Sarkozy: 'The Irish will vote again'

Call Me Jimmy · 16-07-2008 07:53AM

At least give them a chance to say that before ye complain about it!

cournioni · 16-07-2008 08:20AM

Cocky cùnt... For that, I hope there is another referendum and Ireland vote no 100% out of spite.

Reku · 16-07-2008 08:26AM

javaboy wrote: »

The people of Ireland voted in a government which wants to make the treaty law but they cannot change the constitution without a referendum. If people didn't want a pro-European government in power, they should have just voted Sinn Fein and be done with it. But if people are going to vote in a government that is pro-Europe then don't be surprised when they try to get European legislation passed.

You're confusing our MEPs with our TDs, one group are there to manage the internal running of the country, the other to look after our affairs that relate to our membership of the EU.
edit**While most of our MEPs were in favour of a yes vote, 2 were saying to vote no and one said he hadn't even read the treaty when asked about it, 2/13 is far from a majority, but it still indicates that we weren't voting in people who's job it is to deal with the EU on Ireland's behalf according to their stance on one single treaty.

javaboy wrote: »

That's hilarious. It's a false analogy though. The more accurate one would be the man asking her again. The man would be committing a crime by forcing himself on the woman and similarly the government would be violating our constitution by forcing the Lisbon treaty through as it stands.

Yes, and oddly enough if you follow someone around repeatedly asking them to have sex with you when they said no the first time you will be arrested for harassment.

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

If it's a vote for the same treaty, it's a farce to have another vote - especially so close after the last treaty.

+1
If they've changed it even a little I'll give it full consideration as to how I feel about it's implications. If they haven't I'll be voting "no" though I voted "yes" the last time as I really don't care for them feeling like they can just make us keep revoting until we give in and vote the way they want us to.

Call Me Jimmy wrote: »

Worst comes to worst, ye have to spend roughly 15 minutes voting again. Vote no if ye like and that's him told. If there is a regular bi-yearly vote on it, then yer free to vote out a government that is allowing that to happen. Don't over-dramatize the situation, though.

Actually I lose about 40-50mins out of my day each time they do this when you factor in the trip to the polling station and the return home. I already spend most of my waking hours either in work or traveling to/from it, leave me what little time I've left to relax.

Sherifu · 16-07-2008 09:02AM

Are they at least going to change a word in the treaty or something?

Wibbs · 16-07-2008 09:06AM

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

Why don't they just remove the No from the ballot paper altogether? If it's not going to be acknowledged and listened to, we may as well save on the ink.

Nail on the head.

16-07-2008 09:09AM

This post has been deleted.

Call Me Jimmy · 16-07-2008 09:10AM

Fair enough but that's worst case scenario. I'm saying if Sarkozy's private comments had the force of law behind them here I'de agree it's unacceptable. I think it would be quite dangerous politically for the government to ask us to vote again on the same treaty in the near future so I don't think they are just going to jump into anything too quickly.

seamus · 16-07-2008 09:13AM

Sherifu wrote: »

Are they at least going to change a word in the treaty or something?

It would be ultra-fail not to. You can even see that some people are considering voting no just because they're being asked again.

Some token lines into the constitution that guaranteed those items which weren't even threatened - abortion, neutrality and tax - and the treaty would sail through.

You couldn't even complain about being asked a second time, because it would be a different item that we're being asked to vote on.

I'd ignore Sarkozy anyway. Giving the French the European Presidency is like giving the microphone at your wedding to your drunk, sexually suspect uncle. He'll talk a lot, but everyone knows he's just full of **** and a little sleazy.

Rb · 16-07-2008 09:13AM

He'll be here on Monday, if anyone knows of any protests or the like that are going to be staged, please pm me as I'd very much like to attend.

The Lisbon Treaty aims to give more power to France and Germany, I think after all Sarkozy has said over the last month or so I can safely say I will never vote in favour of something that does this. I don't care if they make guarantees on anything anymore, I don't want any more power put into the hands of these un-democratic pricks.

Rb · 16-07-2008 09:17AM

seamus wrote: »

I'd ignore Sarkozy anyway. Giving the French the European Presidency is like giving the microphone at your wedding to your drunk, sexually suspect uncle. He'll talk a lot, but everyone knows he's just full of **** and a little sleazy.

His words seem to have swayed the Czechs and Poles thus far anyway.

Speaking of Sarkozy and drunks, here he is drunk at the G8 summit!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uxb0JHqzlA

Call Me Jimmy · 16-07-2008 09:17AM

But you guys think he leaked it on purpose? That's the only way this could be considered bullying imo and if he did he is a lot more stupid than he looks.

thelordofcheese · 16-07-2008 09:24AM

darkman2 wrote: »

They take NO as not the answer. They want you to vote again. Jesus even if I was a YES supporter - as an Irish person the bullying is unacceptable. Why do people think they said other states to ratify - that is bullying because they are forcing Irish people to look at everywhere else (that where not given democratic referendum) and say do you want to be the odd one out?

I dont like being bullied - im voting no - I dont care about the treaty anymore.

Jesus, not even a week darkman. No cake for you.

Pompey Magnus · 16-07-2008 09:37AM

I was away last time around and didn't get to vote, I will make sure I am available next time to vote No.

To be honest I had been wavering towards a Yes vote in the last day or two before the referendum but I am convinced now in voting against it.

rowlandbrowner · 16-07-2008 09:49AM

he speaks of democracy like it's an obstacle he's trying to navigate past.

super_furry · 16-07-2008 09:53AM

Call Me Jimmy wrote: »

But you guys think he leaked it on purpose? That's the only way this could be considered bullying imo and if he did he is a lot more stupid than he looks.

Well if it was a private meeting of his inner circle, I can't see how it could have come out any other way.

ven0m · 16-07-2008 09:57AM

The second Cowan & his bunch of idiots say we're having a second vote, video & audio footage of him saying "there would be no second vote" will be wheeled out & they can forget about ratification.

What is so funny is, Lisbon is about better democracy apparently - so that means in short judging by the behavior of other countries, acting like dictators & communists is the best way to achieve a new version of the European Union Of State Socialist Republic (EUSSR). Lets face it, there are more Eastern European peoples in the EU now than there are traditional Western Europeans. Do the maths & look at the comments being made by the leaders & ministers in those countries.

javaboy · 16-07-2008 10:04AM

Call Me Jimmy wrote: »

Don't mistake this for me defending him because he seems like a douchebag anyway but a comment in a private meeting with his own people (the context of which hasn't been reported) hardly equates to bullying.

The bottom line is, no matter how many times he "bullies" us he can't force us to vote yes. Worst comes to worst, ye have to spend roughly 15 minutes voting again. Vote no if ye like and that's him told. If there is a regular bi-yearly vote on it, then yer free to vote out a government that is allowing that to happen. Don't over-dramatize the situation, though.

+1. Sarkozy doesn't have any power over us. He is entitled to voice his opinions the same as the rest of us.

Dyr · 16-07-2008 10:06AM

Sarkozy reminds me of this guy

Steve_o · 16-07-2008 10:10AM

Sarkozy can voice his 'opinions' all he wants, the country voted no, tbh I voted yes and would love to have seen the treaty ratified but it wasn't and this is a democracy so thats the end of it as far as i'm concerned.

humanji · 16-07-2008 10:12AM

Is anyone else going to wait and see what happens before going on an ill-informed tirade against the EU?

thelordofcheese · 16-07-2008 10:16AM

humanji wrote: »

Is anyone else going to wait and see what happens before going on an ill-informed tirade against the EU?

Ohh god no, this is AH.
Reailty be damned!

(sadly this kind of kneejerk ranting has infected the European Union forum too)

SimpleSam06 · 16-07-2008 10:26AM

javaboy wrote: »

+1. Sarkozy doesn't have any power over us. He is entitled to voice his opinions the same as the rest of us.

No he is not. He's the representative of a major European power and currently the chief representative of the entire European Union. He is not free to voice his opinions like anyone else. And given that he is the head of one of two countries that hold the lions share of power in Europe and the EU, an economic and political union we are members of, he does indeed have power over us.

Sarkozy himself is a miniature strongman who came to power on the promise of restoring law and order in France, boosting the economy and dealing effectively with immigrant issues. He also doubled his own salary last year. On a personal level, he says that being bullied at school because of his short size "made him all that he is today". This should give you a clear idea of what kind of person we are dealing with.

What gets a lot of people here is that the actions of the EU in this are not representative of the free and democratic Europe we all want to see, but are starting to look more and more like countries which have tried several times in the past to conquer Europe muscling smaller nations into some sort of United States of Europe, and hang the consequences.

We don't want that.

We don't need that.

If they override our voice in this, there is no limit to what they will override in future as it suits them. We are after all, only 1% of Europe's population. I would be very much in favour of the ideal of Europe as its meant to be, but thats looking less and less likely as time goes on.

You won't see a lot of the talking heads from politics stepping in here, ostensibly because "its AH" :rolleyes:, but mostly because they can't ban anyone who disagrees with them here.

SimpleSam06 · 16-07-2008 10:28AM

thelordofcheese wrote: »

(sadly this kind of kneejerk ranting has infected the European Union forum too)

Well purge the infection, comrade! Cleanse and purify for a new Europe!

danmcmie · 16-07-2008 10:30AM

If they make changes to the treaty such as securing the right to our neurtrality, controlling our own tax and abortion laws or keeping our commissioner (some french papers say these will be the new changes) or whatever else the No campaign where whinging about, then whats the harm in a new referendum ???????????

This is exactly what the no campaign was looking for in the first place and for the yes voters (like me), we are getting more than they voted for than they did the first time!!!

Run_to_da_hills · 16-07-2008 10:30AM

javaboy wrote: »

+1. Sarkozy doesn't have any power over us. He is entitled to voice his opinions the same as the rest of us.

Sarkozy is up on his high horse looking for brownie points and thinks he has power over us. If he is like this now you can imagine him if he actually did have control over us. All these idiots are the same when they are placed up on a pedistal, give them nothing and stay out of it, we should have learned our lesson over 800 years.

Dyr · 16-07-2008 10:33AM

Needless to say, If i had a shotgun I'd be loading it right now, over our dead bodies napoleon sarkozy, these tricolours dont run etc etc ROI! ROI! ROI!

thelordofcheese · 16-07-2008 10:34AM

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

Well purge the infection, comrade! Cleanse and purify for a new Europe!

Can't i just settle for ignoring your piss poor attempt at being clever?

Zulu · 16-07-2008 10:40AM

Bambi wrote: »

Needless to say, If i had a shotgun I'd be loading it right now, over our dead bodies napoleon sarkozy, these tricolours dont run etc etc ROI! ROI! ROI!

An bhfuil tu in ann e sin a ra as gaeilge?

Call Me Jimmy · 16-07-2008 10:43AM

Anyone know what that means?

Run_to_da_hills · 16-07-2008 10:45AM

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

Sarkozy himself is a miniature strongman who came to power on the promise of restoring law and order in France, boosting the economy and dealing effectively with immigrant issues. .

He is trying to tackle the same issue on European immigrant and will do it effectivly by bringing in the Euro ID Smart card. He can shove this up his ho*le.

Sarkozy: 'The Irish will vote again'

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