Ipods/mp3 players illegal in Ireland - Sunday Business Post

Tom Dunne · 16-01-2005 05:34PM #1

According to an article in the Sunday Business Post, the act of transferring digital media files from one device to another is illegal under Irish Law.

Dick Doyle, the MD of that much loved organisation, IRMA, is quoted as saying that it was "against the law" to copy music onto Ipods and other devices. It is not just illegal files, it appears to refer to the actual act of copying the files, whether they have been legally acquired or not.

Crazy, just crazy.

Crucifix · 16-01-2005 05:35PM

Oh dear lord. It's not even funny.

Bass.exe · 16-01-2005 05:39PM

Well, in that case, I just broke the law 626 times last Tuesday. :rolleyes:

MrVestek · 16-01-2005 05:39PM

Sir, is that an ipod? Please... step out of the vehicul.

Caliden · 16-01-2005 05:40PM

almost as bad as greece banning computer games there a while back

zoro · 16-01-2005 05:42PM

Is there a link to back up this? I'm not accusing you

Just wondering how accurate it is, or are they just scaremongering.

Peteee · 16-01-2005 05:45PM

Thats rediculous.

Yeah, a linky would be good (Dont say buy the newspaper either

zoro · 16-01-2005 05:47PM

Well I meant to the actual law that states it, but the story will do I suppose

Wertz · 16-01-2005 06:11PM

Achilles wrote:

Sir, is that an ipod? Please... step out of the vehicul.

Would that be yer own vehicle sir?

Typical IRMA bullsh*t. I remember working in a bar way back in the 90's and some IRMA guy showed up wantingto see what entertainment equipment we had. A few weeks later the boss egt's a demand for something like £1500 for the 2 bar's radio/TV equipment. While I understand that performer's rights are important surely laws need to be rewritten to reflect the leaps and bounds that technology has taken even in the last 3 yrs...

BTW dopes illegal too, but does it stop anyone smoking it...?

Dr Bolouswki · 16-01-2005 06:16PM

Its true

try that google thing... its amazing what you'll find...

djfattony2000 · 16-01-2005 06:24PM

I think this law has been around for a while. Its the same with tape recorders and mini disc, its hardly enforced though.

is_that_so · 16-01-2005 06:26PM

tom dunne wrote:

Dick Doyle, the MD of that much loved organisation, IRMA

Same bloke that added €3 to Cds on CD-WOW

Robbo · 16-01-2005 06:29PM

Haven't IRMA a norotoriously bad reputation for actually sending out the cheques to the artists they claim to represent?

btkm8unsl0w5r4 · 16-01-2005 06:36PM

The copyright laws are really struggeling to catch up with modern entertainment media. I think that if they want to prevent widespread piracy then they need to update the law, and offer songs, albums and films at a proper price that will make those you want to obey the law just pay instead. There will always be those who want it for free but if for most law abiding citizens a song costs 50 cent or something they will just pay it. Now as for digital rights management where you can only copy you legally purchased music 5 time of some ****...man will they ever learn

Stephen · 16-01-2005 06:46PM

What a pack of complete assholes.

Time to visit irma.ie and make use of their "contact us" section again.

Mickie M · 16-01-2005 06:55PM

tom dunne wrote:

According to an article in the Sunday Business Post, the act of transferring digital media files from one device to another is illegal under Irish Law.

Dick Doyle, the MD of that much loved organisation, IRMA, is quoted as saying that it was "against the law" to copy music onto Ipods and other devices. It is not just illegal files, it appears to refer to the actual act of copying the files, whether they have been legally acquired or not.

Crazy, just crazy.

right so ive illegally transfered pictures from a digital camera, from 1 computer to another, downloading websites (with media contense), and a butt load of other normal activitys anyone with a computer will do.

not that they will do anything about it.......

alleepally · 16-01-2005 06:58PM

Wish I could read exactly what was said. This seems incredible. Does it mean if I rip a cd I've bought in Ireland and put it on my pc or on an ipod is illegal?

Evilution · 16-01-2005 07:00PM

tom dunne wrote:

According to an article in the Sunday Business Post, the act of transferring digital media files from one device to another is illegal under Irish Law.

Dick Doyle, the MD of that much loved organisation, IRMA, is quoted as saying that it was "against the law" to copy music onto Ipods and other devices. It is not just illegal files, it appears to refer to the actual act of copying the files, whether they have been legally acquired or not.

Crazy, just crazy.

Yet another reminder of just how archaic a society we live in. Its legal to sell the product, to own the product but not to use it :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

dermot_sheehan · 16-01-2005 07:14PM

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/ZZA28Y2000S50.html

Zaph · 16-01-2005 07:17PM

Jules: OK so, tell me again about the iPods.
Vincent: OK what do you want to know?
Jules: iPods are legal in Ireland, right?
Vincent: Yeah, they're legal but they ain't hundred percent legal, I mean, you just can't walk into a restaurant, whip out your iPod and start listenin' to music. I mean they want you to listen in your home or certain designated places.
Jules: And that would be where there's a stereo?
Vincent: Yeah, It breaks down like this, OK, it's legal to buy music, it's legal to own it, and if you're the proprietor of iTunes, it's legal to sell it. It's legal to carry it, but...but that doesn't matter, 'cause, get a load of this; all right, if you get stopped by a cop in Ireland, it's illegal for them to search you. I mean that's a right the cops in Ireland don't have.
Jules: Oh, man, I'm goin', that's all there is to it. I'm f***in' goin'.
Vincent: I know, baby, you'd dig it the most.

zoro · 16-01-2005 07:18PM

gabhain7 wrote:

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/ZZA28Y2000S50.html

Thanks for the link

It appears that the IRMA were once again spouting sh*te. It's legal under the fair use/dealing stuff.

*sigh*

aidan_walsh · 16-01-2005 07:30PM

tom dunne wrote:

It is not just illegal files, it appears to refer to the actual act of copying the files, whether they have been legally acquired or not.

Somehow there is a better chance of Hell hosting the Winter Olympics that that one sticking, me thinks...

Tom Dunne · 16-01-2005 07:30PM

zoro wrote:

Is there a link to back up this? I'm not accusing you Just wondering how accurate it is, or are they just scaremongering.

/me points to the newspaper on the couch

Couldn't find a link on the sbpost.ie

Interesting link, zoro. I always thought Aidrian Weckler was a decent journalist, I wonder how much research actually went into this report.

It does have a sniff of scaremongering by IRMA. Can't really see Gardai arresting you for having music on your MP3 player.

vibe666 · 17-01-2005 07:21PM

zaph wrote:

Jules:
Jules: Oh, man, I'm goin', that's all there is to it. I'm f***in' goin'.
Vincent: I know, baby, you'd dig it the most.

class.

sceptre · 17-01-2005 07:38PM

tom dunne wrote:

According to an article in the Sunday Business Post, the act of transferring digital media files from one device to another is illegal under Irish Law.

Yeah. Or, er, no.

The act of copying copyrighted-by-others items, digital or otherwise is illegal in Irish law (with a few small exceptions, most of them academic and there's a nice sign up in your local library about that). And that's hardly news as some of us have been saying that for years. Many of the same few of us have been ignoring that for years too and will continue to do so. I like to know all about the laws I habitually break with an intent to continuing.

Did the article really say "transferring digital media files" without mentioning the word "copyright"? Because if this was so it's one of the more ignorant pieces of tech/law journalism I've seen in rather a while. This would include you taking your photos from your camera and putting them on your PC. Anyone think that's illegal?

Obviously the players aren't illegal in Ireland. Can anyone confirm that that was even mentioned in the article?

Creamy Goodness · 17-01-2005 07:48PM

it didn't actually say that the ipod itself is illegal, but instead it was very confusing to read.

what i got from it was that that transferring songs onto it be it from p2p networks or from a cd you legally own was illegal.

it also went on saying that the only legal way to get songs on your ipod is by using iTunes.

fintan · 17-01-2005 07:53PM

Yeah Cremo is right

I read that article on sunday as well, it was obvious the journalist was totally confused as to what he was talking about. The eventual gist of the article was that people are breaking the law if they download illegaly off the internet.

They also had a box section talking about itunes being launched in ireland and how great and popular it was.

i'm a www.allofmp3.com man myself

Creamy Goodness · 17-01-2005 07:54PM

fintan wrote:

i'm a www.allofmp3.com man myself

he also mentioned that that site was abit iffy with irish law

sceptre · 17-01-2005 08:29PM

Cremo wrote:

what i got from it was that that transferring songs onto it be it from p2p networks or from a cd you legally own was illegal.

That would be correct. Ripping your owned CD to your hard drive would be illegal as well.

it also went on saying that the only legal way to get songs on your ipod is by using iTunes.

Likely correctish on the "only" way. Assuming it's in the licence when purchasing the music, which I haven't read. If some of the other music services allow this in their T&Cs it isn't the only way.

Bass.exe · 17-01-2005 08:35PM

Cremo wrote:

it didn't actually say that the ipod itself is illegal, but instead it was very confusing to read.

what i got from it was that that transferring songs onto it be it from p2p networks or from a cd you legally own was illegal.

it also went on saying that the only legal way to get songs on your ipod is by using iTunes.

Nowhere in the law does it say it's illegal to transfer music onto your ipod. Anywhere.
It is perfectly legal to make back-up copies, as long as it is within reason, and will not cause the owner of the IP any loss of income. You do have to keep all the backups with the original if you sell or lend the original however. Or destroy them. You COULD argue that this means you have to carry all your CDs around with your mp3 player, but please don't. Someone might take it seriously.

Obviously, when you download music from the net, you are causing the owner of the IP loss of income, so that IS illegal, but under Irish law, the DISTRIBUTOR is the one breaking copyright. Oh, but you can still be charged for holding copies of copyright-infringing material.

Edit: Sceptre - really? where? can you find me that paragraph in the law? No seriously, I'm not being sarcastic. I really want to see it.
Under the EULA that comes with (very nearly) EVERY piece of software, and every piece of music, you are allowed one backup copy. I'm fairly sure that Irish law doesn't say you can't make a copy. It says you can't make an infringing copy. There is a difference.

sceptre · 17-01-2005 08:43PM

Bass.exe wrote:

Nowhere in the law does it say it's illegal to transfer music onto your ipod. Anywhere.

You're making an unauthorised copy of material under copyright. It's the same as photocopying a book.

It is perfectly legal to make back-up copies, as long as it is within reason,

Show me where it says that (because it doesn't)

and will not cause the owner of the IP any loss of income.

Irrelevant. You just made that bit up.

You do have to keep all the backups with the original if you sell or lend the original however. Or destroy them.

Ditto. Or you're getting confused with the licence inside a number of games that occasionally does allow this. Otherwise, just made up.

but under Irish law, the DISTRIBUTOR is the one breaking copyright.

Interesting little idea. Relevant statutes please.

(edit: I interpreted "distributor as "ISP" for some nutty reason. True to the extent that you don't make a copy on your machine when you save it (as you do). They get hammered for being evil:D pirates though, your penalty is lighter but not non-existant)

Please keep in mind when replying that Ireland is not and has never been a part of the United States of America. Reference to their copyright acts of 1909, 1976 or the DMCA of 1998 won't count.

Ipods/mp3 players illegal in Ireland - Sunday Business Post

Comments