Moscow as a CL Final Venue

Pal · 30-04-2008 08:02AM #1

I find this a very odd choice for such a big game.

Predict a lot of problems.
Visas, dodgy cops, hooligans, travel arrangements, exhorbitant prices, 2 English teams fans that don't mix well, etc.,

anybody got any view on Moscow.

would you go ?

Xavi6 · 30-04-2008 08:10AM

I guess UEFA want to mix it up and give all the big cities a chance to host what is a fantastic spectacle.

However, two English teams are not going to mix well. The United/Liverpool rivalry is pretty obvious and Chelsea have a well known hooligan fan base. The problems won't be in the stadium, it'll be in the surrounding bars amongst fans who don't have tickets. I think the Home Office in England said they'd impliment a 'No ticket, no visa' policy but I can't see that deterring most fans. I hope it doesn't end in a blood bath but that unfortunately looks like the most probable scenario, whether it's the fans or local police who are to blame.

Having said all that, and in response to the last question, yes I would go. For some it could be the opportunity of a lifetime to see their team in the biggest European final. If City were there it would be an absolute no brainer.

30-04-2008 08:15AM

It's not any odder than choosing a stadium in the middle of nowhere in Istanbul.

I do think Moscow is going to be a 'mare for fans.

It's an all-English final which is going to attract the less fragrant element, the Russian police don't take any prisoners and Moscow has its own brand of skinheads who kicked the crap out of some Ireland fans back in 2002.

Mitch Connor · 30-04-2008 08:33AM

Deleted User wrote: »

It's not any odder than choosing a stadium in the middle of nowhere in Istanbul.

I do think Moscow is going to be a 'mare for fans.

It's an all-English final which is going to attract the less fragrant element, the Russian police don't take any prisoners and Moscow has its own brand of skinheads who kicked the crap out of some Ireland fans back in 2002.

Was a visa required for Turkey?

30-04-2008 08:38AM

Tauren wrote: »

Was a visa required for Turkey?

No.

kenco · 30-04-2008 08:45AM

I have posted on this before but I think the big , big issue here is the kick off time (10:45pm local time)

I cant believe UEFA did not compromise on this and bring it back a couple of hours. It was asking for trouble no matter who got to the final (German, Italian, etc teams).

I know the drive is to get the final to some of the countries that need development of the game but doing so in a manner which all but encourages violence and conflict is nuts.

I know several die hard Utd fans who missed out on Barcelona in '99. These guys would love to be at a final but ruled this year out once the details became clear.

Xavi6 · 30-04-2008 08:48AM

Is that still a 7.45pm kick off Irish time?

Sherifu · 30-04-2008 08:52AM

Xavi6 wrote: »

Is that still a 7.45pm kick off Irish time?

Yep.

This reminds me of the thread on why is the Olympics in China. Moscow does seem like a pain now it's an all English affair.

Xavi6 · 30-04-2008 08:53AM

Sherifu wrote: »

Yep.

Ugh

Dave! · 30-04-2008 09:20AM

It seems ridiculous to me... Surely it should be as close to the centre of Europe as possible, to make it easiest for fans and teams. It's hard to see how they could have made it more inconvenient.

ibh · 30-04-2008 09:25AM

DaveMcG wrote: »

It seems ridiculous to me... Surely it should be as close to the centre of Europe as possible, to make it easiest for fans and teams. It's hard to see how they could have made it more inconvenient.

Astana FTW!!!

delija_sever029 · 30-04-2008 09:53AM

I hope it wont be -20 degrees on day of the final:D
Anyway,Moscow,why not,nice stadium,but as you said,visas,a bit far away...i hope they will make it still to be ok,UEFA suposed to know why and who they giving organisation of the final

therecklessone · 30-04-2008 09:54AM

For a start, it is ridiculous to hold the final in a country which requires a Visa for entry (certainly for fans from those countries likely to reach the final)

I don't care about sharing the wealth, the last time England were in town fans were attacked in their hotel rooms and there was at least one incident of a disabled fan being assaulted.

Personally, I have a big red X on my map of "countries I'd visit for a football match" as my safety is more important to me than 90mins of football.

mike65 · 30-04-2008 10:10AM

UEFA are clueless - Athens, Istanbul, Moscow and Rome next year.

It'll either go really well as everyone will be scared of spending time in a Russian jail or its gonna be murder.

Mike.

neacy69 · 30-04-2008 10:20AM

mike65 wrote: »

UEFA are clueless - Athens, Istanbul, Moscow and Rome next year.

It'll either go really well as everyone will be scared of spending time in a Russian jail or its gonna be murder.

Mike.

i think so too

BaZmO* · 30-04-2008 10:31AM

Xavi6 wrote: »

I I hope it doesn't end in a blood bath but that unfortunately looks like the most probable scenario, whether it's the fans or local police who are to blame.

Read tabloids much Xavi?

I've no doubt there will be some trouble there, but saying "blood bath" is a little sensationalist.

DaveMcG wrote: »

It seems ridiculous to me... Surely it should be as close to the centre of Europe as possible, to make it easiest for fans and teams. It's hard to see how they could have made it more inconvenient.

So it should only ever be held in Germany, Switzerland or Austria?

I do think it's silly having it in Moscow but evry other European city should be fair game.

delija_sever029 wrote: »

I hope it wont be -20 degrees on day of the final:D

Why do people think that it gets cold in Moscow during the summer? It actually has a continental climate so it gets quite hot during the summer.

therecklessone wrote: »

For a start, it is ridiculous to hold the final in a country which requires a Visa for entry (certainly for fans from those countries likely to reach the final)

Agree 100%
It's a stupid decision to hold a European competition outside of Europe.

spockety · 30-04-2008 10:33AM

BaZmO* wrote: »

Read tabloids much Xavi?
I've no doubt there will be some trouble there, but saying "blood bath" is a little sensationalist.

I don't know you from Adam so I would be wary of calling you naive unjustifiably, but that statement is a little naive.

It could very easily end up as a situation which results in a ban for English teams from UEFA competitions for a few years if Liverpool reach the final alongside United.

patmac · 30-04-2008 10:43AM

Moscow is the most expensive city in the world :http://money.cnn.com/2006/06/23/pf/expensive_cities/
I doubt it matters where it is there is always going to be a problem for a Man Utd v Liverpool/Chelsea Final, the only good thing is that the cost logistics etc will keep the casual fans those who will go on the offchance that a ticket might be available from going. How much is this going to cost anyway €2500/3000, just make sure your travel agent has tickets this time.

BaZmO* · 30-04-2008 10:58AM

spockety wrote: »

I don't know you from Adam so I would be wary of calling you naive unjustifiably, but that statement is a little naive.

It could very easily end up as a situation which results in a ban for English teams from UEFA competitions for a few years if Liverpool reach the final alongside United.

I don't know Adam either and I also have no doubt that there will be trouble, I just thought using words like "blood bath" were a little tabloid-esque.

Killme00 · 30-04-2008 11:01AM

spockety wrote: »

I don't know you from Adam so I would be wary of calling you naive unjustifiably, but that statement is a little naive.

It could very easily end up as a situation which results in a ban for English teams from UEFA competitions for a few years if Liverpool reach the final alongside United.

Yes, both Liverpool and Man Utd have a torrid past in terms of fan violence (Liverpool especially). Chelsea have a strong Hooligan element too. Mixing all of these fans with the Russian hooligans just isnt going to go off very well.

I hope this final will be remembered for the football but unfortunately i doubt it very much.

mike65 · 30-04-2008 11:10AM

No visas will be needed I just heard.

Mike.

Xavi6 · 30-04-2008 11:12AM

BaZmO* wrote: »

Read tabloids much Xavi?
I've no doubt there will be some trouble there, but saying "blood bath" is a little sensationalist.

Well I am a journalist and tabloids are where the money's at so.........

citytillidie · 30-04-2008 11:19AM

Tauren wrote: »

Was a visa required for Turkey?

Yes, however if you had a match ticket you did not need one, people who flew into other cities other than Istanbul were held up until the airport officals got in contact with the goverment about the visa issues as they had not been told about the match ticket been a short term visa

OhNoYouDidn't · 30-04-2008 11:36AM

If a Russian team qualified for a final in England, all these gripes would hold through with them: their fans would require visas, expensive city with a history of hooliganism.

Europe is a big place and there aren't that many 5 star stadia. Deal with it. The world doesnt revolve around the Ole-Ole brigade.

therecklessone · 30-04-2008 11:37AM

Killme00 wrote: »

Yes, both Liverpool and Man Utd have a torrid past in terms of fan violence (Liverpool especially).

I'm sorry chap, but knowing people who used to run with that sort of crowd in the 70s I can tell you that Liverpool were very much in the halfpenny place to United. Don't let Heysel cloud your judgement.

therecklessone · 30-04-2008 11:41AM

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

If a Russian team qualified for a final in England, all these gripes would hold through with them: their fans would require visas, expensive city with a history of hooliganism.

Europe is a big place and there aren't that many 5 star stadia. Deal with it. The world doesnt revolve around the Ole-Ole brigade.

Its simple enough.

The vast majority of countries competing in European football with a realistic chance of reaching a major final would need a visa to visit Russia.

The same could not be said of a final held in Spain, Italy, England, Germany, France, Austria, Greece, Holland, Portugal, Scotland...I think you get my point now?

There's a list here

dc69 · 30-04-2008 11:46AM

has anyone seen the stadium?it looks ripe for a holligan fight.I wouldnt be surprised if there is murder tbh

the stadium doesnt look like it is even made for football,its not a proper stadium at all,looks 200 years old.

I can see the images now.people getting battered by the police

OhNoYouDidn't · 30-04-2008 11:57AM

therecklessone wrote: »

Its simple enough.

The vast majority of countries competing in European football with a realistic chance of reaching a major final would need a visa to visit Russia.

The same could not be said of a final held in Spain, Italy, England, Germany, France, Austria, Greece, Holland, Portugal, Scotland...I think you get my point now?

There's a list here

So a criteria for where a final should be held should be who is likely to qualify?

Moscow is the biggest city in Europe with a qualifying five star stadium and all the other boxes ticked like enough hotel rooms. Now you are saying they should be excluded because the Brits shouldnt have to travel?

UEFA has a broader remit than the EU....

OhNoYouDidn't · 30-04-2008 11:59AM

dc69 wrote: »

has anyone seen the stadium?it looks ripe for a holligan fight.I wouldnt be surprised if there is murder tbh

the stadium doesnt look like it is even made for football,its not a proper stadium at all,looks 200 years old.

I can see the images now.people getting battered by the police

Well if that looks 200 years old....

http://www.uefa.com/multimediafiles/photo/competitions/ucl/464253_mediumsquare.jpg

Killme00 · 30-04-2008 12:00PM

therecklessone wrote: »

I'm sorry chap, but knowing people who used to run with that sort of crowd in the 70s I can tell you that Liverpool were very much in the halfpenny place to United. Don't let Heysel cloud your judgement.

Im not, i clearly said that BOTH Utd and Liverpool have had a torrid past in relation to violence.

AND that wasnt the point i was trying to make. I hope this final will be remembered for the football

therecklessone · 30-04-2008 12:00PM

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Moscow is the biggest city in Europe with a qualifying five star stadium and all the other boxes ticked like enough hotel rooms. Now you are saying they should be excluded because the Brits shouldnt have to travel?

Its got nothing to do with the Brits.

I'm saying common sense suggests that the final should be held somewhere that is relatively easy to travel to and also has as few access restrictions as possible.

I couldn't care who is in the final, you obviously do.

Moscow as a CL Final Venue

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