Decentralisation

gazzer · 22-02-2005 11:47AM

Note that Revenue is considering relocating staff to Navan, expect an announcement just in time for the bye-election.....

I didnt hear anything about this and i work in Revenue.. Then again the staff are usually the last to hear. We usually dont find out till it is on the news

pete · 23-02-2005 02:49PM

http://www.rte.ie/news/2005/0223/flynnp.html

The Taoiseach has also said there was no truth to concerns raised by Fine Gael leader Enda Kenny that public servants who signed on for promotion were being told they had to be prepared to work outside Dublin.

That's not exactly true, is it?

pete · 23-02-2005 03:38PM

pete wrote:

That's not exactly true, is it?

No, it's not:

Official Side Representatives stated that the document had been put forward as a basis for discussion and that they were prepared to discuss and debate its contents with a view to seeing if a mutually-acceptable outcome could be reached. However, in doing so, they stated that their position since the out-set had always been that it was inevitable that there would be a surplus of staff in Dublin as a result of the implementation of decentralisation and some means would have to be found to deal with this. In this regard, from the very beginning they had taken the position that it was their wish that all vacancies would be used to contribute to the programme and thus to minimise the potential Dublin surplus. As a result of the Union opposition to this approach, they had agreed, on a purely temporary and interim basis, to a position in which inter-departmental assignments on promotion were made conditional on the willingness of appointees to re-locate but internal promotions continued within Departments as heretofore. It had always been their view that this was a minimalist, temporary arrangement and that at some point more far-reaching arrangements would be necessary as a significant surplus of staff in Dublin could not be sustained indefinitely. While they stated that, in the context of some agreed arrangements, they might be able to live with some level of surplus for some temporary period, they felt that they could not have a situation where the continuation of 'normal' promotions was contributing to the potential problem.

http://www.pseu.ie/docs/Decent22.doc

pete · 23-02-2005 10:55PM

Mr. Kenny: Since the last occasion on which these questions were asked, significant events have taken place. Will the Taoiseach indicate if he has made any appointment to the chairmanship of the Government decentralisation implementation committee in view of the resignation of Mr. Phil Flynn arising from his association with a person under investigation by the Criminal Assets Bureau in respect of his involvement with a finance company? Will the Taoiseach confirm that there are no restrictions on the promotion of civil servants in Dublin? Queries I have received indicate that when civil servants in Dublin sign up for promotion it must be on the basis that they are prepared to relocate outside Dublin. Does the Taoiseach agree that this is contradictory, given the voluntary nature of the decentralisation programme, under which the former Minister for Finance, Mr. McCreevy, said 10,000 civil servants would be relocated within three years? Can the Taoiseach confirm that promotions are not contingent upon agreement to relocate to a different part of the country?

An Ceann Comhairle: The question refers specifically to the Department of the Taoiseach.

Mr. Kenny: This refers to the Taoiseach’s Department.

The Taoiseach: It does not arise for my Department because it is not moving, but there is no truth in what the Deputy suggests.

http://debates.oireachtas.ie/DDebate.aspx?F=DAL20050223.xml&Node=H3-3#H3-3

I'm having some difficulty reconciling statements made by the Department of Finance quoted in my previous post with what was said today.

Am I missing something, or did the Taoiseach mislead the house?

NewDubliner · 23-02-2005 11:15PM

gazzer wrote:

Note that Revenue is considering relocating staff to Navan, expect an announcement just in time for the bye-election.....

I didnt hear anything about this and i work in Revenue.. Then again the staff are usually the last to hear. We usually dont find out till it is on the news

PSEU circular of Feb 9th:

In response to a query, the Official Side Representatives stated that they were not aware formally of the position in Revenue where that Office had stated an intention to seek some changes in the decentralisation programme in order to move staff to Navan.

I guess that they will be 'formally aware' closer to polling day.....

ishmael whale · 24-02-2005 02:02PM

Sometimes you’ve gotta have a laugh.

http://www.westernpeople.ie/news/story.asp?j=23838

“Cribbin launches scathing attack on Carty over decentralisation
Wednesday, February 23, 2005
Cribbin launches scathing attack on Carty over decentralisation

A further scathing attack has been made on deputy John Carty by a member of Mayo County Council who claimed the deputy “can’t be found, can’t be seen and can’t be heard.”…..Cllr Cribbin was talking during a debate on a notice of motion tabled by Cllr Frank Chambers calling on the council to “welcome the government decision of decentralisation to Knock and Claremorris.”……

Cllr Tom Connolly asked if Cllr Chambers was living on the same planet as him. The Knock proposal was in limbo and there was nothing happening in Claremorris. He said Deputy Carty had “run to ground” and was not available to answer any question in relation to the proposed decentralisation to Claremorris. “This is pie in the sky and has caused untold damage in Claremorris where a lot of development took place on the basis that decentralisation was about to happen,’ he said….

“John Carty has not gone to ground. He is working to deliver decentralisation to Mayo,” said Cllr Carty.

Cllr Connolly: He took all the credit for the announcement but has not been heard from since Claremorris was deferred…….”

NewDubliner · 24-02-2005 08:37PM

ishmael whale wrote:

has caused untold damage in Claremorris where a lot of development took place on the basis that decentralisation was about to happen,’ he said….

In other words, the local property speculators bought lots of sites and houses & are stuck with them.....?

pete · 24-02-2005 08:43PM

NewDubliner wrote:

In other words, the local property speculators bought lots of sites and houses & are stuck with them.....?

My heart. It bleeds.

Victor · 24-02-2005 08:48PM

NewDubliner wrote:

In other words, the local property speculators bought lots of sites and houses & are stuck with them.....?

There be apartments going in Mayo for €105,000

The_Conductor · 24-02-2005 09:25PM

Victor wrote:

There be apartments going in Mayo for €105,000

Woot!
I so wanted another rabbit hutch in Mayo to replace the one I have in Dublin.
Anyone been talking to the Decentralisation Policy Unit lately?
They told me about 6 weeks ago that they had scheduled meetings with Personnel Officers with particular to emphasis on those Departments that had deliverables in their business plans for fast-tracking movers. I guess the 50 staff for Portlaoise by May are included in that- and given that there aren't 50 volunteers inhouse (Ag) they had better get the show on the road, or else end up with egg on their faces.

With regards to Ag- Backweston is back on the cards again, irrespective of Portlaoise. Talk about yet another mess.....

NewDubliner · 24-02-2005 10:22PM

We should be hearing soon of the plan to banish all IT staff from Dublin.

2009 is the date I've heard.

Dinarius · 24-02-2005 11:23PM

I am told that letters of offer to those who have signed up for decentralisation to Clonakilty will be sent out next month (March).

Clonakilty is massively oversubscribed, so it's no surprise that they might run with it early on. "Come on in the water's lovely" kind of thing in a year or two from now, if it works out.

Apparently, they want to get those from outside Marine into the department sooner rather than later, in order to train them in before the move.

Watch this space.

D.

NewDubliner · 24-02-2005 11:42PM

Dinarius wrote:

I am told that letters of offer to those who have signed up for decentralisation to Clonakilty will be sent out next month (March).
D.

How many are from Dublin?

Dinarius · 24-02-2005 11:44PM

I have no idea.

I seem to recall that the numbers were posted here some time ago.

D.

The_Conductor · 25-02-2005 09:51AM

NewDubliner wrote:

We should be hearing soon of the plan to banish all IT staff from Dublin.

2009 is the date I've heard.

Banish??!! Surely not! "Re-assign to administrative duties"?

Ye gods.....
And to think I left the private sector for peace of mind and job security......
Roll on the two by-elections- please please please let the government parties get their arses whipped.

pete · 25-02-2005 12:26PM

from "MEETING OF THE GENERAL COUNCIL SUB-COMMITTEE ON DECENTRALISATION - 23 FEBRUARY, 2005" (not up on the PSEU site yet)

The Official Side Representatives undertook firstly to provide a break-down in the applications as between Dublin and non-Dublin within the next week or so.

No hurry there, lads. Whenever you're ready. It's not like getting people out of Dublin was one of the main reasons for the project in the first place or anything.

To assist in the process of transfers within Dublin the Official Side Representatives indicated that they were compiling figures on the number of posts in the various grades that would be remaining in Dublin. In this way, they hoped to be able to match staff with preferences in situations where they would be compelled to leave their existing Departments, as far as possible.

It was clarified that the Official Side hoped that approaches could begin to be made to staff who had applied under the CAF, in order to move them to Departments/Offices of their choice, within a matter of weeks, in the case of early movers.

Won't be long now. Start clearing your desks.

NewDubliner · 25-02-2005 08:23PM

No doubt the disloyal Dublin refuseniks will be sent for 're-education' & will have to re-write their CVs and apply for new jobs....

NewDubliner · 03-03-2005 07:41PM

From the Examiner:

03/03/05
Pledged civil service jobs ‘must be fast-tracked’
HUNDREDS of jobs promised for Waterford under decentralisation should be fast-tracked, the city’s mayor has said.

Two hundred jobs with the decentralised Department of the Environment are to come to Waterford city. A further 200 are promised for Dungarvan with the transfer of Ordinance Survey Ireland. However, neither project is included in the first tranche of moves.

Last night, Waterford mayor Seamus Ryan said Waterford City Council is ready for the jobs now. “Waterford has a lot to offer decentralising departments - not just from a quality of life point of view but also in the whole economic area.

“Decentralisation is key to the future economic development of Waterford as a gateway city and all the people of Waterford are in favour of decentralisation. We need the local enthusiasm to be matched by the government on this issue.”

It was intended to transfer 10,300 civil and public servants to 53 locations nationwide by the end of 2006. But this was diluted by Finance Minister Brian Cowen, who announced that the first phase of the decentralisation plan would see around 4,000 civil servants moved to 24 locations over the next two years.

However progress on this first phase now seems to have slowed down.

Mr Ryan said: “The lack of progress and indeed energy by the government on this issue is totally unacceptable to us. Waterford City Council is fully supportive of the decentralisation programme and will work with all bodies to ensure that this aim is met.”

uncivilservant · 03-03-2005 11:40PM

http://decentralisation.gov.ie

ishmael whale · 10-03-2005 12:40PM

Unfortunately he didn’t seem to elaborate on how splintering central government departments all over the place would facilitate this mobility.

http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=9&si=1355497&issue_id=12189
Career civil servants urged to be adventurous
THE Taoiseach has urged career civil servants to be more adventurous and to move over to new departments.
The lack of movement between Government departments was one of the remaining negative aspects of the civil service, he said and it would be better for people's careers and for everyone else, if there was greater inter-change between Departments. ….

Firetrap · 13-03-2005 10:27PM

With the Goverment facing a big bill for the nursing home charges, would they not be better off abandoning the ludicrous political stroke that is Decentralisation and all the money it will cost?

RicardoSmith · 13-03-2005 11:03PM

allie_e17 wrote:

With the Goverment facing a big bill for the nursing home charges, would they not be better off abandoning the ludicrous political stroke that is Decentralisation and all the money it will cost?

Ah common sense and politics....never the twain will meet.

NewDubliner · 13-03-2005 11:35PM

ishmael whale wrote:

The lack of movement between Government departments was one of the remaining negative aspects of the civil service, he said and it would be better for people's careers and for everyone else, if there was greater inter-change between Departments. ….

This is government double-speak for "Decentralise or we'll ruin your career and you'll wish you'd left Dublin when we gave you the chance..."

true · 13-03-2005 11:52PM

I know some civil servants in Dublin who would only love to relocate back to their native towns out of the expensive and traffic induced hell they call Dublin , but they have not the opportunity to yet. There are lots of towns and cities in rural Ireland who would like the jobs.

pete · 13-03-2005 11:58PM

true wrote:

I know some civil servants in Dublin who would only love to relocate back to their native towns out of the expensive and traffic induced hell they call Dublin , but they have not the opportunity to yet. There are lots of towns and cities in rural Ireland who would like the jobs.

Have you actually read any of this thread?

jesus.

true · 14-03-2005 12:13AM

I sure have. Why, are you one of the whingers that just wants more money in order to relocate?

RicardoSmith · 14-03-2005 12:14AM

true wrote:

I know some civil servants in Dublin who would only love to relocate back to their native towns out of the expensive and traffic induced hell they call Dublin , but they have not the opportunity to yet. There are lots of towns and cities in rural Ireland who would like the jobs.

In my office about 7% who want to relocate.

true · 14-03-2005 12:56AM

Who are employing them and paying their wages?

pete · 14-03-2005 01:01AM

true wrote:

I sure have. Why, are you one of the whingers that just wants more money in order to relocate?

oh **** off

true · 14-03-2005 01:05AM

No, **** off yourself Pete.

Decentralisation

Comments