Are the Gardai above the traffic laws

Randomswinger · 09-07-2007 10:38AM #1

Over the last few months I've become increasingly annoyed with the large number of people who pay little or no head to the rules of the road or traffic laws such as

- People breaking redlights is on the increase
- People turning right or left when the filter light clearly says straight on only
- Lack of indication for manovers or at junctions
- Handheld mobile phones

Now I'm of the opinion that the Gardai should at least try to set a good example to other road users. Over the last 5 days I've seen a combination of marked and unmarked cars doing the following

- Driver speaking on handheld mobile phone
- Turning right where right turns are not allowed (they were not a call happily waited at the junction)
- Not using indicators
- Stopping in yellow boxes
- Smoking & driving

If they're driving around like no one else matters on the road how will anyone ever obey a traffic law again?

godtabh · 09-07-2007 10:43AM

Randomswinger wrote:

- Smoking & driving

Is that against the law?

eve · 09-07-2007 10:45AM

I saw a ban garda driving a police car last week while texting-she had the phone held up level with the top of he steering wheel.

Also encountered a police car speeding up Talbot St about a month ago with no falshing lights or sirens to warn people.

Slaanesh · 09-07-2007 10:45AM

Commercial vehicles = no smoking?

jhegarty · 09-07-2007 10:47AM

kearnsr wrote:

Is that against the law?

yep , its a work place...

Mena · 09-07-2007 10:47AM

Randomswinger wrote:

- Driver speaking on handheld mobile phone

They're exempt from that rule so this is not, in any way, breaking the law.

Out of your list, the thing that gets me the most, is the "- People turning right or left when the filter light clearly says straight on only". And then they have the nerve to start hooting and yelling at me when I stay put, waiting for the green light/arrow... :mad:

daedalus2097 · 09-07-2007 10:47AM

A Garda car is a place of work, therefore is a no smoking zone. Same as a taxi or delivery van...

whippet · 09-07-2007 10:48AM

deleted as the point has been well made several times while I was typing !

daedalus2097 · 09-07-2007 10:50AM

whippet wrote:

deleted as the point has been well made several times while I was typing !

Edit: Oops - deleted my clarification

cormie · 09-07-2007 11:03AM

Slaanesh wrote:

Commercial vehicles = no smoking?

I don't think so, only if there are passengers being carried for reward as far as I can tell from this.

azzeretti · 09-07-2007 11:05AM

Mena wrote:

They're exempt from that rule so this is not, in any way, breaking the law.

Out of your list, the thing that gets me the most, is the "- People turning right or left when the filter light clearly says straight on only". And then they have the nerve to start hooting and yelling at me when I stay put, waiting for the green light/arrow... :mad:

You see, this really wrecks my pickle. If there is a two way light, one with a light for straight and one with a right turn, and the filter light is NOT on, then you MUST proceed ahead. That is, if the light for straight is green, and there is a filter light, but its not on, or not red, it means you should continue and cross when safe to do so. It wrecks my head when people have a clear road and green light and no filter (i.e not red or not lit) and they sit there waiting for a little green arrow.

You only stop if the light is RED, if the filter light is simply not ON, you can still proceed with caution when the main light is GREEN.

Sorry for hyjacking, but this wrecks my head, Garda doing it, or anyone else.

Owen · 09-07-2007 11:06AM

I've posted about this before, and been flamed for my opinions, so it's good to see someone else questioning the Gardaí's ability to set an example. In Cork, I see them speeding constantly, on the phone, making illegal turns, driving without seatbelts, etc.

Kinetic^ · 09-07-2007 11:07AM

Seen one one the phone while driving down Clanbrassil street last week.:rolleyes:

Mena · 09-07-2007 11:10AM

azzeretti wrote:

You see, this really wrecks my pickle. If there is a two way light, one with a light for straight and one with a right turn, and the filter light is NOT on, then you MUST proceed ahead. That is, if the light for straight is green, and there is a filter light, but its not on, or not red, it means you should continue and cross when safe to do so. It wrecks my head when people have a clear road and green light and no filter (i.e not red or not lit) and they sit there waiting for a little green arrow.

You only stop if the light is RED, if the filter light is simply not ON, you can still proceed with caution when the main light is GREEN.

Sorry for hyjacking, but this wrecks my head, Garda doing it, or anyone else.

Hmm, I've seen/heard varying opinions on this, all contradictory. I'll look it up.

cormie · 09-07-2007 11:10AM

azzeretti wrote:

You see, this really wrecks my pickle. If there is a two way light, one with a light for straight and one with a right turn, and the filter light is NOT on, then you MUST proceed ahead. That is, if the light for straight is green, and there is a filter light, but its not on, or not red, it means you should continue and cross when safe to do so. It wrecks my head when people have a clear road and green light and no filter (i.e not red or not lit) and they sit there waiting for a little green arrow.

You only stop if the light is RED, if the filter light is simply not ON, you can still proceed with caution when the main light is GREEN.

Sorry for hyjacking, but this wrecks my head, Garda doing it, or anyone else.

Never knew that, can you link to where it says it in the rules of the road or the law before I start doing it please?

miles teg · 09-07-2007 11:10AM

A friend of mine was nearly crashed into on a roundabout by a gard who was using a mobile phone at the time.
He rang the local station to report the incident (without initially mentioning it was a cop car). When he was asked for the license number, he gave it and the gard tooka minute to look it up on the computer... "hang on, that's a garda squad car number you gave me!"
"yeah, it was a gard that nearly crashed into me"
The gard on the phone then made loads of excuses saying he couldn't follow up the complaint... the radio in the car wasn't working properly and they had to use the phones etc.
Perks of the job

JohnCleary · 09-07-2007 11:12AM

Kenny 5 wrote:

Seen one one the phone while driving down Clanbrassil street last week.:rolleyes:

And your point is....? They're allowed to (Unfortunately)

mcauley · 09-07-2007 11:12AM

"Are the Gardai above the traffic laws?"

Simply put - Yes.

godtabh · 09-07-2007 11:12AM

Slaanesh wrote:

Commercial vehicles = no smoking?

Never copped the smoking ban bit. Mind you its done every were. I made a complaint to Dublin Bus about it when a driver was smoking while letting people on and they said they couldnt do anything about it.

As for the left/right turn there is a place in Lucan village were there right turn is banned to the N4 beside the cop shop and I've seen the gardai stand out side and chat to their mates while this goes on and nothing happens

Jack Bauer999 · 09-07-2007 11:17AM

kearnsr wrote:

Never copped the smoking ban bit. Mind you its done every were. I made a complaint to Dublin Bus about it when a driver was smoking while letting people on and they said they couldnt do anything about it.

As for the left/right turn there is a place in Lucan village were there right turn is banned to the N4 beside the cop shop and I've seen the gardai stand out side and chat to their mates while this goes on and nothing happens

was he smoking in the bus or standing outside?

_Kaiser_ · 09-07-2007 11:25AM

azzeretti wrote:

You see, this really wrecks my pickle. If there is a two way light, one with a light for straight and one with a right turn, and the filter light is NOT on, then you MUST proceed ahead. That is, if the light for straight is green, and there is a filter light, but its not on, or not red, it means you should continue and cross when safe to do so. It wrecks my head when people have a clear road and green light and no filter (i.e not red or not lit) and they sit there waiting for a little green arrow.

You only stop if the light is RED, if the filter light is simply not ON, you can still proceed with caution when the main light is GREEN.

Sorry for hyjacking, but this wrecks my head, Garda doing it, or anyone else.

I always assumed it was this way too. Although I've rarely come across people sitting waiting like you describe unless there's an L-plate on the car.

markpb · 09-07-2007 11:29AM

ned78 wrote:

I've posted about this before, and been flamed for my opinions, so it's good to see someone else questioning the Gardaí's ability to set an example. In Cork, I see them speeding constantly, on the phone, making illegal turns, driving without seatbelts, etc.

I wouldn't normally make excuses for Gardai, they do their fare share of bad driving but nothing you've complained about it surprising or illegal. The second is easily explained because their radios are so useless (in the clear) that they're rarely used, the third is because turn restrictions are to prevent rat running through estates - enforcing that for gardai would be stupid and I'm sure you can see why - and the last isn't illegal at all because they're expected to be able to make a quick exit from their car if something happens.

There's a reason why they're exempt from RTA laws, use your head.

Mitch Connor · 09-07-2007 11:29AM

Kaiser2000 wrote:

I always assumed it was this way too. Although I've rarely come across people sitting waiting like you describe unless there's an L-plate on the car.

that is how i was taught when learning to drive, as was my brother and my GF (all recent enough learners) If the light is green, proceed with caution - the green arrow going green indicats that you have right of way over oncoming traffic (but should obviously still proceed with caution.)

godtabh · 09-07-2007 11:30AM

Jack Bauer999 wrote:

was he smoking in the bus or standing outside?

on the bus with people on board

Owen · 09-07-2007 11:31AM

markpb wrote:

I wouldn't normally make excuses for Gardai, they do their fare share of bad driving but nothing you've complained about it surprising or illegal.

I'll defer to your insight, but in the case of speeding, without any sirens/lights on?

Kurumba · 09-07-2007 11:34AM

I was sitting at a red light waiting for a green light, or an arrow to go right, plently of people behind me also waiting when a garda car came up on the left handside and took blatently broke a very red light. Again, no flashing lights. I had seen them in the shop a few mins previous buying their breakfast rolls, so were obviously in a hurry to get back to the station!

markpb · 09-07-2007 11:37AM

ned78 wrote:

I'll defer to your insight, but in the case of speeding, without any sirens/lights on?

I didn't argue with you about that, I'd tend to agree with you. I think some gardai tend to drive fast because they can.

On the other hand, from speaking with some Gardai, the semi-plausible reason given was that people tend to freeze or react terribly badly when a garda car comes up behind them with lights and sirens. Some of them prefer to finesse the situation and try to get past without them.

If you watch the traffic, you'll regularly see people jamming on the brakes when there's oncoming traffic, leaving the Gardai no space to get past. You'll see other people trying to move out of the way and successfully blocking the gardai by accident.

The only time the lights are really needed (and useful) is coming up to a free-flowing junction when the gardai need to pass a red or if they're in an area where jaywalking is common.

daedalus2097 · 09-07-2007 12:01PM

Mena wrote:

Hmm, I've seen/heard varying opinions on this, all contradictory. I'll look it up.

If you're in a straight ahead lane and you have a straight ahead filter you must proceed. If it's just a green light and you're in a lane that allows right turning but the right turn filter is not up, you can still turn right if the way is clear. If it's not though you're perfectly fine to sit there.

daedalus2097 · 09-07-2007 12:08PM

markpb wrote:

The only time the lights are really needed (and useful) is coming up to a free-flowing junction when the gardai need to pass a red or if they're in an area where jaywalking is common.

I think if they're in any unexpected place they should be used. Like speeding down a bus lane when the main carriageway is jammed with traffic. A friend of mine was hit by one in this situation, jaywalking indeed but wouldn't have happened if sirens were being used. I'd agree though that sometimes people panic, drive into any gap they can find across the lanes and as a result cause a mini gridlock for everyone.

MGrah · 09-07-2007 12:13PM

azzeretti wrote:

You see, this really wrecks my pickle. If there is a two way light, one with a light for straight and one with a right turn, and the filter light is NOT on, then you MUST proceed ahead. That is, if the light for straight is green, and there is a filter light, but its not on, or not red, it means you should continue and cross when safe to do so. It wrecks my head when people have a clear road and green light and no filter (i.e not red or not lit) and they sit there waiting for a little green arrow.

You only stop if the light is RED, if the filter light is simply not ON, you can still proceed with caution when the main light is GREEN.

Sorry for hyjacking, but this wrecks my head, Garda doing it, or anyone else.

There's two different types of junction in question here.

One where a filter light to with a directional arrow to the right is attached to a regular traffic light with no directional arrow, in which case the standard green light means you can go any direction when clear.

The second, less common but on the increase, type has a straight ahead directional arrow next to the turn right directional arrow, in which case the straight ahead does not entitle you to turn right, and you must wait for the turn right arrow. These always have two separate red light, so you would see a straight ahead arrow next to a red light, meaning straight ahead is the only direction you can go. Usually these are located where pedestrian lights are in place accross the junction.

cormie · 09-07-2007 12:36PM

that's how I understood it too. If there is a normal green light and the filter light isn't green, you can still go, but if that normal green light was a straight only filter light, you have to wait for the right/left filter light to go green before you can go.

Can anyone link to documentation that says if there is no red light above the right/left filter lights and the straight arrow is green, you can still go left/right please?

Are the Gardai above the traffic laws

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