Kilkenny GAA Thread

ye it was something like that, but I thought he might have turned them down on some job as well. Surely if he is good enough that’s the man to get plus the fact the old guard was in charge of the CB ( some still are) and they could be ruthless.

I'd 100% agree with you, I think when picking the next manager they should bring in a recruitment specialist who will look at the cases of each candidate based on their CV's, achievements and their plan for how they propose to do the job. I don't think this will happen but would be great if they did. To be fair I'm not sure if the perception that he'sonly interested in going places to make a few bob would go against him, if that was the case Henry and Eddie wouldn't have been brought in. I think with Tom, he doesn't have as high a profile as others and has even left the media side of things to other members of his backroom, my guess is that could be as big a thing that will work against him as anything else.

So what do each of the candidates bring to the table

• Henry with Herity in tow. Probably the safest choice for the CB in that it probably wouldn't get widespread criticism. Henry by himself is probaby not innovative enough and didn't work wonders with Galway or Kilkenny U20's. I think he needs someone like Herity or else I wouldn't be going with Henry. Herity seemed to be popular with the Tipp players and was the first to have a look at Eoin Cody at centre forward
• Herity as main coach. I don't think he has proved himself as the main coach yet. Would bring a different style to the team
• Brian Dowling as the main coach. Has had success with Kieran's and Camogie. I was impressed with Kildare's first half against KK, they had a good running game.
• Eddie Brennan. Hasn't been a huge success with the KK team this year as a forwards coach. For whatever reason, there doesn't seem to have been great morale in the team this year
• Tom Mullally. Has done well in his appointments to date. I don't know enough about his tactics
• Brian Hogan. Did well with OLG but KK u20's underperformed
• Dream team? Henry with Herity and Brian Dowling. County board need to push the boat out and make the decision early. Not sure if Henry and Herity are committed to Shamrocks this year
• The problem for any new team is that you are playing 6 league games in probably wintery weather in February and March followed by 5 championship matches in April and May before hopefully a Leinster Final after a 2 week gap. It leaves very little time to implement a new style. Warm weather training in January?
• The good news is we have Galway, Dublin and Offaly in the Park next year with away games against Wx and McDonagh winners.
• A separate issue is the coaching teams for other underage teams and development squads

By that reasoning, (regarding the money or going to another county)which I think is bang on the money the CB are ruling out Henry, Dowling,Brennan, Herity, Fennelly and a host more. This is a **** show that keeps on giving huge problems and it's coming from the top down - end of story. You couldn't make it up.

Maybe wait until the new management team is announced before negativity kicks in. A lot of people might, as usual find they have jumped the gun. I hope, and have little doubt it will comprise personnel from those mentioned here . Managements of KK teams of all grades have always been of the highest Calibre in my experience. The focus needs to be placed on players imo. If the half dozen or so players more or less missing this year return for '27 we will possibly be in contention at senior , but that will mask what has been an incremental decline in results and standards particularly at under 20 down, for more than a decade now. I am not pointing the blame at anyone , players or those actively volunteering and working for the good of the game. Adrian Ronan and Taggy on Kclr recently ,referenced development squads, and countered misinformation regarding same. They lamented the absence of volunteers particularly coaches of standard in clubs at all ages throughout the county. Worthy of a listen. For those who "watch our matches on the radio" or on the couch, or only go once in a while believing we have an entitlement to win and are outraged when we lose , do you ever ask yourself what you have ever done , or could do for the betterment of hurling in your club or in the county? Offering solutions here , some of which are worthy of consideration is pointless. Positive action is needed by all true KK followers, we are overloaded with critics and negativity. To finish as I should have begun, sincere respect and gratitude to Derek Lyng for his contribution to KK hurling for an unbroken 25 years plus. What a warrior and how he carried himself with such humility and dignity at all times as a player, mentor, manager and the manner of his leavetaking in the past week. A role model of the highest order. Down south it is said Mick Rice also stepping away (not confirmed anywhere),. If so another similar to Lyng that put everything on the line for his county as player and mentor. I hope both remain involved at some level, lads like them are hard to replace. Finally hurling doesn't end when the county team is beaten. My favourite time of year is Late July on, club championship matches at all grades galore. Where it begins and ends.

I’m sorry now but please tell me Henry’s 4 or 5 equivalent of a Kilkenny U21 team that had high hopes of winning an AI losing to Westmeath? Even if you don’t think Henry did a great job, he was beaten by us twice in Leinster finals, Limerick twice in semi finals, and a poor last year where Dublin knocked them out, hardly anything even remotely similar to that Westmeath loss. That’s not having a go at Eddie either but I actually think Henry is held to too high a standard because of the brilliant player he was. His first year with Galway went fairly well, a poor performance in the Leinster final against us but they bounced back well and gave Limerick a massive battle in the semi final eventually losing by 2. His second year we absolutely robbed them with Cillian Buckley’s last second goal in the Leinster final and in the semi final they through the kitchen sink at Limerick early on but ran out of steam in the second half, similar to us in the final. The 3rd year was admittedly very disappointing but as you say if his name wasn’t Henry Shefflin I actually think people would give him a hell of a lot more credit than he does get. I would prefer he stayed with U20’s for another few years and take it at later date but after Dowling or Mullaly is undoubtedly the next best option.

Kilkenny v Clare in Junior Hurling 1993. From the Wexford Scrapbook Facebook page. Same day as the senior replay. Interesting how many Juniors played senior after!

I don't know whether the Junior was an All Ireland semi.

And Eamonn Kennedy in the subs. Wasn't it a good way of blooding lads, Junior and Intermediate.

Well Willie, Sean Ryan from Dunnamaggin as well. I said in an earlier post it was a great competition to bring players on it certainly served us well, the great Pat Dwyer and Liam Simpson to name but two.

I don't disagree that the performance in the U20 final was poor but I don't think it is comparable to that defeat to Westmeath. That Kilkenny U21 team that lost to Westmeath off the top of my head included Darren Brennan, Conor Delaney, Tommy Walsh, Paddy Deegan, Liam Blanchfield, Billy Ryan, Alan Murphy, a team that would have been far superior to this year's U20 team. You're right that was a good Westmeath team but that Kilkenny U21, most of them were coming off an AI minor win 2 years previous and sould have been well set to win at least one U21 final after.

I think you points on Henry's time at Galway are very fair and very true in lots of ways. The way I seen it with Henry is that he went to Galway, he knew he was only going to do the 3 years and what he wanted, and I'm assuming his remit from the Galway CB, was to win an AI. I think he knew he wouldn't do that by bringing in loads of younger players and trying to develop them, I think he saw his best chance of winning an AI was trying to get a kick out of the players that were there. Personally that's why I'd be against outside managers coming over a county, they're pure aim is success and to acheive it in there tenure as manager.

I'd agree with you, Henry wouldn't be my first or even second choice as manager, I've fairy nailed my colors to the Tom Mullaly mast, even though I'd be surprised if it happened, but I do think people are overly harsh on Henry's managerial career. I'd like to see him stay with the U20's another few years as, from what I hear, the players really liked the set up this year.

THE CHALLENGE: Cork /UCC, Limerick/UL, Clare/UL, Tipp (SETU) Galway/UCG and Dublin/UCD/DCU/DIT now offer a young hurler an improved overall life in addition to daily practice and interplay at a 3rd level college.  All the above universities are centrally located and offer a wide range of career choices. UCC has / had 4 firmer coaches as full time coaches. Some may remember as I do when Mark lander excluded some south Kilkenny lads from the UCC team. Few if any go there today. Lyng teaches there. Fennelly at SETU Nenagh. These colleges I suspect have sports scientists who have studied sports best practices in the US, UK and other countries. Limerick for eg have mental coaches to help players "get their head right" for a game as Michael F often said.

I would ask the CB and all concerned with our future to consider the above and how we adapt to compete. My suggestions are:

1. Have a group of career mentors who are both former hurlers and successful in a wide  variety of careers including teaching, medicine, business, etc . They would make presentations to "interested" young groups of 15 -18 year olds and be available to meet with interested 17-18 yr olds at meeting rooms in UPMC or a Kilkenny hotel to help guide career and hurling choices.
2. We need a comprehensive training program with Brian Dowling, Michael Rice and Kilkenny CBC coach as leaders. Volunteer local coaches trained in Kierans on hurling drills. Dermot Healy had a great Kierans drills program from age 12 in my 70s time. I would add: Handpassing is a clear weakness; not crisp and strong like DJ but are slow and hang in the air; even flop;  give out wrist stengtheners (same as used for carpel tunnel) to kids; I had that at age 12; at least 40 each hand am, lunch and pm. Handball also helps. Catching under pressure another clear weakness. 
3. The lead coach and team of selectors are responsible for creating a unified camp which players find both very challenging and satisfying. Solving team dysfunctions quickly is key. They will be judged by team performance on the field and successful player development. They are responsible for developing everyone they select on the panel.
4. The lead coach has to have maturity, a calm temperament to mentor young men to be their best selves, a good media communicstor.  the time available outside his career to fo the job, and most important a supportive family and employer. If they are in job transition or starting a new business they don't have the financial security needed to take on the role.

Agreed. Same for Shannon Technological Univ. Kids should be encouraged to choose a career which suits their interests and talents.

Very good post Ned… and an excellent point re Dan outside manager chasing short term success over a long term rebuild. I have to admit I hadn’t thought of it that way before. I’d actually argue that Derek had that same short term approach to the KK job and had short term success on his mind in an effort to prove himself after Cody if you like. Might explain his being slow to blood more young players.

When I was thinking of Henry's time as Galway manager, it similarities with Derek's time as our manager are massive, I think both thought there best chance of success was with what they inherited but probably goes to show the foolishness of short term thinking in GAA terms.

I think a problem he had with Galway as well was that as Galway is so far away he probably didn't know the club championship like a local would, even if he had gone to Waterford or Wexford it's a lot closer and he proably could have popped in and out of games but being so far away he probably had to plan out the games he wanted to see and I'd imagine wouldn't have seen enough of the club players he wasn't familiar with. Now in saying that, I'm by no means an apologist for him and he probably would, or should, have weighed up all these eventualities before going up there but I do think it's not as black and white as just saying he did a good or bad job. One thing about him any of the players who've played under him have nothing but good words about him.