garcia
    14. Jose Reina
    15. Dan Agger
    16. Mohammed Sissoko
    17. Fernando Morientes
    18. Yossi Benayoun
    19. Diego Cavalieri
    20. Alvaro Arbeloa
    21. Sebastian Leto
    22. Jose Miguel Gonzalez
    23. Gabriel Paletta
    24. Mark Gonzalez
    25. David Ngog
    26. Scott Carson
    27. Mikel San Jose
    28. David Martin
    29. Antonio Barragan
    30. Besian Idrizaj
    31. Jack Hobbs
    32. Alex Cooper
    33. Alexander Kacaniklic
    34. Krisztian Nemeth
    35. Andras Simon
    36. Victor Palsson
    37. Gary Mackay Steven
    38. Vitor Flora
    39. Andriy Voronin
    40. Nikolay Mihaylov
    41. Emmanuel Mendy
    42. Marvin Pourie
    43. Dani Pacheco
    44. Nikola Saric
    45. Lauri Dalla Valle
    46. Gerardo Bruna
    47. Hakan Duyan
    48. Damien Plessis
    49. Peter Gulacsi
    50. Charles Itandje
    51. Philipp Degen
    52. Vincent Lucas
    53. Ryan Crowther
    54. Mihail Alexandrov
    55. Robbie Fowler
    56. Ryan Wilkie
    57. Javier Mascherano
    58. Miki Roque
    59. Nabir El Zhar
    60. Mark Smyth
    61. Jay Smith
    62. Stephen Darby
    63. Craig Lindfield
    64. Adam Hammill
    65. Danny Guthrie
    66. Paul Anderson
    67. Lee Peltier
    68. Fabio Aurelio
    69. Jan Kromkamp
    70. Boudewijn Zenden
    71. Mauricio Pellegrino
    72. Godwin Antwi
    73. Robbie Threlfall
    74. Ryan Flynn
    75. Calum Woods
    76. Paul Willis
    77. Danny O'Donnell
    78. Ramon Calliste
    79. Steve Irwin
    80. Martin Kelly
    81. Ronald Huth
    82. Jordy Brouwer
    83. Francisco Manuel Duran
    84. Emiliano Insua
    85. Ray Putterill
    86. Martin Hansen
    87. Jay Spearing
    88. Dave Roberts
    89. David Mannix
    90. Antonio Nunez

    only 1 world class player Rafa has bought

    bought some very good players but alot of Rubbish too

    reina
    skertl
    agger
    torres
    masch
    alonso
    all fantastic players

    good players
    kuyt
    aurelio
    yossi
    riera
    arbeloa

    potential
    pacheo
    babel
    ngog
    lucas
    nementh


  • #10843
    raven136
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,929 ✭✭✭raven136


    daithijjj wrote: »
    raven.........i dont mean to pick on your particular post, theres others that should be included. All this balderdash about reyes costing 17mil just makes me compelled to make the point that both reyes and jeffers were bought solely of the profit of anelka going to madrid for 22.5 mil..........a cool 22mil profit. Those players cost arsenal nothing..........so if we include all dealings inc those 3 players then arsenal actually made a huge profit.

    I might also point out that arsenal sorely miss flamini, fabregas and walcott...............this time 12 months ago arsenal were playing some of the best football to be seen in a very long time on a minimal outlay for a top team in the prem. As a liverpool fan i very much admire wenger..............not only has he lost the likes of henry, viera, (insert french world cup winner here), but they have also purchased a huge new stadium in the interim.............criticising wenger for arsenals poor showing this season is a tad below the belt from any forum member.

    How is it below the belt?
    playing good football is not what its about surely?
    would arsenal fans rather play like barca or win?
    wenger didnt "lose"those players,he decided to let them go and stick with his kids.
    This january window,did arsenal need an arshavin type player or a masch type player?


  • #10844
    Headshot
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56,089 ✭✭✭✭Headshot


    your a better man than me raven136 if you think lucas can make it
    :pac:


  • #10845
    Chucky the tree
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,341 ✭✭✭✭Chucky the tree


    Liverpool Sqaud:


    Diego Cavalieri: £3m
    Daniel Agger: £5.8m
    Stephen Gerrard: £0
    Torres: £20m
    Vorinin: £0
    Riera: £8m
    Aurelio: £0
    Alsono: £10.7
    Benayoun: £5
    Pennant: £6.7
    Arbeoloa: £2.5
    Dirk Kuyt: £9
    Babel: £11
    Mascherano: £18.6m
    Leiva: £6m
    Insua: £0
    Carragher: £0
    Ngog: £1.5m
    Reina: £6m
    Spearing: £0
    Degen: £0
    Plessis: £0
    Nemeth: £0
    Itandje: £0
    El Zhar: £0
    Darby: £0
    Kelly: £0
    Flynn: £0
    Irwin: £0
    Skrtel: £112m
    Lindfield: £0
    Eccelston: £0
    Hansen: £0
    Gulasci: £0

    £112m.


  • #10846
    5starpool
    Subscribers Posts: 32,893 ✭✭✭✭5starpool


    eagle eye wrote: »
    You are losing to the run of yourself making comments like this.

    I've given the minutes he played twice in this thread. 1254 mins iirc. Over 29 games. Thats 1254/29 = 43.24 mins per game.

    Here are a couple of questions for you regarding Robbie Keane.

    How many games did he play in the position that he has excelled in at Spurs?
    What player at Liverpool makes the sale of Robbie Keane sensilbe?
    How many Liverpool players have scored more goals than Robbie Keane this season?
    How many Liverpool players have a better goal per minutes on the pitch ratio than Robbie Keane this season?
    How many Liverpool players have more assists than Robbie Keane this season?

    Christ, can everyone please shut up about Robbie F**king Keane please? He is gone, and can I just say amen to that. When he played for Liverpool it was like watching him in a competitive game for Ireland.


  • #10847
    Chucky the tree
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,341 ✭✭✭✭Chucky the tree


    daithijjj wrote: »
    raven.........i dont mean to pick on your particular post, theres others that should be included. All this balderdash about reyes costing 17mil just makes me compelled to make the point that both reyes and jeffers were bought solely of the profit of anelka going to madrid for 22.5 mil..........a cool 22mil profit. Those players cost arsenal nothing..........so if we include all dealings inc those 3 players then arsenal actually made a huge profit.

    .




    They also sold Reyes for £8m


  • #10848
    L'prof
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,055 ✭✭✭✭L'prof


    Just one point to make as I don't like all this Wenger bashing, he has spent on average £5m a season (purchases-sales), just out of interest what has Rafa averaged?


  • #10849
    daithijjj
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,588 ✭✭✭daithijjj


    raven136 wrote: »
    How is it below the belt?
    playing good football is not what its about surely?
    would arsenal fans rather play like barca or win?
    wenger didnt "lose"those players,he decided to let them go and stick with his kids.
    This january window,did arsenal need an arshavin type player or a masch type player?


    Wenger doesnt buy any player that he feels wont be right for arsenal........it just might be the case that there was nobody to fill that gap for him in this window so he will wait till the summer. While city are firing money at all and sundry it would be very hard to get said def mid player of arsenal class as they adhere strictly to a club cap on wages for any given season...........simply filling a gap is not on wengers agenda.


  • #10850
    raven136
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,929 ✭✭✭raven136


    daithijjj wrote: »
    Wenger doesnt buy any player that he feels wont be right for arsenal........it just might be the case that there was nobody to fill that gap for him in this window so he will wait till the summer. While city are firing money at all and sundry it would be very hard to get said def mid player of arsenal class as they adhere strictly to a club cap on wages for any given season...........simply filling a gap is not on wengers agenda.

    on an earlier point you made,arsenal sold anelka in 1999 and bought reyes in 2004.dont think the reyes money came from his sale.

    I dont care much for Arsenals policy,im comparing liverpool under rafa and arsenal under wenger at the same time.
    Rafa gets dogs abuse and wenger is a saint,one has won more in a similar amount of time that is all.


  • #10851
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 42,150 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    5starpool wrote: »
    Christ, can everyone please shut up about Robbie F**king Keane please? He is gone, and can I just say amen to that. When he played for Liverpool it was like watching him in a competitive game for Ireland.
    That post was directed at Mr Alan, if you want to quote it please be ready to reply properly and not just try and wipe it away with some silly comments regarding your own personal view.


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  • #10852
    daithijjj
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,588 ✭✭✭daithijjj


    raven136 wrote: »
    on an earlier point you made,arsenal sold anelka in 1999 and bought reyes in 2004.dont think the reyes money came from his sale.

    I dont care much for Arsenals policy,im comparing liverpool under rafa and arsenal under wenger at the same time.
    Rafa gets dogs abuse and wenger is a saint,one has won more in a similar amount of time that is all.

    Point noted on the dates of the transfers, however, that money was there for wenger to spend and it was sitting there for him. He did not splash it on any old player to fill gaps and this just adds to the point i was making about him being patient in the transfer market and waiting for the right player to become available.

    Yes rafa has won more, that is a simple fact. I was just trying to get across that wenger rarely signs a dodo......whereas our manager, who i respect, has signed a bucket load of trash if we go through that list in the above post.....you know who they are yourself. Anyway, good 3 points today..........starting with 6 defenders almost came back to bite us on the arse.


  • #10853
    raven136
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,929 ✭✭✭raven136


    let wenger pick the wide players and kids and let rafa pick keepers,defenders and defensive mids.That would be a hell of a team:D


  • #10854
    Handsome Bob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,905 ✭✭✭✭Handsome Bob


    Headshot wrote: »
    found this list on the internet

    its rafa's buys (suppose buys anyway)
    1. Fernando Torres
    2. Robbie Keane
    3. Ryan Babel
    4. Xabi Alonso
    5. Dirk Kuyt
    6. Albert Riera
    7. Andrea Dossena
    8. Peter Crouch
    9. Lucas Leiva
    10. Jermaine Pennant
    11. Martin Skrtel
    12. Craig Bellamy
    13. Luis Garcia
    14. Jose Reina
    15. Dan Agger
    16. Mohammed Sissoko
    17. Fernando Morientes
    18. Yossi Benayoun
    19. Diego Cavalieri
    20. Alvaro Arbeloa
    21. Sebastian Leto
    22. Jose Miguel Gonzalez
    23. Gabriel Paletta
    24. Mark Gonzalez
    25. David Ngog
    26. Scott Carson
    27. Mikel San Jose
    28. David Martin
    29. Antonio Barragan
    30. Besian Idrizaj
    31. Jack Hobbs
    32. Alex Cooper
    33. Alexander Kacaniklic
    34. Krisztian Nemeth
    35. Andras Simon
    36. Victor Palsson
    37. Gary Mackay Steven
    38. Vitor Flora
    39. Andriy Voronin
    40. Nikolay Mihaylov
    41. Emmanuel Mendy
    42. Marvin Pourie
    43. Dani Pacheco
    44. Nikola Saric
    45. Lauri Dalla Valle
    46. Gerardo Bruna
    47. Hakan Duyan
    48. Damien Plessis
    49. Peter Gulacsi
    50. Charles Itandje
    51. Philipp Degen
    52. Vincent Lucas
    53. Ryan Crowther
    54. Mihail Alexandrov
    55. Robbie Fowler
    56. Ryan Wilkie
    57. Javier Mascherano
    58. Miki Roque
    59. Nabir El Zhar
    60. Mark Smyth
    61. Jay Smith
    62. Stephen Darby
    63. Craig Lindfield
    64. Adam Hammill
    65. Danny Guthrie
    66. Paul Anderson
    67. Lee Peltier
    68. Fabio Aurelio
    69. Jan Kromkamp
    70. Boudewijn Zenden
    71. Mauricio Pellegrino
    72. Godwin Antwi
    73. Robbie Threlfall
    74. Ryan Flynn
    75. Calum Woods
    76. Paul Willis
    77. Danny O'Donnell
    78. Ramon Calliste
    79. Steve Irwin
    80. Martin Kelly
    81. Ronald Huth
    82. Jordy Brouwer
    83. Francisco Manuel Duran
    84. Emiliano Insua
    85. Ray Putterill
    86. Martin Hansen
    87. Jay Spearing
    88. Dave Roberts
    89. David Mannix
    90. Antonio Nunez
    only 1 world class player Rafa has bought

    bought some very good players but alot of Rubbish too

    Pity Rafa can't command £30m at will for individual world class players. Pity the board doesn't have faith in Rafa to give him £18m (for one player) or £32m (for two players) just to buy squad players.

    Take all of the above players and divide them by the five seasons Rafa has been in charge, in what season each one came in, and what was the total budget Rafa had available to him. Plus if you take into account the money Rafa has recouped through selling players, you'll find just how laughable the concept of "Rafa spending badly" is. He's had to work with buttons within constraints in comparison to Chelsea and Man U.

    There's no comparison IMO.


  • #10855
    L'prof
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,055 ✭✭✭✭L'prof


    daithijjj wrote: »
    Yes rafa has won more, that is a simple fact.

    I don't know about that!


  • #10856
    daithijjj
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,588 ✭✭✭daithijjj


    raven136 wrote: »
    let wenger pick the wide players and kids and let rafa pick keepers,defenders and defensive mids.That would be a hell of a team:D


    Arsene benitez has a ring to it all right..;)


  • #10857
    K-9
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,316 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    jasonorr wrote: »
    I don't know about that!

    In the same time frame obviously.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • #10858
    daithijjj
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,588 ✭✭✭daithijjj


    jasonorr wrote: »
    I don't know about that!

    i was referring to the last few seasons.......1 champions league and fa cup to benitez and 1 league and fa cup to wenger. Charity shields? not sure if id call that a trophy.


  • #10859
    jesus_thats_gre
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,446 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    jasonorr wrote: »
    Just one point to make as I don't like all this Wenger bashing, he has spent on average £5m a season (purchases-sales), just out of interest what has Rafa averaged?

    I think it works out at just over 20 million..


  • #10860
    jesus_thats_gre
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,446 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    raven136 wrote: »
    let wenger pick the wide players and kids and let rafa pick keepers,defenders and defensive mids.That would be a hell of a team:D

    I actually said this before on the Arsenal thread..


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  • #10861
    PHB
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,617 ✭✭✭✭PHB


    LZ5by5 wrote: »
    Pity Rafa can't command £30m at will for individual world class players. Pity the board doesn't have faith in Rafa to give him £18m (for one player) or £32m (for two players) just to buy squad players.

    Take all of the above players and divide them by the five seasons Rafa has been in charge, in what season each one came in, and what was the total budget Rafa had available to him. Plus if you take into account the money Rafa has recouped through selling players, you'll find just how laughable the concept of "Rafa spending badly" is. He's had to work with buttons within constraints in comparison to Chelsea and Man U.

    There's no comparison IMO.

    I think you'll find, in the countless discussion on the topic, and I mean countless, that most people will agree that United and Liverpool have roughly similar net spends since Benetiz joined Liverpool, Chelsea have significantly more, Arsenal having significantly less.

    What this means as Rafa as a manager is open to much debate, but the sheer numbers just aren't. Fergie and Benetiz have had fairly similar net spends since Rafa joined Liverpool.
    The reason United's squad is currently more expensive is because Fergie spend his money on less more expensive players in general, while Rafa bought more less expensive players.


This discussion has been closed.
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