O'Donoghue Not Guilty of Murder

seamus · 16-01-2008 05:14PM

Peared wrote: »

I was hoping a special kind of justice would be doled out inside tbh.

Sure, why bother with a legal system at all? Why don't we just stone every offender to death, whether or not they're actually guilty?
Anyone who thinks that somehow their brand of justice is more "fair" than the sentences imposed by the courts should be shipped off to the depths of Sierra Leone or somewhere to enjoy their barbaric existence.

Peared · 16-01-2008 05:17PM

seamus wrote: »

Sure, why bother with a legal system at all? Why don't we just stone every offender to death, whether or not they're actually guilty?
Anyone who thinks that somehow their brand of justice is more "fair" than the sentences imposed by the courts should be shipped off to the depths of Sierra Leone or somewhere to enjoy their barbaric existence.

No no you misunderstand. I was happy to see justice done in the courtroom. I was hoping for some prison justice. As well as not instead of.

LadyJ · 16-01-2008 05:19PM

Peared wrote: »

I hope he does get a hard time. I hope every day of the rest of his life is a living hell. Accidently killing a child is one thing. What he did afterwards and put the family through is another. I cannot believe people here are trying to demonise that childs poor mother. I was hoping a special kind of justice would be doled out inside tbh.

I'm not trying demonise anyone.

Also, I'm sick of people wanting revenge rather than justice.

event · 16-01-2008 05:25PM

KaG1888 wrote: »

Why would a mother make up something like that?

maybe she knew what happens to paedo's in jail

panda100 · 16-01-2008 05:26PM

Genghiz Cohen wrote: »

The legal system determined the length of time he should be confined in jail, he served his time, he has paid his debt, as far as I'm concerned, he is now just another person in the tabloids for the wrong reasons.

I couldnt agree more. He's repaid his debt to society. If I saw him on the street he would just be another normal person as far as Im concerned.
Also its quite alarming looking at the pictures of him before and after he went to prison. He look like a 40 year old man now,not the ripe old age of 23.

dresden8 · 16-01-2008 05:30PM

Ah the poor chap. Now he has plenty of time on his hands you can invite him round to babysit.

Maximilian · 16-01-2008 05:32PM

Peared wrote: »

I was hoping for some prison justice. As well as not instead of.

ie. Murder. So you think the best way to deal with murder is murder?

sickpuppy · 16-01-2008 05:32PM

Are you people for real? paid his debt me hole.
He gets 3 years for killing a child dumps him like an unwanted pet in a ditch
and will probably get liable againest the newspapers.
The sentencing in irish courts is a joke heinous crimes like murder and rape get petty sentences.
If i was a relative of that child that was manslaughtured id accidentally end
Mr o Donoghues then the debt would be paid.

seamus · 16-01-2008 05:32PM

Peared wrote: »

No no you misunderstand. I was happy to see justice done in the courtroom. I was hoping for some prison justice. As well as not instead of.

Therefore you believe that the justice system is inadequate and you know better. You're about 500 years too late for that kind of thing. Come live with us in a civilised society.

Peared · 16-01-2008 05:33PM

I think a lot of people dont feel that 3 years counts as justice for taking a life. But ok we have to accept that it was manslaughter. Thats the act itself. But burning a wee boys body and hiding it while the parents went through a hell that hopefully people here never have to understand is another thing entirely. It makes people angry. It makes people want revenge. Its human to not always want the pc solution. Its human to want to see somebody who has done something hideous and awful suffer consequences. I make no apologies for feeling that way. We have to trust that the courts will get it right. But there is a difference between what is technically and legally right and what the man on the street sees as fair.

Also, and this is a personal opinion I realise most wont agree with, I think if it was a girls body the repulsion for this man would be on a different level.

seamus · 16-01-2008 05:35PM

sickpuppy wrote: »

If i was a relative of that child that was manslaughtured id accidentally end
Mr o Donoghues then the debt would be paid.

And what about Mr O'Donoghue's family? I guess then they'd be well within their rights to kill you as repayment for your debt after you've killed their child? And then your family can kill your killer....and so on.

But burning a wee boys body and hiding it while the parents went through a hell that hopefully people here never have to understand is another thing entirely.

First off, he didn't burn the body.
The main thing is, the herald-reading troglodyte on the street has an inability to understand what *anyone* went through in this whole scenario. I have no idea how I would react in such a situation but I can definitely say that if I panicked enough, there's a good chance that I would hide the body and try to pretend that nothing happened. I've never been in any situation that warrants even remotely that amount of panic, so I simply can't say that I would be a calm and rational individual, 100% prepared to do the right thing. Nobody can.

Peared · 16-01-2008 05:37PM

I did not once say I would like to see him killed. Look back on my posts. Too good for him. I would like to see him live a very long very miserable life. His family however do have my sympathy.

Edit
I see u were not referring to me, didnt read the quote properly.

padi89 · 16-01-2008 05:38PM

sickpuppy wrote: »

If i was a relative of that child that was manslaughtured id accidentally end
Mr o Donoghues then the debt would be paid.

Thats lovely.So not alone has your family enough to deal with having a member murdered but they also have to deal with having a murderer in the family.:rolleyes:

Dudess · 16-01-2008 05:39PM

He was scared of what would happen to him (as anyone would be) and in desperation he dumped the body, then tried to burn it. Seems he was right to be scared of what would happen to him.
I'm intrigued by how so many people are such experts as to what they would have done if they were unlucky enough to be in his shoes.
Then he came to his senses, realised he wasn't going to be able to cover his tracks, and came forward.

Wacker · 16-01-2008 05:40PM

Peared wrote: »

But burning a wee boys body

He didn't burn the body.

Muff_Daddy · 16-01-2008 05:40PM

"speculation from Magella Houlihan's cold and calculated attempt to paint Wayne as a paedophile."

I don't think it was cold or calculated at all. It was a mother, who lost her child at the hands of O'Donoghoe, despertly seeking what she perseved to be justice for her 11-year-old son's death. Put yourself in her shoes, if you are a parent, do you honestly believe 4 years for your son's death is justice being served?

I do believe manslaughter was the right verdict, as there was no malice involved but I fully understand Magella Houlihan being upset at the sentence. Essentially, Wayne will have to live with his actions for the rest of his life, and I find it very hard to emphasise with him. Everyone is a loser in this tragic case.

Maximilian · 16-01-2008 05:41PM

Peared wrote: »

I did not once say I would like to see him killed. Look back on my posts. Too good for him. I would like to see him live a very long very miserable life. His family however do have my sympathy.

Edit
I see u were not referring to me, didnt read the quote properly.

So if someone kills another in circumstances where he didn't intend to do it, panics, and tries to cover it up, they should burn in hell or whatever permanent punishment you had in mind. You have some screwed up notions of justice.

We're not talking about Hitler here.

grumpytrousers · 16-01-2008 05:42PM

Dudess wrote: »

I love the self-appointed legal experts here. No wonder judges always appear so grumpy, when their decisions are constantly being undermined by people who haven't got a clue.

Aye - it reminds me of that line used by, I think, Mitchell & Webb who appear fronting a TV discussino programme

"we're sure you don't fully appreciate the intricacies of what we've just discussed here, but we're also sure that you 'reckon' something or other! Why not tell us by texting us on...."

Regarding O'Donoghue...the criminal justice system isn't perfect. It certainly isn't about redressing the wrongs visited upon the victim or their family, so anybody waving a flag for the Houlihan family and what they deserve should, with the greatest of respect, take their whinging elsewhere.

I don't say that lightly, and I don't mean to be dismissive. The system is what it is and doesn't allow for emotive responses to harsh cases. If it did, there would be no certainty in criminal trials or sentencing and such uncertainty would lead to greater injustices.

I don't doubt the hurt the Houlihan family feel today, or that they will continue to feel for a long time to come yet. It is not (he said, with a detached viewpoint) the resonsibility of the Criminal Justice system to apply a salve to their wounds. It IS the responsibility of the Criminal Justice system to try and, if a conviction is secured, punish wrongdoers on behalf of society as a whole.

Wayne O'Donoghue was put through the process. The office of the DPP did all they could to put together a case where the most serious charges that they could seriously proffer would stick, and where a conviction was likely.

Was other material left out? Possibly. Is it any of our business? Actually no; as long as the person, Wayne O'Donoghue, has no way to refute any half truths leaked to the newspapers (which is surely what will be happening!).

He did the crime. He's done the time. Let him be...

In the alternative, why don't we just bring back lynch mobs and put to one side any pretence we have of being civilised...

padi89 · 16-01-2008 05:42PM

Peared wrote: »

I would like to see him live a very long very miserable life. His family however do have my sympathy.

WTF? Thats a daft thing to say.By you wishing hell on their son your just contributing more to their suffering.

LadyJ · 16-01-2008 05:45PM

Peared wrote: »

I think a lot of people dont feel that 3 years counts as justice for taking a life. But ok we have to accept that it was manslaughter. Thats the act itself. But burning a wee boys body and hiding it while the parents went through a hell that hopefully people here never have to understand is another thing entirely. It makes people angry. It makes people want revenge. Its human to not always want the pc solution. Its human to want to see somebody who has done something hideous and awful suffer consequences. I make no apologies for feeling that way. We have to trust that the courts will get it right. But there is a difference between what is technically and legally right and what the man on the street sees as fair.

Peared, I can completely understand why the family wouldn't see this as justice and why they would want him hanged for his crime. I know I would if I was a mother of the dead child. But of course I would feel that way! We need the legal system to be completely objective because emotions get in the way of true justice being served.

Violence/revenge just isn't the answer. It isn't right.

Also, and this is a personal opinion I realise most wont agree with, I think if it was a girls body the repulsion for this man would be on a different level.

Well, I see what you mean but it wouldn't affect my opinion.

Peared · 16-01-2008 05:46PM

I am contributing to their suffering? That actually made me laugh out loud. There is only one person responsible for their suffering. Ok you might not want to see him have a sh*t time but for gods sake at least make him responsible for his own actions.

Dudess · 16-01-2008 05:46PM

Muff_Daddy wrote: »

"speculation from Magella Houlihan's cold and calculated attempt to paint Wayne as a paedophile."

I don't think it was cold or calculated at all. It was a mother, who lost her child at the hands of O'Donoghoe, despertly seeking what she perseved to be justice for her 11-year-old son's death. Put yourself in her shoes, if you are a parent, do you honestly believe 4 years for your son's death is justice being served?

Agreed. What she did was so understandable - and she should not be condemned as "cold and calculating" when she lost her son. But what she did was wrong.

grumpytrousers wrote: »

Aye - it reminds me of that line used by, I think, Mitchell & Webb who appear fronting a TV discussino programme

"we're sure you don't fully appreciate the intricacies of what we've just discussed here, but we're also sure that you 'reckon' something or other! Why not tell us by texting us on...."

Quality!

padi89 · 16-01-2008 05:50PM

Peared wrote: »

I am contributing to their suffering? That actually made me laugh out loud. There is only one person responsible for their suffering. Ok you might not want to see him have a sh*t time but for gods sake at least make him responsible for his own actions.

Of course he is responsible where did i say he is not?The guy has done his time and obviously brought a mountain of sh1te on his and their family.He served his time ,you may not agree with his sentence but whats the point in being a Lynch Mob?Can you not just let him and his family try get on with their lives besides giving another digg?Take your anger out on the system if you have an issue.

Maximilian · 16-01-2008 05:50PM

Peared wrote: »

.... for gods sake at least make him responsible for his own actions.

Like go to prison for 3 years or something?...

seamus · 16-01-2008 05:56PM

Yeah, if only we could come up with some way of punishing offenders, I don't know, maybe like locking them away from their family and restricting their ability to move around and perhaps enforcing a strict regime on them? Ah well...

Hrududu · 16-01-2008 05:56PM

Ok you might not want to see him have a sh*t time but for gods sake at least make him responsible for his own actions.

Am I missing something? He did take responsibility. I agree that its a terrible situation for all involved.

cabrwab · 16-01-2008 06:10PM

We all remember the media outcry that went on when this child was missing, so we all feel like we know the people involved. We don't.
The mother was wrong saying the things she said, and as a consequences she had judges changing the rules with regards victim impact statements.

This guy has served what i can only imagine was a tough 3years for a young guy, okay 3/4year sentace aint alot for killing somebody, but your basing this on a person who has killed and NOT come forward this guy did.
Okay he hid the body. "Everybody runs" its the chance to pretend it didn't happen put everything back to the way it is.
He didn't run he stood up and said he did it.

It was an accident. The media should f'off leave both families alone, we have the answers it has gone through the courts. Both familes have to deal with all this s**t again.
Let them all move on put it all painfully behind them.

I hope i got across what i wanted to say.

Maximilian · 16-01-2008 06:13PM

In fact I think a large part of his sentence was attributable to the cover-up element.

Boggles · 16-01-2008 06:18PM

seamus wrote: »

I have no idea how I would react in such a situation but I can definitely say that if I panicked enough, there's a good chance that I would hide the body and try to pretend that nothing happened. I've never been in any situation that warrants even remotely that amount of panic, so I simply can't say that I would be a calm and rational individual, 100% prepared to do the right thing. Nobody can.

I can only speak for myself, I have nephews and there friends I horse around with, and if I accidently caught them in the windpipe or whatever to make them start choking, I would call an ambulance. I would hope everyone would.

I would panic most definately, but it is a huge stretch from this to following the actions of Ian Huntley.

seamus · 16-01-2008 06:23PM

Boggles wrote: »

I can only speak for myself, I have nephews and there friends I horse around with, and if I accidently caught them in the windpipe or whatever to make them start choking, I would call an ambulance. I would hope everyone would.

And if they were dead before you even noticed? It's one thing to go "Oh ****, he's choking, someone get help!", it's entirely another to be faced with, "Oh ****, I've just killed him. Me, I caused him to die. What am I going to do?".

O'Donoghue Not Guilty of Murder

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