20 Year old Irish man,shot dead by US police

_blank_ · 03-07-2008 10:54AM

Deleted User wrote: »

Has it even been announced where he had been shot? (on the body, before anyone says Oregon)

Little toe.

ejmaztec · 03-07-2008 10:56AM

Dragan wrote: »

Well in the public eye the whole guilty till proven innocent thing applies it seems.

Well, at least the cop will get the opportunity of proving it either way, but Hanlon won't.

Steve · 03-07-2008 11:03AM

There is a lot of urban myth surfacing in this thread:

Deleted User wrote: »

Im not saying he definitely didnt do something to warrant force being used but A) cops are supposed to try and wound, not kill. and going by what we have heard, with the cop being put on admin leave, it definitely seems fishy.

A) If an officer decides to shoot, they are trained to aim for centre body mass which is the most effective way to disable to disable the suspect. Basically if they shoot, they shoot to kill. They also cannot shoot unless they believe the suspect has a lethal weapon and is about to use it. A lot of kids get shot waving imitation firearms

The officer is suspended with pay after any firearms incident involving death or injury. By shooting, the officer is risking his career, livelihood and even liberty so they don't take the decision lightly.

I have some friends in Oregon and have been to a few of the shooting ranges that the cops use and got to know a few of them as well. Thats what I'm basing this on.

The whole 'shoot to injure' or 'shoot him in the leg' or 'shoot the gun from his hand' thing is a load of codswallop as well and only happens in the movies. Untill you've actually tried to shoot something for real with a handgun, you can't understand how inaccurate they are, that's why they aim for centre body mass.
In the shooting range at 25yds, you're doing well to hit the target (about the size of an A4 page), let alone get a bullseye.

Kintarō Hattori · 03-07-2008 11:06AM

ThE_IVIAcIVIAIV wrote: »

the shame, what an ****in idiot cop i hope he dies.whats the world coming to? and maybe he was just in the wrong place at the wrong time... and didn't rob anybody. and having mental problems is no reason to be shot. and sure the cop wouldn't have known about his probs.... poor family.

I'd recommend following the advice you give in your sig.

skywalker · 03-07-2008 11:08AM

ThE_IVIAcIVIAIV wrote: »

the shame, what an ****in idiot cop i hope he dies.whats the world coming to? and maybe he was just in the wrong place at the wrong time... and didn't rob anybody. and having mental problems is no reason to be shot. and sure the cop wouldn't have known about his probs.... poor family.

AS has been said already, no one here knows the circumstances of the case, and you "hope the cop dies" are you serious?

DadaKopf · 03-07-2008 11:18AM

Yeah, feck sake. The kneejerkism in this thread is insane.

What we know:

An Irish man has been shot dead
A police officer shot him
There was an allegation of a robbery
It happened in Silverton, Orgeon

What we don't know

Anything about Hanlon or his mental state
What he was doing
What provocation led to the shooting
Firearm policy and training of the Oregonian police service

We know nothing, yet so many people will jump to conclusions based on teary-eyed feelings of nationalism and anti-Americanism. Oh, no, a son of mother Ireland could never do anything wrong, it must be those nasty, gun totin' Americans. Total Irish exceptionalist narccissism.

R0ot · 03-07-2008 11:35AM

DesF wrote: »

Hang on.

The sister was on the rayjo this morning.

Apparently the dude was being treated for psychological problems.

Maybe he gave the policeman cause to shoot?

Well short of pulling a knife/crowbar/gun on the police officer there would not have been cause to shoot no matter how "freaky" he may have been acting, it's the reason the police carry tazers(sp?), pepper spray and batons.

Wompa1 · 03-07-2008 12:02PM

I watch alot of CSI so I think I can solve this groovy mystery..The young man in question frequented an Ice Cream parlour not 5 minutes from the scene of the shooting, That night he had himself some punch and pie before walking back to his house. When walking home he came upon a burglary, he called the cops and asked for assistance, as the cops arrived he realised he was an illegal alien and decided to run, the cops shouted at him to stop but he didn't hear them due to an inner ear problem he developed at the age of 9 when he banged his head falling off a see-saw, he kept running giving the cop no alternative but to shoot. Don't thank me just pay it forward!

joejoem · 03-07-2008 12:08PM

drunkmonkey wrote: »

That's why i've never visited or intend on visiting America....

Cops are shooting civillans everyday, I think the cops in this case as making out that he could have been escaping from a burgulary (which is utter rubbish).
Even if he was that's no reason to shoot a man dead...

*makes mongo face*

America isn't all gun wielding maniacs. From reading that article it would seem the fella had phsycological problems, I find it hard to believe that the cop was just using him as target practice inbetween swigging moonshine.

Yes its a sad case, I'm sure if I was a cop / garda putting my life on the line is different situations I would choose my safety over someone suspicious. It would depend on the circumstance of course.

ejmaztec · 03-07-2008 12:13PM

joejoem wrote: »

*makes mongo face*

America isn't all gun wielding maniacs. From reading that article it would seem the fella had phsycological problems, I find it hard to believe that the cop was just using him as target practice inbetween swigging moonshine.

.

You forgot the doughnuts

03-07-2008 12:15PM

Tasers can kill as well. And if the person died from this, then people will ask, "why were tasers used?"

MIN2511 · 03-07-2008 12:25PM

Wompa1 wrote: »

I watch alot of CSI so I think I can solve this groovy mystery..The young man in question frequented an Ice Cream parlour not 5 minutes from the scene of the shooting, That night he had himself some punch and pie before walking back to his house. When walking home he came upon a burglary, he called the cops and asked for assistance, as the cops arrived he realised he was an illegal alien and decided to run, the cops shouted at him to stop but he didn't hear them due to an inner ear problem he developed at the age of 9 when he banged his head falling off a see-saw, he kept running giving the cop no alternative but to shoot. Don't thank me just pay it forward!

hehehee

R0ot · 03-07-2008 12:48PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Tasers can kill as well. And if the person died from this, then people will ask, "why were tasers used?"

Yeah well a baton can kill too. I'd rather have the chance of a tazer hit not killing me over someone shooting me and i'm sure others are the same.

Manic Moran · 03-07-2008 01:02PM

The ignorance is strong in this thread...

Dadakopf has it right. We know basically nothing upon which to base a decision either condemning or praising the cop.

It should also be noted that not all departments carry Tasers. They're something of a 'loaded' weapon, in that if they're used and someone dies, people holler "Why did they use a Taser on him!? Police Brutality!" or "There was no call to use a Taser on me! Police brutality!" and some departments simply couldn't be arsed to deal with it.

NTM

DadaKopf · 03-07-2008 01:02PM

Wompa1 wrote: »

I watch alot of CSI so I think I can solve this groovy mystery..The young man in question frequented an Ice Cream parlour not 5 minutes from the scene of the shooting, That night he had himself some punch and pie before walking back to his house. When walking home he came upon a burglary, he called the cops and asked for assistance, as the cops arrived he realised he was an illegal alien and decided to run, the cops shouted at him to stop but he didn't hear them due to an inner ear problem he developed at the age of 9 when he banged his head falling off a see-saw, he kept running giving the cop no alternative but to shoot. Don't thank me just pay it forward!

I'll wait 'till it's on Cold Case.

Canis Lupus · 03-07-2008 01:09PM

So many people jumping to conclusions on this thread that I had to check we weren't talking about Eastern Europeans.

run_Forrest_run · 03-07-2008 02:15PM

The mother of the victim is on Live Line right now.

Wompa1 · 03-07-2008 02:22PM

DadaKopf wrote: »

I'll wait 'till it's on Cold Case.

Did you not see the earlier thread!? People will demand answers! It won't go on long enough to reach cold case. Maybe since he's Irish the priority will be raised and they can get all the fictional detectives working on it, Grisham for his pithy one liners, Caruzo for his stupid one liners and sun glasses and Mac for his....I guess police work seeing as though the others are more joke characters...ohh and throw in House aswell just in case it wasn't the shot that killed him

yayamark · 03-07-2008 02:30PM

Jesus yer mad here in AH ye should be on the olympics for long jumps:rolleyes:

FruitLover · 03-07-2008 02:37PM

Deleted User wrote: »

BUT shoot him in a non fatal - non life threatening area FFS

Not an option for police. It's either shoot to the center mass or don't shoot at all. (Just realized this point has already been addressed)

stevec wrote: »

Basically if they shoot, they shoot to kill.

Not exactly - they shoot to incapacitate. Naturally, death is often a side-effect of a couple of bullets in the chest.

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Bollix the cops shot a man dead they are wrong, end of story!!!

Ah, we didn't realize you were there at the time of the shooting. Can you give us your eyewitness report please?

drunkmonkey wrote: »

If they ever arm the Gardai I will start carrying a gun myself and will shoot first if one of them even looks funny at me....

I doubt it. Trying to look like a hard man on the internet is really sad.

yayamark · 03-07-2008 02:52PM

oh great marie carthy from abbeylara is on now

Why hasnt she flown out to the states to get answers rather than tTALKING about it in radio 1.

Now people are giving her money?

Bunker85 · 03-07-2008 02:52PM

U.S. gun culture is world famous. The police over there never know when they stop someone if they are armed or not. Is it any wonder that the U.S. police tend to shoot first. They take no chances. Until the Law makers of the US ban the owning of personal weapons and change that culture, it's always gonna happen. And as a former member of the Irish Military, I know you don't shoot to wound, you shoot to kill, or render your oponent ineffective. But also you use the required amount of force required, so if your oponoent is unarmed you do not shoot to kill. If your oponent is running away you do not shoot to kill.

Run_to_da_hills · 03-07-2008 02:58PM

DadaKopf wrote: »

Yeah, feck sake. The kneejerkism in this thread is insane.

What we know:
An Irish man has been shot dead

A police officer shot him

There was an allegation of a robbery

It happened in Silverton, Orgeon

What we don't know
Anything about Hanlon or his mental state

What he was doing

What provocation led to the shooting

Firearm policy and training of the Oregonian police service

We know nothing, yet so many people will jump to conclusions based on teary-eyed feelings of nationalism and anti-Americanism. Oh, no, a son of mother Ireland could never do anything wrong, it must be those nasty, gun totin' Americans. Total Irish exceptionalist narccissism.

You can add also add to the fact that Andrew Hanlon was an Illegal Alien which would automatically make him a defendant in Big Brother America.

Bunker85 · 03-07-2008 02:58PM

U.S. gun culture is world famous. The police over there never know when they stop someone if they are armed or not. Is it any wonder that the U.S. police tend to shoot first. They take no chances. Until the Law makers of the US ban the owning of personal weapons and change that culture, it's always gonna happen. And as a former member of the Irish Military, I know you don't shoot to wound, you shoot to kill, or render your oponent ineffective. But also you use the required amount of force required, so if your oponoent is unarmed you do not shoot to kill. If your oponent is running away you do not shoot to kill.

CPT. SURF · 03-07-2008 03:02PM

Another reason they aim for the vital organs area is because a bullet is unlikely to pass through that part of a persons body and go on to injure someone else. If you start aiming for people's legs and arms you will have missed shots going off and hitting God knows what

Pigletlover · 03-07-2008 03:11PM

That interview on Liveline was radio at it's worst. The mother just seems to be out make as much money as she can out of her son's death, going on about how her main worry was being able to afford to get to America, then the pledges start rolling in. I can see her going on a big crusade all over America like Robert McCartney's sisters :rolleyes: She said she hadn't spoken to him for a couple of months, hardly sounds like a loving mother. His sister said on the radio this morning that she tried sending him home to get psychiatric care in Ireland, but there was no one to bring him from the airport to a hospital.

Kur4mA · 03-07-2008 03:17PM

It's terrible that he was shot dead, but the whole story sounds verrry fishy tbh. I don't trust any of the U.S officials to get to the bottom of it however, so expect nothing to come of this other than a whinging mother and a seemingly genuine upset sister.

Morlar · 03-07-2008 03:44PM

I think its sad for the family. The person who was shot had psychological problems and was recieving treatment, he was shot by a police officer answering a burglary call. Considering the above and the fact that it was the first shooting in that town in 20 years I can't think of any reason not to believe the police acted per their standard procedure at this point.

It seems to me that some people are intent on blaming the police regardless - if it had been their home being broken into by a strange man I wonder would they have felt the same. This nonsense about 'not visiting america' due to its gun culture is just silly. Hopefully the review will get to the bottom of it and if there was an over-reaction or a mistake I am sure the police officer will be hung out to dry.

jennieinthe08 · 03-07-2008 03:45PM

I knew AJ and all of us will really miss him. He was really excited to go to America and couldnt wait to go. I really think ot was wrong place wrong time because knowing him he didn't have a bad bone in his body. I'd love to know why such force was used because I really can't imagine him doing anything to provoke being shot dead. He was DEFINATELY not the type to carry a weapon. I hope he's at peace and they get to the bottom of this to prevent it happening again.
xxxx

drunkmonkey · 03-07-2008 04:12PM

FruitLover wrote: »

I doubt it. Trying to look like a hard man on the internet is really sad.

What, and you'd feel safe walking around at night knowing there's a 18 year old garda with an itchy trigger finger keeping the place safe...

get out of that garden, the majority of garda are good people but there's a few thugs in there that I would not feel safe around if I knew they were armed....

Police should not be armed!

20 Year old Irish man,shot dead by US police

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