I love the Garda !!!!!!!

Duggy747 · 21-05-2007 05:52PM

Well, Paddy_Irishman, I can see where you're coming from alright and somehow ye find my story a bit suspicious (Which, in fairness, I would too if I was reading from someone else) But I honestly can't stress it much more, and to clear things up I was drinking that night but spent my last tenner heading to the nite-club thus I was in pretty sober stage by the time I hit the chipper. It's pretty easy for you to state "You were obviously being difficult and being a smart ass" when you weren't there? In my town this stuff ain't new and I'm sure as hell it's the same around other parts.

the_syco · 21-05-2007 05:55PM

THe cops don't do much in my town apart from
a) staying outside nightclubs, and talking to the local ladies.
b) arresting people who are handed to them by the bouncers
c) walking around the village at 2pm

Now, you may say thats their job, but as they only do "b", and say, not arrest the tards fighting 10 meters down the road, it shows how little they do.

And as for "c", if they walked around at 9pm (or even drove around in their paddywagon) it would keep the scum inside, and not openly drinking anywhere they want. I don't care, but you never really see old people walk around after 8pm or 9pm. Must be intimidated by the large groups of scum drinking at the entrances of the estates.

nesf · 21-05-2007 05:56PM

OP, you've made a lot of unsubstantiated allegations. I'm willing to let this remain open only as long as people don't start naming individual gardaí and accusing them of stuff. Even naming stations is a no go area. This is due to legal reasons.

Other than that, I advise people who find this kind of stuff offensive to simply give it no weight or take it with a large pinch of salt. Or ignore the thread. Beyond this person's word there is no reason to take any of this seriously so there is no reason to get upset by it.

Keep it civil lads.

patrickolee · 21-05-2007 05:57PM

Duggy747 wrote:

Well, Paddy_Irishman, I can see where you're coming from alright and somehow ye find my story a bit suspicious (Which, in fairness, I would too if I was reading from someone else) But I honestly can't stress it much more, and to clear things up I was drinking that night but spent my last tenner heading to the nite-club thus I was in pretty sober stage by the time I hit the chipper. It's pretty easy for you to state "You were obviously being difficult and being a smart ass" when you weren't there? In my town this stuff ain't new and I'm sure as hell it's the same around other parts.

For what it's worth, I believe you. I've come across a few bad gardai incidents along the way... (most of them are very nice people BTW). Not going to go into details, no point.

Duggy747 · 21-05-2007 06:00PM

patrickolee wrote:

For what it's worth, I believe you. I've come across a few bad gardai incidents along the way... (most of them are very nice people BTW). Not going to go into details, no point.

Thanks, I'm not having something of a witchhunt on Gardaì, you get dicks on all levels of life but at least they're the minority

Jumpy · 21-05-2007 06:05PM

Duggy747 wrote:

Thanks, I'm not having something of a witchhunt on Gardaì, you get dicks on all levels of life but at least they're the minority

I am soooo tempted to quote Team America here

event · 21-05-2007 06:47PM

Lorax wrote:

Or the countless times people have been beaten/killed in cells and no-one has ever been brought to justice for it.

could you show us come links on that? Proof?

SetantaL wrote:

In short, the guards lie through their teeth. We all know it happens, but people don't want to go into open court and put their word against a guar. They don't want the hassle because the next time you're out for a pint they'll stick you to the wall again. They can victimise you that way.

so you give us one case, and as a result, all guards lie through their teeth.

I know a bad accountant, and i also have a friend whos mothers uncles brothers midwifes sisters babysitter knew of a bad nurse, but do i moan about it in here?

Can anyone here actually back up their claims of widespread( and i mean actual proof, not giving me one case, or a friend of a friend) abuse?

I am not a member of the gardai, before anyone asks, but i dont get the abuse they are given

patrickolee · 21-05-2007 07:06PM

Well I saw with my own two eyes and heard with my own two ears a Garda couching a prosecution witness before he took the stand on how he should lie! I was one of three people who heard it. Won't go into anymore details than that. I will not report through any official channels largely for the reasons SetantaL quotes.

mikemac · 21-05-2007 07:13PM

jimi_t wrote:

If you want a well documented and legitimate text talking about garda brutality, you could do worse than read Fr. Peter Mc Verry's book "The Meaning in the Shadows". Title's a bit crap, but this guy is the real deal. I spent two weeks with him in one of the homeless hostels he set up in drumcondra, talking to the guys there, going to their hearings in the courts etc... The stories I heard from both himself and the guys in the hostel make the events here sound a tad Fischer Price.

http://www.veritas.ie/veritas/asp/section.asp?s=309

Here's an extract from the book (available online @URL, no copyright issues).

I'm not going to quote the description of Summerhill as it's too long.
Fr. Peter McVerry obviously knows his stuff but I can't disagree more.

I pass Summerhill every day and constantly see kids shoplifting, riding small motorbikes on the footpath, putting rubbish in the canal and loads more.
So the article states it is not the kids fault, it is societys.
What sh***e! I don't get social housing or welfare benefits like many Summerhill families do.
I want to see the gardai crack down on anti-social behaviour and if some scumbag gets a beating in the station, so be it.
This is off-topic though but it'd make a good Humanities thread.

HammerHeadGym · 21-05-2007 07:13PM

AlmightyCushion wrote:

...yerr man gets a rake of complaints about this sort of thing, something might get done...

Even if nothing get's done, a complaint will stop him getting promoted past seargent.

ZING!!

tallaght01 · 21-05-2007 07:14PM

event wrote:

could you show us come links on that? Proof?

so you give us one case, and as a result, all guards lie through their teeth.

I know a bad accountant, and i also have a friend whos mothers uncles brothers midwifes sisters babysitter knew of a bad nurse, but do i moan about it in here?

Can anyone here actually back up their claims of widespread( and i mean actual proof, not giving me one case, or a friend of a friend) abuse?

I am not a member of the gardai, before anyone asks, but i dont get the abuse they are given

I think part of the problem is that the gardai don't endear themselves to the population, so people are more likely to believe negative stories about them. Essentially, many people would argue that, given their experiences, the gardai are capable of an abuse of power. I think a lot of people find the gardai to be rude generally. Most people, I would imagine, have a story about a rude garda.
I was in the car with me sister a while ago in Dublin. A cop stopped her and accused her of a traffic offence. The traffic signs on this particular road had changed, so what my sis was doing was now legal, whereas previously it wasn't (I think it was that you were now allowed a left hand turn, or something minor like that). The cop hadn't noticed the new sign. No big deal, you'd imagine. But the dogs abuse her gave her. It was ages before she could get in a word to show him the new roadsign. he then let her go, quite begrudgingly. It was as if she was still in the wrong.No apology or nothing.

I was in Crumlin a couple of years ago meeting a mate. I was just wandering down the street, when 2 cops stopped me. I'm not againsts random stops to be honest. But they treated me like dirt. "Where are your drugs?" They asked me straight out. Obviously, I don't take drugs so didn't have any on me. But, again, when they had completed the search in the middle of the busy street, they just said "go on, get out of here". No apology or anything. Still treating me like a criminal. Compare that with the cops you meet on holidays in new York for eg. Some of the cops I met in Times square were the friendliest people you could ever meet. None of this proves anything, of course. My experiences don't make all gardai bad people. But my experiences cloud my judgement, and as a result I'm more likely to believe stories such as those told by the OP, rather than stories about, say, postmen. And I don't think my experience of the gardai are unique.

drdre · 21-05-2007 07:32PM

DarkJager wrote:

Not sure if you posted here looking for advice or just to vent some anger but I'll give you my 2 cents:

If the summons arrives and your taken to court, then explain exactly what you've told us above. You should also contact the Garda Ombudsman and make an official complaint against the conduct of this Garda. We really don't need wannabe Robocops like him on the street.

I agree with you.Just report the garda if you can.

jimi_t · 21-05-2007 08:00PM

micmclo wrote:

I pass Summerhill every day and constantly see kids shoplifting, riding small motorbikes on the footpath, putting rubbish in the canal and loads more.
So the article states it is not the kids fault, it is societys.
What sh***e! I don't get social housing or welfare benefits like many Summerhill families do.

Well, you have to take into consideration that McVerry is a priest first of all.

Second of all he lived there from 1974 onwards, taking the time to know the people. He didn't simply walk past it and take it at face value.

Thirdly, a mantra in this book is the preventative measure. It comes across very left wing and airy-fairy there, I know, but when you read further on and take things in perspective with the rest of the book it seems a little more realistic.

I want to see the gardai crack down on anti-social behaviour and if some scumbag gets a beating in the station, so be it.

A "scumbag" isn't born, they're a product of both their environment and social conditioning. I know that sounds very southside sociology student, but bear with me.

I mean, I know where you're coming from. You get mugged or beaten up or held up by a junkie and suddenly the most liberal of people become hardcore right-wing on crime. The whole "well thats fine until it happens to you" angle.

But the simple thing is this approach has been tried...and tried.... and tried... and it only exascerbates the problem. You can't physically harass an already disadvantaged section of society until the problem goes away - I mean, you may subdue them for a while, but ultimately this kind of brutality will only lead to deeper resentment and alienation. The only longterm solution is to get to the cause of the problem and understand why this behaviour is happening. I mean there's only a few miles between Ballsbridge and Ballyfermot - why is there so much more violence, substance abuse and other crime in one than the other?

...But yeah, fairly off-topic at this stage.

Paddy_Irishman · 21-05-2007 08:07PM

Duggy747 wrote:

Well, Paddy_Irishman, I can see where you're coming from alright and somehow ye find my story a bit suspicious (Which, in fairness, I would too if I was reading from someone else) But I honestly can't stress it much more, and to clear things up I was drinking that night but spent my last tenner heading to the nite-club thus I was in pretty sober stage by the time I hit the chipper. It's pretty easy for you to state "You were obviously being difficult and being a smart ass" when you weren't there? In my town this stuff ain't new and I'm sure as hell it's the same around other parts.

Ye thats fair to say I couldnt know you were obviously being difficult and a smart ass if I wasnt there. But it would be fair to say you were not acting like you said you were in your story either

.

I think a grey area for how you acted is probably more acceptable. Nobody is going to admit they were ignorant or drunk etc of course. Also I know I think it all the time myself but you think you were fairly sober, how do you think a stone cold sober person working would see you? Say a Barman? Or a Bouncer? Or at the end of a night, a guard?

I just dont believe all your story, I do believe you were on a night out and had a few beers. I believe you went to the chippy at the end of the night, how you paid for the chips I dunno, you said you spent all your money goin into the club

. I also believe that you were most likely standing on the street gobbling up your chips and having the craic and that a squad car passed and said move in off the road and you either ignored them or said something smart and then that pissed off the guards and you were arrested etc.

As for the philosopher above me. If your so enlightened please do tell the world why they 'scumbags' act like that. It's easy to play devils advocate when it doesnt affect you really and come up with different ways of tackling social problems when you in reality will have 0% actualy impact on implementing.

"God see's all from heaven but nobody can hear him roar".

nesf · 21-05-2007 08:12PM

jimi_t wrote:

...But yeah, fairly off-topic at this stage.

Yes, a good topic for another thread though, but I wouldn't start one here. It'd just descend into muppetry within 20 posts.

jimi_t · 21-05-2007 08:19PM

nesf wrote:

Yes, a good topic for another thread though, but I wouldn't start one here. It'd just descend into muppetry within 20 posts.

Yip. Just wanted to defend and explain the authors viewpoint in a book citing tons of examples of garda brutality, in an attempt to satiate posts like

event wrote:

could you show us come links on that? Proof?

so you give us one case, and as a result, all guards lie through their teeth.

Can anyone here actually back up their claims of widespread( and i mean actual proof, not giving me one case, or a friend of a friend) abuse?

I am not a member of the gardai, before anyone asks, but i dont get the abuse they are given

because, in fairness, a lot of this is friend of a friend stuff - but that doesn't mean it's not happening.

nesf · 21-05-2007 08:23PM

jimi_t wrote:

because, in fairness, a lot of this is friend of a friend stuff - but that doesn't mean it's not happening.

Yes, but would you agree that there are more stories than actual occurrences? I agree that it does happen but I wouldn't agree that it's widespread or endemic.

cson · 21-05-2007 08:43PM

No smoke without fire I guess.

BuffyBot · 21-05-2007 08:55PM

OP = Vicki Pollard.

"but I did nuffin like, you ask Michelle cos she was out back givin a bj to Mark because Paula, the one who got banged up for robbing two bags of sprouts in Somerfields broke up with him and needed company and I didn't do nuffin cos I was like totally not there 'cos.. (ad nauseum)

godtabh · 21-05-2007 09:18PM

How come you never hear the good stories?

Seems to me that people here will only dwell on the negative.

What would people suggest instead of the Garda?

patrickolee · 21-05-2007 09:20PM

Psni

lemansky · 21-05-2007 09:32PM

Yea the incident described by the OP is ridiculous alright.But as has been said a complaint will get you nowhere beyond the feeling that you'll give yourself that you tried to do something if you know what I mean.But onthe flip side not all Gardai are like that.Many are great people(in Dublin anyway)and the actions of a few shouldn't count against those who put their lives on the line for us.

lemansky · 21-05-2007 09:34PM

kearnsr wrote:

How come you never hear the good stories?

If we heard the good stories we'd have nothing to moan about and the guards could appear as good people....some people couldn't live with that!:D

cson · 21-05-2007 09:35PM

Lives on the line?............right.....

In defence of the Gardai, Police forces on the continent and the US tolerence of being drunk in public is somewhat less than that of our own force.

lemansky · 21-05-2007 09:42PM

cson wrote:

Lives on the line?............right.....

Well you know.... meat cleavers ,guns,swords,more guns syringes.......the necessity of stab proof vests....yeah

cson · 21-05-2007 09:48PM

lemansky wrote:

Well you know.... meat cleavers ,guns,swords,more guns syringes.......the necessity of stab proof vests....yeah

Oh yeah. Limerick.

Boston · 21-05-2007 09:50PM

jimi_t wrote:

The point at the end of the story McVerry is that this happens nearly every single night of the week somewhere in Dublin. These two girls just happened to be of the right social background and have the cash and means to do something about it.

A flash of a trinity college ID is more then enough to get you out of a stop of bother with the gardi on most drunken nights out.

lemansky · 21-05-2007 09:51PM

cson wrote:

Oh yeah. Limerick.

ERU pull you over for speeding-they take no chances!I hear though up here in Dublin a Garda was threatened with a sword there a few days ago....to the extent that negotiators were informed!

jimi_t · 21-05-2007 11:34PM

Paddy_Irishman wrote:

As for the philosopher above me. If your so enlightened please do tell the world why they 'scumbags' act like that.

When people start talking about issues like this, others are quick to jump in with some snide "Oh well then Mr.Smartypants, tell us how" comment. I don't pretend for a second to have the answers.

If some random punter like myself could isolate the root cause(s) just like that, there wouldn't be a problem. There's no quick-solve solution. I just believe that throwing some money towards subsidised housing as a token gesture, and then going down and smacking a few heads together when things get out of hand makes the problem worse rather than better. Anyone who has given their time to try and make a difference would agree with me. I'm no idealist, I just can't see the harm in trying.

It's easy to play devils advocate when it doesnt affect you really and come up with different ways of tackling social problems when you in reality will have 0% actualy impact on implementing.

It's this kind of attitude that's the real problem. We can't do anything so just give up? Why not try volunteering yourself - god knows that plenty of organisations could do with the help. Try helping out with a homework club or a youth club or similar. It might just open your eyes

Hoops1888 · 21-05-2007 11:46PM

Are you honestly surprised?

I love the Garda !!!!!!!

Comments