Losing your religion?

Pigman II · 24-08-2005 01:34PM

Personally I find the parallels between religion and entertainment media disturbing. Hopefully in another generation people will follow pattern and turn their back on that too.

Also religion isn't the cause of war, people are the cause of war.

highdef · 24-08-2005 01:48PM

People may be the cause but their reason's for starting a war are based on their religious beliefs, in most cases, at first anyway.

Pigman II · 24-08-2005 02:15PM

Lets not have anything in that case. If it wasn't religion being used to rally the sheep then it'd be a flag or a corporation logo. At the end of the day no matter what the 'cause' is the only common element is those who buy into it.

Viscosity · 24-08-2005 02:34PM

I think its mainly a fear thing. We are sitting on a piece of rock thats flying around the sun and spinning on its axis at the same time. I think its understandable in some ways that people seek a different reason for their existence and I don't think they should be ridiculed for it as long as its kept a personal thing. But then again I'm sure people who have abandoned religion get hassled a fair bit. When religion goes wrong, it can have horrific effects.

Kingp35 · 24-08-2005 02:58PM

[I stopped believing when I was about 18. Up to that point I guess I bought into the brainwash thing I never really thought about it. Once I did I began to notice, all the ridiculous contradictions and utter rubbish that the bible comes out with, all the sorrow and hurt that the catholic church has caused people in the past and the simple scientific reasons why all this is just utter rubbish. Ill give you an example of a typical thing that the catholic church wants us to believe that causes so much hurt:

The church is responsible for hundreds and thousands of deaths in South Africa today. How do you ask? The church is totally against all forms of contraception. The South African people are devout catholics and because of this they refuse to wear contraception and thus they keep passing on the aids virus to each other. Thousands and thousands die every year because of it. If the church changed its views on contraception so many of these people could be saved but they don’t.

It is things like this that turns me off religion. I never go to church only to go to weddings and funnerals. It just causes wars the world over and nothing that does that can be anygood. Pigman its fact wars are fought because of religion. You can speculate all you want that people would fight over something else if not over religion but you or nobody else has any proof of this. We all have proof that wars are fought over religion. This is the case all throughout history. Look at the crusades and all the people who died again because of religion.

How can someone believe in something like this?

bus77 · 24-08-2005 03:17PM

Pigman II wrote:

Personally I find the parallels between religion and entertainment media disturbing.

I did for awhile too, but then I reached the conclusion that it is similar forces that forms them both. Human Nature.

highdef · 24-08-2005 03:27PM

Here here Kingp35

JC 2K3 · 24-08-2005 03:29PM

bus77 wrote:

I did for awhile too, but then I reached the conclusion that it is similar forces that formed them both. Human Nature.

I suppose, but it all starts with matter of a few men's lust for power, human nature is what makes us stupid enough to worship gods/kings/corporations. I think it's because if we all have the same opinions no one gets hurt, but life with inequality and without diversity sucks.

Adblock · 24-08-2005 04:46PM

"The church is responsible for hundreds and thousands of deaths in South Africa today."

In part this is true, but if you look at the broader picture, you are just as responsible, there are many drugs that could help these people but they cost a fortune when the patented rights for production have to be paid, who enforces those patents?
But I don't really care about this; it's the next statement.

"Pigman its fact wars are fought because of religion. You can speculate all you want that people would fight over something else if not over religion but you or nobody else has any proof of this. We all have proof that wars are fought over religion." Now this is the stupidest thing I have ever read.

The Cold War --- Fought over Pride
This First World War ---Land
The Ottoman empire --Land
The British Empire --Land/Pride
The Falklands War --Land/Oil
The Independence of France among many other countries
The American Civil War --Civil Rights
The Mongol Empire --Land/Greed
The Battle of Waterloo /Land Greed
Franco-Prussian War /Land
The Breakaway of Taiwan /hasn't been a war yet but look out.
The Japan-China War both were communist

Anyway the list goes on and on.

I'm not saying that religion hasn't played its part, but there are many reasons for war and with or without religion war will happen. Just try not to be so bias, it will help you when learning.

Ps if someone comes back claiming that one/more/all of the wars above were caused by religion, just have the fore-site to know that there were thousands of wars and I could give you a list 40 time longer, its just I'm bored now.

zinc · 24-08-2005 04:55PM

I lost the shackles of religion I'd say at 17, opium of the masses my friends.

stevenmu · 24-08-2005 05:24PM

Kingp35 wrote:

The church is responsible for hundreds and thousands of deaths in South Africa today. How do you ask? The church is totally against all forms of contraception. The South African people are devout catholics and because of this they refuse to wear contraception and thus they keep passing on the aids virus to each other. Thousands and thousands die every year because of it. If the church changed its views on contraception so many of these people could be saved but they don’t.

The catholic church also teaches abstinence, they don't really seem to be taking that one to heart. If it wasn't for the amount of extra-marital sex, contraception wouldn't be needed to prevent the transmission of aids. A girl I know did a study on a SA family as part of some kind of socieology course, or something like that. The mother caught AIDS by working as a prostitute. Even after she found out, she kept having unprotected sex with clients. She also kept having unprotected sex with her husband, who then contracted it, and went on to have several more kids, all of whom were infected too. That doesn't sound devoutly catholic to me.

larryone · 24-08-2005 06:11PM

Priests sexually abusing little kids doesnt sound devoutly catholic to me either.

Viscosity · 24-08-2005 06:25PM

stevenmu wrote:

The catholic church also teaches abstinence, they don't really seem to be taking that one to heart. If it wasn't for the amount of extra-marital sex, contraception wouldn't be needed to prevent the transmission of aids. A girl I know did a study on a SA family as part of some kind of socieology course, or something like that. The mother caught AIDS by working as a prostitute. Even after she found out, she kept having unprotected sex with clients. She also kept having unprotected sex with her husband, who then contracted it, and went on to have several more kids, all of whom were infected too. That doesn't sound devoutly catholic to me.

Yeah I heard similar stories from a friend who worked in Zambia. In some parts of Africa they have tried an ABC campaign. As far as I can remember its Abstain, Be Faithful and Contraception. I'm not sure if that was even working though. But having said that alot of people here have a pretty careless attitude to STIs even with the education/awareness schemes and the widespread availability of contraceptives. We're damn lucky not to be as bad off as Sub-Saharan Africa.

Fobia · 24-08-2005 07:37PM

[size=-1]Sir, ( a + bn )/n = x , hence God exists; reply!
[/size]

Adblock · 25-08-2005 01:00PM

so you think Sir, ( a + bn )/n = x , hence God exists; reply! is witty, ah its not

here is a better reason for why god exists

1)Logic can be broken,

here is a series

2,4,6,8,10 .....ah whats next 12 u say ok then 12. but it could be 13
so if it is logical* which is a word and has no meaning, other than the syntax of the statement it is used in.ok so here is a better example

its logical* for you to claim god dose not exist ..fair enough

is it also logical to claim, if i jump up i will fall down...... what if im in space"no gravity"

so whats the moral of the story..

logic is a set of rules that conform to an idea or expression. this dose not mean logic can be broken..

you cant prove god exists...

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar · 25-08-2005 01:20PM

but you don't have to. he told us himself, and jesus totally backed his story up.

Goodshape · 25-08-2005 01:25PM

It's fairly logical that if you are in a zero-gravity environment, you will not fall down.

'does God exist' arguments never get anywhere. I don't think it can be conclusivly proven either way, largly due (I think) to the fact that so few people will even agree on what it is that does or does not exist in the first place.

I think it's fairly logical to assume that the childhood vision of God - long white bearded guy sitting upon a throne of clouds - does not exist. But there could well be 'something' 'out there' that is responsable.

Either way, I don't really think it's too relevent to the topic ('losing your religion').

Sifo · 25-08-2005 01:45PM

R0ot wrote:

Lost my religon when i was 12, regained christianity when i was 18

as soon as i saw the poll i got the impression that most of those who lose their religion lose it because of their age and lack of understanding(no offence). ok religion isnt considered to be cool in the modern world, have you ever wondered why we're here??!! i doubt we're here to work 9 to 5, pay taxes, stick to the rules of corrupt government etc etc etc...

Those of you who lost their religion do you believe in anything?

stevenmu · 25-08-2005 01:45PM

Adblock wrote:

here is a series

2,4,6,8,10 .....ah whats next 12 u say ok then 12. but it could be 13

In the series, as you've defined it, the next number is 12, the only way it could be 13 is if you defined the series incorrectly in the first place.

Adblock wrote:

is it also logical to claim, if i jump up i will fall down...... what if im in space"no gravity"

It's impossible to jump up, or fall down in space. In space there's no up to jump to, and no down to fall to. In fact up and down only apply on earth because we all generally accept up to mean skyward and down to mean towards the centre of the earth. This in itself is entirly subjective, if somebody in Australia jumps up, they travel the same direction we would if we fell down. There's no such thing as up or down, it's all relative to you position.

Adblock · 25-08-2005 02:07PM

Some Member said this back the way "I don't think it can be conclusivly proven either way, largly due (I think) to the fact that so few people will even agree on what it is that does or does not exist in the first place."

Well said , I couldnt agree more. !!!

stevenmu · 25-08-2005 02:16PM

I'd agree completly with that myself

Adblock · 25-08-2005 02:25PM

stevenmu wrote:

In the series, as you've defined it, the next number is 12, the only way it could be 13 is if you defined the series incorrectly in the first place.
It's impossible to jump up, or fall down in space. In space there's no up to jump to, and no down to fall to. In fact up and down only apply on earth because we all generally accept up to mean skyward and down to mean towards the centre of the earth. This in itself is entirly subjective, if somebody in Australia jumps up, they travel the same direction we would if we fell down. There's no such thing as up or down, it's all relative to you position.

what im trying to say is this

if you flip a coin 20 times

Probability (P)

[Rules of the System
P(Head)=10/20
P(Tail)=10/20
]
And 10 times you get a tail and 10 a head. ok this is fine all the *rules* of the system have been explained and the logic can be observed to follow, but now something unexpected happens the coin lands on its edge, the system of logic has been broken" As I had defined it", this doesn't mean we cant edit and change the logic "e.g. allowing a certain probability for the coin landing on its edge" it means logic is a best fit and the logic of any system can be broken at times.

I'm not anti logic and I'm not trying to prove it's logical to believe in god, I'm just trying to show you that logic is not a fundamental truth.

Now I have to go to a stupid meeting but anyway ill pick at your jumping in space problem later.

Goodshape · 25-08-2005 02:30PM

Sifo wrote:

Those of you who lost their religion do you believe in anything?

I believe in something, just ditched the organised bit of religion. I don't need someone to dictate my beliefs to me. I don't need dogma.

Fobia · 25-08-2005 03:22PM

Adblock wrote:

so you think Sir, ( a + bn )/n = x , hence God exists; reply! is witty, ah its not

I thought it was, but it's not mine, Euler said it.

Adblock · 25-08-2005 03:45PM

I have to admit i was a bit of a d*ickhead

It was funny, but i thought you copped it from here

Over 300 reasons as to why god exists

http://www.godlessgeeks.com/LINKS/GodProof.htm

what can i say, im a moody bitch i came from a woman!!

Macka · 25-08-2005 03:53PM

Lost my belief in christianity at about 12/13. I'm still fascinated by cathedrals and artwork associated with the church, some of the churches I've seen on mainland Europe are some of the most spectacular buildings I've ever seen. The vatican's pretty impressive too.

larryone · 25-08-2005 06:41PM

Goodshape wrote:

I don't think it can be conclusivly proven either way, largly due (I think) to the fact that so few people will even agree on what it is that does or does not exist in the first place.

If you consider God to be synonimous with existance, then you could prove the God exists, by proving that existance exists.

I think therefore I am, therefore God also is.

I believe in God, but not Religion.

NotMe · 25-08-2005 11:06PM

I stopped believing around 14/15. I was never really religious before but I just didn't question what I was told before that. Didn't stop going to mass til a few years later.. damn parents :rolleyes: .. threatened me with no pocket money so basically forced me to go. That didn't help my faith at all.

Losing your religion?

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