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Saudi woman gets jail (and whipped) for being gang raped

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Comments

  • #62
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,214 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    voodoo_child wrote: »
    Here's the picture of when they caught her in another mans vehicle:

    Link
    Heh :)


  • #63
    hopalong85
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 541 ✭✭✭hopalong85


    Terry wrote: »
    What would you call this?:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shock_and_awe#Iraq_War

    Conventional war or terrorism?


    The terminology suggests terrorism.

    Like i said i don't really think terrorism is easy to define. I don't think it's unrealistic to call the American invasion of Iraq a form of terrorism. Personally i'm completely against their presence there. I also don't think it's unreasonable for Iraqis to continue resisting after the fall of Baghdad.

    I guess the point i was trying to make is that certain people will look at the history of groups such as the ANC and call them freedom fighters not terrorists, whereas they will call Hamas murdering terrorist b*****ds. I think that's pretty wrong.


  • #64
    Thirdfox
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,105 ✭✭✭Thirdfox


    The_Minister wrote: »
    IIRC that brings the longest sentence up to ten years, but I'm open to correction.

    EDIT: LOL @ Voodoochild

    10 years... if they serve all of it then it would be most probably longer than a life sentence in Ireland. (normally 12 years often commuted down to 8).

    Apparently they could have been executed too.

    Interesting to see how our legal system gives a lesser sentence for rape than the Saudi system.

    edit: oh and the winners decide history - theoretically we could all be hailing the Nazis (well not me since I would be killed :()


  • #65
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,214 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    Thirdfox wrote: »
    theoretically we could all be hailing the Nazis (well not me since I would be killed :()
    Why d'you say that? Are you Jewish/gay/a Jehovah's Witness/disabled?


  • #66
    The Hill Billy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,873 ✭✭✭✭The Hill Billy


    The_Minister wrote:
    I just want to take the time to thank you for being calm, rational, and not losing your head
    It is important to extract the facts from the lurid headlines & shoddy journalism that is all too prevalent these days (not to mention the subsequent posts that reach AH).
    The_Minister wrote:
    She was raped. It's a pity.
    Poor girl. :(


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  • #67
    Thirdfox
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,105 ✭✭✭Thirdfox


    dudess wrote:
    Why d'you say that? Are you Jewish/gay/a Jehovah's Witness/disabled?

    None of the above - being of Chinese origin getting incorporated into the "East Asian Co-prosperity Sphere" a.k.a. Japanese empire would result in my chances of survival being distinctively lowered.


  • #68
    humanji
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,976 ✭✭✭✭humanji


    Dudess wrote: »
    Why d'you say that? Are you Jewish/gay/a Jehovah's Witness/disabled?
    Just ugly? :p


  • #69
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,214 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    Oh yeah, I've read about that experiment camp as featured in the movie Men Behind The Sun. I won't be watching that film.
    Whatever about the Japanese in WWII, the Nazis wouldn't have had a problem with the Chinese though, would they?


  • #70
    SimpleSam06
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,048 ✭✭✭SimpleSam06


    The_Minister wrote:
    IIRC that brings the longest sentence up to ten years, but I'm open to correction.
    After a spot of research, the seven rapists, whose previous sentences ranged from 10 months to five years in prison, also had their prison terms increased to between two and nine years.

    The girl is nineteen years old and was gang raped 14 times. I couldn't find her name.


  • #71
    Thirdfox
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,105 ✭✭✭Thirdfox


    Oh my point would be that I would either be a) in China and in squalor or b) dead c) not born

    wouldn't have a chance for hailing anyone really!

    The Nazis didn't really care about China but they did think the Aryan race might have come from Asia (sent a few trips to Tibet to analyse the people there...)


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  • #72
    aidan24326
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,925 ✭✭✭aidan24326


    Being born female in Saudi Arabia is definitely the drawing the short straw. The men in question got off lightly enough though, it's not unheard of for Saudi men to have their cock chopped off for sexual crimes. Fcuked up country.


  • #73
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,214 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    Thirdfox wrote: »
    Oh my point would be that I would either be a) in China and in squalor or b) dead c) not born

    wouldn't have a chance for hailing anyone really!

    The Nazis didn't really care about China but they did think the Aryan race might have come from Asia (sent a few trips to Tibet to analyse the people there...)
    Yeah, their phrase "Aryans of the East" and all that...


  • #74
    daveirl
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,483 ✭✭✭✭daveirl


    This post has been deleted.


  • #75
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,214 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    Ok, I do, but couldn't it be argued that Phelps IS imposing his views on others? Like picketing a young man's funeral with his crazy chants and banners?


  • #76
    fits
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,565 ✭✭✭✭fits


    I'm surprised noone has commented on this
    The victim's lawyer was suspended from the case, has had his licence to work confiscated, and faces a disciplinary session.

    That is more worrying to me than anything else in the story. Its intimidating lawyers from defending women in similar predicaments... Awful. :(

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  • #77
    Kotek Besar
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,597 ✭✭✭Kotek Besar


    If only you all knew the truth. When you die then you'll know.


  • #78
    InFront
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,698 ✭✭✭InFront


    aidan24326 wrote: »
    Being born female in Saudi Arabia is definitely the drawing the short straw. The men in question got off lightly enough though, it's not unheard of for Saudi men to have their cock chopped off for sexual crimes. Fcuked up country.
    Yeah, Saudi is a pretty messed up place in more ways than this story even touches on. I feel sorry for the girl, and also for most Saudi women. KSA needs a change of leadership and a new beginning, and its wallowing in some pre-Islamic mudpool is only being encouraged and prolonged by US foreign policy, which purportedly aims to give the Middle East a "re-birth".


  • #79
    cornbb
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,790 ✭✭✭cornbb


    fits wrote: »
    I'm surprised noone has commented on this



    That is more worrying to me than anything else in the story. Its intimidating lawyers from defending women in similar predicaments... Awful. :(

    BBC News is reporting that the lawyer is still fighting his and the woman's corner, he claims that the judges have been influenced by personal feelings and that his suspension was illegal. Fair play for having the guts to stand up to a very intimidating system like that.


  • #80
    fits
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,565 ✭✭✭✭fits


    cornbb wrote: »
    BBC News is reporting that the lawyer is still fighting his and the woman's corner, he claims that the judges have been influenced by personal feelings and that his suspension was illegal. Fair play for having the guts to stand up to a very intimidating system like that.


    Yes big time, what a brave person.

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  • #81
    johnnyskeleton
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 14,566 Mod ✭✭✭✭johnnyskeleton


    ionapaul wrote: »
    Who knows what the average Saudi wants - the country is a dictatorship/absolute monarchy, the only people whose opinions matter are those in the House of Saud. The royal family has more political power than Charles I had in 1640s, and he got his head chopped off for his tyranny! The 'average' Saudi doesn't matter, sad to say.

    Didn't he get his head chopped off for being a Catholic sympatiser, and because the Protestant Puritans despised his romatic dash, verve and charisma? That's the way we was learned it.


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  • #82
    johnnyskeleton
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 14,566 Mod ✭✭✭✭johnnyskeleton


    Thirdfox wrote: »
    10 years... if they serve all of it then it would be most probably longer than a life sentence in Ireland. (normally 12 years often commuted down to 8).

    You don't listen to anything anyone else ever says, do you?

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055165353&highlight=life+sentence

    Life is life in Ireland, a few very exceptional people have served less than 12 years in custody for a life sentence, some may serve 40 years.
    Thirdfox wrote:
    Interesting to see how our legal system gives a lesser sentence for rape than the Saudi system.

    Not really, the people of Ireland are overwhelmingly against the death penalty. You should compare them in terms of punishments which are acceptable to both Ireland and Saudi Arabia (i.e. imprisonment and fine as opposed to physical injury/death).

    You can't really say that Ireland gives a lesser sentence for rape, seeing as how the maximum sentence for rape in Ireland is the maximum sentence that the courts can impose for any offence.


  • #83
    Deliverance
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,674 ✭✭✭Deliverance


    Can't comment on the Saudi justice system or their ways but I can offer an experience of an Irish nurse aquaintance that was the victim of an attempted rape over there some years back. The attempted attack was witnessed and the guy was arrested and publicly lashed.

    She saw him sometime afterwards and commented that he looked like a broken destroyed man. But if the worst case scenario had happened ie: she was raped and he was not caught then it would have been her as the potential broken destroyed person. Strange kind of justice happened there.


  • #84
    johnnyskeleton
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 14,566 Mod ✭✭✭✭johnnyskeleton


    Deliverance wrote: »
    Can't comment on the Saudi justice system or their ways but I can offer an experience of an Irish nurse aquaintance that was the victim of an attempted rape over there some years back. The attempted attack was witnessed and the guy was arrested and publicly lashed.

    She saw him sometime afterwards and commented that he looked like a broken destroyed man. But if the worst case scenario had happened ie: she was raped and he was not caught then it would have been her as the potential broken destroyed person. Strange kind of justice happened there.


    Sounds to me like justice was served i.e. he committed an offence, was convicted and punished for it, and appears to have learned from his experience.


  • #85
    slipss
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,025 ✭✭✭slipss


    GDM wrote: »
    they are still the law of the land there and have to be followed.

    Didn't read the whole thread just the first page but I couldn't disagree more and I'm in the very real danger of going into a rabbling incoherent overlong pointless rant right about now.

    This whole idea of, dee law is dee law and must be obeyed, at all times vitout question! is ridiculas and its one of the most destructive and counterproductive shams of morality ever ground slowly but surely into the consciousness of civilisation. "all it take for evil to prosper is for good blaa blaa blaa...." and all that. Just no, is all. Terrible attitude, just because something is legal it doesn't mean its right and has to be accepted and just because its ilegal doesn't mean its immoral. In the same vien just because it happens somewhere else and its the norm doesn't mean it should ever be accepted or allowed if its inherently wrong (for the purpose of this rant I take wrong to mean anything that contridicts the free will of another human being as long as that human being isn't contradicting the free will of others, or something like that). If your next door neighbour is beating the crap out of his kids should you ignore it because its just the way that family does things? I know that its not exactly the same thing but the princible is pretty much coresponding (or whatever that word is).

    Before 1979 (i think) it was illegal to sell contraception in this country, before some other year it was illegal for two women to ride each other (now that was a fookin mad law). The law is twisted and reshaped constantly by governments for reasons that very rarely take into consideration the best interest of the citizenry and any law which you deem to be immoral should never ever be accepted as supreme, that shouldn't change because its happening on some other lump of muck sitting beside some other big salty lake, people are people regardless of where they live.

    Now having skillfully avoided the afore mentioned pitfall of the longwinded, self righteous, jumbled rant, i'm off. Good day to you sir.


  • #86
    Terry
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,073 ✭✭✭✭Terry


    slipss wrote: »
    Didn't read the whole thread just the first page but I couldn't disagree more and I'm in the very real danger of going into a rabbling incoherent overlong pointless rant right about now.

    This whole idea of, dee law is dee law and must be obeyed, at all times vitout question! is ridiculas and its one of the most destructive and counterproductive shams of morality ever ground slowly but surely into the consciousness of civilisation. "all it take for evil to prosper is for good blaa blaa blaa...." and all that. Just no, is all. Terrible attitude, just because something is legal it doesn't mean its right and has to be accepted and just because its ilegal doesn't mean its immoral. In the same vien just because it happens somewhere else and its the norm doesn't mean it should ever be accepted or allowed if its inherently wrong (for the purpose of this rant I take wrong to mean anything that contridicts the free will of another human being as long as that human being isn't contradicting the free will of others, or something like that). If your next door neighbour is beating the crap out of his kids should you ignore it because its just the way that family does things? I know that its not exactly the same thing but the princible is pretty much coresponding (or whatever that word is).

    Before 1979 (i think) it was illegal to sell contraception in this country, before some other year it was illegal for two women to ride each other (now that was a fookin mad law). The law is twisted and reshaped constantly by governments for reasons that very rarely take into consideration the best interest of the citizenry and any law which you deem to be immoral should never ever be accepted as supreme, that shouldn't change because its happening on some other lump of muck sitting beside some other big salty lake, people are people regardless of where they live.

    Now having skillfully avoided the afore mentioned pitfall of the longwinded, self righteous, jumbled rant, i'm off. Good day to you sir.
    I thnk you should have read the rest of the thread before going on your rant.


  • #87
    Deliverance
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,674 ✭✭✭Deliverance


    johnnyskeleton wrote: »
    Sounds to me like justice was served i.e. he committed an offence, was convicted and punished for it, and appears to have learned from his experience.
    True in a way, but very basic justice in a straightforward case, so it worked I suppose. Kind of a spiritual castration in a way I guess. Something not quite right about it though.


  • #88
    Terry
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,073 ✭✭✭✭Terry


    Deliverance wrote: »
    True in a way, but very basic justice in a straightforward case, so it worked I suppose. Kind of a spiritual castration in a way I guess. Something not quite right about it though.
    Squeal like a pig.


  • #89
    Deliverance
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,674 ✭✭✭Deliverance


    Terry wrote: »
    Squeal like a pig.

    Hahaha, excellent, Very subtle, just what I was thinking in a way.


  • #90
    The Hill Billy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,873 ✭✭✭✭The Hill Billy


    Update to this thread:

    The girl has received a pardon from the Saudi king.

    Well, that's alright then. :(


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  • #91
    Morlar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,273 ✭✭✭Morlar


    Hill Billy wrote: »
    Update to this thread:

    The girl has received a pardon from the Saudi king.

    Well, that's alright then. :(

    Indeedy ! No harm no foul eh.

    Apparently her male companion who was also gang raped and sentenced to 90 lashes (after that pesky woman appealed) hasnt been pardoned yet.


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