M1 to Newry - completion date?

ardmacha · 11-07-2007 4:05pm

Alternative routes are not just for those who "are not allowed" to drive on motorways, they are also for people who don't feel comfortable driving on them!! There are many old people, etc who are not comfortable driving on motorways.

So these people will be perfectly happy to drive on the new road if it called the N1, but won't want to drive on it if it is the M1!

And I also think it should have a 100km/h limit!!!! Only "M" roads should have 120km/h limits.

Roads should have speed limits appropriate to their design, not their label.

Skyhater · 11-07-2007 4:13pm

ardmacha wrote:

So these people will be perfectly happy to drive on the new road if it called the N1, but won't want to drive on it if it is the M1!

100km/h speed limit vs. 120km/h speed limit!!!!
Although speed limits mean nothing in this country (....especially for cars with Yellow Number Plates!!!)

Roads should have speed limits appropriate to their design, not their label.

NO, the roads should have a classification "M", "N", "R" or "L" depending on their design (....and certain other constraints) ...... Then the speed limit should come from that!!! (In most cases)

Victor · 12-07-2007 10:04am

Skyhater wrote:

Having said that.... what's the alternative rout for the M50:

The difference is the M50 is a completely new route, with no previous incarnation being destroyed.

Exceptions being:
N50 at Firhouse - replaced with bridge at Spawell Roundabout.
Turnapin Lane at Clonshaugh - little used country lane.

Mayo Exile · 12-07-2007 3:33pm

Received email from the Roads and Traffic section of Louth County Council today. They are still hoping for an early August opening of the full scheme, probably August 2nd. This means it should be complete for the bank holiday weekend.

Mayo Exile · 16-07-2007 9:04am

Originally posted by Mayo Exile: Received email from the Roads and Traffic section of Louth County Council today. They are still hoping for an early August opening of the full scheme, probably August 2nd. This means it should be complete for the bank holiday weekend.

Ditto as well from the NRA. They say official opening date is August 2nd.

Mayo Exile · 20-07-2007 1:44pm

Same info from the Roads Service of Northern Ireland too. 2nd August will be the opening date for the whole scheme. So those doubts that the NI section of the scheme was behind the Southern section appear not to be true.

Zoney · 20-07-2007 3:01pm

Skyhater wrote:

NO, the roads should have a classification "M", "N", "R" or "L" depending on their design (....and certain other constraints) ...... Then the speed limit should come from that!!! (In most cases)

M is the only classification that is (and should be) dependant on design.

The other classifications (N and R specifically) are applied to routes of strategic importance, without reference to the existing road design. That's as should be - it is necessary to have a primary N road between Limerick and Cork despite part of the route currently being winding country lane. Even with upgraded/new road along N/R roads, design will vary dependant on things like traffic volumes, need for junctions, local conditions, etc.

Speed limits should be based on road design, not classification. Thus certain classes of route, because they need to have a decent speed limit, should be of a minimum design quality. The problem is that if we did this, it would all the more show up for example the inadequate stretches of N road in the country - as they would now not only be shoddy roads, but have a low speed limit too! For safety I would argue myself for putting low speed limits on sub-standard parts of N roads regardless - but politically it's not going to happen, at least until far more of the network is upgraded than just the "inter-urbans".

In summary, in an ideal state of affairs, all N and R roads would be upgraded to a minimum standard reflecting their status. Thus they could legitimately have decent speed limits, based on the road design rather than classification.

Mayo Exile · 25-07-2007 8:54am

Originally posted by Murphaph: No it's not. The bypass is to be bypassed completely by a new HQDC (possible motorway) much to the west of the existing road. They will (I believe) leave the Cloghogue Roundabout in situ pretty much unaltered until the new bypass is built in 3 or so years!

Not all the way it seems. It appears roughly to follow the current bypass from the Cloghogue roundabout out to the Camlough Road junction, then go left of the current road all the way to the Sheepbridge junction. See preferred route leaflet:

http://roadimprovements.roadsni.gov.uk/publicannouncementleaflet.pdf

Confirmed by Roads Service NI here:

http://roadimprovements.roadsni.gov.uk/index/schemes/a1_beech_hill_to_cloghogue-newry.htm

MDTyKe · 25-07-2007 11:49am

Its official speed limit is... 120. Check the bye-laws on Louth Coco. However, the bye-laws dont come in until Aug 17. So in theory, its 100 for 2 weeks.. I doubt they'll put up/take down/put up signs though?

Matt

Mayo Exile · 25-07-2007 12:34pm

Originally posted by MDTyKe: Its official speed limit is... 120. Check the bye-laws on Louth Coco.

Here it is. Also says Aug 15th, not the 17th. Can't see them enforcing a lower limit for 13 days from the opening date of the 2nd.

http://www.louthcoco.ie/downloads/Byelaws/NationalRoadsSpecialSpeedLimitByeLaws2007.pdf

MDTyKe · 25-07-2007 2:04pm

Mayo Exile wrote:

Here it is. Also says Aug 15th, not the 17th. Can't see them enforcing a lower limit for 13 days from the opening date of the 2nd.

http://www.louthcoco.ie/downloads/Byelaws/NationalRoadsSpecialSpeedLimitByeLaws2007.pdf

Agreed. I think the signs will probably say 120 too, as opposed to 100, then 120 two weeks later!

However, I will add. As great as it is 120, I just hope this isn't their way around not upgrading it to an M road. Even though it's not much of a difference, it is key economically and gives a better impression for the border region. Just depends whether the 'alternative route' is accepted as being alternative or not though. Not sure what NI's stance will be.. though if the South upgrades to motorway, under UK law, I think if the road only leads to a motorway, it will be 'upgraded' to the A1(M) for a part at least.

Matt

MrPudding · 25-07-2007 2:54pm

ardmacha wrote:

The only traffic not allowed to use motorways is tractors and the like.

Am I missing something here. What about learners? Motorbikes under 125cc?

Also, as someone pointed out, people that don't want to use the motorway or perhaps don't want to pay a toll.

MrP

Stark · 25-07-2007 3:07pm

MrPudding wrote:

Also, as someone pointed out, people that don't want to use the motorway or perhaps don't want to pay a toll.

MrP

You don't have to stick a toll on a road to make it a motorway. The M7 is a motorway and that doesn't have a toll. (well not until the M7/M8 spur is completed).

MrPudding · 25-07-2007 3:12pm

Stark wrote:

You don't have to stick a toll on a road to make it a motorway. The M7 is a motorway and that doesn't have a toll. (well not until the M7/M8 spur is completed).

The M1 already has a toll.

MrP

MDTyKe · 25-07-2007 3:16pm

Well, there 'is' an alternative route. You can see it on Google Maps. However, whether it's considered 'alternative' or not, begs a question. I would hope it would. Although not ideal, it still is alternative. I'd just like to see the M number the whole way up.

Matt

ucdperson · 25-07-2007 6:40pm

Am I missing something here. What about learners? Motorbikes under 125cc?

Also, as someone pointed out, people that don't want to use the motorway or perhaps don't want to pay a toll.

Learners can learn somewhere else. There is no toll payable for the section in question. Motorbikes under 125cc is an issue, but it should not be difficult to build a modest ordinary road alongside to cater for these.

Mayo Exile · 27-07-2007 8:54am

Road works at Feede again today from 8am to midday and 7pm to 10pm. Must be doing work on the junction there, finishing off the slip roads, applying markings, signage etc. Details on AA Roadwatch website. 6 days until official opening.

Mayo Exile · 31-07-2007 11:41am

Piece on page 2 of yesterday's Irish Times (Mon July 30th) that the Minister for Foreign Affairs, Dermot Ahern will open the scheme on Thursday next. As well as being the local TD, I suppose its symbolic that he is doing the job instead of Minister for Transport Dempsey as its the first cross border scheme to open on the island. I'm guessing the top brass from the NI devolved government will be there too and possibly the NI Secretary of State. I wonder where on the road the actual opening will be? Maybe right on the border itself?

Happy Bertie · 31-07-2007 1:27pm

Mayo Exile wrote:

Piece on page 2 of yesterday's Irish Times (Mon July 30th) that the Minister for Foreign Affairs, Dermot Ahern will open the scheme on Thursday next.

I thought is was going to be this Thursday (Aug 2nd). What source mentioned it being next Thursday (Aug 9th)?

Stark · 31-07-2007 1:31pm

I think he means next Thursday as in this Thursday.

Happy Bertie · 31-07-2007 1:55pm

Stark wrote:

I think he means next Thursday as in this Thursday.

Thanks Stark.

This article illustrates the confusion "this" and "next" causes, especially between International and North American English.

What I gather is Americans will say "this Thursday" to mean "next Thursday" internationally. In the U.S. "next Thursday" would mean Aug 9th, note this next time "ye're" talking to a North American.:)

spacetweek · 31-07-2007 3:10pm

Happy Bertie wrote:

Thanks Stark.

This article illustrates the confusion "this" and "next" causes, especially between International and North American English.

What I gather is Americans will say "this Thursday" to mean "next Thursday" internationally. In the U.S. "next Thursday" would mean Aug 9th, note this next time "ye're" talking to a North American.:)

< OT > The convention in this regard actually appears to vary even within Ireland. E.G. I know several people who use American usage in this context, but I don't. Until recently I did not even realise there was any other way of doing it.
< /OT >

Mayo Exile · 31-07-2007 4:36pm

Originally posted by Stark: I think he means next Thursday as in this Thursday.

Apologies for the confusion caused by sentence structure! It's this Thursday, August 2nd.;)

RadioCity · 01-08-2007 7:18pm

A bit in today's Belfast Telegraph about the new section of road opening:
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/article2823566.ece

Interesting info about the price of land.

Mayo Exile · 02-08-2007 8:54am

Scheme officially opens today! Ceremony takes place around midday. Minister for Foreign Affairs Dermot Ahern will open it along with NI Minister for Regional Development Conor Murphy.

However RTE causes some last minute confusion though, with Tommy Gorman's report on the RTE radio this morning saying that the section from Dundalk to the border was opening today while the other piece from the border to Newry opening in a few months time. Also says the same on RTE's news website: http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/0802/motorway.html

However AA Roadwatch came on straight after the news saying the whole scheme would open today! Also piece on BBC NI news website says entire scheme opens today:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/6926783.stm

Mayo Exile · 02-08-2007 11:35am

Looking at the BBC's map of the scheme there is now an offramp at Flurry Bridge as well as the onramp on the southbound DC:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/07/uk_enl_1186001501/html/1.stm

This is to access the Carrickdale Hotel complex it seems. Its not on the original NRA Map:
http://www.nra.ie/News/DownloadableDocumentation/file,1157,en.PDF

Also on page 10 of this weeks Dundalk Argus (1 August) there is an ad on behalf of the Carrickdale Hotel with a map highlighting this.

wwhyte · 02-08-2007 12:11pm

I'll be driving this tomorrow so I can see which of the various news stories are true... I'll post a report.

Mayo Exile · 02-08-2007 1:28pm

Road now open but RTE still saying only open to the border:
http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/0802/motorway.html

while AA Roadwatch in its National Summary Report and Traffic Alerts sections is saying the whole scheme is open (www.aaroadwatch.ie)

Originally posted by wwhyte: I'll be driving this tomorrow so I can see which of the various news stories are true... I'll post a report.

Ta for that! Will probably take a spin up it myself this evening to see who's telling the truth!!;)

Stark · 02-08-2007 2:03pm

Mayo Exile wrote:

Road now open but RTE still saying only open to the border:
http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/0802/motorway.html

In the same article they say:

The road between Ballymascanlon at the end of the M1 outside Dundalk and the Cloghogue roundabout outside Newry was opened this afternoon.

So they just seem to have a funny idea of where the border is.

JupiterKid · 02-08-2007 5:21pm

I was up in the North a few weeks ago and it looked to me that a lot more work was needed on the road on the NI side of the border. It's pretty amazing if the entire road is opened to Clohogue roundabout. It sounds like the entire length of the road may well be open to traffic, but a lot of completion work is still to be carried out.

Skyhater · 02-08-2007 9:10pm

The entire road is open..... It was on BBC Newsline this evening.
Also, there was a 2 mile tailback back from the Clohogue roundabout

lego · 03-08-2007 12:22am

Motorway all the way to the border (quasi-motorway just before the border), then its on to the rickety congested A1 in Norn Iron. Now they're the poor relations.

http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news?articleid=3079303

http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news?articleid=3080873

RadioCity · 03-08-2007 10:18am

Also, there was a 2 mile tailback back from the Clohogue roundabout

So, as ever the traffic has been moved elsewhere, into "Norlern Arland" by the looks of it making the Newry bypass the bottleneck now, not Dundalk as it was for long enough. The benefit has been totally lost has it?

It looks very embarrassing for the Roads Service/Department for Regional Development in the North. The A1 was always a crappily built stretch of road as it was generally built as a standard single carriageway, twisty in places and then another road put down beside it making it dual.

As if that wasn't bad enough, the dreadful junction at Sprucefield at the M1 was the icing on the cake. The A101 slighly relieved the original awful layout, but only just.

Mayo Exile · 03-08-2007 2:02pm

Originally posted by JupiterKid: I was up in the North a few weeks ago and it looked to me that a lot more work was needed on the road on the NI side of the border. It's pretty amazing if the entire road is opened to Clohogue roundabout. It sounds like the entire length of the road may well be open to traffic, but a lot of completion work is still to be carried out.

Originally posted by Skyhater: The entire road is open..... It was on BBC Newsline this evening.
Also, there was a 2 mile tailback back from the Clohogue roundabout

Took a spin up it myself last night. Lovely until near the Clohogue roundabout. What a disaster! No wonder there are 2 mile tailbacks. You are funnelled off the northbound DC along a narrow corridor you wouldn't put a motorised anorexic mouse through!! You can still see the northbound DC continuing right up to that small hill before the roundabout itself. Alot of work to be done there. The layout would definitely want to be improved before the Xmas shopping season starts, when half of Dublin comes to Newry to stock up on alcohol related products!

Rashers72 · 03-08-2007 2:05pm

Can you avoid it by going through Carlingford? Just want to get to Sainsbury's in Newry.
Or what is the worst times for the tailbacks, so I can avoid them.

Mayo Exile · 03-08-2007 2:34pm

Originally posted by Rashers72: Can you avoid it by going through Carlingford? Just want to get to Sainsbury's in Newry.
Or what is the worst times for the tailbacks, so I can avoid them.

Yes you can go this way via Carlingford and Omeath, over the border a couple of miles and then take a right. This takes you to the left turn for the back way into the Quays shopping centre (Sainsburys). Its the way I use coming up to Xmas. The Quays is in a permanent state of chaos at the weekends at this time with alot of traffic using the A1, around the Clohogue roundabout and down the dreaded hill into Newry. Then you are trying to get parking. Alternatively the other way is to get there as early as you can...........

E92 · 03-08-2007 2:54pm

I note that this road has not been reclassified yet to Motorway, which is a pity, however it is good to see that it boasts a 120 km/h spped limit south of the border.

wwhyte · 03-08-2007 3:12pm

Open all the way to Cloghogue! And a very nice drive it is too. There's a very handsome bridge at Jonesborough; the fact that it's slightly down the hill from the old road between the border and Meigh makes that plain seem much wider; and the slight change in angle coming over the last hill before Newry improves the impact of the view. Oh, and the fact that you aren't stuck behind some bloke in a tractor all the way doesn't hurt either...

They were reporting two-mile tailbacks at Newry where the road narrows from two lanes to one northbound, but the traffic was pretty light when we went through at about ten this morning.

Google maps is already showing it open. But the satellite pictures don't even show the Dundalk bypass section...

LFCFan · 03-08-2007 4:04pm

Mayo Exile wrote:

stock up on alcohol related products!

for wine and spirits maybe. The vast majority of Beers are now cheaper in the South as I found out recently. I guess the abolition of the groceries order has served some purpose afterall

As for the road. All that will happen until the M1 is completed to Belfast is that the bottleneck will continue to move ever closer to Belfast. Right now, all the time you make up on the motorway is lost as you come to that roundabout.

wwhyte · 03-08-2007 4:24pm

LFCFan wrote:

As for the road. All that will happen until the M1 is completed to Belfast is that the bottleneck will continue to move ever closer to Belfast. Right now, all the time you make up on the motorway is lost as you come to that roundabout.

I don't think that's entirely true. At light traffic times (like this morning) the improvement is significant, and even at heavy traffic times you can get ahead of several lorries going up the hill out of Dundalk.

Skyhater · 03-08-2007 5:13pm

LFCFan wrote:

As for the road. All that will happen until the M1 is completed to Belfast is that the bottleneck will continue to move ever closer to Belfast. Right now, all the time you make up on the motorway is lost as you come to that roundabout.

As far as the current plans are concerned, The M1 is completed..... It runs from Dublin to Dundalk.
Then you have the N1 section (could be reclassified motorway, but i doubt it.... They have destroyed the alternative route)
Then you have the A1...... Even if the NI authorities do upgrade this to Motorway, it probably won't be called the M1.... NI have their own M1 which runs from Belfast to Dungannon.
We won't go into the reasons why the M1 classification wasn't used for the main north south route or why it probably won't change :-)
They might call the road the A1(M).

Victor · 03-08-2007 7:43pm

In the NI scheme of things, the Lisburn-Newry motorway was to be the M11.

DerekP11 · 04-08-2007 12:14am

Hit the approach to Newry at lunch time today. Approx 3km tail back, plus further delays on the Newry bypass. I didn't feel aggrieved as I was in another country governed by a different administration. Its their problem.

I had to laugh at the following quote from an article posted;

ONE of the most important road schemes in Irish history opens today, linking both sides of the border on the Belfast to Dublin route – a road which even unionists are now

describing as the key corridor in the island.

Ha! It wasn't the key corridor in the late 60s when they rolled the M1 to Dungannon and wanted to single the rail line as far as the border.

The crown abandoned them and they can't see it yet.:D

Mayo Exile · 06-08-2007 2:09pm

There's just been a piece on the lunchtime edition of BBC NI's Newsline programme highlighting the continuing problems at this roundabout. Tailbacks on the northbound DC especially severe yesterday (Sunday). According to the report the Roads Service NI has admitted the problem and is looking to see if it can change the layout at Clohogue to improve the situation.

spacetweek · 09-08-2007 2:41pm

Victor wrote:

In the NI scheme of things, the Lisburn-Newry motorway was to be the M11.

That's true, but since all the old motorway plans for NI are now scrapped, that number is probably obsolete. It'll most likely be A1(M). Another section of A1(M) is due to be created up at the A1/M1 junction near Lisburn.

Richard · 09-08-2007 5:43pm

spacetweek wrote:

That's true, but since all the old motorway plans for NI are now scrapped, that number is probably obsolete. It'll most likely be A1(M). Another section of A1(M) is due to be created up at the A1/M1 junction near Lisburn.

I don't think, however, that they'll designate it as a motorway just for the sake of it, unless they could upgrade the whole Northern Irish M1 - Border route to motorway status.

ipodrocker · 18-09-2009 12:30am

i noticed on wesley johnston's website there are new updated pics of the scheme, think the latest on the upgrade is completion in the region of late 2010 so we will have a constant HQDC all the way from dublin to belfast

ardmacha · 18-09-2009 12:35am

so we will have a constant HQDC all the way from dublin to belfast

There will a DC everywhere, but from Sheepbridge to Sprucefield will not be HQ!

ipodrocker · 18-09-2009 12:43am

But I presume that section will be dualled bar with the current round abouts correct?

L1011 · 18-09-2009 7:27pm

ipodrocker wrote: »

But I presume that section will be dualled bar with the current round abouts correct?

Its already all dualled. The roundabouts at Hillsborough and Sprucefield will remain for the moment.

Some busy median breaches have/are currently being converted to overbridges to reduce the risk of high speed collisions but its nowhere close to a full HQDC refit.

Eventually the Sprucefield roundabouts will be bypassed with the M1 A1 Link leaving Hillsborough as the only roundabout between Dublin and Belfast.

M1 to Newry - completion date?

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