Cork Hurling Manager?

Daysha · 29-10-2008 01:41AM

Orizio wrote: »

BTW, this Gardiner/Donal Og representing the views of the panel bull**** needs to stop, note Brian Murphy in todays Evening Echo saying he had no problem whatsoever playing for Gerald McCarthy and stating that he fundamentally disagreed with the idea of players questioning the manager.

Ok, now you're just getting paranoid. Since you last posted there has been one poster who mentioned the words Gardiner and Dónal Óg. He was perfectly explaining the process of how the selection was decided on. They were the two players that were chosen by the panel to act as a liason, so to speak, between the players and the board.

So, yes, in that position, John Gardiner and Dónal Óg Cusack are representing the views of the panel at those county board meetings. Why are you telling us to stop this so called bull**** when it's proven fact that they are?!?

It is now common knowledge, both in Cork and even my own county that a secret ballot took place, and that all but two players decided to pack it in if Gerald stayed in the job. That is a fact.

Brian Murphy could easily be one of those two honourable players that have decided to stay on regardless.

(See, I can post in bold too

)

Orizio wrote: »

Note the term 'possibility'. Note the fact that Brian Murphy, for one, is not going anywhere. Note that no one has actually left the panel, or retired. You are assuming far too much.

Nobody has left the panel because they're waiting to see whether Gerald will cave. Once they're 100% sure he won't be backing down (which could be as far away as just before the NHL), then they'll start officially hanging up the boots.

Orizio wrote: »

Justin McCarthy.

Quite correct, and that saga got severe media coverage both in Waterford and nationally. So that doesn't exactly back up your point that the media are just picking on you guys.

Orizio wrote: »

He had no choice, nor a reason not to, support the players.

Completely disagree with that. What the players did was wrong, and, regardless of the way the GAA handled it, they deserved the ban. A different manager may have chosen to come down heavier, denouncing what they did before the game, accepted the ban and internally disciplined the 3 players. That wouldn't have been completely over the top considering the situation that happened no?

Either way, to say that Gerald had no choice but to support the players is illogical, and if I was to be honest, pretty disrespectful to the man.

Orizio · 29-10-2008 02:02AM

Apologises btw, I got ex Cork player Brian Murphy confused with current Cork player Brain Murphy.

Pigletlover · 29-10-2008 11:17AM

Orizio wrote: »

On the strike point, if this was a strike then the whole of the panel would have refused to play for Gerald McCarthy and then made certain demands that had to be accepted before they went off strike again, like last year when the whole panel refusing to play because of the selection process.

Ben O'Connor has confirmed to the Examiner that the panel won't play under Gerald McCarthy, but would be willing to play under a new management team, I don't see how it can be called anything but a strike.

CORK GAA was once more locked in crisis, with All-Ireland winning skipper Ben O’Connor confirming the entire senior squad will not play under Gerald McCarthy.

And O’Connor, Cork’s only All-Star in 2008, claimed that younger players received unwelcome phone calls advising them to return to the panel or “it wouldn’t look good for them for the future”.

In an exclusive Irish Examiner interview, the Cork legend blasted the county board for instigating the second massive stand-off to have hit the Rebels this year.

He issued a stark warning to McCarthy and the county board: “This panel are ready to go the whole distance, we’re ready to pull out, tell them to work away next year.

“If there’s a new management team after that, and if we’re wanted back again, then no bother, but as it stands, we’re having nothing to do with the current set-up.

“People tell us that we should be honoured to play for Cork — it’s not an honour to play for Cork, it’s an honour to win for Cork, that’s my argument. It’s no good us going up and down to Páirc Uí Chaoimh three or four times a week if we’re not winning, or at least giving ourselves the best chance of winning.

“After what we’ve experienced for the last two years, we feel we need change to get back to Croke Park again.”

The Newtownshandrum man revealed: “Last week, some of our younger panel members got phone calls. It was done in a ‘nicey-nicey way’ but they were told they would want to be looking out for themselves and for their inter-county careers.

“They were told if they didn’t come back to training, or back to the panel, it wouldn’t look good for them for the future.

“It was only the younger panel members got those phone calls — I didn’t get one, neither did Joe Deane, Timmy McCarthy or any of those lads. It was all the younger lads — I don’t think that’s on.”

Waylander · 29-10-2008 11:24AM

Orizio I think you should just concede defeat in this one. The Cork players are acting like a shower of pre-madonnas and its unacceptable to my mind. I had heard about that Ben O Connor interview before PL posted it up. As it was you were the only man here fighting their corner.

Geology · 29-10-2008 12:27PM

They should let them all retire. This team's run out of steam anyway and have turned into nothing but a side of walking egos.

run_Forrest_run · 29-10-2008 02:30PM

between the Cork GAA and the Cork CIE employees I am fed up of hearing about all this discontent Leeside!

Let all the hurlers go and bring in some fresh players who will be proud to play for their county and let the aging tired players continue their bickering somewhere else, away from the sport and away from everyone else.

Daysha · 29-10-2008 02:44PM

Gerald was just on NewsTalk there. I didn't get to listen to him myself but the jist of it was:

1) He confirmed we won't be resigning, even if the entire panel retires and he has to start a new team from scratch.

2) He essentially views the players actions as another strike.

3) Refuted Bens comments about the younger players being pressurised by the county board, but also said the older players were guilty of the same thing.

“People tell us that we should be honoured to play for Cork — it’s not an honour to play for Cork, it’s an honour to win for Cork, that’s my argument.

I'm sorry but that's a rediculous thing to say. Is he saying that the hundreds of people down the years that played for Cork but never won a thing shouldn't be honoured of representing their county? And what about the modern day hurler battling it out with the weaker counties. Should they not be equally as honoured?

Give me a break. There are thousands of hurlers up and down the country that would kill to line up in Croke Park or where their county colours in their local stadium. It is a honour the the Cork panel have unfortunately taken for granted.

It is also an amazing honour for any person to manage their native county. That is an honour the panel are trying to take away from Gerald, and wrongly so.

One final point. The panels maintain the view that they feel they can go on to win trophies under a new manager. But, lets face it, if by some miracle Gerald does resign, he won't be doing so for a good while, ie just before the NHL. Do the players really think that any manager that comes in then would do just as good a job in 3/4 months as Gerald could have done in 12?

If they want to win AI's again, they have to do one simply action. Back the manager. Because while the county bickers amongst themselves for the 2nd successive year, Kilkenny are already planning for their 4 in a row. And the longer this goes on (and this could drag for a while) the further and further they fall behind the benchmark that they need to reach.

rebs23 · 29-10-2008 02:44PM

Waylander wrote: »

Orizio I think you should just concede defeat in this one. The Cork players are acting like a shower of pre-madonnas and its unacceptable to my mind. I had heard about that Ben O Connor interview before PL posted it up. As it was you were the only man here fighting their corner.

I think the wrong questions are being asked here. Surely the most obvious question is why are the Cork County Board reappointing Gerald McCarthy again? It is obvious he has brought nothing to develop the team or to our tactics. We have lost 5 championship games over the last 2 years. He is simply not up to it but yet the "committee" to appoint the Cork manager never even considered or discussed anyone else.
Its a sham a typcial Frank Murphy stroke that if it happened on a the National stage (which he has done on more than one occasion) everyone on here would be giving out about.
His time is up, he is an embarrassment at this stage, despite his wealth of knowledge and ability but we need new ideas, a new way of doing things and we should be a lot more focused on developing squads, underage schools of excellence and using the Cork senior players to market the games in the county. The shabby state of Pairc Ui Chaoimh is testament to the shabby way that Cork GAA is run.
While everyone knows the players are running out of public sympathy, their grievances are real with the way the team and Hurling is run in the county. Frank Murphy is only interested in retaining control and the Cork County Board are puppets to his will. (Would you want to be looking for funding/schedule changes from Frank if you didn't side with him?)
Time to retire with dignity Frank.

Daysha · 29-10-2008 02:50PM

rebs23 wrote: »

The shabby state of Pairc Ui Chaoimh is testament to the shabby way that Cork GAA is run.

In October 2007 the Cork County Boards announced plans to redevelop Páirc Uí Chaoimh into a state-of-the-art 60,000-seat sports and concert venue in conjunction with the Cork Docklands redevelopment. If these plans get the go-ahead, Cork would have the second largest stadium in the country behind Croke Park, which has a capacity of 82,000. The Cork stadium would be bigger than the redeveloped Lansdowne Road (50,000), while also outstripping other Munster GAA venues. If approved by the city council's planners and leaders, Páirc Uí Chaoimh will also get an ancillary all-weather pitch as well as a 400-space car park and a dining facility. To accommodate the county board's plans and the docklands redevelopment, Cork city council has acquired 22 acres ( former Cork Showgrounds) of nearby land following a compulsory purchase order.

Just throwing it out there

The_Kew_Tour · 29-10-2008 02:55PM

deise59 wrote: »

4) Cork are one of the most successful countys in the history of the GAA, .

You meant to say they are the most successful

The_Kew_Tour · 29-10-2008 02:57PM

rebs23 wrote: »

I think the wrong questions are being asked here. Surely the most obvious question is why are the Cork County Board reappointing Gerald McCarthy again? It is obvious he has brought nothing to develop the team or to our tactics. We have lost 5 championship games over the last 2 years. He is simply not up to it but yet the "committee" to appoint the Cork manager never even considered or discussed anyone else.
Its a sham a typcial Frank Murphy stroke that if it happened on a the National stage (which he has done on more than one occasion) everyone on here would be giving out about.
His time is up, he is an embarrassment at this stage, despite his wealth of knowledge and ability but we need new ideas, a new way of doing things and we should be a lot more focused on developing squads, underage schools of excellence and using the Cork senior players to market the games in the county. The shabby state of Pairc Ui Chaoimh is testament to the shabby way that Cork GAA is run.
While everyone knows the players are running out of public sympathy, their grievances are real with the way the team and Hurling is run in the county. Frank Murphy is only interested in retaining control and the Cork County Board are puppets to his will. (Would you want to be looking for funding/schedule changes from Frank if you didn't side with him?)
Time to retire with dignity Frank.

agree with everything you said till your last sentence.
That man never had dignity.

bazermc · 29-10-2008 03:13PM

adrian280582 wrote: »

You meant to say they are the most successful

Well not if they keep on getting their knickers in a twist about everything - look at last year on strike and then won nothing in the championship

Pride Fighter · 29-10-2008 03:39PM

adrian280582 wrote: »

You meant to say they are the most successful

I think they are tied with Kerry with both having 36 AI's apiece:p.

Waylander · 29-10-2008 03:41PM

rebs23 wrote: »

I think the wrong questions are being asked here. Surely the most obvious question is why are the Cork County Board reappointing Gerald McCarthy again? It is obvious he has brought nothing to develop the team or to our tactics. We have lost 5 championship games over the last 2 years. He is simply not up to it but yet the "committee" to appoint the Cork manager never even considered or discussed anyone else.
Its a sham a typcial Frank Murphy stroke that if it happened on a the National stage (which he has done on more than one occasion) everyone on here would be giving out about.
His time is up, he is an embarrassment at this stage, despite his wealth of knowledge and ability but we need new ideas, a new way of doing things and we should be a lot more focused on developing squads, underage schools of excellence and using the Cork senior players to market the games in the county. The shabby state of Pairc Ui Chaoimh is testament to the shabby way that Cork GAA is run.
While everyone knows the players are running out of public sympathy, their grievances are real with the way the team and Hurling is run in the county. Frank Murphy is only interested in retaining control and the Cork County Board are puppets to his will. (Would you want to be looking for funding/schedule changes from Frank if you didn't side with him?)
Time to retire with dignity Frank.

I agree that Frnk Murphy has to go, but I didnt give him the lifetime appointment! I believe the teams main concern is that they want to play a short passing game, whereas Mc Carthy wants a longer game. IF this is correct i think the team are mad. They are getting on as a unit, and they are up against the best hurling team ever to play together, they are not going to outhurl Kilkenny. I think long ball and power game is the only chance they have.

Rebs I hear you about the 5 games lost in two years, but the players cannot be absolved of blame on this front either. Sometimes, Cork simply are not the best team around, and despite what the good folk of Cork think, they are not automatically entitled to win titles.

I have never liked the idea of players picking managers, that is meant to work the other way round so I probably would not be inclined to support them ordinarily. However I think 2 strikes in a year, when they undertook not to strike after the first one is a bit too much. Maybe next year they wont like the physio and will go out again. I am sorry but they agreed to terms after last years strike. They got two reps on the Manager Selection committee. Time to shut up and play ball as far as I am concerned.

evil-monkey · 29-10-2008 04:19PM

Orizio wrote: »

They called a private meeting with McCarthy, and the media reported on said meeting. Yes?

a private meeting on which the media reported?? if you want something to remain private, giving details to the media ain't the best way about it.

according to Newstalk this morning, Ben O'Connor himself used the word strike...whether they actually do it or not, threatening is pretty much the same thing. Time to concede defeat my friend...

edit: just read a good quote from the Independent's Martin Brehany that I feel sums this all up; "it's safe to declare that winter is on its way. Why? Because there's a row in Cork."

The_Kew_Tour · 29-10-2008 04:53PM

Pride Fighter wrote: »

I think they are tied with Kerry with both having 36 AI's apiece:p.

not when you combine U21 and Minor also

uibhlaoirekid · 29-10-2008 05:00PM

wat ya tink about donal o grady 4 d job?!

smashey · 29-10-2008 05:07PM

uibhlaoirekid wrote: »

wat ya tink about donal o grady 4 d job?!

Welcome to the forum uibhlaoirekid.

I have just a wee bit of advice for you. Please do not use text speak as it's frowned upon round these parts.

Daysha · 29-10-2008 06:17PM

uibhlaoirekid wrote: »

wat ya tink about donal o grady 4 d job?!

He's a wonderful manager as already proved, and my first choice after Justin left Waterford. But Gerald McCarthy is still the manager and will be for the next 2 years, so there's not much point speculating on other candidates. If anything O' Grady would be sympathetic to Gerald if he is shafted out of the job, and therefore probably wouldn't take it out of principle.

evil-monkey · 30-10-2008 05:16PM

where's our friend from the pro-player camp gone to?? hiding in the long grass no doubt...

Daysha · 30-10-2008 06:16PM

I don't mind if he doesn't reply tbh. He's entitled to his opinion. There's no such thing as right or wrong.

evil-monkey · 30-10-2008 06:23PM

deise59 wrote: »

I don't mind if he doesn't reply tbh. He's entitled to his opinion. There's no such thing as right or wrong.

awww, bless

Orizio · 30-10-2008 08:50PM

Meh, looks like I was wrong and everyone else was right.

Obviously I had a bit too much respect, or belief, in the Cork panel's, well, level of common sense. I was actually reading the Ben O'Connor interview a couple of days ago and taught what a steaming pile of irrational gibberish. Completely bereft of humility or respect for the people of Cork. I just hope the footballers see sense and tell the hurlers to feck off.

Let the squad retire, and start from scratch.

Daysha · 30-10-2008 09:24PM

Was that me that said there's no such thing as right or wrong in this case?

How foolish of me

Nah, seriously though, that's a perfect example of how much public opinion how turned on the players recently. I was 100% behind them in 2002, kind of 50:50 on the issue last year, but this year, they don't deserve to where the county colours anymore.

Like Orizio said, let them retire. Hurling will be better without them.

Orizio · 30-10-2008 09:41PM

Thing is, a lot of the '99 lads need to go anyway, and probably would have gone, dispute or not. So a revamp was always in the air.

Anyone want to throw up a Cork team for the opening game of next year's Championship?

rebeve · 31-10-2008 02:18AM

Just have a look back at how democratic Frank used an obscure rule (NO BETTER MAN THAN frank TO COME UP WITH AN obscure RULE) ,to dump Gerald from the Cork selectors in 1993. Gerald had his day , no canon o brien to bail him out now , so gerald get a life and go away and take the FUHRER with ya

slan
Conor

Daysha · 31-10-2008 02:40AM

rebeve wrote: »

Just have a look back at how democratic Frank used an obscure rule (NO BETTER MAN THAN frank TO COME UP WITH AN obscure RULE) ,to dump Gerald from the Cork selectors in 1993. Gerald had his day , no canon o brien to bail him out now , so gerald get a life and go away and take the FUHRER with ya

slan
Conor

Took me a while to actually understand what you're trying to say, but care to explain why gerald needs to "get a life"?

Some people think Frank Murphy is wrong, some people think the players are wrong, but how in the name of god is Gerald McCarthy wrong in all this?!?

rebeve · 31-10-2008 12:19PM

Because he allowed himself to used as a stick to beat the players with . O Grady was the best manager Cork ever had IMHO .Then closely followed by Allen , who worked under O Grady for a few years .Unfortuanetly Frank had unfinished business with the class of 2002. Everybody expected the same management structure to stay in place , except the bold frank , who wanted to settle old scores , enter Gerald . Thats all Gerald ever was,his time had long passed . People outside of Cork have no idea how much influence this man has. He is the GAA in Cork .
Slan
Conor

Daysha · 31-10-2008 12:43PM

rebeve wrote: »

Because he allowed himself to used as a stick to beat the players with . O Grady was the best manager Cork ever had IMHO .Then closely followed by Allen , who worked under O Grady for a few years .Unfortuanetly Frank had unfinished business with the class of 2002. Everybody expected the same management structure to stay in place , except the bold frank , who wanted to settle old scores , enter Gerald . Thats all Gerald ever was,his time had long passed . People outside of Cork have no idea how much influence this man has. He is the GAA in Cork .
Slan
Conor

So you're blaming Gerald McCarthy for being appointed by Frank Murphy?

Sorry, I'm still confused at where you're coming from. You said Gerald needs to "get a life". I asked you why, and you're saying because he allowed himself to take the Cork managers job?!

You've got to be kidding me. Gerald McCarthy is one of the all-time Cork GAA legends. Frank offered him a dream job, manager of his native county. Regardless of Franks reasoning behind his appointment, can you honestly blame Gerald for not taking the job?

Also, there were never any sounds of discontent from the players or the supporters when he first took the job at the end of 2006. Interesting to hear that now, when things aren't going well on or off the pitch, both the players and some supporters have resorted to throwing accusations left right and centre about the appointment in the first place.

rebeve · 31-10-2008 01:04PM

Also, there were never any sounds of discontent from the players or the supporters when he first took the job at the end of 2006. Interesting to hear that now, when things aren't going well on or off the pitch, both the players and some supporters have resorted to throwing accusations left right and centre about the appointment in the first place.

But you see there was . In actual fact people were stunned . If frank had to engineer a rule in 93 to dump Gerald who was elected democraticly (ha ha ) .
How did gerald improve as a coach, since .Waterford wasted no time in showing him the door .
As for taking the Cork job ,Gerald knew he was being used end of story .

Cork Hurling Manager?

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