WTF Sort of sentence is this?

Huggles · 03-03-2008 03:26PM #1

Jesus christ this country is ****ed...

Link

A Kildare man who raped his infant daughter has been given a 15-year prison sentence at the Central Criminal Court.

The 30-year-old, who can't be named for legal reasons, pleaded guilty to two charges of rape on dates in 2005.

Mr Justice White said there was nothing more appalling than the oral rape of a three-year-old child, the gravity of which is increased when it is your own child.

He said he had considered imposing a life sentence for the offences, which took place on dates in 2005.

The offences came to light during a conversation between the child and her mother while she was washing her teeth.

Judge White directed that the man's name be entered on the register of sex offenders.

He also suspended the final three years of the sentence as well as imposing five years post-release supervision.

Collie D · 03-03-2008 03:28PM

Don't know about you but I wouldn't find twelve years in prison a walk in the park. No injustice here but I can sense the "lock them up and throw away the key" brigade about to roll in

Huggles · 03-03-2008 03:29PM

Do you really think the punishment equals the crime here?

He will be out in less than 15 years. :mad:

Dinter · 03-03-2008 03:29PM

Rabble rabble rabble

leninbenjamin · 03-03-2008 03:29PM

life sentence in this country is roughly 8 to 12 years anyway so it wouldn't make much difference to be honest...

Lawless_Samurai · 03-03-2008 03:30PM

Collie D wrote: »

"lock them up and throw away the key" brigade about to roll in

Nah wouldn't bother with that just chop off his jibbly bits

Gummy Panda · 03-03-2008 03:31PM

15 years seems like a decent sentence compared to previous sex offenders sentences like 5 years with 2 suspended or something.

Collie D · 03-03-2008 03:34PM

Gummy Panda wrote: »

15 years seems like a decent sentence compared to previous sex offenders sentences like 5 years with 2 suspended or something.

Exactly. Surprised he got that long tbh compared to others you hear of. I can't imagine that a man who raped his own child would get an easy time behind bars so it's not as if he's getting off lightly.

Besides, the judge had suspended the final three years because of recent appeals to sentences he had already passed down.

Twelve years is a stiff sentence. A lot of users here seem to be of the opinion that prison is a holiday camp. Don't think I'd fancy doing a twelve stretch.

orestes · 03-03-2008 03:34PM

The amount of times he will probably be on the receiving end of a vicious buggering in prison should make things a little bit more even

Rb · 03-03-2008 03:35PM

Wow that's absolutely sick.

Yeah, the sentence is better than what some have received, but it's still a joke. The guy stuck his penis in his three year old daughters mouth ffs, he deserves to spend the rest of his life in prison, fck 12 years.

slipss · 03-03-2008 03:37PM

On the subject of ridiculas sentences.

"Anne Lawlor said that she stabbed her former fiance twice in the back as he slept because he had a "controlling" personality.

"Obviously not controlling enough," a colleague observed wryly last week when the waitress appeared in the Dublin Circuit Criminal Court to face charges of assault. His understandable cynicism about the whole affair was not exactly tempered when Ms Lawlor walked away at the end of the hearing with a two-year suspended sentence.

Anne Lawlor's stated reasons for stabbing her ex-fiance were that he was "messing with my head" and had been "slagging off" her dead father -- neither of which seems a particularly compelling answer to the question: Why did you do it?"

Does anybody think for even a second that the same sentence would have been handed down if this story read "Dutch man stabs his ex girlfriend in the back as she slept", good old double standards are alive and well in the Irish justice system.

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/analysis/punishment-is-now-a-dirty-word-1303590.html

Collie D · 03-03-2008 03:39PM

slipss wrote: »

On the subject of ridiculas sentences.

"Anne Lawlor said that she stabbed her former fiance twice in the back as he slept because he had a "controlling" personality.

"Obviously not controlling enough," a colleague observed wryly last week when the waitress appeared in the Dublin Circuit Criminal Court to face charges of assault. His understandable cynicism about the whole affair was not exactly tempered when Ms Lawlor walked away at the end of the hearing with a two-year suspended sentence.

Anne Lawlor's stated reasons for stabbing her ex-fiance were that he was "messing with my head" and had been "slagging off" her dead father -- neither of which seems a particularly compelling answer to the question: Why did you do it?"

Does anybody think for even a second that the same sentence would have been handed down if this story read "Dutch man stabs his ex girlfriend in the back as she slept", good old double standards are alive and well in the Irish justice system.

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/analysis/punishment-is-now-a-dirty-word-1303590.html

I read about that last week and was amazed. Suspended sentence for stabbing somebody in their sleep. That's one cold, calculating bitch who should have been up on attempted murder charges.

Dinter · 03-03-2008 03:41PM

Provocation should never, ever, ever, be accepted as mitigating for such acts.

It would be easier to walk away than try and kill someone.

Slow Motion · 03-03-2008 03:46PM

Please feel free to correct me, but don't most sentences carry a 25% automatic reduction for good behaviour? So it won't even be 12 years!

Collie D · 03-03-2008 03:50PM

Slow Motion wrote: »

Please feel free to correct me, but don't most sentences carry a 25% automatic reduction for good behaviour? So it won't even be 12 years!

Yes but not sure if that's the case if he's already had 20 per cent suspended, although I am open to correction too.

gucci · 03-03-2008 05:01PM

that has to be one of the most sickening cases iv ever heard off.....dear god i feel sick

aidan_dunne · 03-03-2008 05:37PM

Collie D wrote: »

........ I can sense the "lock them up and throw away the key" brigade about to roll in

F**k that! Too easy on him. Slow, painful torture over the course of several days, ultimately culminating in the sick bastard being hung, drawn and quartered sounds much more appropriate to me.

That's the problem these days, we're way too f**king soft on the likes of these sickos! Bleeding heart PC liberal lefties all too quick to march in to defend the "human rights" of the criminal. How can you even begin to talk about this guy's "human rights"? He isn't human, he's a sick animal that deserves to be put down. I'm sure he wasn't too concerned about that poor child's "human rights" when he was doing what he did. :mad:

Collie D · 03-03-2008 05:40PM

aidan_dunne wrote: »

F**k that! Too easy on him. Slow, painful torture over the course of several days, ultimately culminating in the sick bastard being hung, drawn and quartered sounds much more appropriate to me.

That's the problem these days, we're way too f**king soft on the likes of these sickos! Bleeding heart PC liberal lefties all too quick to march in to defend the "human rights" of the criminal. How can you even begin to talk about this guy's "human rights"? He isn't human, he's a sick animal that deserves to be put down. I'm sure he wasn't too concerned about that poor child's "human rights" when he was doing what he did. :mad:

Who are you calling a liberal PC leftie? You do twelve years surrounded by criminals and tell me it's easy. I just said it wasn't a soft sentence but I suppose your reaction is to be expected.

aidan_dunne · 03-03-2008 05:44PM

Collie D wrote: »

Who are you calling a liberal PC leftie?

Not directed personally at you, Collie. Apologies if you thought it was. Just saying that, in general, there seems to be a lot of people out there these days who are too quick to jump to the defense of the criminals and are more concerned about the rights of the criminal than the rights of the victim and this just seems completely wrong, in my opinion.

Jigsaw · 03-03-2008 05:55PM

aidan_dunne wrote: »

F**k that! Too easy on him. Slow, painful torture over the course of several days, ultimately culminating in the sick bastard being hung, drawn and quartered sounds much more appropriate to me.

That's the problem these days, we're way too f**king soft on the likes of these sickos! Bleeding heart PC liberal lefties all too quick to march in to defend the "human rights" of the criminal. How can you even begin to talk about this guy's "human rights"? He isn't human, he's a sick animal that deserves to be put down. I'm sure he wasn't too concerned about that poor child's "human rights" when he was doing what he did. :mad:

So refreshing to see sentencing policy in Ireland being discussed using such reasoned and cogent legal argument.

Seriously like, what the man did was utterly deplorable but sentences have to be proportionate. You feel he should be executed for what he did? What would you suggest if he had had penetrative sex with the child? Would you advocate that he is executed, brought back to life and then re-executed?

I stress that I am certainly no apologist for this man or anyone like him and child abuse is one of the most abhorrent crimes out there, but due to the emotive nature of the issues involved, it always generates irrational expressions by people of what a country's justice sentencing policy ought to be.

LaVidaLoca · 03-03-2008 06:00PM

F**k that! Too easy on him. Slow, painful torture over the course of several days, ultimately culminating in the sick bastard being hung, drawn and quartered sounds much more appropriate to me.

That's the problem these days, we're way too f**king soft on the likes of these sickos! Bleeding heart PC liberal lefties all too quick to march in to defend the "human rights" of the criminal. How can you even begin to talk about this guy's "human rights"? He isn't human, he's a sick animal that deserves to be put down. I'm sure he wasn't too concerned about that poor child's "human rights" when he was doing what he did

Yeah Im sure if the punishment was 30 years, he would have thought twice about doing it.

You fool. Criminals do the stuff they do, precisely because they think they're gonna get away with it.

beautiation · 03-03-2008 06:05PM

The sentence is a bit too light, I agree. Something 20+ would sound about right to me. But people whose cheerful reaction to this is "ah sure he'll be raped every day in there anyway" do you really think it's a good thing to have that kind of culture in prisons? Not only are you condoning the removal of human rights, but you're also trusting the hardened criminals at the top of prison hierarchies to be given some kind of mandate to complete the justice of a sentence, as if justice is what's on their minds. I really don't know how much raping, beatings etc. really do go on in prison, but if it's anything like enough to justify the confidence some people have that this guy will live out 12 years of torture it's an absolute disgrace, and definitely something that we shouldn't turn a blind eye to.

aidan_dunne · 03-03-2008 06:07PM

Well, I just think sick f**kers like that shouldn't be let live. That's just my opinion and you're fully entitled to your own. If someone ever did anything like that to a child of mine, though, I wouldn't hesitate to take the law into my own hands and dish out the punishment I saw fit, and to hell with the consequences.

Collie D · 03-03-2008 06:11PM

There are very few prisoners in Ireland who have served more than twenty years. You could probably count them on your fingers tbh. 12 years is a stiff sentence in this country and probably wouldn't be far off a life sentence.

The judge has said that his hands were somewhat tied in his sentencing. Twelve years is a tough, long sentence and he will not just walk through it. Remember what you were doing twelve years ago and it might give you some insight into how long a time that is. Then imagine that time spent in a small room for 20+ hours a day with only other criminals to keep you company. This man is being punished for his crimes and rightly so

PS I knew as soon as I heard this story on Newstalk this afternoon that it would end up on Boards

beautiation · 03-03-2008 06:14PM

aidan_dunne wrote: »

Not directed personally at you, Collie. Apologies if you thought it was. Just saying that, in general, there seems to be a lot of people out there these days who are too quick to jump to the defense of the criminals and are more concerned about the rights of the criminal than the rights of the victim and this just seems completely wrong, in my opinion.

aidan_dunne wrote: »

Well, I just think sick f**kers like that shouldn't be let live. That's just my opinion and you're fully entitled to your own. If someone ever did anything like that to a child of mine, though, I wouldn't hesitate to take the law into my own hands and dish out the punishment I saw fit, and to hell with the consequences.

But why exactly? I'd be furious too, but how does extreme punishment help the child anymore than a suitable jail sentence would? And you'd proabably end up in jail leaving your child without a parent, or possibly killed if the attack failed, or what if you maiming the paedophile ended up getting him more sympathy off the judge and a lighter jail sentence? I can understand the temptation to indulge your anger would be very strong, but what good can it do? Is it not just selfish at the end of the day really?

aidan_dunne · 03-03-2008 06:16PM

I'd like to to know what people's opinion on the "life sentence" should be, actually? Do you believe life should mean life, i.e. that you're never let out ever again and you die in prison as opposed to the current definition of "life"?

Steak · 03-03-2008 06:23PM

haha. I was scanning the paragraph for grammar mistakes.

Collie D · 03-03-2008 06:26PM

Steak wrote: »

haha. I was scanning the paragraph for grammar mistakes.

Dashticle · 03-03-2008 07:09PM

Well yes, his life is effectively over. He gets out over a decade later, is 42 with no friends. If he gets caught doing anything, even being drunk in the street, it's back in for another two years at least, he'll be 50 before they stop monitoring him closely. Plus he gets on the sex offenders register for life.

Off topic, I understand that rape is not that common in the Irish prison system. Beating the **** out of child molestors is pretty common though.

gurramok · 03-03-2008 07:15PM

How about this for a sentence http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/mhojkfojmhey/rss2/

Gets 20 yrs with 12yrs suspended, wtf?

'Judge Martin Nolan suspended the final 12 years of the prison terms to take into account that Smith had pleaded guilty to all the charges before the court, co-operated with the gardaí in all cases bar one and apologised during interview to his victims.'

Err, judge Nolan, so feckin what?

Plead guilty because you were caught red handed, co-operated with gardai because you were caught after the fact and apologised after the fact so you gain 12 yrs back from the sentence on basic stuff! :mad:

Is there some sort of performance review for judges?

Who can fire them if they don't do their job properly?

Collie D · 03-03-2008 07:17PM

gurramok wrote: »

Is there some sort of performance review for judges?

Who can fire them if they don't do their job properly?

The Minister for Justice as far as I know. And he's a spineless c*nt like all other FFers. I know McDowell was a complete and utter fascist bastard but at least he wasn't afraid to slag off the judiciary every now and again

WTF Sort of sentence is this?

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