Italy tackles Roma Gypsies.

_blank_ · 20-05-2008 09:30AM

Also the fact that Begging was basically made legal recently, it gave these societal leeches a carte blanche.

Bleeding Hearts answer this.

Is it ok for these people to shove their young kids in the faces of passing pedestrians and motorists while begging?

Suzywuzy · 20-05-2008 09:30AM

I had an incident with two female Romanian's on Saturday morning on my way into town. I'm far from racist, with half of my closest friends being from Moldova, Africa, etc, but these two women really pissed me off. And I heard similar stories that evening from a friend. Not going to go into details but can't say I've had good experiences with them, particularly these two who were highly insulting and ignorant. Would have confronted them in the same way had they been Irish, French or whatever nationality !!! :mad:

Slow Motion · 20-05-2008 09:30AM

DesF wrote: »

Bleeding hearts, answer this.

Should Ireland allow every Tom, Dick and Harry from all corners of the globe into the country, and then allow them to live in the filth and frankly animal conditions that existed on the M50 Roundabout?

QFT! I've said it before and am happy to say it again. If you are being persecuted for no good reason, if you have skills or even a wish to gain some, if you are honest decent and reasonably hardworking, if you want to contribute to this society and better your and your families circumstances, then come in and cead mile failte (sp). If you want to rip people off and live off our welfare state and indulge in criminality, FCUK OFF! And don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out!

Dudess · 20-05-2008 09:30AM

SDooM wrote: »

Ah, After Hours, where being liberal is a bad thing

Yeah, there is a certain bunch of idiots contingent who have that view but it's not unreasonable to be concerned about the anti-social behaviour endemic within Roma immigrant society. That's not being racist.

daisy123 wrote: »

Are they Roma or Romanians?

Roma. And Romanians are sick sh1t of being confused with them.

togster · 20-05-2008 09:31AM

Dudess wrote: »

Sorry, but... nonsense. People's concerns about the criminal elements among Roma communities are valid, not mindless racism.

Sorry but... i responded to a claim that ALL were like this. No group of people are without fault. It is racist to claim that ALL the members of a group of people are criminals. It is mindless racism because people don't take the time out to investigate what is happening. Roma gypsies are not the same as romanians. They originate from northern india and travelled.

Mena · 20-05-2008 09:32AM

Ah sure, you Irish are all wife beating drunks anyway no? I can't remember when last I saw a sober Irishman on a Friday night...

Gotta love generalisations!

This being said, if any immigrant (or native for that matter!) could not be arsed to contribute, turf them out. Lets just have less of the generalisations as they simply weaken your argument.

Sam Vimes · 20-05-2008 09:32AM

togster wrote: »

Yes everyone should conform to our way of thinking. Gas them all

are you being serious? there's a difference between respecting someone's right to, for example, wear special religious clothing and respecting someone's right to lie, cheat and steal their way through life. i'm not saying that they all do that but to suggest that doing it is just another way of life that should be respected is ridiculous

if you're taking the piss then disregard

aidan_walsh · 20-05-2008 09:32AM

I'm far from racist, with half of my closest friends being from Moldova, Africa, etc

/pays SDooM

Caoimhín · 20-05-2008 09:32AM

Bloody PC gone mad i say.
Drag em into the street and shoot them in the head.
That ill learn em.

_blank_ · 20-05-2008 09:33AM

togster wrote: »

Sorry but... i responded to a claim that ALL were like this. No group of people are without fault. It is racist to claim that ALL the members of a group of people are criminals. It is mindless racism because people don't take the time out to investigate what is happening. Roma gypsies are not the same as romanians. They originate from northern india and travelled.

I'm not mistaking Roma with Romanians, actually.

I know exactly what them animal-living people were on the M50.

I know exactly what kind of people lug babies around the streets with them are.

Slow Motion · 20-05-2008 09:33AM

Suzywuzy wrote: »

I had an incident with two female Romanian's on Saturday morning on my way into town. I'm far from racist, with half of my closest friends being from Moldova, Africa, etc, but these two women really pissed me off. And I heard similar stories that evening from a friend. Not going to go into details but can't say I've had good experiences with them, particularly these two who were highly insulting and ignorant. Would have confronted them in the same way had they been Irish, French or whatever nationality !!! :mad:

Or Roma? The distinction is quite important!

Dudess · 20-05-2008 09:33AM

Suzywuzy wrote: »

I had an incident with two female Romanian's

Roma.

togster · 20-05-2008 09:33AM

DesF wrote: »

The bleeding hearts want to see out country overrun by leeches, as far as I can tell.

And the racists want us all to gas themm Am i right? I doubt it so top generalising. It makes it pointless to debate with you.

Gone West · 20-05-2008 09:34AM

togster wrote: »

FuzzyLogic wrote: »

I applaud any action which disperses them from their burrowing into the framework of a modern society which is too PC for any of its institutions to step up to the plate and take action.

Yes everyone should conform to our way of thinking. Gas them all

Thats a ridiculous assertation that only stands to undermine your point of view on this issue, which you haven't actually expressed(before posting that), which is notable in itself.

Likewise, I know this is obvious and tedious for the >85 IQ crowd on AH today, but bear with me.
I've conveniently highlighted the relevant word in my post and the relevant word in your post. As you can see, I was talking about one specific sub group of people, not, as you suggest "everyone".

Have a nice day.

togster · 20-05-2008 09:34AM

DesF wrote: »

I'm not mistaking Roma with Romanians, actually.

.

But do you consider roma gypsies a race of people? You again failed to answer that!

_blank_ · 20-05-2008 09:35AM

togster wrote: »

And the racists want us all to gas themm Am i right? I doubt it so top generalising. It makes it pointless to debate with you.

All you are doing is bandying around the racist tag.

Why shouldn't we deport them, why should we put up with the ones who are acting outside the law?

Dudess · 20-05-2008 09:35AM

togster wrote: »

Sorry but... i responded to a claim that ALL were like this. No group of people are without fault. It is racist to claim that ALL the members of a group of people are criminals. It is mindless racism because people don't take the time out to investigate what is happening. Roma gypsies are not the same as romanians. They originate from northern india and travelled.

I was referring more to the "gas them all" comment you made to Fuzzylogic before DesF's comment about all Roma (which I disagreed with too) - I don't think Fuzzylogic is around to defend himself so I'm gonna say I think it's grossly unfair of you to imply he has a nazi-type mindset.

Doctor DooM · 20-05-2008 09:35AM

Dudess wrote: »

Yeah, there is a certain bunch of idiots contingent who have that view but it's not unreasonable to be concerned about the anti-social behaviour endemic within Roma immigrant society. That's not being racist.

Roma. And Romanians are sick sh1t of being confused with them.

Stating that no Roma is interested in integrating IS being racist though.

I don't think anyone is going to argue there is an issue here. I would like to be able to walk down O Connell Street without a begger latching onto my arm, just like everyone else (Thats O connell St in Dublin, Biko

)

My point is that saying something like that and statements like "bleeding heart liberals answer this" are approaching trolling and of course are going to get the far left eedjits (who are just as bad as far right, only tend to have less money

) going.

Bubs101 · 20-05-2008 09:36AM

Having lived in Italy I absolutely despise those scum and I applaud the actions of the Neapolitans,it's about time they did some thing, but I don't see how they can kick them all out. Believe me, I wish they could but they breed like Rabbits and most of the kids are born in Italy so surely they have a right to stay?

_blank_ · 20-05-2008 09:36AM

togster wrote: »

But do you consider roma gypsies a race of people? You again failed to answer that!

No, I don't.

You see, again, I see everyone as equal. Black, brown, yellow, red, pink, African, Asian, European, American.

But the people that act outside of the laws and just sponge of state benefits, beg with children and do not even attempt to find work or better themselves.

I look down on them.

Doctor DooM · 20-05-2008 09:38AM

DesF wrote: »

All you are doing is bandying around the racist tag.

Why shouldn't we deport them, why should we put up with the ones who are acting outside the law?

What you said was racist. You said all of them were bad, without exception. Thats racism.

But I agree with your point. no foreign criminals should be allowed use Ireland as their stomping ground.

Doctor DooM · 20-05-2008 09:39AM

aidan_walsh wrote: »

/pays SDooM

What can I say, he shoots, he scores.

Sparky · 20-05-2008 09:39AM

Any Roma I have come across have always been begging, trying to push cheap rings on you and then try to guilt trip you by showing their some other Romas kid at you.

I seen a Roma girl recently, no older than 20 with a child getting sasuages at a deli counter, then she goes up to the counter and then guilt trips the cashier that its for her child. If she was so poor, why the reason for all her teeth to be gold?
We dont need all this begging and whatnot

Sam Vimes · 20-05-2008 09:40AM

DesF wrote: »

Race doesn't come into it. If these were pure stock aryan people coming and doing this, I'd say the same.

it's not racism by the exact definition of racism but it is prejudice. just like if you hate all people from ballymun it's prejudice. someone doesn't have to belong to a different race for discriminating against them to be wrong.

i'm not disagreenig with you on the roma's though. just pointing out that it is a form of racism. i worked in retail for years and i don't think you'll find a single retail employee with a good opinion of roma gypsies. the most ridiculous example i ever heard was when my girlfriend was working in a pet shop and a woman with her two kids stole a hamster out of it's cage.

Sherifu · 20-05-2008 09:40AM

caoibhin wrote: »

Bloody PC gone mad i say.
Drag em into the street and shoot them in the head.
That ill learn em.

Dude this joke got old. Let it go.

_blank_ · 20-05-2008 09:41AM

SDooM wrote: »

What you said was racist. You said all of them were bad, without exception. Thats racism.

The exception proves the rule.

The fact that somebody knows a couple of successful Roma. Wow.

The vast majority have no interest in that though.

Kick out all the parasites, be they Roma, African, Asian, dammit even American. If an American person comes here and expected to get that treatment, fúck them, fúck off back to where you came from.

SDooM wrote: »

But I agree with your point. no foreign criminals should be allowed use Ireland as their stomping ground.

No people who beg with children.

No people who sponge off my tax money.

Look, I'd turf Irish people out too, but they are at least Irish.

We have enough of our own problems, without taking on others too.

Maximilian · 20-05-2008 09:43AM

togster wrote: »

Sorry but... i responded to a claim that ALL were like this. No group of people are without fault. It is racist to claim that ALL the members of a group of people are criminals. It is mindless racism because people don't take the time out to investigate what is happening. Roma gypsies are not the same as romanians. They originate from northern india and travelled.

Mena wrote: »

Ah sure, you Irish are all wife beating drunks anyway no? I can't remember when last I saw a sober Irishman on a Friday night...

Gotta love generalisations!

This being said, if any immigrant (or native for that matter!) could not be arsed to contribute, turf them out. Lets just have less of the generalisations as they simply weaken your argument.

Generalisations are necessary in these discussions but of course there will be exceptions. Generally speaking then, the following facts about Roma Gypsies are pretty hard to dispute. These people:

(a) Beg, in an obnoxious way;
(b) are involved in proportionately more crime than the average person;
(c) contribute nothing or very little to society;

Why on earth then, can anyone blame me for wishing to exclude them from our country. What debt do we owe these people? Are we too timid to say "actually no piss off we don't want you, sorry about that. Try France maybe"

As regards those who defend Roma gypsies - I think their sympathies are genuinely either misguided or misplaced. Hopefully the latter as there are far needier people out there.

Gone West · 20-05-2008 09:43AM

to the kool kids on the thread you know who you are

I get the point re: not 100/100 of the Romas you meet in Dublin are beggars, scammers, non-workers, etc.
Fair enough, but feck it, its close enough to 100%.

You don't have to be prejudiced, thats a silly thing to say. If I saw some romas chilling out, or eating in a restaurant, drinking a pint in a pub, anything at all, alls cool, I've not "pre judged" them. But when you see them sitting beside a phone box in the rain holding up a helpless baby to the wind and rain for sympathy coins, well then you judge them.
Its not prejudice, because its plain that they are scum when you see them doing this. Someone come on here and try to defend their actions...

I get the defending a people, the standing up for freedom and Human rights and all that, absolutely.

But seriously, somebody tell me that 90% or more of Romas that you see in Ireland aren't up to no good.

Doctor DooM · 20-05-2008 09:43AM

Sam Vimes wrote: »

it's not racism by the exact definition of racism but it is prejudice. just like if you hate all people from ballymun it's prejudice. someone doesn't have to belong to a different race for discriminating against them to be wrong.

i'm not disagreenig with you on the roma's though. just pointing out that it is a form of racism. i worked in retail for years and i don't think you'll find a single retail employee with a good opinion of roma gypsies. the most ridiculous example i ever heard was when my girlfriend was working in a pet shop and a woman with her two kids stole a hamster out of it's cage.

+1, from another ex retailer. I have had many many bad encounters with Roma in the past. In fact I used to do a real life roll eye smiley when I saw them come in the door. But I still wouldn't make a statement like that.

Sherifu · 20-05-2008 09:44AM

There must be a hell of a lot of them in Europe by now because I don't see too many of them here anymore.

Italy tackles Roma Gypsies.

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