Council tenants to get apartments in "The Grange"

stovelid · 13-11-2008 03:23PM

quirke_folder wrote: »

they offer houses to people in areas like Moyross, Ballynanty, O'Malley Park, Carew Park, St Marys Park and Keyes Park and people are turning their noses up at those houses as they are waiting for the houses in sought after areas to come on the market for them.

They may just be waiting for houses in non-life threatening areas?

veritable · 13-11-2008 03:27PM

Wagon wrote: »

Yeah...people who buy a place to live are a shower of flash shallow ****...when will they learn?

If I decided to get myself a nice apartment for that price cos I worked hard for it and liked it enough, and then some shower of **** move in next door for free I'll be mighty pissed off as well. Rob the people who work for their money and give the wasters what you took from them. Seems fair alright...

I completely agree. Life is unfair FOR EVERYBODY. If you can't make something of yourself, you should be poor. If you CHOOSE to have multiple children, you must be responisble for this and the crippling financial burden you put yourself under.

The people who sacrifice themselves to make money to afford places like the Grange do not deserve to have welfare grabbing excuses living next door to them, bringing down the value of asset they have bought with hard earned money.

Berty · 13-11-2008 03:27PM

stovelid wrote: »

They may just be waiting for houses in non-life threatening areas?

Beggars cant be choosers. If I take one person for example whom is my finacees brother and his fiancee. They are on the waiting list for a house in Limerick and they keep getting offered this house and that house and they keep rejecting them. Each time the council say "if you dont take the next one we offer you we are taking you off the top of the list". They never do.

The same couple are living in a house paying FULL rent. They are not claiming rent allowance only rent relief once a year.

If they can afford a house then why are they entitled to a council house?

Dudess · 13-11-2008 03:30PM

andrewh5 wrote: »

So you would be quite happy if you owned one of the apartments to have a skanky family put in next door to you? This is not the way to go. The skangers in Kilgobbin are currently having great fun stoning bus windows as they drive through the estate. Would you want one of them living in your apartment block?

Come on now. A skanky family will not be put beside you - and why this assumption that it's such a guarantee they'll be skanky because they come from a council estate? I worked in the council - the people housed in one-off council properties in upmarket areas were very, very carefully selected and went on to be superb tenants and very popular in their new communities.

quirke_folder wrote: »

If you can get a job then you do not need benefits. If you have a job you can afford a house of your own or at least an appartment.

You certainly can't in a lot of cases unfortunately.

he tells me that they offer houses to people in areas like Moyross, Ballynanty, O'Malley Park, Carew Park, St Marys Park and Keyes Park and people are turning their noses up at those houses as they are waiting for the houses in sought after areas to come on the market for them.

They're only the areas I hear about in the news so often. Would you soddin' well blame them for refusing?! When I worked in Cork City Council there was no problem with getting accommodation pretty much immediately in the worst estates in Knocknaheeny, The Glen, Togher, Mayfield and Mahon - I wonder why...
And while most people living in those estates are great people, a tiny few make life utter hell for everyone else.

Wagon wrote: »

people who buy a place to live are a shower of flash shallow ****...when will they learn?

Sigh... because of course any "place to live" is half a million euro.

If I decided to get myself a nice apartment for that price cos I worked hard for it and liked it enough, and then some shower of **** move in next door for free I'll be mighty pissed off as well. Rob the people who work for their money and give the wasters what you took from them. Seems fair alright...

Why in the name of Christ would anyone spend half a million on a two-bed apartment in a not especially beautiful area?

milod · 13-11-2008 03:33PM

Jumpy wrote: »

They arent stupid, they will obviously vet the people they put in there.

Hmm yeah - I rented my house to the council on one of those RAS schemes where they take it off you and let it to their supposedly vetted tenants.

I got the house back in ruins and had to spend 25K fixing it up (still in dispute with the city council about that).

I suppose, to be fair, the chap renting it kept his methadone bottles very tidy, and he did lift the carpet he'd pissed on when his family de-toxed him in the back bedroom.

That house is my pension - it's the only property I own and I can't really afford to live in it on my own. Instead I live with my g/f and pay rent to her.

There's a lot of snide, and gleeful reaction to people who work hard to be self-sufficient and then get it in the neck. And there's a far too much 'understanding' for the lazy twats who don't mind milking the state for dwindling resources.

I don't think council house dwellers are lazy, but you're far more likely to find a lazy twat if you look in a free council house...

Berty · 13-11-2008 03:35PM

Dudess wrote: »

They're only the areas I hear about in the news so often. Would you soddin' well blame them for refusing?! When I worked in Cork City Council there was no problem with getting accommodation pretty much immediately in the worst estates in Knocknaheeny, The Glen, Togher, Mayfield and Mahon - I wonder why...
And while most people living in those estates are great people, a tiny few make life utter hell for everyone else.

How can they expect to be offered anything else. These are the council estates. These are where the houses are and these are the areas these people are from. If they have such a problem living there then get up off their lazy ass's, stop wearing Pyjamas all day long and get a F*CKING JOB. Then get your own house and stop waiting for the council to offer you a house in the nice area. Earn some money and buy yourself in to the nice area.

Everyone else in society seems able to do it. Why cant they?

mad m · 13-11-2008 03:36PM

Lets not forget the money from the council doesnt stop there. The council will be paying management fees for the up keep of these apartments as well...Or it might be built into the rent...Imagine €2000+ a tenant a year for management fee's.....

Wagon · 13-11-2008 03:36PM

Dudess wrote: »

Why in the name of Christ would anyone spend half a million on a two-bed apartment in a not especially beautiful area?

Well, I'm pissing into the wind here with this but I'll take a stab at it......I'll guess...people who want to live in a nice apartment in this area, which could be close to work or family/friends or something like that. Jesus Dudess, you'd swear you could get one of those apartments for free the way your going on.

veritable · 13-11-2008 03:36PM

Dudess wrote: »

Come on now. A skanky family will not be put beside you - and why this assumption that it's such a guarantee they'll be skanky because they come from a council estate? I worked in the council - the people housed in one-off council properties in upmarket areas were very, very carefully selected and went on to be superb tenants and very popular in their new communities.

You certainly can't in a lot of cases unfortunately.

They're only the areas I hear about in the news so often. Would you soddin' well blame them for refusing?! When I worked in Cork City Council there was no problem with getting accommodation pretty much immediately in the worst estates in Knocknaheeny, The Glen, Togher, Mayfield and Mahon - I wonder why...
And while most people living in those estates are great people, a tiny few make life utter hell for everyone else.

Sigh... because of course any "place to live" is half a million euro.

Why in the name of Christ would anyone spend half a million on a two-bed apartment in a not especially beautiful area?

I wish we could say the same for the dublin county councils

Dudess · 13-11-2008 03:38PM

quirke_folder wrote: »

How can they expect to be offered anything else. These are the council estates. These are where the houses are and these are the areas these people are from.

Council estates aren't just in dodgy areas.

If they have such a problem living there then get up off their lazy ass's, stop wearing Pyjamas all day long and get a F*CKING JOB. Then get your own house and stop waiting for the council to offer you a house in the nice area. Earn some money and buy yourself in to the nice area.

Everyone else in society seems able to do it. Why cant they?

Again, not all council tenants are unemployed/scummy. Do you honestly believe a house/apartment can be purchased on any salary?

veritable · 13-11-2008 03:41PM

Dudess wrote: »

Council estates aren't just in dodgy areas.

Again, not all council tenants are unemployed/scummy. Do you honestly believe a house/apartment can be purchased on any salary?

yes, maybe in the desirable area you want, but if you can't afford it, move to an area you can. Or else, work harder, and use your head to make money. dont expect everything on a plate

Dudess · 13-11-2008 03:41PM

Wagon wrote: »

I'll guess...people who want to live in a nice apartment in this area, which could be close to work or family/friends or something like that.

Wagon, how are you missing my overwhelmingly obvious point? There's nothing wrong with wanting to buy a place, in a decent enough area, near family, friends, work... but it is possible to do this without paying half a million euro! In fact you could purchase a THREE-bedroom place that ticks all of the above boxes... for less than half a million euro.

mountainyman · 13-11-2008 03:44PM

milod wrote: »

That house is my pension - it's the only property I own and I can't really afford to live in it on my own. Instead I live with my g/f and pay rent to her.

There's a lot of snide, and gleeful reaction to people who work hard to be self-sufficient and then get it in the neck. And there's a far too much 'understanding' for the lazy twats who don't mind milking the state for dwindling resources.

You aren't self sufficient you are scrounging of the state as much as any junkie. You're a private landlord gouging the poor and becasue we pay your rackrent the Irish people.

Death to landlords.
Hang them all.

As for the halfwits in the Grange. HA HA HA.

The only problem I have with the agreement is that teh apartments are not worth 200K.

Berty · 13-11-2008 03:47PM

Dudess wrote: »

Council estates aren't just in dodgy areas.

Again, not all council tenants are unemployed/scummy. Do you honestly believe a house/apartment can be purchased on any salary?

Bah, Im talking about people on waiting lists which is the whole point of this thread.

I have a problem with people who are working waiting for houses. They, in most cases, do not need or deserve these houses they are waiting for. Im not going to dig a hole about the people already in council houses although I will say that most of them could do with being means tested.

Council estates are not just in dodgy areas, that is true however more often than not the area itself is now dodgy because it has "certain" council families in it.

Whether we like it or not there will always be the element who will take a free house or socially aided house and make a mess of it, make a mess of the area and bring the whole area into disrepute.

I never did and never will mention that council families are scummy. The phrase I keep using are lazy and undeserving in most cases.

I know a family whereby the parents have a council house, their son has a council appt because of his supposed medical condition, daughther has a bungalow because of her single mother status. She is married now so somebody should have pulled the carpet from beneath her. Her other son is on a waiting list. Her two brothers have council bungalows. All of them are on every benefit they can possibly swing a cat at. The only exception to this family is their other daughter, my fiancee who has the only job in the family.

Every single one of them has a medical card and free travel and between them they only pay €115 a month for rent to the city council.

This is only one case. There are 1000's of cases just like this all over the country. Its a crying joke!!!

veritable · 13-11-2008 03:48PM

mountainyman wrote: »

You aren't self sufficient you are scrounging of the state as much as any junkie. You're a private landlord gouging the poor and becasue we pay your rackrent the Irish people.

Death to landlords.
Hang them all.

As for the halfwits in the Grange. HA HA HA.

The only problem I have with the agreement is that teh apartments are not worth 200K.

Absolute State of you.
You sound like a Muppet

veritable · 13-11-2008 03:49PM

quirke_folder wrote: »

Bah, Im talking about people on waiting lists which is the whole point of this thread.

I have a problem with people who are working waiting for houses. They, in most cases, do not need or deserve these houses they are waiting for. Im not going to dig a hole about the people already in council houses although I will say that most of them could do with being means tested.

Council estates are not just in dodgy areas, that is true however more often than not the area itself is now dodgy because it has "certain" council families in it.

Whether we like it or not there will always be the element who will take a free house or socially aided house and make a mess of it, make a mess of the area and bring the whole area into disrepute.

I never did and never will mention that council families are scummy. The phrase I keep using are lazy and undeserving in most cases.

I know a family whereby the parents have a council house, their son has a council appt because of his supposed medical condition, daughther has a bungalow because of her single mother status. She is married now so somebody should have pulled the carpet from beneath her. Her other son is on a waiting list. Her two brothers have council bungalows. All of them are on every benefit they can possibly swing a cat at. The only exception to this family is their other daughter, my fiancee who has the only job in the family.

Every single one of them has a medical card and free travel and between them they only pay €115 a month for rent to the city council.

This is only one case. There are 1000's of cases just like this all over the country. Its a crying joke!!!

Here here

Alun · 13-11-2008 03:50PM

tba wrote: »

There should be no such thing as a council estate!

Absolutely. I lived in the Netherlands before moving here, and there they deliberately mix up all kinds of housing ... social housing, apartments, rented houses, owner occupier houses of all sizes and prices together in one development with never more than a dozen or so of each type in one go. Also one development may have dozens of different builders involved resulting in a huge variety of different designs of house all the way from traditional to plain whacky. As a result they don't get the massive all-the-same housing estates like we, and the Brits, have, nor the resultant ghettoization.

stovelid · 13-11-2008 03:51PM

quirke_folder wrote: »

Beggars cant be choosers.

You know, this is the kind of punitive approach that has completely failed. If you put a good family in a council property - integrated in a stable area - it could be a better long-term environment for children than dumping them in one of the worst areas in the country. What if the increased social and education opportunities resulted in the next generation breaking out of the poverty cycle, and the associated costs to the state?

I don't know how successful integrated housing could be, but the arguments against it have to be better than I paid a vastly inflated price for my property, and they are getting it a reduced rent. Dumping the poor in isolated, mass housing has failed.

You should remember that the local authority still own the property. While a single mother gets their rent paid, they don't get the property in the same way that a buyer gets it.

Dinter · 13-11-2008 03:56PM

mountainyman wrote: »

You aren't self sufficient you are scrounging of the state as much as any junkie. You're a private landlord gouging the poor and becasue we pay your rackrent the Irish people.

Death to landlords.
Hang them all.

As for the halfwits in the Grange. HA HA HA.

The only problem I have with the agreement is that teh apartments are not worth 200K.

Oh here's the Emancipator. On to free us all from the shackles of bondage instigated by villainess absentee landlords with his worthless diatribe and pointless hysterics. Come on Mountanyman, get over your begrudgery will you? Fair enough you have a chip (gorge) on your shoulder but it's not the 1800's and you are not Daniel O'Connell.

Anyway OT, society may have a duty to look after its weakest members but since when does weakest include laziness and since when does caring for mean luxury apartments?

Dudess · 13-11-2008 03:56PM

veritable wrote: »

yes, maybe in the desirable area you want, but if you can't afford it, move to an area you can. Or else, work harder, and use your head to make money. dont expect everything on a plate

Jeez, you've quite the black and white view of the world... The woman sitting across from me is 40 and single - no way can she afford a house, so she's applying for affordable housing. Again, quite the lottery. She's not looking for a place in anywhere special - she's looking for something in a not particularly salubrious part of Cork's northside. What do you propose she do, seeing as it's so simple?
Take a hairdresser: that's a job. Yet, despite the fact that a job is all one needs to afford their own place, I doubt a hairdresser would be able to do so.
And then there's mortgage approval by the bank to consider.

ronbyrne2005 · 13-11-2008 03:56PM

Anyone getting unemployment and their rent paid/subsidised should be made do public works in their free time. Now obviously those with young kids can't do that but maybe state should provide free childcare while they do their public works. Public works would be like cleaning playgrounds,cutting grass along canals etc, painting homes of elderly, sweeping streets etc. No more Jeremy Kyle marathons and Oprah and Dr Phil all day. Fecking spongers a lot of them. Get milions in benefits over the course of their lives and pay a fraction in taxes and indoctrinate their offspring with welfae-ritis. You the taxpayers of Ireland are paying for them to watch tv all day, swan around town/shopping centres , drink their cheap beer from Off-licence etc. :pac:

Berty · 13-11-2008 03:57PM

stovelid wrote: »

You know, this is the kind of punitive approach that has completely failed. If you put a good family in a council property - integrated in a stable area - it could be a better long-term environment for children than dumping them in one of the worst areas in the country. What if the increased social and education opportunities resulted in the next generation breaking out of the poverty cycle, and the associated costs to the state?

gets it.

That is so true. The quality of life for the children would increase without doubt in the area of education, crime and further down the line prejudice because of the area they are from. It would break a cycle which is very true.

Why can the parents not provide the same for the children?

Why is it to be bestowed on the government and local council to provide what is their responsibilty to their own children?

You cannot look upon the children and say because they have children we should allow them certain advantages over the co-habiting couple that are on the list.

_blank_ · 13-11-2008 04:02PM

Dudess wrote: »

The woman sitting across from me is 40 and single

She has a lot more serious issues than being able to afford a house then.

Dudess · 13-11-2008 04:05PM

mountainyman wrote: »

You aren't self sufficient you are scrounging of the state as much as any junkie. You're a private landlord gouging the poor and becasue we pay your rackrent the Irish people.

Death to landlords.
Hang them all.

Yeah, all those people who can only afford to rent should sleep rough - to sock it to the landlords!!!
There's a market for letting, people have every right to take advantage of it and not have bullsh1t judgements thrown at them like yours. There are a hell of a lot of landlords - I'd love to know why you think you can make such generalisations on the basis of a few sh1tty landlords.

Berty · 13-11-2008 04:07PM

Dudess wrote: »

Jeez, you've quite the black and white view of the world... The woman sitting across from me is 40 and single - no way can she afford a house, so she's applying for affordable housing. Again, quite the lottery. She's not looking for a place in anywhere special - she's looking for something in a not particularly salubrious part of Cork's northside. What do you propose she do, seeing as it's so simple?
Take a hairdresser: that's a job. Yet, despite the fact that a job is all one needs to afford their own place, I doubt a hairdresser would be able to do so.
And then there's mortgage approval by the bank to consider.

Hang on a minute. Do you know why I lived in a council estate in my own private house for 3 years? It was because I could not afford to live anyplace else. I wanted to get on the property ladder and I did. I could not afford any place else so if she desperately wants a house and cannot afford one in the area she wants, either she keeps saving, hopes she is the person who won last nights lottery in Cork or buys the house she can afford and when she can afford the next house, sell and move on up.

Dudess · 13-11-2008 04:10PM

On your own or with your fiance? It should be remembered that not everyone is guaranteed to be in a couple.

And a predominantly council area is exactly where she's looking.

Plus, what were you earning? There are certain variants that need to be taken into consideration. I'm seeing a lot of generalising on this thread...

Dinter · 13-11-2008 04:15PM

Dudess wrote: »

I'd love to know why you think you can make such generalisations on the basis of a few sh1tty landlords.

Because Mountanyman hasn't got past the Encumbered Estates Act in his history book.

Orange69 · 13-11-2008 04:16PM

Read all about it folks. Ireland is a frigging dump full of scum and managed by incompetent morons.. Get out now while you are young and you still can!

The people who paid good money to purchase these apartments must be appalled!

Orange69 · 13-11-2008 04:16PM

Dinter wrote: »

Mountanyman

I loled...

stovelid · 13-11-2008 04:21PM

quirke_folder wrote: »

Why can the parents not provide the same for the children?
Why is it to be bestowed on the government and local council to provide what is their responsibilty to their own children?

Some parents do manage to do well by their kids despite living in bad areas, but the fact remains that children are at a severe disadvantage there. But nobody can deny that living in an OK area could tip the balance for, say, a restless young lad brought up by a single mother in the absence of a male figure.

The 'prairie' estate model has failed. We should encourage moves toward any integration that could lessen policing, jail, and crime bills in the future.

Council tenants to get apartments in "The Grange"

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