1-2NL hand. How to extract more?

NickyOD · 23-04-2006 01:44PM #1

Villain is bad, but not nearly as bad as most at these tables. He atleast has the sense to be somewhat aggressive but overplays most of his hands after the flop.

He raises to 7 UTG. This is the 3rd pot in a row he has raised. The last 2 hands were not shown. I call in the small blind with AdJc. BB calls.

€21 in the pot.

The flop comes down KcQcTd. I've flopped the nuts!! I bet $10. BB folds and the Villain makes it $35. I reraise to $100 and after some serious thinking he calls. The turn is a complete irrelevent blank that couldn't have helped either of us.

We both have about $250 behind. What should I do now? He does not have a flush draw. Most likely KQ, QT or KT. A set is possible but unlikely given the amount of time it took for him to see the turn. My table image is really bad but I don't know if he has noticed.

Hectorjelly · 23-04-2006 02:27PM

well given the line you have chosen you have to lead the turn, if you check he will check behind. Given that he probably has a set id just push, there are about a million river cards that you dont want to see, and most player cant fold sets. I think your line is good.

Flipper · 23-04-2006 03:08PM

Hey nicky,

Personally, I don't think I would have re-raised to $100 on the flop. Having to act first is a disaster in this situation. If you flat call the $35, he would almost certainly lead at it with a pot sized bet which you could then raise... If he calls, you move all in on the river and if he doesn't, you still take down a nice pot.

On the river, there is only 9 cards that change the nuts (3 x K, 3 x Q & 3 x J) and 6 cards that may lead to a split (3 x A & 3 x 10). Why do you think think he DOESN'T have a flush draw? Anyway, he's only 9/2 to fill it on the river.

If he is a loose player, he'll probably go to the end of the earth with two pair anyway!!

RoundTower · 23-04-2006 03:34PM

I would bet now, either fairly big $150 or so or all in. I like your line up to now, calling the $35 and checking the turn looks like a good way to win the minimum.

Why can't he have a flush draw? Especially something like AcTc.

delanec8 · 23-04-2006 03:39PM

Its an awkward amount that both of you have left. If you were deeply stacked here I would usually bet 180-200. That would look suspicious here, leaving yourself 70 or 50 behind. I think you have to pump it all in. He may drop 2 pair but a lot of the time at this level they won't and judging by your description he isnt getting away from a set.

What other bet can you really make? 100 is begging for a call and gives him close to the odds to draw out on you with a flush draw. anything over 150 without going all in looks suspicious.

You would have to know the villain if you were to consider checking to him.

NickyOD · 23-04-2006 10:08PM

I actually felt that if I led the turn he might fold, so I took a long time to check to him but like HJ predicted he checked behind. The river was another blank and I fired $150 which he called. I'm not sure if there was a way to get all his money in this hand but it felt like there might have been.

Hectorjelly · 23-04-2006 10:24PM

well you got most of it! I think you need to bet the turn. By calling the 100 on the flop he has shown he will is probably committed to the hand.

Hectorjelly · 23-04-2006 11:45PM

Flipper wrote:

On the river, there is only 9 cards that change the nuts (3 x K, 3 x Q & 3 x J) and 6 cards that may lead to a split (3 x A & 3 x 10). Why do you think think he DOESN'T have a flush draw? Anyway, he's only 9/2 to fill it on the river.

You realise a flush beats a straight?

There are 9 cards that make a full house, 11 cards that make a flush possible, if Im counting right thats 18 cards in total that make AJ not quite the nuts anymore on the river. The 6 cards that put a 1 card straight out there would be bad as well, allthough they cant beat us they can kill our action. Similarly allthough its unlikely the villain is on a flush draw he might put us on one and fold if we wait until the river.

fuzzbox · 24-04-2006 08:58AM

I push the turn here. There is 207 in there, and you have 250 left, just stuff it in, he probably calls with lots of stuff.

Alternatively - bet 150 now, and the rest on any river.

Checking the turn is bad.

NickyOD · 24-04-2006 09:19AM

fuzzbox wrote:

I push the turn here. There is 207 in there, and you have 250 left, just stuff it in, he probably calls with lots of stuff.

Alternatively - bet 150 now, and the rest on any river.

Checking the turn is bad.

Pushing the turn is terrible!! He will almost certainly fold. Just because he has smooth called a big reraise on the flop is no guarantee he will commit everything on the turn when a blank lands. If that was the case why did he not just shove in the first place. The reason he smooth calls me is because he hopes to get to a showdown as cheaply as possilbe or to improve his hand to a house. He only had K-T.

Flipper · 24-04-2006 09:21AM

Hectorjelly wrote:

You realise a flush beats a straight?

There are 9 cards that make a full house, 11 cards that make a flush possible, if Im counting right thats 18 cards in total that make AJ not quite the nuts anymore on the river. The 6 cards that put a 1 card straight out there would be bad as well, allthough they cant beat us they can kill our action. Similarly allthough its unlikely the villain is on a flush draw he might put us on one and fold if we wait until the river.

Does a flush really beat a straight?????

I forgot that. I really don't think the villian would procrastinate and just call the 100 on the flop if he does have a set or even two pair. That is if he is the donkey that nicky implied he is. But i do think the flush is a strong possibility. Over-betting on a board like this may also work. Nothing to lose and everything to gain in this situation

FastMachine · 24-04-2006 09:46AM

I'd either push it all in on the turn here or else bet something like 180 into the 220 pot that basically puts him all(they'll usually reraise all in rather that flat call) in but looks more reasonable compared to the pot. There's no way I'm giving a free card or making an insufficient bet odds-wise on that board where he could have a flush draw or a set if he called the flop bet.

If he was bad enough I'd stick it all in on the flop first to act, as there's so many hands that could call you, but you say he's bad but not as bad as most so checkraising and getting it in on the turn is also good. Any ace high flush draw, Jc10c, KQ/KJ/K10, all sets, maybe even QJ/Q10 would call an all in on the flop. Basically, if he's bad and he's got any sort of a hand on a flop like that he should be willing to go all in.

fuzzbox · 24-04-2006 10:23AM

NickyOD wrote:

Pushing the turn is terrible!! He will almost certainly fold. Just because he has smooth called a big reraise on the flop is no guarantee he will commit everything on the turn when a blank lands. If that was the case why did he not just shove in the first place. The reason he smooth calls me is because he hopes to get to a showdown as cheaply as possilbe or to improve his hand to a house. He only had K-T.

This is not true.
Pushing the turn is most certainly not terrible, if he will call you with worse hands.

The pot is 211 and you push for 250 ... why is this a problem?

NickyOD · 24-04-2006 10:33AM

fuzzbox wrote:

This is not true.
Pushing the turn is most certainly not terrible, if he will call you with worse hands.

The pot is 211 and you push for 250 ... why is this a problem?

The problem is he folds most of the time.

fuzzbox · 24-04-2006 10:39AM

NickyOD wrote:

The problem is he folds most of the time.

Why do you believe that to be true?

He prolly has 2pair when he calls, and ppl dont fold 2pair ....

FastMachine · 24-04-2006 11:10AM

This is an ideal board for getting all your cash in on the turn or earlier. He has to have hit something on the flop unless he's raised with a small pair or sc's in which case you'll make nothing off him anyway.

If you bet 1/2 the pot(100) on the turn he has to call 100 to win 470 - 4.7 to 1, more than enough odds for a flush or house. If he has a set or flush draw you're not going to fold the river even if the board pairs or flushes so why not try and get all the cash in the pot when you're 100% sure you're ahead and there's a very good chance he'll call. I think you're giving the villain too much credit, what do you expect him to fold on the turn that he called a cr on the flop with?

Hectorjelly · 25-04-2006 01:33AM

NickyOD wrote:

The problem is he folds most of the time.

I think that a player who calls a 100 on the flop is calling the rest on the turn. I really doubt he is folding a set or 2 pair. He may fold a flush draw which is fine.

Atlas_IRL · 25-04-2006 09:29AM

NickyOD wrote:

Villain is bad, but not nearly as bad as most at these tables. He atleast has the sense to be somewhat aggressive but overplays most of his hands after the flop.

He raises to 7 UTG. This is the 3rd pot in a row he has raised. The last 2 hands were not shown. I call in the small blind with AdJc. BB calls.

€21 in the pot.

The flop comes down KcQcTd. I've flopped the nuts!! I bet $10. BB folds and the Villain makes it $35. I reraise to $100 and after some serious thinking he calls.

A lot of ppl would go all in on the turn after that much commited but the board is still scary for him, he's last to act so its harder for him too call an all in here... The fact that you didnt need to raise preflop might make him think less of your cards as well

1-2NL hand. How to extract more?

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