Kerry Footballers 2000-2008 - Best Team Ever?

DDC1990 · 31-08-2008 10:49pm #1

2000 - Winners
2001 - Semi Finalists
2002 - Finalsits
2003 - Semi Finalists
2004 - Winners
2005 - Finalists
2006 - Winners
2007 - Winners
2008 - Winners/Finalists

This Kerry team by Reaching the final today, have possibly written themselves into the history books as one of (if not the best) the best teams in GAA history. Granted you have the Wexford 4 in a Row team, the Kerry 4 in a Row (that was so nearly 5 in a Row) and the Dublin team that Rivaled that Kerry side, were tremendous but that was a different era. This is an era of superfitness, blanket defence, qualifiers and second chances for big teams. An era of ultra-competitiveness, in which Kerry have managed at least a semi-final in the last 9 attempts.

This team has had, and does have great players from the backs through midfield and up to the forwards. Séamus Moynihan, Marc and Tomás Ó Sé, Aiden O'Mahoney. The Great Darragh Ó Sé and significant others! Colm "Gooch" Cooper, Kieran Donaghy, The great Maurice Fitzgerald, Darragh Ó Cinnéide. All brilliant players on a brilliant team. Names that now could rival the Mikey Sheeheys, The Eoin "Bomber" Listons and the Pat Spillanes.

Not Only that but this current generation have (with a few exceptions) a lot more football in them. Scanlon, Donnacha Walsh, Reidy, Cooper, Tommy Walsh, Donaghy and so on are all in theire early to mid twenties and so may have many All-Irelands in them.

The 2008 All Ireland final will be a very tough test of Kerry, but it will give an indication of how far they have come since loosing the 2005 final to the same oposition. Many feel that after loosing to Tyrone in 2005 Kerry were forced to re-invent their game and adapt to the "Blanket" or "Swarm" Defence. Since then Kerry have won two All Irelands and are on the hunt for the 3-in-a-row. Come September 21st we will really see if Kerry are worth considering the best ever Gaa Footballing side or if Tyrone can challenge tehm for that title. One thing is for certain... I can't bloody wait!

Pride Fighter · 31-08-2008 10:54pm

They probably are. The Kerry teams of the 70's never had to play tough teams in a quarter or qualifier. In the 70's there were great teams such as Sligo and Offaly and many others who would give anyone a game on the day. Unfortunately they got knocked out early if they could not get out of their province.

jmayo · 31-08-2008 11:18pm

People always look at current and think they are the best but sorry I can only ever rate this current generation as second to the GREAT team of Dwyers.
O'Dwyers team had no second chances, this team has and they have now used it to get to another final.
Also this team looked to have run out of ideas until they discovered what Donaghy could do.
Saying that they are by far the best team in the country and would be superb if they could sort out some defensive issues and letting opposition back into games.
At least this final should be more evenly matched than their last few wins, where the opposition failed to turn up.

K-9 · 31-08-2008 11:39pm

I'd look at it a different way, just take the Qualifier era.

DDC1990 wrote: »

2001 - Semi Finalists (trashed by Meath)
2002 - Finalsits (poor second half against Armagh)
2003 - Semi Finalists (shocking display, 7points?)
2004 - Winners (Fair enough)
2005 - Finalists (beaten by the better team)

Would we be asking this question then?

DDC1990 wrote:

2006 - Winners (Class team, beat Armagh)
2007 - Winners (Class team, beat Monaghan and Dublin)
2008 - Winners/Finalists ( will define how great they are)

Agreed there!

DDC1990 wrote:

This Kerry team by Reaching the final today, have possibly written themselves into the history books as one of (if not the best) the best teams in GAA history. Granted you have the Wexford 4 in a Row team, the Kerry 4 in a Row (that was so nearly 5 in a Row) and the Dublin team that Rivaled that Kerry side, were tremendous but that was a different era.

If 2 AI's count as a great teams, what about Galway and Down in the 60's and again in the 90's with no Back Doors and competitive provinces?

DDC1990 wrote:

This is an era of superfitness, blanket defence, qualifiers and second chances for big teams. An era of ultra-competitiveness, in which Kerry have managed at least a semi-final in the last 9 attempts.

Winning 2/3 games a year isn't a sign of a great team! Kerry can get to an AI SF winning 2 competitive games. By that reasoning Armagh would be a great team this decade too! They where good, not great!

DDC1990 wrote:

This team has had, and does have great players from the backs through midfield and up to the forwards. Séamus Moynihan, Marc and Tomás Ó Sé, Aiden O'Mahoney. The Great Darragh Ó Sé and significant others! Colm "Gooch" Cooper, Kieran Donaghy, The great Maurice Fitzgerald, Darragh Ó Cinnéide. All brilliant players on a brilliant team. Names that now could rival the Mikey Sheeheys, The Eoin "Bomber" Listons and the Pat Spillanes.

Not Only that but this current generation have (with a few exceptions) a lot more football in them. Scanlon, Donnacha Walsh, Reidy, Cooper, Tommy Walsh, Donaghy and so on are all in theire early to mid twenties and so may have many All-Irelands in them.

Agreed.

DDC1990 wrote:

The 2008 All Ireland final will be a very tough test of Kerry, but it will give an indication of how far they have come since loosing the 2005 final to the same oposition. Many feel that after loosing to Tyrone in 2005 Kerry were forced to re-invent their game and adapt to the "Blanket" or "Swarm" Defence.

This is going to be test of how they can cope with Tyrone's swarm attack. 3-14? against Dublin and 0-23 against Wexford.

DDC1990 wrote:

Since then Kerry have won two All Irelands and are on the hunt for the 3-in-a-row. Come September 21st we will really see if Kerry are worth considering the best ever Gaa Footballing side or if Tyrone can challenge tehm for that title. One thing is for certain... I can't bloody wait!

Agreed. If Kerry win, the one remaining hoodoo is gone. If Tyrone do, they could well be the biggest of the big 3 this decade! Nobody can say Tyrone won soft AI's and Kerry wouldn't have beaten them when it mattered this decade!

It's a fascinating final with so many what ifs!

DDC1990 · 01-09-2008 7:54am

Great post seanies32, agree with a lot of what you are saying just disagree with a few things. Fine in 2001 we were thrashed by Meath but you can't forget that was a Meath team that wasn't half bad, and we had an off day. Its just like people saying Dublin are a bad team, because Tyrone hammered them this year... just not true. AS for 2003... we were utterly unprepared for the blanket defence, we felt like we were being fouled, and ended up thoroughly fustrated. Again more a manager mistake then players.

CyberDave · 01-09-2008 9:41am

It's hard to say really. The Kerry teams of the 70s never got a second chance!

homerjay2005 · 01-09-2008 10:13am

yep, the current crop of players are right up there and deserve to be put in the same league as the "golden" era. if they were to win it this year, i think they would equal them in status - 5 all ireland finals in a row and 4 wins. it would be an incredible achievement. i think its harder to win it now, as the standard has levelled, even though the backdoor has been introduced.

and remember, half of this kerry team are under 25.

kevmy · 01-09-2008 12:02pm

I'm going to say something controversial here in that I think this Kerry team is on the way down.

I think the peak for this team was 04-05-06. Essentially the Jack O Connor era he was a way better manager than Paidí and in my opinion is a better one than Pat O'Shea who seems to be a very lucky one.

If you think about it Tyrone, Armagh, Dublin and Mayo were in 04, 05 and 06 than they are now (with the possible exception of Tyrone who have found their form from nowhere but I'd still fancy the 05 Tyrone team to beat the present one). So the competition was tougher. Also the flaked Mayo twice in finals, thrashed Cork in semi finals and essentially moved imperiously towards victory with only Tyrone stopping them from outright victory.

If you take into account that the competition is weaker both last year and this year and then see how Kerry struggled to make it to the final this year and last.
Beat by a mediocre Cork team in Munster, put to the pin of their collar by an improving but not yet brilliant Galway team, draw with Cork and then almost throwing away the replay despite Cork only playing for 15 mins.

Last year wasn't much better scrapping past Monaghan and nearly being beat by a mentally suspect Dublin team.

I couldn't see the Jack O Connor team having this much trouble against these array of good but not great teams

homerjay2005 · 01-09-2008 12:21pm

kevmy wrote: »

I'm going to say something controversial here in that I think this Kerry team is on the way down.

using your logic, the same can be said for every team in ireland. the fact of the matter remains, they are in the final for the 5th year in a row and until somebody beats them, they are on the up. remember, hunger plays a massive part and every team in ireland, should have more hunger. so this team, is running on sheer skill together with a determination to proove the doubters like yourself wrong.

and the gaa are doing their best this year to twart the 3 in a a row. this, IMO will be Kerrys sweetest all ireland success in recent memory if they win it.

telecaster · 01-09-2008 2:25pm

I dont think its anywhere near accurate to cite Kerry 2000 - 2008 as one team. In terms of personnel and style we are talking about at least 2 different teams. Names that featured prominently nearer the start of the century such as O'Cinneide, MacGearrailt, Fitzmaurice, Fitzgerald and of course Moynihan....to a lesser extent MF Russell also have no real association to the Donaghy era.

Aside from nitpicking the question though, I don't think they are quite at the level of 70s Kerry yet. They look oddly vulnerable at times....though admittedly invincible at others.

DDC1990 · 01-09-2008 5:20pm

I can see what you are saying kevmy but, its the team not the Manager that should be taken into account.

As for Telecaster, I think they are linked. Cooper, Tom O'Sullivan, The three Ó Sé's all played with those players mentioned above, and MF Russell is still on the panel... looking for a sneaky 6 All Ireland.

K-9 · 01-09-2008 5:32pm

DDC1990 wrote: »

Great post seanies32, agree with a lot of what you are saying just disagree with a few things. Fine in 2001 we were thrashed by Meath but you can't forget that was a Meath team that wasn't half bad, and we had an off day. Its just like people saying Dublin are a bad team, because Tyrone hammered them this year... just not true. AS for 2003... we were utterly unprepared for the blanket defence, we felt like we were being fouled, and ended up thoroughly fustrated. Again more a manager mistake then players.

Indeed, that wasn't a bad Meath team, it was more the manner of the defeat!

As you say they should have been better prepared for 03, but Armagh in 02 was good preparation, though not to the intense levels of 03. Even if they where, I still don't think they'd have coped!

homerjay2005 wrote: »

and the gaa are doing their best this year to twart the 3 in a a row.

Explain? I'm confused!

telecaster wrote: »

I dont think its anywhere near accurate to cite Kerry 2000 - 2008 as one team. In terms of personnel and style we are talking about at least 2 different teams. Names that featured prominently nearer the start of the century such as O'Cinneide, MacGearrailt, Fitzmaurice, Fitzgerald and of course Moynihan....to a lesser extent MF Russell also have no real association to the Donaghy era.

Aside from nitpicking the question though, I don't think they are quite at the level of 70s Kerry yet. They look oddly vulnerable at times....though admittedly invincible at others.

But it's been a seamless transition.

sam34 · 01-09-2008 9:19pm

DDC1990 wrote: »

Granted you have the Wexford 4 in a Row team, the Kerry 4 in a Row (that was so nearly 5 in a Row)

dont forget that as well as the nearly-5-in-a-row taht kerry had a 4 in a row in the 1930s

Nalced_irl · 01-09-2008 9:54pm

I think its impossibe to say one team from one era are better than a similarily (sp?) successful team from another era. Too much has changed in the years in between and its a completely different game these days. I think you can only put teams up as the best of their era as which the current team would be, but to say they are better than the team of the 30`s or whatever cant be said with any confidence as they were completely different teams playing a completely different type of football. Thats how i see it anyway. Big test will be the final this year as others have said. Its the one major hurdle they havent jumped yet against Tyrone but if they win that i dont think you can argue that they are the best of the last 8-10 years.

kevmy · 02-09-2008 11:39am

homerjay2005 wrote: »

using your logic, the same can be said for every team in ireland. the fact of the matter remains, they are in the final for the 5th year in a row and until somebody beats them, they are on the up.

I do think most of the top teams are on the way down, others are on the way up but haven't quite reached the top level. For example no one can tell me the present Armagh and Mayo sides are as good as those of 4 or 5 years ago. Tyrone have been poor the last couple of years due to retirements and injuries. Teams like Cork, Galway and Wexford have all improved in the last year or so but they're still not quite up to the AI level.

Now fair play to Kerry they beat what was put infront of them and no one can fault them. They have been the best in the country but I do think they aren't quite as good as they were a couple of years ago.

This happens often enough in GAA imo AI won in 95, 96, 97, 98 and 99 were not as tough as those won between 88 and 94 and those won between 00 and 06

cruiserweight · 02-09-2008 12:00pm

sam34 wrote: »

dont forget that as well as the nearly-5-in-a-row taht kerry had a 4 in a row in the 1930s

Of course and if Kerry hadn't beaten us in two final it would have been six in a row

yahoo_moe · 02-09-2008 4:36pm

DDC1990 wrote: »

As for Telecaster, I think they are linked. Cooper, Tom O'Sullivan, The three Ó Sé's all played with those players mentioned above, and MF Russell is still on the panel... looking for a sneaky 6 All Ireland.

I agree with Telecaster and was just about to make the same point.

Seanies/DDC, I agree there are links and it's been a good transition but if Kerry win this year, that'll be 5 AIs in 9 years. But the 2000 team had a lot more in common with the '97 team than this year's crop so I don't really think that you could say the same team will have won (if they do

) 5 AIs in 9 years. It's more like 2 teams winning 6 AIs in 12 years, with some overlap in the middle and the latter team winning 4 in 5.

O'Dwyer's team had a lot more fellas winning 5-7 AIs each - Power, Sheehy, Deenihan, O'Keeffe, Egan, Spillane, Moran, Liston, O'Shea, etc. (I haven't checked the exact details but you get the gist) - whereas in the last 9/12 years, Kerry have had a lot more 2-3 AI players than 4/5 AI players.

So... I don't think this Kerry team compares with the 70s team because I don't think it's one team.

Kerry Footballers 2000-2008 - Best Team Ever?

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