Tibettan scumbags

snyper wrote: »

I would suggest because the Chineese gov have being slaughering the tibetan people for thast 4 decades or more.

Ha! The population of the region has doubled in the past 4 decades. I'd love to know your sources.

People here seem to be for autonomy for the people in the region. That’s fine, I think that if they want it they should get it....but then what?

A religious dictator shrouded in an aura of Zen and mysticism.... is still a dictator.
Are people in Ireland for the separation of church and state or not?

Know what serfdom is?
Can you locate the place on a map? (no googling please )

If you honestly answered 'no' to either the above two questions I kindly ask you to refrain from pretending to know what the issues are.

And how will they afford this autonomy exactly?....where will they get the money for all the roads, medicine and clean water currently provided for them by the PRC?
Oh wait...I forgot about the mountain of cash the DL has been sitting on with thanks to the CIA....he'll share it of course, right?
Would it be likely that we will see an American base there?
Tibetan culture is slowly vanishing.....it will either take 100 years under the PRC or 15 years with thanks to someone else.

Miss Fluff, I agree that the average Chinese person is not as exposed to international news as you or I may be....but I think that the more you examine the propaganda of the west vs the propaganda in China....they become strikingly similar.

Miss Fluff wrote: »

Why on earth should they question it? Yes, many of the people you or I know in China have been educated and can speak English so can seek out international websites (the ones that haven't been blocked) so to make a sweeping statement like they know what is going on is still making me ROFL quite frankly.

Haha....but there it is, I agree with you but you're making that statement from the standpoint that you actually DO know whats going on.
But then.....its the propaganda you've grown up with , why on earth should you question it?
International websites??:)
Thats a joke right?...no sorry..I take it back...there's no bull**** on the net.

faceman wrote: »

The average Chinese person has plenty of exposure to international news, Im not sure how you came to that conclusion.

Likewise.....well.... actually I'm not curious at all...I know how.:)

The same way many Chinese people come to equally inaccurate conclusions. They fall for the propaganda just like the people here have.
The main difference is that its not hidden in China...it is in fact openly labeled "Propaganda", and most Chinese people are aware that they are being lied to about something even if don't know the specifics of each issue.

Whereas in Ireland....propaganda is more subliminal than that...many of its citizens aren't even aware it exists.:(

I'd like to point out that this issue is openly discussed on English language forums in Beijing, but users were in fact requested to refrain from doing so at all on this very site last month.

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/announcement.php?a=525

Wow...look at all that free speech go!!
Oh...and trust me....Tibet gets much better coverage in China than it gets on any Irish media source....even if it is biased in the other direction.

faceman wrote: »

I used to have a similar view as im sure many westerners do. However i spent some time in China recently and it sure was an eye opener.

Have you ever been to China?

The average Chinese person has plenty of exposure to international news, Im not sure how you came to that conclusion. Granted that the is some censorship of some websites, (I remember reading a figure of 10% of news websites but i dont have figs to back it up), international news is readily available. CNN is shown on the TV (although certain reports on China have in the past been blocked out) The internet is everywhere, particularly wifi spots in urban areas.

From the comfort of my hotel room and office i was able to browse many internation news sites without issue.

My colleagues and people i spoke to there were well versed on both Chinese and international affairs.

They spoke openly on political affairs.

Having spent a number of years in East Africa, I saw more censorship there than I did in China.

PLease elaborate on why you hold that view?

Have I been to China? Yes, I ran a company of 230 people in Beijing for a year Faceman so I'd know the country pretty well. BBC News website was blocked, any reports on CNN and BBC World relating to China were blocked out. Granted some people know what's going but I'd say they are in the minority. Some people still think the Cultural Revolution was for the common good ffs. So while some educated, travelled Chinese are aware of what's going on, there are plenty who have no idea.

Miss Fluff wrote: »

Have I been to China? Yes, I ran a company of 230 people in Beijing for a year Faceman so I'd know the country pretty well. BBC News website was blocked, any reports on CNN and BBC World relating to China were blocked out. Granted some people know what's going but I'd say they are in the minority. Some people still think the Cultural Revolution was for the common good ffs. So while some educated, travelled Chinese are aware of what's going on, there are plenty who have no idea.

haha...you were in Beijing for a whole year and you've already become an expert on the country....and you had time to do that while managing 230 people, no less.

Nevermind the fact that Beijing is nothing like the rest of the country, I've been in China for more than five years and I'm still a learner....I know some people who have been here for 15 years or more that still would'nt be quite bold enough to make that statement.
You must be quite special.

And perhaps you'd care to have a look at what China was like before the cultural revolution before you start pretending that the world of Chinese politics is black and white.

Change doesn't come over night.Rome wasn't built in a day.
But what the hell, you're right....as long as we're pretending to know what we're on about lets take the moral high-ground and imply that we know more about the place than they do because we are so free and enlightened.

Acid_Violet wrote: »

I fúcking love the irony that you're giving out about 'scumbags' who are acting drastically to alleviate their problems of oppression and poverty but that you're not saying a word against the oppressors. You're either extremely naive and have no idea of what the Chinese government has been doing to

a) christians
b) practitioners of falun gong
c) tibetans
d) trade union workers
e) any kind of protestors against the government's regime

or have a pretty fúcked sense of right and wrong imho.

Well thanks for all that info....would you care to fill us in on what we have no idea about?
You just listed off several groups....but we're still waiting for the revelation of how there is some kind of secret genocide going on.
We have no idea what they're doing to them?

do you?

Burko wrote: »

haha...you were in Beijing for a whole year and you've already become an expert on the country....and you had time to do that while managing 230 people, no less.

Nevermind the fact that Beijing is nothing like the rest of the country, I've been in China for more than five years and I'm still a learner....I know some people who have been here for 15 years or more that still would'nt be quite bold enough to make that statement.
You must be quite special.

And perhaps you'd care to have a look at what China was like before the cultural revolution before you start pretending that the world of Chinese politics is black and white.

Change doesn't come over night.Rome wasn't built in a day.
But what the hell, you're right....as long as we're pretending to know what we're on about lets take the moral high-ground and imply that we know more about the place than they do because we are so free and enlightened.




Well thanks for all that info....would you care to fill us in on what we have no idea about?
You just listed off several groups....but we're still waiting for the revelation of how there is some kind of secret genocide going on.
We have no idea what they're doing to them?

do you?

Errrr change does come overnight, its called a revolution. You must have a short memory and forgotten what happened in Bucharest in 1989.

And perhaps you should educate yourself on China before joining this discussion, try Googling 'Human Rights China'; look at Amnesty's website, go to the UNs section on Human Rights and read the reports, go to Human Rights Watch.Its all there, if you don't know about these issues that are now common knowledge then get your head out of the sand. Ffs at least inform yourself before making statements like that.

Thirdfox wrote: »

Oh so with our shambolic health service the cure is to have a revolution and implement overnight change?

Either you are politically naive or you want to see chaos (I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and go with the first). Modern countries cannot afford to have revolutions unless they want to plunge back 50 years in terms of their

Oh my god,what kind of thwarted logic is that? Like learn how to reason in a rational manner if you are going to discuss the topic. You just can't compare the Irish Health system and the Romanian Revolution of 1989, that is daft and its the reasoning of a child.

Revolutions are for countries where the people want change, reforms are for health systems that need change, theres a wealth of difference between the two and if you didn't know that its a bit rich to be calling me politically naive.

The fact of the matter is a previous poster said change can't come overnight and I said yes, yes, yes it can giving the Romanian revolution as an example. And Im right.

Thirdfox wrote: »

Do you think it's feasible for a major world power to undergo an overnight revolution?

I still stand by the statement that you are politically naive. Or maybe bloodthirsty (that is what would happen with a revolution - civil war on such a scale making Iraq looking like a picnic in the park). Let the Chinese kill each other - we can then teach them democracy our way, the right way. Get off your high horse and look at reality.

So, no. You are wrong. Going further than a simple statement - you are wrong insofar as the Chinese will not undergo another revolution, it's simple economic and stability suicide. And most Chinese people are happy with the progress made so far.

(I can't help but smile at the irony of starting a sentence with the word "Like" and then delivering a lecture about logic and acting like a child.)

WTF???? Why are you trying to put words in my mouth? When did I ever say what China needs is a revolution? I didn't, simple as. I said you were wrong to equate the Irish health system with the Romanian revolution.
Now you are wrong yet again because your flawed reasoning has led you down a path of inference. You inferred by me saying that change can come overnight in the form of the Romanian revolution then the same can happen to China. Wrong again, I don't want revolution for China so stop trying to put words in my mouth.

And yet again you have shown your political naivety. You said

So you want the Chinese to have a revolution - good for you. Do you know the cost in human life and the cost for you in economic terms (never mind the poor Chinese)?

You can't honestly tell me you know something about politics and not know that a revolution can be peaceful? Like the Orange Revolution in Ukraine 2004 or the fall of the Berlin Wall 1989, now commonly known in politics as The Peaceful Revolution, for example?

Thats three times you were wrong in one afternoon, nice hat-trick buddy.