1988 IRA funeral Footage

Zebra3 · 04-04-2006 11:23PM

I remember it all very well.

It 'started' when an unarmed IRA ASU were shot dead by the SAS in Gibraltar. Their bodies were flown back to Dublin and then moved back to Belfast where Michael Stone turned up throwing grenades and shooting at those burying their dead.

Usually there would be a huge RUC/British army presence at these funerals to try and stop any shots being fired over the coffin, etc but by pure chance the RUC only turned up as Stone was about to beaten to death. Coincidence? :rolleyes:

Days later, the two British soldiers bizarelly drove into the middle of one of the funerals of those Stone had killed and needless to say people weren't gonna let the same thing happened again. Given that one of the soldiers (neither were in uniform and they were in an unmarked car) turned a gun on the mourners, it was no surprise they were taken out and killed.

The Brits must have known they were driving into the funeral. They could not have not known!!! What were they up to and what was their motive????

The Sweeper · 04-04-2006 11:56PM

I remember watching that for the first time on the BBC One Northern Ireland news when I was a child and it had just happened. The images stuck with me throughout my life.

I haven't seen them again in eighteen years, until now.

And every detail is precisely as I remember it.

I suppose it's like that when you watch someone dying.

The thing I always remember from my childhood is my mother saying "look at him, he's firing in the air to scare them, he doesn't want to hurt anyone, he's just firing in the air".

We'd never seen anything quite like it.

Don't kid yourselves. You're watching murder when you watch those tapes.

Mr_Roger_Bongos · 05-04-2006 12:24AM

I think it was guessed at the time that they were in the s.a.s. and from memory (documentary program on the incident and the events that surrounded it) they didn't stumble into the funeral. They were parked at the side of the road to observe anyone who may have I.R.A. connections who was in attendance. I'd say the mob probably didn't know they were sercuirty forces, but it was guessed because they were both sitting in the car while a funeral procession passed.

biko · 05-04-2006 12:29AM

Bambi wrote:

the tune is "black is the colour" isnt it? its some song about the gibraltar three..lyrics are pretty brutal

It's the Ballad of Mairéad Farrell

dubtom · 05-04-2006 04:31AM

I would guess your best bet would be to ask UTV/BBC. As I recall the actually executions were filmed from a helicopter and shown on TV after a court case of one of those accused. One was shot 7 and the other 8 times in the head. I haven't seen that actual footage since and you'll notice in the link provided above that it had been edited out. I have to say that it's a shame that perfectly good historical footage of events from 1916 on are ruined by that music played over them.

klong · 05-04-2006 04:52AM

Mr_Roger_Bongos wrote:

I think it was guessed at the time that they were in the s.a.s. and from memory (documentary program on the incident and the events that surrounded it) they didn't stumble into the funeral. They were parked at the side of the road to observe anyone who may have I.R.A. connections who was in attendance. I'd say the mob probably didn't know they were sercuirty forces, but it was guessed because they were both sitting in the car while a funeral procession passed.

When the two corporals were searched by the mob their military ID cards were found, both of which had "Herford" written on them. Herford was/is a garrison town in Germany. Hereford, close to the England/Wales border, is where the SAS are based. This is how the belief that they were SAS came about.

Hagar · 05-04-2006 06:24AM

dubtom wrote:

One was shot 7 and the other 8 times in the head.

Funny they didn't look Brazilian...:rolleyes:

05-04-2006 09:34AM

Zebra3 wrote:

I remember it all very well.

It 'started' when an unarmed IRA ASU were shot dead by the SAS in Gibraltar. Their bodies were flown back to Dublin and then moved back to Belfast where Michael Stone turned up throwing grenades and shooting at those burying their dead.

Usually there would be a huge RUC/British army presence at these funerals to try and stop any shots being fired over the coffin, etc but by pure chance the RUC only turned up as Stone was about to beaten to death. Coincidence? :rolleyes:

Days later, the two British soldiers bizarelly drove into the middle of one of the funerals of those Stone had killed and needless to say people weren't gonna let the same thing happened again. Given that one of the soldiers (neither were in uniform and they were in an unmarked car) turned a gun on the mourners, it was no surprise they were taken out and killed.

The Brits must have known they were driving into the funeral. They could not have not known!!! What were they up to and what was their motive????

That's more than a little biased.

Whatever about the motive' of the 'Brits', two men didn't deserve to be dragged into wasteland and executed. And remember they were not shot dead by the passionate grievers or killed at the scene in a fit of rage. It was cold and calculating.

dubtom · 05-04-2006 10:21AM

Hagar wrote:

Funny they didn't look Brazilian...:rolleyes:

What????

magpie · 05-04-2006 11:29AM

I remember seeing this on the news at the time and being utterly appaled by what I saw.

A silver audi came zooming around the corner, the driver realised they were in the wrong place and then starting trying to reverse away, at which point the car was deliberately boxed in by black cabs and a mob descended on the car ending in the footage presented here.

What amazes me is that with all the trite republican propaganda and justifications beiong trotted out here nobody has pointed out that despite the fact these two soldiers were armed they neither ran anyone over in an attempt to escape, nor did they shoot any of the crowd who were evidently bent on killing them. All they did was fire one or two shots in the air to try nd clear the crowd.

If I'd been in that car I would've emptied my magazine into the crowd and then floored it through them to escape - so surely you have to hand it to those guys for showing such constraint in the face of the barbarism and hatred on display at an IRA funeral. And what did they get in return? They were stripped, beaten, thrown off a carpark and shot repeatedly in the head.

Think about that if you're planning on voting Sinn Fein. Do you really want these animals running our country?

Dyr · 05-04-2006 11:38AM

Constraint? after the events that had occured which led to this funeral, driving a speeding car into a funeral cortege and then waving guns around is constraint? Just shows what an oxymoron military intelligence can be, darwinism took care of the rest

magpie · 05-04-2006 11:43AM

driving a speeding car into a funeral cortege

They drove around a corner, realised they were in the wrong place, tried to reverse away and were then deliberately boxed in by taxis. Try watching the footage.

and then waving guns around is constraint?

They fired warning shots after a mob had descended on the car and started trying to kill them. Again, try watching the footage.

This is why there will never be peace on this island, when people like bambi are so completely blinded by dogma they can't even discern what's going on in perfectly clear film footage.

Dyr · 05-04-2006 12:42PM

magpie wrote:

They drove around a corner, realised they were in the wrong place, tried to reverse away and were then deliberately boxed in by taxis. Try watching the footage.

lol, british military intelligence didnt realise there was an IRA funeral on there at the precise time they decided to take a high speed tour of belfast? You dont just drive around a corner and then realise you're speeding past the major media event of the day. The "honest mistake guvnor" line doesnt wash. Its no suprise the crowd reacted they way they did regardless of what you thought watching from the living room

magpie wrote:

This is why there will never be peace on this island, when people like bambi are so completely blinded by dogma they can't even discern what's going on in perfectly clear film footage.

lol a bit more, are we being blinded by amateur dramatics a bit?

Snickers Man · 05-04-2006 02:00PM

Mr_Roger_Bongos wrote:

I think it was guessed at the time that they were in the s.a.s. and from memory (documentary program on the incident and the events that surrounded it) they didn't stumble into the funeral. They were parked at the side of the road to observe anyone who may have I.R.A. connections who was in attendance. I'd say the mob probably didn't know they were sercuirty forces, but it was guessed because they were both sitting in the car while a funeral procession passed.

The IRA always said they were SAS because they like to associate that word with the most bloodthirsty ruthless murderous killers in the British Army.

Probably quite rightly. The Gibraltar operation was one of the few, if not the only times, that the SAS took out an IRA unit without causing 'collateral damage' to innocent bystanders.

More reasoned speculation at the time pointed out that both men in the car were signallers and that therefore the likelihood was that they were attempting to bug the march to provide audio to go along with the pictures provided by the camera in the helicopter overhead.

What is utter nonsense is the Army's official story that the men were on leave and just happened to drive into an IRA funeral on the Falls Road because they got lost.

Gimme a break!

This was a day, or maybe two, after a funeral had been attacked and three people killed. In fact, I think it was the funeral of one or two of those people.

Sure. What happened was savage. And unjustifiable. But it was hardly a surprise.

It was very like the killing of Jean Menendez in London (The Brazilian to which somebody referred earlier) in London. A bunch of pumped up people with guns reacting to what they wrongly believed was a dangerous situation.

Snickers Man · 05-04-2006 02:01PM

Mr_Roger_Bongos wrote:

I think it was guessed at the time that they were in the s.a.s. and from memory (documentary program on the incident and the events that surrounded it) they didn't stumble into the funeral. They were parked at the side of the road to observe anyone who may have I.R.A. connections who was in attendance. I'd say the mob probably didn't know they were sercuirty forces, but it was guessed because they were both sitting in the car while a funeral procession passed.

The IRA always said they were SAS because they like to associate that word with the most bloodthirsty ruthless murderous killers in the British Army.

Probably quite rightly. The Gibraltar operation was one of the few, if not the only times, that the SAS took out an IRA unit without causing 'collateral damage' to innocent bystanders.

More reasoned speculation at the time pointed out that both men in the car were signallers and that therefore the likelihood was that they were attempting to bug the march to provide audio to go along with the pictures provided by the camera in the helicopter overhead.

What is utter nonsense is the Army's official story that the men were on leave and just happened to drive into an IRA funeral on the Falls Road because they got lost.

Gimme a break!

This was a day, or maybe two, after a funeral had been attacked and three people killed. In fact, I think it was the funeral of one or two of those people.

Sure. What happened was savage. And unjustifiable. But it was hardly a surprise.

It was very like the killing of Jean Menendez in London (The Brazilian to which somebody referred earlier) in London. A bunch of pumped up people with guns reacting to what they wrongly believed was a dangerous situation.

Snickers Man · 05-04-2006 02:16PM

magpie wrote:

If I'd been in that car I would've emptied my magazine into the crowd and then floored it through them to escape -

You'd have ended up just as dead. You'd never have got out of there alive. They were boxed in by black taxis, as you said.

Mind you. Love the signature tune. Brings back memories of Jenny Hanley in a low cut blouse with unfettered bazoomas bouncing all over my TV screen.......

.....arrghhh. Podge and Rodge moment. Arghhh..............

magpie · 05-04-2006 02:20PM

Love the signature tune. Brings back memories of Jenny Hanley in a low cut blouse with unfettered bazoomas bouncing all over my TV screen.......

He he! You've got to love magpie, the working man's blue peter as it was once described.

Freelancer · 05-04-2006 03:22PM

Zebra3 wrote:

Usually there would be a huge RUC/British army presence at these funerals to try and stop any shots being fired over the coffin, etc but by pure chance the RUC only turned up as Stone was about to beaten to death. Coincidence? :rolleyes:

Oh pluzzeeee.

The RUC and British Army hung back, because, weirdly, they thought their presence at the funeral of an IRA man shot dead by the SAS, might, just might be seen as antagonistic.

Trying to shove this one on the bloody brits is a bit rich.

Days later, the two British soldiers bizarelly drove into the middle of one of the funerals of those Stone had killed and needless to say people weren't gonna let the same thing happened again. Given that one of the soldiers (neither were in uniform and they were in an unmarked car) turned a gun on the mourners, it was no surprise they were taken out and killed.

Oh for fúcks sake. They fired one warning shot into the air, they did not "turn a gun on the mourners" they paniced and shot a shot in the air.

These are just another in a long line of pointless stupid deaths in the north trying to garner some "politcal points" to justify your ignorance is childish and pointless.

minesajackdaniels wrote:

I remember watching that for the first time on the BBC One Northern Ireland news when I was a child and it had just happened. The images stuck with me throughout my life.

Ditto I was sitting in the front room of my uncles house in Donegal when I saw both the Stone attack and the murders, I don't need to see the video I remember it clear as day.

The RUC arrested a group of men for the murder of the soldiers and they were convicted, several years later most of them were released, as the convictions were seen as "unsafe" one of the men was either mildly autistic or mentally handicapped.

No one comes out of this looking well, the IRA for sending people to Gilbrator to carry out a bombing (I mean come on how's that going to help Ireland) Thatcher for her shoot to kill policy, and loyalists for attacking a funeral, the IRA for executing the men, and not coming forward when the wrong men were convicted for the crime. No one can point fingers at anyone after this.

Dyr · 05-04-2006 04:26PM

Freelancer wrote:

Oh pluzzeeee.

The RUC and British Army hung back, because, weirdly, they thought their presence at the funeral of an IRA man shot dead by the SAS, might, just might be seen as antagonistic.

Trying to shove this one on the bloody brits is a bit rich.

Last i heard Stone claimed that the RUC colluded in his attack. Still funny how the boys in blue arrived just in time to rescue him :rolleyes:

LikeOhMyGawd! · 05-04-2006 04:26PM

I'm new here but would like to contribute to this thread and to share some info that might be interesting.

I went to QUB and was in the Officers' Training Corps. Once during a drinking session after a shooting competition in Edinburgh I got speaking to a Colonel who had been stationed in Belfast at the time. We were generally talking about sacrifices made in the line of duty and he made quite a surprising admission. He told us that the two soldiers who drove into the cortege were members of the SAS and not Signallers as widely reported. They came off the motorway into West Belfast but took a wrong (left) turn into Andersonstown where they should have taken a right turn towards Milltown Cemetary and the barracks located there. As soon as they realised their mistake they radioed control to get assistance. As soon as they were hemmed in by the mourners some units based at the baracks were ready to get out and extracate them. The Army helicopter which was monitoring the whole thing was also prepared to descend to split the group up. The commanding officers in charge of the day's operation took the decision not to intervene fearing another bloodbath of Bloody Sunday proportions. In effect the soldiers were abandoned to their fate in order to avert a potentially more explosive situation.

Thank God time has moved on somewhat and the same should never to be seen again.

It would seem to me that other people have an agenda here (i.e. Magpie) and fail to understand that time has indeed moved on and democracy is starting to prevail. Gradually the slate is being wiped clean and each side is coming to terms with the past. Calling people or parties 'animals' is misguided and statements like

magpie wrote:

If I'd been in that car I would've emptied my magazine into the crowd and then floored it through them to escape

are hugely hypocritical and show an immense deal of ignorance.

Agree with them or not, the crowd consisted of numerous people burying their dead. Not everyone in that crowd had a hand in what happened and not everyone would have subscribed to what became of the men who were murdered.

magpie · 05-04-2006 04:43PM

time has indeed moved on and democracy is starting to prevail. Gradually the slate is being wiped clean and each side is coming to terms with the past.

I'm sure Denis Donaldson would agree with you.

hugely hypocritical and show an immense deal of ignorance

How exactly? Who was attacking whom in this situation?

the crowd consisted of numerous people burying their dead.

'their' dead presumably in some broader, sectarian sense? Or are you stating that the crowd attending the funeral were all related to the persons being buried?

Not everyone in that crowd had a hand in what happened and not everyone would have subscribed to what became of the men who were murdered.

No, but I can count at least 40-50 in the video either directly involved or cheering them on.

The commanding officers in charge of the day's operation took the decision not to intervene fearing another bloodbath of Bloody Sunday proportions. In effect the soldiers were abandoned to their fate in order to avert a potentially more explosive situation.

This is what I've been saying all along. The British Army could have extricated them, but rather than risking any further civilian casualties decided to leave them to their fate.

I don't see any evidence of this kind of restraint from Republican circles.

LikeOhMyGawd! · 05-04-2006 04:59PM

magpie, it is hypocritical to brand on one had a group as 'animals' and on the other state you'd 'empty a magazine into the crowd'.

Plenty of people have fired into crowds in Northen Ireland. All of them could be rightly called 'animals'. Anyone who would advocate or suggest doing the same is no better. Those in glass houses etc.

Zebra3 · 05-04-2006 07:07PM

Bambi wrote:

Last i heard Stone claimed that the RUC colluded in his attack. Still funny how the boys in blue arrived just in time to rescue him :rolleyes:

Thank you Bambi. Think I saw Stone say that himself on some TG4 documentary.

Hagar · 05-04-2006 07:23PM

Bambi wrote:

Last i heard Stone claimed that the RUC colluded in his attack. Still funny how the boys in blue arrived just in time to rescue him

Err.. the boys in green actually. There were no Gardaí present.

This title of this thread implies that those being buried were IRA members. Has this ever been proven?
I thought that they were mourners at a previous funeral who were killed by a Loyalist.
Nationalist almost certainly, IRA members, doubtful.

Tom65 · 05-04-2006 07:28PM

Hagar wrote:

Err.. the boys in green actually. There were no Gardaí present.

This title of this thread implies that those being buried were IRA members. Has this ever been proven?
I thought that they were mourners at a previous funeral who were killed by a Loyalist.
Nationalist almost certainly, IRA members, doubtful.

One of those Stone killed was an IRA member, I think that is proven. As far as I know, the others he killed weren't.

Freelancer · 05-04-2006 08:17PM

Zebra3 wrote:

Thank you Bambi. Think I saw Stone say that himself on some TG4 documentary.

facts links evidence?

You don't seem to want to trouble yourself with any of those.

Stone can claim that, however to take as a recent example of whataboutery, one of the former hungry strikes claims the IRA forced the strike to continue for longer than necessary to maximize the publicity, and SFers were quick to dismiss this as not proveable.

Stone is an animal he's never expressed regret for the murders, why's it so hard to believe he would lie?

This title of this thread implies that those being buried were IRA members. Has this ever been proven?

Three people were killed one was an IRA member. Whys that so hard to believe? They were mourners at the death of

Hagar · 05-04-2006 08:26PM

(Sorry one of my posts is missing. Bloody slow down.)

I don't know for a fact that one of them was or wasn't an IRA member so I will accept your word for it, no links required.
But that leaves the other two. Neighbours, relations, friends, school chums, workmates or whatever who weren't IRA members and who attended the funeral to be murdered by Mr. Stone.

biko · 05-04-2006 08:36PM

Hagar wrote:

Err.. the boys in green actually. There were no Gardaí present.

Lovely tee. :rolleyes:

Dyr · 05-04-2006 09:03PM

Hagar wrote:

Err.. the boys in green actually. There were no Gardaí present.
l.

ehh no. Unless the RUC were wearing green uniforms. Nice attempt though

Hagar · 05-04-2006 09:11PM

They were. They do.
When was the last time time you were in the six counties?

1988 IRA funeral Footage

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