Moderator attitude on the Soccer Forum

--amadeus-- · 20-08-2008 09:37AM

Firstly thanks for giving your side of the story - put like that I can understand you getting frustrated; it's only human and I appreciate you are a volunteer.

This particular thread wasn't about the rule changes it was about the attitude of moderators. There are a specific set of posts (some of which you referenced, some I linked to in my OP) which I thought were particulalry OTT, which showed moderators posting in an inflamatory, overly emotional and bad tempered manner. Looking at it from teh perspective of pages and pages of negativity I can understand anyone losing thier cool.

But talk to anyone who has worked in IT development. You spend days (or weeks and months) slaving over something you think is the poodles privates only for the ingrates you did it all for to crib and moan over the smallest, most unimportant detail while ignoring all the great stuff. It's annoying as hell and you want to slap them. But you can't, you suck it up, smile, and say "Right, we'll look at that, but lets see how it works". Because in the real world you can't just take a pop at people who are muppets. In particular you can't take a pop at muppets if you have a position of responsibility over them, you have to lead by example.

All teh sniping aside there have been a few people on this thread who feel that the tone of some of teh moderation has been excessive at times. I stand by the idea that a bitchy moderator makes for a bitchy forum (I personally would prefer fewer rules more rigidly enforced and with more no comment banings but I'm not a mod!). I can see where you are coming from with the provocation of users but can you see where we are coming from?

_blank_ · 20-08-2008 09:39AM

javaboy wrote: »

It's funny. I know why the entry rules are there and I fully agree with the need for them but for some reason it kind of irks me that I'd have to apply for access with the whole "state the italicised words" thing. It feels a bit condescending or something. I think other people feel the same way.

Not enough for it to really matter.

For every dissenting voice to the access request procedure, about once a month I'd say (or less) there are on average 5 requests a DAY to get into soccer. So that's about (30*5) 150 people who have no issue and just get on with it, to one or two voices, usually the same voices, per month.

I'd say that's a pretty high success rate.

mike65 · 20-08-2008 09:45AM

I thought I said Platini is a Grade A wanker. (unless I used Ronaldo in a cheeky tag description).

Mike

PHB · 20-08-2008 09:46AM

I think you've missed my point.

Looking at it from teh perspective of pages and pages of negativity I can understand anyone losing thier cool.

I have no problem with negativity. None. Couldn't care less.

Because in the real world you can't just take a pop at people who are muppets. In particular you can't take a pop at muppets if you have a position of responsibility over them, you have to lead by example.

Really? You live a different life to me.

All teh sniping aside there have been a few people on this thread who feel that the tone of some of teh moderation has been excessive at times.

I'll live with it. Honestly, I'm fine with discussion, I really am.

But if you make stupid posts and display a lack of understanding that a 5 year old could make, I think i'll point that out.

And if somebody wants to compare me it to fascism and talk about over-regulation, I think I'll respond

What the hell is wrong with people?

You have to post match discussions in match threads.
You can post other stuff in the superthread.

That's over regulation? That's Hitler like?
Grow up for crying out loud.

Nice editing in the first post btw, good to see you're keeping it clean.

I'll respond in kind

thanks ...I can see where you are coming from

PHB · 20-08-2008 09:46AM

mike65 wrote: »

I thought I said Platini is a Grade A wanker. (unless I used Ronaldo in a cheeky tag description).

Mike

That was another ban you got if I'm not mistaken. You used Ronaldo in a tag description. You never got banned for it because you were already banned and I guess the statute of limitations would be passed by now.

javaboy · 20-08-2008 09:47AM

Des wrote: »

Not enough for it to really matter.

For every dissenting voice to the access request procedure, about once a month I'd say (or less) there are on average 5 requests a DAY to get into soccer. So that's about (30*5) 150 people who have no issue and just get on with it, to one or two voices, usually the same voices, per month.

I'd say that's a pretty high success rate.

Oh I'm not arguing that it's not successful and I'm actually in favour of it. It clearly goes a long way towards keeping the idiots out. My point was that it feels kind of childish/condescending to me.

Chong · 20-08-2008 09:52AM

Xavi6 wrote: »

Phew, I wasn't mentioned! :pac:

Phew indeed, in fairness great post PHB.

I think at the end of the day , Amadeus is looking for a little more respect. He is looking for less of the talking down/adult to child approach. That is all he is looking from this post I believe.

If people are to be banned simply ban them thats it.

Chong · 20-08-2008 09:55AM

I think undoubtedly the changes are good, for the place, it rocked the weekend when I could go back to the United thread without the match day clutter.

ITs all about respect in this situation, Mods need to respect the majority of the posters on their forum and the posters need to respect the mods.

--amadeus-- · 20-08-2008 09:57AM

Not sure if you are being sarcastic about my editing of your post? I picked the parts of it that I thought illustrated my point and used an ellipse to show that I had ommitted parts.

Anyway I think we've hit on the point of difference - I have never and would never take a confrontational or agressive stance in a real life conversation. In particular I feel that it's wrong to do so when you have some degree of seniority or authority. From what you've just said you feel that it's acceptable to do so.

There is a world of difference between being Assertive and being Aggressive. My viewpoint is that there have been times when your reaction to stupid posts has been, well...stupid!

Anyway, glad that you can see where I am coming fom and good luck with the forum.

_blank_ · 20-08-2008 09:58AM

Van Zuylen wrote: »

I think undoubtedly the changes are good, for the place, it rocked the weekend when I could go back to the United thread without the match day clutter.

Thsi is the best thing about the new rules. Zero clutter in the superthreads.

It's brilliant, and anyone who can't see and accept that either

a. has an agenda against the mods
b. is an idiot.
c. all of the above

Boggles · 20-08-2008 10:05AM

Des wrote: »

Thsi is the best thing about the new rules. Zero clutter in the superthreads.

It's brilliant, and anyone who can't see and accept that either

a. has an agenda against the mods
b. is an idiot.
c. all of the above

d. A Liverpool fan.

_blank_ · 20-08-2008 10:07AM

Boggles wrote: »

d. A Liverpool fan.

Actually.

The overwhelming majority of people who are up-in-arms about this are Liverpool fans.

Bitterness over the "Liverpool only" forum being rejected, I'd say. It looks like it may even be an organised backlash at this stage.

Grow up lads.

Chong · 20-08-2008 10:11AM

Des wrote: »

Actually.

The overwhelming majority of people who are up-in-arms about this are Liverpool fans.

Bitterness over the "Liverpool only" forum being rejected, I'd say. It looks like it may even be an organised backlash at this stage.

Grow up lads.

Well tbh thats BS "if" they are, My Man United forum idea was turned completely on its head, everyone has the realise these are not going to happen.

--amadeus-- · 20-08-2008 10:11AM

OT, but anyway...

If there is an organised backlash I've not heard of it and this thread is not part of it.

But that utterly pointless jibe by Boggles is symptomatic of the crap that he throws up time and time again on the LFC superthread. Now I've no problem with someone coming in and saying thier piece - quite a few Villa fans did during the Barry saga - but stirring for the sake of it gets a bit tiresome. And maybe the LFC fans are the most vocal about the rules because thier thread gets a far higher proportion of "external" muppetry*?

[edit]*I mean people who are not team followers who seem to go to the thread with the express purpose of getting a rise out of people rather than non-followers going in for a proper conversation

mike65 · 20-08-2008 10:14AM

Boggles is indeed a source of great annoyance/amusment (depending) yet he gets away with it every time.

Des if Liverpool fans did organise a backlash, the mods would be very aware of it.

Mike.

javaboy · 20-08-2008 10:19AM

@PHB my scroll wheel is knackered! I haven't seen posts that long in Feedback since Overheal's last "Long Cat is Long" effort.

_blank_ · 20-08-2008 10:19AM

--amadeus-- wrote: »

And maybe the LFC fans are the most vocal about the rules because thier thread gets a far higher proportion of "external" muppetry*?

[edit]*I mean people who are not team followers who seem to go to the thread with the express purpose of getting a rise out of people rather than non-followers going in for a proper conversation

No.

It seems to me that in the Liverpool thread, anyone who comes in with "criticism" or an opinion that doesn't toe the general line of the Liverpool fans on the thread is called a troll/muppet or whatever.

It's oversensitivity.

_blank_ · 20-08-2008 10:21AM

mike65 wrote: »

Des if Liverpool fans did organise a backlash, the mods would be very aware of it.

How?

As far as I know, Mods, or Admins, don't have access to people's personal email accounts.

stovelid · 20-08-2008 10:27AM

I spend a great deal of my life having to put up with my wife's bemusement at how supporting my team(s) can turn a grown man into a fool.

Just occasionally, I can see her point.

Sherifu · 20-08-2008 10:28AM

Des wrote: »

How?

As far as I know, Mods, or Admins, don't have access to people's personal email accounts.

5starpool · 20-08-2008 10:30AM

Boggles wrote: »

d. A Liverpool fan.

Very mature, well done.

Des wrote: »

Actually.

The overwhelming majority of people who are up-in-arms about this are Liverpool fans.

Bitterness over the "Liverpool only" forum being rejected, I'd say. It looks like it may even be an organised backlash at this stage.

Grow up lads.

I have no real interest in a Liverpool only forum here, but I did much prefer it when all Liverpool related things were kept in one thread. I don't use threads during matches so all the "goal, torres" etc comments don't bother me, but if I happened to not see a game or highlights I would be likely to look in the liverpool thread in the hours afterwards (or before for midweek games esp) to see what people had to say, but if I had to get through a thread talking about 10 games to filter out the liverpool related comments.

As for the idea of a liverpool fans organised backlash, lol, conspiracy forum is thataway

>

_blank_ · 20-08-2008 10:34AM

5starpool wrote: »

but if I had to get through a thread talking about 10 games to filter out the liverpool related comments.

It has already been stated in the rules, that for "big" matches, there can be seperate threads.

redspider · 20-08-2008 10:39AM

PHB wrote: »

This is an absolutely huge post.

This is when I got actively pissed off.

Now to me this idea is one of two things, profoundly stupid or childish. I'd believe the latter.

to see if people would be stop talking crap.

but half of the stuff brought up was a load of ****e. It's possible some posts were just really really stupid, or its possible that they were just being childish, I'm not entirely sure.

All in all, I'm pretty pissed off not only about this feedback thread, but the thread in the soccer forum.

Either way, I'm happy to stand by saying a 5 year old could understand the distinction.

That post by PHB is 'the world according to PHB'. Others will see it differently and one thing is for sure, there is clearly a split among soccer forum members as to the usefulness of this new 'match posts' rule. The OP's point is also quite valid as the way the modding has been carried out shows a very bad attitude in a lot of cases.

As a mod PHB, you should not be getting pissed off, you should not be calling discussion a load of shi.te, you should not be calling things childish. Nor should any mod.

One suggestion I would offer is that all Mods should act like actual Referees do in football matches. Refs dont go around getting pissed off, and calling players 'names'. If the rules are clear and fairly implemented, then everyone knows how to behave. The football authorities are trying to bring in respect as an attitude to go across the board.

This is a new rule and it has just been introduced just before many seasons have started. Like any new rule, it has been brought in for certain reasons and aims. However, there can be faults with it if part of its implementation is deleting posts which are subjective in nature. I would have no problem with the rule if posts such as:

"Get in there Player Name"
"you beauty" etc

were moved to a match thread. (I dont find those kind of posts useful anyway even in a match thread but thats another story). But if a post is 20% match stuff and 80% other, then what. A poster could find that their post is deleted without question.

Another suggestion, perhaps the rule can be adjusted that once the match has ended that people can post about a match in a club superthread. Consider the superthread as a pub.

The point I raised about superthreads having problems in themselves is that are are N sub-topics going on at any club, and these get lost easily and mixed up in a forum. This problem is still there even with all match posts removed. Separate sub-forums would seem to be the only solution for that.

By the way, I have no problem going into any club's superthread and discussing the merits or otherwise of players tactics performances etc. Just the fact that I limit myself to the Liverpool superthread is due to time constraints. I have plenty of opinions, dont worry about that.

Boggles > I stand by my muppet comment

By the way, isnt this against the football charter by insulting someone else? As a result, shouldnt Boggles be banned or yellow-carded?

Or do mods care about insults at all?

Redspider

5starpool · 20-08-2008 10:43AM

Des wrote: »

It has already been stated in the rules, that for "big" matches, there can be seperate threads.

I don't just want to read about comments on 'big' matches. By big, I assume united v liverpool type games or semis and finals or title clinching games.

Chong · 20-08-2008 10:49AM

redspider wrote: »

you should not be calling discussion a load of shi.te, you should not be calling things childish. Nor should any mod.

I strongly agree on this point this what so many people and mods fail to realise, they are there to do a job they volunteered for . Now the job might be extremely difficult but they were not forced in to the position they took up. Mods sometimes note I said sometimes are on a power trip, some are very good at their jobs. The problem is when they go over board in the job they do and start to take the whole job personally.

20-08-2008 10:58AM

Des wrote: »

No.

It seems to me that in the Liverpool thread, anyone who comes in with "criticism" or an opinion that doesn't toe the general line of the Liverpool fans on the thread is called a troll/muppet or whatever.

It's oversensitivity.

I am a Liverpool fan and I have to agree with Des here. Alot of the people that post in that thread are over sensetive. For example I made the point one day defending MON about the Barry situation and people as usual had a hissy fit. There are fans from every club that don't have an open mind about football & they don't see by the aura of their own club on Boards & in real life. That will never change but when people like Boogles are coming into a thread like the Liverpool one and purposely acting the bollix it does put a spanner in the works.

@ Boogles - you can be very annoying but at the same time humorous as I know you're generally just taking the piss. I don't react to it but a majority of people do. You can see by the amount of complaints & the amount of people that have put you on ignore that you are doing no good so why keep doing it? I find it funny at times but I really think we could do without your contribution to our thread. You wouldn't like if Mr.Alan or someone kept posting in a trowlish manner in the United thread.

Chong · 20-08-2008 11:01AM

Something I was told many times in Soccer forum, and elsewhere, if you dont like people or there posts ignore simple as. If the lad boggles irks people ignore him, I on the other like boggles

. Ignore is a utility available , use it.

PHB · 20-08-2008 11:05AM

redspider wrote: »

Boggles > I stand by my muppet comment

By the way, isnt this against the football charter by insulting someone else? As a result, shouldnt Boggles be banned or yellow-carded?

Or do mods care about insults at all?

Redspider

Check what forum it is.

Second time you've made accusations of bad modding which have now twice turned out to completely utterly amazingly impressively wrong.

As for the other stuff, I've already addressed every objection you made about 20 times, read my posts in the discussion of rules thread.

Oh, but if you're looking for the one reason for the rule change, it's been posted 2 posts above us.

by KaG
I find it funny at times but I really think we could do without your contribution to our thread. You wouldn't like if Mr.Alan or someone kept posting in a trowlish manner in the United thread.

_blank_ · 20-08-2008 11:09AM

Deleted User wrote: »

I really think we could do without your contribution to our thread.

Liverpool fans DO NOT OWN the Liverpool thread.

Why can they not accept that?

It is clearly in the rules, Boards.ie and any threads thereon are open to ANYBODY to post on.

If a person has access to the soccer forum, they have access to all threads.

No one group has, or should expect, special exclusive access rights

If people WANT that, then there are a crapload of rose-tinted fansites where you can go and have cozy love ins.

Boards isn't that place. No matter how hard people cry about it.

And, it never should be.

Chong · 20-08-2008 11:13AM

Des wrote: »

Liverpool fans DO NOT OWN the Liverpool thread.

Why can they not accept that?

It is clearly in the rules, Boards.ie and any threads thereon are open to ANYBODY to post on.

If a person has access to the soccer forum, they have access to all threads.

No one group has, or should expect, special exclusive access rights

If people WANT that, then there are a crapload of rose-tinted fansites where you can go and have cozy love ins.

Boards isn't that place. No matter how hard people cry about it.

And, it never should be.

Sometimes its hard to adhere to that thought, cause some of us are used to our "Rose Tinted websites". I for one though do respect the concept now as you have said everywhere on boards is for everyone to post, its just diffcult sometimes.

Moderator attitude on the Soccer Forum

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