Riot squad to be at Croker on Saturday

A Dub in Glasgo · 25-02-2007 04:39PM

I have been to many football games where the police use horses for crowd control. The main issue I have with them is the **** they leave all over the place.

cushtac · 25-02-2007 04:46PM

PeakOutput wrote:

well im guessing the reason is because the last time the english were in croke park they brought tanks and killed gaa fans and players

There were no tanks involved in the incident, that was just an invention for the Michael Collins film. Auxillieries turned up and fired into the crowd & players with their rifles.

PeakOutput wrote:

and it was played at the special olympics as i already said in this thread

Was listening to the Last Word on Fri, Matt Cooper says they checked with Special Olympics Ireland and they said that it wasn't played in Croker.

25-02-2007 04:48PM

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

I have been to many football games where the police use horses for crowd control. The main issue I have with them is the **** they leave all over the place.

http://totallyabsurd.com/horsediaper.htm

InFront · 25-02-2007 04:59PM

You may laugh, but that's actually a very valuable tool in the studies of animal nutrition!

Hagar · 25-02-2007 04:59PM

cushtac wrote:

There were no tanks involved in the incident, that was just an invention for the Michael Collins film.

There were no tanks in the Michael Collins film, that was an armoured car. There was an armoured car involved in the real incident as decribed here

As the spectators streamed out, an armoured car on St James Avenue fired its machine guns over the heads of the crowd, trying to halt them.
By the time Major Mills got his men back under control, the police had fired 114 rounds of rifle ammunition, and an unknown amount of revolver ammunition as well, not counting 50 rounds fired from the machine guns in the armoured car outside the Park. Seven people had been shot to death, and five more had been fatally wounded; another two people had been trampled to death by the crowd. The dead included Jeannie Boyle, who had gone to the match with her fiancée and was due to be married five days later, and two boys aged just 10 and 11. Two football players, Michael Hogan and Jim Egan, had been shot; Hogan was killed, but Egan survived, along with dozens of other wounded and injured. The police raiding party suffered no casualties at all.

copacetic · 25-02-2007 05:29PM

Terry wrote:

They all look the same to me.

There is usually one in Ballyfermot.

more horse rascism, (horsism?)!

25-02-2007 05:47PM

daveym wrote:

more horse rascism, (horsism?)!

Dont you mean Nagging

whiskeyman · 25-02-2007 06:00PM

Myth wrote:

http://totallyabsurd.com/horsediaper.htm

I've actually seen these (or something very similar) over in London at Hampton Court palace / gardens.
There's a few horse carriages giving rides to tourists around the grounds, and I guess that can't keep going around cleaning up after them.
Sometimes its awful on a hot day seeing a pile of horse sh*te on Grafton St after they go up there. It's ridiculous. I saw an tourist go flying after stepping in it by accident (had his eyes in a camcorder at the time, so didn't see it).

Terry · 25-02-2007 06:13PM

InFront wrote:

Those horses are as quiet as badgers, nothing very intimidating. I don't see the advantage of using them

Dude, badgers are lethal.
They'll take a lump out of you given the chance.

K-9 · 25-02-2007 07:44PM

cushtac wrote:

Was listening to the Last Word on Fri, Matt Cooper says they checked with Special Olympics Ireland and they said that it wasn't played in Croker.

The Tribune said the same today. Urban legend by the sounds of it.

cushtac · 26-02-2007 02:11PM

Hagar wrote:

There were no tanks in the Michael Collins film, that was an armoured car. There was an armoured car involved in the real incident as decribed here

I was trying not to be pedantic about it, and the incident did not take place as depicted in the film (i.e. Brits driving onto the pitch and milling everyone out of it with machine guns.)

axer · 26-02-2007 02:56PM

Seanies32 wrote:

English or Irish? These horses where bought from an English Police Force. I bet they where English!:)

My understanding is that the Gardai and Irish Defense forces only buy Irish Draughts.

I don't even understand why they played "God Save the Queen" at the Ireland v England Rugby match. England has no National Anthem. GSTQ is the national anthem for the uk as a whole.

Firstly, Ireland was not competing against the uk - only against England.
Secondly, as Northern Ireland is unfortunately still part of the uk and Northern Ireland are part of the Irish Rugby team - the song is not really representing England.

I have no problem with them playing GSTQ in Croke Park but I do believe they should have made a public apology to the Irish people or at least some sort of gesture before or after the match for what they did the last time they were in Croke Park.

seamus · 26-02-2007 03:14PM

axer wrote:

I have no problem with them playing GSTQ in Croke Park but I do believe they should have made a public apology to the Irish people or at least some sort of gesture before or after the match for what they did the last time they were in Croke Park.

Funnily enough, *they* didn't do anything. In fact, they weren't even in Croke Park before.

The people representing the nation that played Ireland on Saturday, were not representing the same nation that entered Croke Park those 80-odd years ago. While a nation doesn't forget its past actions, nor does it become completely disassociated with it, asking a nation to apologise for an act which was carried out when 99% of its citizens weren't even born yet is like asking a man to apologise for his grandfather's crimes. It's idiotic and inflammatory.

Countries aren't like people. A man can commit a crime, and he will always be that same man that committed the crime. A country that commits a crime, is only that country as long as the same people remain in power.

NutJob · 26-02-2007 03:26PM

Muppet of the year award goes to........

Plissken1 · 26-02-2007 03:40PM

NutJob wrote:

Muppet of the year award goes to........

brilliant pic, sums it all up really

"NO CHAV SCUM" either ..... haha :-)

axer · 26-02-2007 04:09PM

seamus wrote:

The people representing the nation that played Ireland on Saturday, were not representing the same nation that entered Croke Park those 80-odd years ago. While a nation doesn't forget its past actions, nor does it become completely disassociated with it, asking a nation to apologise for an act which was carried out when 99% of its citizens weren't even born yet is like asking a man to apologise for his grandfather's crimes. It's idiotic and inflammatory.

A government should take responsibility for atrocities caused by that nation in the past. The government is an organisation, whilst it can have different people running it, it is still the same organisation. 1920 is not that long ago. I think a gesture of the sort would improve anglo-irish relations and would help some move on.

Plissken1 · 26-02-2007 04:54PM

axer wrote:

A government should take responsibility for atrocities caused by that nation in the past. The government is an organisation, whilst it can have different people running it, it is still the same organisation. 1920 is not that long ago. I think a gesture of the sort would improve anglo-irish relations and would help some move on.

Get a couple of ministers from both Governments, to go on Gerry Springer and sort it all out !

mackerski · 26-02-2007 04:58PM

axer wrote:

A government should take responsibility for atrocities caused by that nation in the past.

Should a rugby team?

humanji · 26-02-2007 05:02PM

axer wrote:

A government should take responsibility for atrocities caused by that nation in the past. The government is an organisation, whilst it can have different people running it, it is still the same organisation. 1920 is not that long ago. I think a gesture of the sort would improve anglo-irish relations and would help some move on.

And when can the British people recieve your apology for all the IRA atrocities?

seamus · 26-02-2007 05:04PM

axer wrote:

A government should take responsibility for atrocities caused by that nation in the past.

I disagree to a point. Think of it this way - If the U.S. ever manage to get a stable democratic government in Iraq, are they responsible for the atrocities carried out by Saddam Hussein?

I only believe that a government still bears responsibility for the nation's atrocities if they continue to carry out similar acts, and they fail to acknowledge the atrocities committed by their predecessors. Acknowledging an atrocity doesn't imply the need for an apology, only a recognition of the fact that it was a mistake.

Asking for an apology from a Government that's miles apart from the Government of the day is useless filibustering. Just another obstacle that the hardliners use to justify their bull****.

If the UK Government should apologise for the murders at Croke Park, then we should, by the same token, apologise for the deaths of those British agents on the same day.

Ste.phen · 26-02-2007 05:19PM

seamus wrote:

I disagree to a point. Think of it this way - If the U.S. ever manage to get a stable democratic government in Iraq, are they responsible for the atrocities carried out by Saddam Hussein?

I only believe that a government still bears responsibility for the nation's atrocities if they continue to carry out similar acts, and they fail to acknowledge the atrocities committed by their predecessors. Acknowledging an atrocity doesn't imply the need for an apology, only a recognition of the fact that it was a mistake.

Asking for an apology from a Government that's miles apart from the Government of the day is useless filibustering. Just another obstacle that the hardliners use to justify their bull****.

If the UK Government should apologise for the murders at Croke Park, then we should, by the same token, apologise for the deaths of those British agents on the same day.

Hear, hear.

I think the scumbag in the Celtic tshirt pretty much sums up the stupidity of most of the debate.

starn · 26-02-2007 09:40PM

NutJob wrote:

Muppet of the year award goes to........

Anyone knw what page of the Indo this appeared on

mackerski · 27-02-2007 12:00AM

seamus wrote:

If the U.S. ever manage to get a stable democratic government in Iraq, are they responsible for the atrocities carried out by Saddam Hussein?

Only if they armed him and helped him stay in power and stood idly by while he did it.

axer · 27-02-2007 12:24AM

humanji wrote:

And when can the British people recieve your apology for all the IRA atrocities?

The IRA were neither elected representitives nor statutory upholders of the law. You cannot draw that parallel.

mackerski wrote:

Should a rugby team?

Nope, but on an occaision like that in Croke Park there was an opportunity for the English Government to do it.

seamus wrote:

I disagree to a point. Think of it this way - If the U.S. ever manage to get a stable democratic government in Iraq, are they responsible for the atrocities carried out by Saddam Hussein?

That is a completely different situation. The governing body in that case was ousted by force and completely removed.

seamus wrote:

I only believe that a government still bears responsibility for the nation's atrocities if they continue to carry out similar acts, and they fail to acknowledge the atrocities committed by their predecessors. Acknowledging an atrocity doesn't imply the need for an apology, only a recognition of the fact that it was a mistake.

I agree, maybe asking for an apology might be a bit much but they should make a public recognition of their country's wrong doing against the Irish nation in the past via some wreath laying or otherwise.

seamus wrote:

If the UK Government should apologise for the murders at Croke Park, then we should, by the same token, apologise for the deaths of those British agents on the same day.

Those who killed those British agents were not elected representitives of Ireland nor were they statutory upholders of the law. Again a parallel cannot be drawn between the two.

cushtac · 27-02-2007 12:40AM

axer wrote:

Nope, but on an occasion like that in Croke Park there was an opportunity for the English Government to do it.

The GAA has said that any apology or gesture should be an occasion in & of istself, and that it's not up to a sporting body to do so.

InFront · 27-02-2007 01:36AM

starn wrote:

Anyone knw what page of the Indo this appeared on

I just leafed through it this morning, it's one of the first few pages iirc. It's also in the Times, sports section.

Guy:Incognito · 27-02-2007 01:38AM

I demand that no more scandanavians be let in to this country until we get a formal appology from the respective governments for the raping and pillaging of the vikings.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 27-02-2007 04:45AM

Immortalised on the BBC
http://www.bbc.co.uk/mediaselector/check/player/sol/newsid_6390000/newsid_6397100?redirect=6397165.stm&news=1&bbram=1&nbwm=1&bbwm=1&nbram=1
In case you missed it...

csk · 27-02-2007 09:44AM

seamus wrote:

If the UK Government should apologise for the murders at Croke Park, then we should, by the same token, apologise for the deaths of those British agents on the same day.

I fail to see why we should apologise. There is a difference between a counter intelligence operation carried out by the Irish Army and sanctioned by a Minister of the Government and a force of occupation murdering random people at a football match.

That being said I don't think the British Government should have apologised Saturday either.

mackerski · 27-02-2007 03:11PM

axer wrote:

the English Government

No such thing.

Riot squad to be at Croker on Saturday

Comments